# Israel vs Palestine



## Plainsman (Jul 30, 2003)

Over the years this is perhaps the most clear explanation of the Israel/Palestine conflict that I have read. I often hear and read many anti sematic articles by the mainstream media and leftist organizations. I don't understand why. 
Even before Obama was elected I told people and people on this site that he would backstab Israel. Again I ask myself, why? Then we wonder why the world doesn't love or trust us. We constantly abandoned those we tell "we got your back". All it takes is a change in Washington (Obama this time) and our allies are left hanging. We can't be trusted anymore. At least our government can't be trusted anymore. Not by the world, nor by it's own citizens. Even our border invasion from the south is planned.



> Charles Krauthammer
> 
> By Charles Krauthammer Opinion writer July 17 at 5:35 PM 
> 
> ...


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## Plainsman (Jul 30, 2003)

As I understand it there has been an area that Palestinians lived in, but they never organized as a country. The first organization I see is when they declared themselves a free state in 1988 and were later recognized by the United Nations. It would be like the Norwegians in North Dakota declaring Cass country a free Norwegian state and asking for United Nations recognition as such. That without consulting with the United States, or North Dakota, and shooting rockets into Valley City if they don't agree. 
Have you ever read "Son of Hamas"? One of my sons gave it to me last year to read. The man who wrote it was the son of one of the top people in Hamas just a few years ago. It gives some very good insight into Hamas from within. It doesn't agree with the current propaganda. 
My problem is every time they have a cease fire who brakes it without provocation? To me the word of a Palestinian is worthless. I have evolved from being pro Israel to sort of more anti jerks.


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## Plainsman (Jul 30, 2003)

Plainsman wrote:


> I have evolved from being pro Israel to sort of more anti jerks.


Dougie wrote:


> And really dont see how any Christian could ever be Pro Israel


Your not listening Dougie. I at one time was pro Israel. I am now more anti jerk. Many of the Muslims are jerks. Most of them who will not denounce the terrorists apparently are jerks also. I still support those who support us. I support Israel not as pro Israeli, but as an ally. I also support them as a democracy.

The "Son of Hamas" was written by a son of one of the Hamas founders who was very high in their organization. Your simply blinded by your anti Semitism. It's very apparent in the paranoid way you speak of Israel.

With the news these days and the number of Americans signing up with ISIS it's very concerning. Even as close as Minneapolis and St. Paul people are joining ISIS. Don't do it Dougie.


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## Plainsman (Jul 30, 2003)

> your beloved Israel


Your still not listening.



> We armed and trained, funded them. Now the tiger we thought we had by the tail actually acts like a tiger. People like me and our Founders were right all along.
> Protect our borders and stop being the worlds policeman for Israel.


We are stupid and never learn. We constantly fund those we think are allies only to be betrayed. I think that's what happened in Benghazi. I agree we need to shut our borders and stop being the policeman for the world. Not just Israel. Picking that nation only exposes your animosity towards them. I would stop being the policeman, but I would stand up for those who are our allies and stand with us.

What do you think about the long overdue attack against ISIS and going into Jordan. I think it was timed to come before the election.


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## Plainsman (Jul 30, 2003)

> Mike over at Tomato Bubble is saying this red haired, fair skinned man is an Israeli...


I agree with much of what you say, but statements like that above are sort of like the people who think we were the ones that hit the world trade centers and blamed it on others so we could go to war. I have a hard time with conspiracy theories that get to far fetched. I just don't see an Israeli marching with ISIS unless of course he is spying on them.

Oh, as far as Israel spying on us. I think every nation spies on all other nations. I however don't like our own nation spying to much on it's citizens.


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## Plainsman (Jul 30, 2003)

> LBJ lied about the Gulf Of Tonkin and we went to Vietnam.


We were in Vietnam with Kennedy, a long time before LBJ. I wouldn't defend that piece of crap for anything, but your wrong about when we went and why.



> Notice his 6 pointed Star of David Chain. Oops. An Israeli.


Give me a break. It looks more like a four point something or other to me.

I think were both a little paranoid. Your paranoid about Israel, and we have had people on here who clearly hate Jews. One so bad that some people said they would leave if we didn't ban him. I said I can't ban him until he breaks the rules. So one guy left and when the guy got to crazy I banned him. So posts like yours that blame Jews for everything I give a jaundice eye. It's just been our past experience here that we have attracted some crazies. I'll wait and see where you go with yours.


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## Plainsman (Jul 30, 2003)

Hmmmm isn't Henry Kissinger Jewish?


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## Bobm (Aug 26, 2003)

what a total load of Crap.... Dougie why don't you post a few videos of Israeli's beheading people and selling little girls as "wives"
the world will never be at peace until the last Muslim is dead

the palestinans...

One of the most incorrigible fallacies pertaining to the Middle East is the notion that the Palestinians are entitled to a state of their own. This fallacy stems from the misconception that there is a nation of 'Palestinians', and to the extent that such a nation exists, this name is an accurate representation of the Arabs who live in modern Israel. This artful manipulation of the geopolitical lexicon was meant to bestow upon a group of random Arabs a false sense of geographical ties to the Holy Land.

In 1977, during an interview with the Dutch newspaper Trouw, PLO Executive Committee member Zuheir Mohsen described the stratagem as this:

"The Palestinian people does not exist. The creation of a Palestinian state is only a means for continuing our struggle against the state of Israel for our Arab unity. In reality today there is no difference between Jordanians, Palestinians, Syrians and Lebanese. Only for political and tactical reasons do we speak today about the existence of a Palestinian people, since Arab national interests demand that we posit the existence of a distinct Palestinian people to oppose Zionism."

This delusion is no trivial matter. For years, the left wing foreign policy establishment has rapturously promoted the 'Palestinians' as the cause célèbre of our national security interests. Instead of focusing on the real threats to our national security (such as those who, incidentally, fund the so-called Palestinians), the foreign policy establishment has singularly focused on creating a state for the most virulently anti-American people on the face of the planet. Their maniacal fixation on the Palestinians has left them devoid of solutions regarding the broader turmoil in the Middle East.

Islam Explained in Layman's Term

Here is a perspective by Dr Peter Hammond. Dr Hammond's doctorate is in Theology.
He was born in Cape Town in 1960, grew up in Rhodesia and converted to Christianity in 1977.
Adapted from Dr Peter Hammond's book : Slavery, Terrorism and Islam

The Historical Roots and Contemporary Threat :
Islam is not a religion, nor is it a cult. In its fullest form, it is a complete, total, 100% system of life.
Islam has religious, legal, political, economic, social, and military components. The religious component is a beard for all of the other components.
Islamisation begins when there are sufficient Muslims in a country to agitate for their religious privileges.
When politically correct, tolerant, and culturally diverse societies agree to Muslim demands for their religious privileges, some of the other components tend to creep in as well.
Here's how it works :
As long as the Muslim population remains around or under 2% in any given country, they will be for the most part be regarded as a peace-loving minority, and not as a threat to other citizens. This is the case in:
United States -- Muslim 0.6%
Australia -- Muslim 1.5%
Canada -- Muslim 1.9%
China -- Muslim 1.8%
Italy -- Muslim 1.5%
Norway -- Muslim 1.8%

At 2% to 5%, they begin to proselytize from other ethnic minorities and disaffected groups, often with major recruiting from the jails and among street gangs.
This is happening in :
Denmark -- Muslim 2%
Germany -- Muslim 3.7%
United Kingdom -- Muslim 2.7%
Spain -- Muslim 4%
Thailand -- Muslim 4.6%

From 5% on, they exercise an inordinate influence in proportion to their percentage of the population.
For example, they will push for the introduction of halal (clean by Islamic standards) food, thereby securing food preparation jobs for Muslims.
They will increase pressure on supermarket chains to feature halal on their shelves -- along with threats for failure to comply.This is occurring in :
France -- Muslim 8%
Philippines -- 5%
Sweden -- Muslim 5%
Switzerland -- Muslim 4.3%
The Netherlands -- Muslim 5.5%
Trinidad & Tobago -- Muslim 5.8%
At this point, they will work to get the ruling government to allow them to rule themselves (within their ghettos) under Sharia, the Islamic Law.
The ultimate goal of Islamists is to establish Sharia law over the entire world.
When Muslims approach 10% of the population, they tend to increase lawlessness as a means of complaint about their conditions.
In Paris, we are already seeing car-burnings. Any non Muslim action offends Islam, and results in uprisings and threats, such as in Amsterdam , with opposition to Mohammed cartoons and films about Islam. Such tensions are seen daily, particularly in Muslim sections, in :
Guyana -- Muslim 10%
India -- Muslim 13.4%
Israel -- Muslim 16%
Kenya -- Muslim 10%
Russia -- Muslim 15%

After reaching 20%, nations can expect hair-trigger rioting, jihad militia formations, sporadic killings, and the burnings of Christian churches and Jewish synagogues, such as in:
Ethiopia -- Muslim 32.8%
At 40%, nations experience widespread massacres, chronic terror attacks, and on-going militia warfare, such as in:
Bosnia -- Muslim 40%
Chad -- Muslim 53.1%
Lebanon -- Muslim 59.7%

From 60%, nations experience unfettered persecution of non-believers of all other religions (including non-conforming Muslims), sporadic ethnic cleansing (genocide), use of Sharia Law as a weapon, and Jizya, the tax placed on infidels, such as in:
Albania -- Muslim 70%
Malaysia -- Muslim 60.4%
Qatar -- Muslim 77.5%
Sudan -- Muslim 70%

After 80%, expect daily intimidation and violent jihad, some State-run ethnic cleansing, and even some genocide, as these nations drive out the infidels, and move toward 100% Muslim, such as has been experienced and in some ways is on-going in:
Bangladesh -- Muslim 83%
Egypt -- Muslim 90%
Gaza -- Muslim 98.7%
Indonesia -- Muslim 86.1%
Iran -- Muslim 98%
Iraq -- Muslim 97%
Jordan -- Muslim 92%
Morocco -- Muslim 98.7%
Pakistan -- Muslim 97%
Palestine -- Muslim 99%
Syria -- Muslim 90%
Tajikistan -- Muslim 90%
Turkey -- Muslim 99.8%
United Arab Emirates -- Muslim 96%

100% will usher in the peace of 'Dar-es-Salaam' -- the Islamic House of Peace.. Here there's supposed to be peace, because everybody is a Muslim, the Madrassas are the only schools, and the Koran is the only word, such as in :
Afghanistan -- Muslim 100%
Saudi Arabia -- Muslim 100%
Somalia -- Muslim 100%
Yemen -- Muslim 100%

Unfortunately, peace is never achieved, as in these 100% states the most radical Muslims intimidate and spew hatred, and satisfy their blood lust by killing less radical Muslims, for a variety of reasons.
'Before I was nine I had learned the basic canon of Arab life. It was me against my brother; me and my brother against our father; my family against my cousins and the clan ; the clan against the tribe ; the tribe against the world, and all of us against the infidel. - Leon Uris, 'The Haj'
It is important to understand that in some countries, with well under 100% Muslim populations, such as France, the minority Muslim populations live in ghettos, within which they are 100% Muslim, and within which they live by Sharia Law.
The national police do not even enter these ghettos. There are no national courts, nor schools, nor non-Muslim religious facilities. In such situations, Muslims do not integrate into the community at large. The children attend madrassas. They learn only the Koran. To even associate with an infidel is a crime punishable with death.
Therefore, in some areas of certain nations, Muslim Imams and extremists exercise more power than the national average would indicate.
Today's 1.5 billion Muslims make up 22% of the world's population. But their birth rates dwarf the birth rates of Christians, Hindus, Buddhists, Jews, and all other believers.
Muslims will exceed 50% of the world's population by the end of this century.

Adapted from Dr Peter Hammond's book : Slavery, Terrorism and Islam: The Historical Roots and Contemporary Threat


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## Plainsman (Jul 30, 2003)

Thanks for all the good info Bob. That was interesting.
The Koran tells Muslims to be peaceful until their number are sufficient to rise up and kill the infidels. They are not peace loving.

Dougie I can see some Palestinian wearing that star for a photo op. They do some pretty good public relations for a bunch of hoodlums. I would turn Israel loose on them. I'm waiting for Israel to kick the snot out of Iran. My prediction is when the republicans take the senate by storm this November Israel will blow a big hole in the middle east. I'm so sick of Muslims I'll cheer for Israel. You make me sick of Muslims.


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## Plainsman (Jul 30, 2003)

> This is NOT a PR Stunt. Its sloppy work.


The Mossad doesn't do sloppy work. No one is that stupid as to wear things that would be a give away their true identity. It's bs for the gullible.


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## Plainsman (Jul 30, 2003)

You have some wild ideas Dougie. So you think the mother ship is on the other side of the moon.


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## Plainsman (Jul 30, 2003)

Here you go Dougie, your beloved Hamas in action in Atlanta. Warning: unneeded strong language.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=StmNW4ZWQwo#t=308


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## Plainsman (Jul 30, 2003)

I guess Israel made a big mistake. What is important is what *&&^% they are today.


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