# When does an guide/outfitter become bad?



## the phrophet (Dec 2, 2004)

I have been reading several comments on these boards and have a question about when does a guide/outfitter become bad.

It appears from reading here that they become bad when they cut into someone's hunting spot or come to North Dakota. Otherwise it seems they are OK as long as they don't bother anyone here.

This site is a billboard for guides and outfitters to advertise on (check the top on each page) but the consensus must be that it is OK as long as the advertising is not from a ND guide or outfitter.

So the question is, are the people here hypocrits or do they have their heads in the sand and can't see the problem until if affects or bothers them.

Thought for the day:

If an outfitter doesn't affect my hunting is he a bad outfitter or do I just not care?


----------



## smalls (Sep 9, 2003)

I have been clicking all over the board to see what banner ads come up.

Taylor Decoys
Fox and Pfortmiller
The Motel <- not a guide
Habitat Now
Franklin Forge Patent Mint
Easy Up Blinds


----------



## Bob Kellam (Apr 8, 2004)

Prophet

Answer a question for me What *Good* is derived from the Commercialization of North Dakotas "State Owned" wildlife?

Excerpts from the North Dakota Constitution and The North Dakota Century Code

Article XI 
General Provisions

Page No. 34

Section 27. Hunting, trapping, and fishing and the taking of game and fish are a valued part of our heritage and will be forever preserved for the people and managed by law and regulation for the public good.

North Dakota Century Code 20.1-01-03 
Ownership and Control of Wildlife is in the state - Damages - Schedule of monetary values - Civil penalty The ownership of and title to all wildlife within this state is in the state for the purpose of regulating the enjoyment, use, possession, disposition and conservation thereof, and for maintaining action for damages as herin provided. Any person catching, killing, taking trapping, or posessing any wildlife protected by law at any time or in any manner is deemed to have consented that the title thereto remains in this state for the purpose of regulating the taking, use possession, and disposition thereof...

Does Commercilization benefit a few or many?

Is it not against the law to be a "commercial hunter"?

Do commercial hunting operations sell wildlife under the guise of access fees?

Do commercial hunting operations pay commercial tax on leased habitat land?

Do the laws as they exist today allow North Dakota to be taken advantage of?

Bob


----------



## DJRooster (Nov 4, 2002)

I think that you need to ask the people in SW North Dakota or the people in S. Dak. They have more expertise in this area.


----------



## Drew Willemsen (Sep 29, 2003)

I don't think that guides are necessaryly "bad", but just not needed to hunt waterfowl and upland birds in North Dakota. There is no reason someone needs to come to North Dakota and pay someone to hunt. I think that it sucks that guides and outfitters are posting and leasing up land to hunt, and making money on land that in the past could have been hunted for free or after helping a farmer with a little work. Its one thing to not know anything about waterfowl or upland bird hunting and find someone to take you out hunting, but to pay someone, just seems stupid....thats my .02


----------



## drjongy (Oct 13, 2003)

the phrophet said:


> It appears from reading here that they become bad when they cut into someone's hunting spot or come to North Dakota. Otherwise it seems they are OK as long as they don't bother anyone here.


As a resident and sportsman of North Dakota, I am really only concerned with issues that effect North Dakota. Other states and their residents can worry about themselves.


----------



## gandergrinder (Mar 10, 2002)

drjongy,
I could not agree with you more. States set game laws so the only influence I can have on anything is in the state where I vote. I cannot change the laws in other states so why would I waste my energy. It sounds like we are isolationists but the reality of it is that we can only effect the resources in our state through the government and private conservation organizations.


----------



## johnsona (Dec 4, 2003)

the phrophet said:


> If an outfitter doesn't affect my hunting is he a bad outfitter or do I just not care?


The thing about that is that an outfitter ALWAYS affects someone's hunting, so I always care whether I am affected or not. If we are going to stop the commercialization of ND, people need to help even if it doesn't affect them directly, because one day it will.

As far as you trying to stir the pot by calling us hypocrits, that sure is a great way to start off your first post. :withstupid: Trust us, we see the problem, it's just not that simple sometimes. Even if we would fight battles in other places, it's pointless because most other states are already overrun with g/o's. It's a little ridiculous for a ND resident to go and argue about why WY shouldn't let more g/o's operate there, don't you think?


----------



## goosehtr4life (Dec 16, 2002)

Phropet, I'll tell you when it bothers me...When people do not guide on land THEY OWN!!! Period end of sentance...Farmers/land owners can post/not post their land..Allow access/or not.. But when an outfitter/guides come in and lease up Several thousands acres of land, that even if they were posted, you could still ask and may rec.l permission to hunt....

:eyeroll: Do you understand if this continues there will be know where for the Avg Joe to go without having to spend money...

Have a good day


----------



## Booster (Sep 8, 2003)

I couldn't agree more! There is nothing wrong with people who guide unless they don't guide on their OWN land! I have heard a lot of people complaining about guides this year and ruining their hunts. I talked to one guy who was set up in a field and 10 min. before shooting time a pick and trailor came in and set up down wind of them. That is what I think makes guides be so disliked around my area. People take the time and scout out the land and someone comes in a ruins their hunt. This is unexceptable in my part of the country. If they would just stick to their own land there wouldn't be any problems!


----------



## g/o (Jul 13, 2004)

12


----------



## njsimonson (Sep 24, 2002)

Generally, are hunting guides frowned upon more than fishing guides? From what I hear/see, I think so.


----------



## nodakoutdoors.com (Feb 27, 2002)

the phrophet said:


> This site is a billboard for guides and outfitters to advertise on (check the top on each page) but the consensus must be that it is OK as long as the advertising is not from a ND guide or outfitter.


You obviously aren't familiar with the site. This will help explain to you how google ads work:

http://nodakoutdoors.com/members/phpBB/ ... php?t=6429

Thanks for the prophecy though.


----------



## drjongy (Oct 13, 2003)

g/o said:


> ...but don't say g/o's are bad because you don't like what they do.


That's like saying 'don't hate meth dealers just because they are trying to sell a highly addictive and dangerous drug to your kids'

Sorry...perhaps a little over the top but I think you get my point, g/o. :wink:


----------



## g/o (Jul 13, 2004)

12


----------



## smalls (Sep 9, 2003)

To me this argument is much like the argument of NR hunters, I draw the line between g/o's as a business and g/o's as individuals. I don't dislike the individuals. Most are good, honest people not unlike everyone else. I do however, reserve the right to dislike g/o's a a business.

Hunting to me is a passion and a process. I enjoy every step of hunting, but g/o's reduce that process down to one part that is viewed as "climactic", the shoot. To me that disgraces the essence of hunting, it is like only eating the dessert at every meal, you didn't earn it by cleaning your plate of vegetables first.

The other problem with hunting guides is the exclusivity of the profession. When they lease land, it is essentially gone. This doesn't compare to fishing guides, who cannot control access to a body of water, it is a non-restrictive business.

The fact is if we have 1 megahunting-guide, or 10,000 little guides, the possibility for them to restrict the hunting of all others is possible. Not only is it possible, it has happened all over the south and parts of the midwest (Texas, Arkansas, Kansas, Georgia).

In summary, guides and outfitters as people= not inherently bad.

Guide and outfiiters as businesses= crappy, inherently bad.


----------



## KEN W (Feb 22, 2002)

I have no problem with G/O.They have their place.Especially hunting geese where large settings are used.Some people don't have the equiptment and others just basically don't know what they are doing.

BUT...you want to be like us then hunt like us.No leasing of land.If a farmer wants to charge....he can do it on his own.1 farm or ranch only....not lease someone elses.This would still allow the farmer to make money....it just eliminates the middle man.

Free-lance like the rest of us do.


----------



## buckseye (Dec 8, 2003)

> Thanks for the prophecy though


.

:toofunny:


----------



## Dick Monson (Aug 12, 2002)

> It appears from reading here that they become bad when they cut into someone's hunting spot or come to North Dakota.


My, my. Lets rack up the balls here. The G/O out at Richarton that was was busted (fedral and state) for a national poaching ring. The G/O at Almont, same thing. And our dear friend down at Streeter, who could count the violations? The commercial deer poaching ring that just hit the skids. And possibly Gander Mountain outside the law on outfitting. Yeah, thats *bad*. All just mom and pops trying to eke out a bare and miserable existance here on the prairie. You bet.

Oh yes, and lest I forget, Cannonball's purchase of wild birds, never prosecuted, in violation of the century code. It's not you know or who you snow, but who you pay off. Baaaaaad.


----------



## DJRooster (Nov 4, 2002)

I think that guides get bad when there are so many that there is no longer any room for the little guy and if they get so big that they tie up too much land that there is no longer any room for the little guy. There has to be a middle ground that is good for everyone involved. But I am afraid that....


----------



## Ron Gilmore (Jan 7, 2003)

Willful disrespect for the wildlife and taking the view that the wonderful animal or birds is nothing more than a dollar on the hoof or in flight. Taking and not puting back. Not willing to help the G&F get control of an out of control deer population by restricting access. Having no respect for others in the outdoors.


----------



## djleye (Nov 14, 2002)

> Willful disrespect for the wildlife and taking the view that the wonderful animal or birds is nothing more than a dollar on the hoof or in flight.


Amen Ron, That is as well as it can be put!!!!!!! :beer:


----------



## drjongy (Oct 13, 2003)

g/o said:


> drjongy, Over the top? If I abide by the laws set forth in this state governing g/o's I've done nothing wrong. Comparing me to a meth dealer well is more than just a little over the top. Comments like yours are why the state is taking the direction it is.


What direction would that be...more freelance hunting?

Just because something is legal, g/o, doesn't make it right, so please don't hind behind that B.S.

If you only guide on your personal property than I have no problems with your profession whatsoever. Otherwise I could care less if you all go broke.


----------



## WARDEN247 (Sep 7, 2004)

I don't know about bad G/O's, but a good G/O would be chained with another G/O at the bottom of the ocean with the Lawyers.. :lol: It's a joke just laugh..


----------



## StillKillsTheOldWay (Nov 14, 2004)

Look guys, I am not sure what all the fuss is about. I began working for a small guide down here in Lubbock because I am a First Generation Hunter and know very little compared to most of you "Experts". Without the knowledge I have gleaned from the guides I work with I would still be sitting out in a field by myself wishing I knew more about the game I am hunting and wishing I could learn how to call better. Maybe in North Dakota everyone grows up hunting at age 3, but for guys like me, the opportunity to spend time with guides and learn from them is priceless. All I do is set up decoys and clean birds, but I would do it again everytime. Do I think they can become "Bad"? Maybe if there only motive is cash flow. I see VERY FEW problems, but maybe it's me or maybe it's just Capitalism. I don't mean to ruffle feathers, I am just tying to give an IMO. Thanks guys and thanks for the help ya'll have also provided through this website. :beer:


----------



## Ron Gilmore (Jan 7, 2003)

Could it be the reason you could not learn on your own as many of us have done and continue to do is the opportunity to do so was taken away by the very people you seem to worship so much?

We are trying to keep ND a place where a freelance hunter can come and learn without having to resort to using a fee operation.

I remember well not knowing the first thing about calling ducks, or setting a decoy spread. I remember well the first time that the ducks dropped into my decoys because they where set right by me. I remember well getting home from school and taking the shotgun and pushing the buck brush for grouse, or watching the ducks feeding in a field and figuring out how to hunt it. Some things worked but others more times did not.

You cannot put a price on that. I equate it back to the Rubik's Cube. What sense of pride or accomplishment was gained from having someone else show you the way to make the sides all match? What sense of accomplishment is gained by shooting ducks over decoys set by someone else,scouted by someone else, called by someone else, and then cleaned by someone else?

How can one appreciate the good years when they never have a bad year? How does that person become motivated to become active in an organization like Delta,or DU, or Pheasants Forever when they do not have anything at stake in the future of birds when everything is done for them?

So when the bird numbers get low and the habitat is not producing the birds it is today and we need the help of all the licensed hunters across this nation to fix the problem and it does not happen. Think back to this thread and see if these words imparted to you ring louder and clearer them!


----------



## StillKillsTheOldWay (Nov 14, 2004)

I DID learn a lot of things in the past 3 years hunting out on my own, but there are some tips that these guys help me with. I did experience the pride of my success on my own. I still go hunting by myself almost 90% of the time, and I DO NOT hunt with them when I work for them. I do not and will never pay for a guided hunt, but there is a market for it and I am a broke college student who needs money. Why not get experience from the guys? They are ALL members of DU and PF and many other groups. I also am going to become a memeber of DU in Jan. and by the way, I write letters to my congressman every month for the NRA. On the issue of land, most of the land is at a high price because of the farmers trying to make a buck, not because these Outfitters by 1,000 acres. There are maybe 5 or 6 outfitters in the Panhandle. Like I said, I am not trying to ruffle feathers, I am only stating my IMO. These Outfitters are not going to fall of the Earth, so maybe you should suggest to all of your groups that ya'll should work to limit Outfitters on how much they can take over the area. Maybe it is all a different story in North Dakota, and that's fine, but this is my IMO about the Texas Panhandle.


----------



## Old Hunter (Mar 8, 2002)

StillKillsTheOldWay Your name does not fit the way you hunt. The old way was to learn to hunt on your own. Having a guide dress you, put the birds in front of you, shoot them for you, tell you what a great shot you are then put you to bed is not the old way. You say you didnt come here to" ruffel any feathers" then you throw a smart *** remark about the people on this forum thinking their are experts. 
We have had enough of the Texas style hunting here. Texas guides are up here now involed in prostitution, illegal posting and a numberof other offenses. 
"I did not and never will pay for a guided hunt." But yet you think it is just fine to commericialize the whole sport except when it comes to you. Texas style hunting is not appreciated here .


----------



## buckseye (Dec 8, 2003)

When they buy alot of beer and get all the land in the areas posted so there is no place to hunt. It's easy to see where the guides and posted land is there are dead deer laying along the roads near those areas.

Actually we have mostly fly-by-night o/g's around here so I probaly wouldn't recogonize a real o/g.


----------



## JFarsdale (Nov 23, 2004)

I have no problem with o/g. as long as they do not lease up land. I personly feel the problem is not the o/g but It is the land owners and hunters. they are responding to a demand. I look around and see more land posted not for o/g but for privet partys. also how many good deer hunting spots do you see with posters all around them. and you can,t hunt it for the landowner is a headhunter. I know of at least 4 spots in less then 5 miles from my house. And the spots are the best deer hunting in the area. I take that back it is more like 6 spots.


----------



## StillKillsTheOldWay (Nov 14, 2004)

My ID on this website is based off a LostProphets song, my favorite band. I apoligize for the misunderstanding. I did learn how to hunt on my own, but sought more advice and tips to aid the knowledge I had obtained myself. The guides I work with are honest to goodness great people. There is no prostitution ring on the side or illegal posting. I put "Experts" the way I did because I was implying that you guys would not consider yourselves experts, but many of you really are. The sentence was a compliment seeing as how I ended with "Thanks guys". I also would like to apologize for any of the Texans in your area causing trouble. That is not indicative of Texans as a whole, but I know there are bad apples. And yes, I will never pay for a guided hunt, but there is a demand for it. I as a consumer choose not to, but other consumers do and there is not a whole lot I can do about it other than explain to the people I know who want to go on a guided hunt, why I don't or why I would choose a said O/G because of a, b, and c. Are there bad outfitters, are there bad hunters, yes and yes. But does this mean we should get rid of the whole lot of them? How would me getting help from guides who are friends of mine versus a father helping a son? Is a college student less intelligent because a Professor helped him learn all he knows? I know there are really bad O/G's, but they are not all bad and that is the point I am trying to make. I happen to work for what I feel is a fantastic O/G and a group of guys who care about the game and conservation. I would submit that more land is taken by farmers and headhunters looking for $$$ like JFarsdale said. Maybe I am wrong, but please address the Post, not try and to attack each other. That is an Ad Hominem logical fallacy that really gets us nowhere. This was a good post Prophet, thanks for the idea.

P.S. By the way, I am currently learning how to Bowhunt ALL on my own. :beer:


----------



## Old Hunter (Mar 8, 2002)

StillKillsTheOldWay
I accept your explaination in regards to the use of the word Expert. Thank you for the compliment. It seems that you are a fine young man that is working hard at becoming a good hunter.Your involvment in the organizations that you refer to tells me that you have a passion for the sport. It must be very difficult for a young person to be able to hunt In Texas. Im sure there is public land but we know that there will never be enough of that to sustain the shooting sports. 
You say there are 5 or 6 outfitters in the Panhandle! The thought that 6 people control all most all the hunting in the Panhandel is not good for the sport of hunting. What does it cost to hunt your club for a day ? $150 or $200 per day? If a guy would like to take his son and daughter hunting for the day what does he spend $500 or $600. This is without any other expences. This cost makes it a rich mans sport. When only the rich are able to hunt the sport will not survive. How many young men do 6 clubs need for bird boys? At 5 per club that gives about 30 young people a chance to hunt in the Panhandel that could not otherwise afford it . In North Dakota a young man like yourself can go hunting at will. He can be polite and ask a farmer for permission to hunt and will most likely he will be able to hunt for the day for free. If this same young man or woman does some work or some other kind gesture for the farm family he can develope a reationship that will last a lifetime. The farmers of ND are that kind of people.
The fact that you agree with Farsdale's comments about farmers taking up the hunting oppertunities that shows how little you know about hunting in ND. There are many generous farmers in ND and they are the reason that we have the opportunity to hunt. 
You have every right to express your opinions and you do in a very respectable manner. The vast majority of North Dakota sportsmen and women do not like the Texas style of big dollar hunting. This type of hunting is promoted by guides and outfitters. People in this part of the country value some things more than money. Good Luck


----------



## StillKillsTheOldWay (Nov 14, 2004)

Old Hunter,
I really appreciate the compliments. And you are correct, I do not know much about North Dakota hunting. The farmers are not near as friendly here, but there is still a decent amount of land to hunt. I hunt public lands provided by Texas Parks & Wildlife probably 90% of the time. Are they sanctuaries for wildlife like some places, no but I would give them a 8 or 9 out of 10 rating. The public lands program in Texas has gone from nothing in 1997 to nearly 1.5 million acres as of this season and that does not include WMA's and Parks. The 5 to 6 outfitters do not control the hunting here since the Panhandle is such a large area, but we can agree to disagree. The hunt price at the Outfitter I work for, ranges from $100 to $200 per person and in most cases discounts are given to Parents who bring children. Is it dirt cheap, no but we give them information about DU and other groups when they come on the hunt and we also explain to them the Public Lands program and how that it would be very easy for them to take the child out hunting several times a year on their own. Is this why our Outfitter makes just enough to get by? Probably :lol: , but we want people to have the info we have about hunting in Texas. We also do the same for Non-Residents.

I am glad to know the view of Texas-style hunting. Like I said, now that I know that I can begin to alter that perception. I will admit that there are HUGE Outfitters down in the Houston and San Antonio area; the BIG dollar type and I do disagree with their approach. If these are the types of Outfitters in North Dakota, I would want to get rid of them as well. Does anyone know if the is anything in the works to fix that in North Dakota?

Hopefully ya'll can fix the problem whether through legislation or just plain whatever it takes. If ya'll are ever in the Texas Panhandle region, you can always give me a buzz. Thanks Guys! :beer:


----------



## mallardwacker (Dec 6, 2004)

I just came across your website a couple of days ago and instantly became a member. I'm just a farm boy from sw minnesota who lived in South Dakota for 8 years and recently moved back to Minnesota for job reasons. But I just want to comment on what I have learned over the years as far as G/O's and these people taking away from the average guy. I have seen what has happened in South Dakota and it is very depressing. It gets worse every year, in fact I rarely pheasant hunt anymore just because it seems useless. In fact I would sooner go back to my fathers farm in Minnesota and hunt then spend a weekend driving around counting posted signs.

I hope that there can be something done to keep hunting from going corprate or at least keep it from growing. You guys have seen it in South Dakota and Minnesota and I cant tell you how happy I am to see all you good people in North Dakota fighting this "snowballing" problem.
I have never waterfowl hunted in North Dakota but hope to someday, but if North Dakota is turning into a South Dakota I wont waste my time fighting someone who has a deeper pocket book then I do. I guess my newphews will just have to shoot ducks on the "x-Box".

If this sport is to survive with the average guy then there should be some regulations and limits. Why not limit the G/O's?

Thank you for the web site and fighting for the "little guy" :beer:


----------



## Bob Kellam (Apr 8, 2004)

mallardwacker

Welcome to the site!!!

Lots of Great Guys here that all have a passion for the outdoors. We need every voice we can get.

Voice your opinion, You have experience with issues that involve hunting that many here know nothing about SD for example.

Teach us some stuff, learn some stuff from us and have fun!!

Bob


----------



## mallardwacker (Dec 6, 2004)

Thanks Bob

We all know that money is what is driving us out. As far as South Dakota goes that is all they are concerned with and the G/O's there are the same way. More land and rifle as many hunters through as you can. What happend to enjoying the outdoors, watching the dog work, letting the new guy tag along with the group? It is very depressing. I think a person need to start at the local level, get guys together to discuss concerns and invite a game official to sit in on a topic. I'm sure this is been talked about and looked into, but I just want to keep "harping on it". The more we keep talking and bugging the right people the better chance we have.

Thanks again

Shoot the Drakes!!


----------



## Decoyer (Mar 2, 2002)

When do guides and outfitters become bad??? When they pimp a public resource. I don't care if they are from ND, CO, AR, or Canada. This is a resource that we ALL pay for to manage, there is no reason that someone should be able to get money on top of that to provide you access to a public resource.


----------



## Remmi_&amp;_I (Dec 2, 2003)

Decoyer said:


> When do guides and outfitters become bad??? When they pimp a public resource. I don't care if they are from ND, CO, AR, or Canada. This is a resource that we ALL pay for to manage, there is no reason that someone should be able to get money on top of that to provide you access to a public resource.


Yep, I know of an operation in the Butte, ND area that advertises the public lands near it's hunting lodge. I know for a fact they don't "guide" on the public land, but they point it out to people that are their for an extended period of time.


----------



## wmcpartland (Dec 13, 2004)

what a verbose post. You all need to come to the east coast and help me shoot my fields. We can't find enough goose hunters. In fact, I often find myself the night before and the morning of a hunt trying to get just one other gunner out there with me. The farmers around here think I'm a freak, humping a trailer full of decoys, spending 45 minutes setting up, only to be done hunting after the first hour with a limit of 5 birds. I spend more time setting up and breaking down a spread then I do hunting.


----------



## Remmi_&amp;_I (Dec 2, 2003)

Be careful, it could all disappear one day!


----------



## wmcpartland (Dec 13, 2004)

I think about that all the time. Fortunately, I think that day, if it comes, is way out in the future...unless all you NoDaks move to Maryland.


----------



## Brad Hanson (Nov 13, 2004)

Maybe I shouldnt make any comment but state issues aside....all I will say is dont paint with a broad brush. Take each individual case on its merits. Dont hang em all just to be sure you have the guilty ones.


----------



## dugie_fresh (Jan 10, 2005)

So g/o should only be able to hunt on land they OWN? What if you all could only hunt on land you OWN? I bet you'd really scream. The truth is that the farmer OWNS the land and is the only one who can say who can and can't hunt on it. This is the way it should be. They own it, it's theirs.

When does a g/o become bad. When he/she breaks the law. Some have and they will be punished. Just like some "average joe" hunters have, and they will be punished. G/o provide a service. Just like a mechanic provides a service by fixing your vehicle. They do what they do in a legal, ethical way and then go about their lives.

It is not just g/o who ruin hunts for people by downwinding and other things. People are people, some are good and some are bad. I'm not saying that all g/o are saints. Some do illegal things. So do regular hunters. I don't understand the idea that just because there are g/o none of you will ever be able to hunt again. It's not like they're commercial fisherman and are going to totally destroy the population, they have laws and limits to abide by. If they don't, they could lose their livelihood. I hunt a lot and have never had a problem finding a place to hunt. I bet a lot of you haven't either. However, I have had a fair share of my hunts foiled by other hunters. Not by g/o.

Lets look at this rationally and logically, and before you start to scream at the top of your lungs, think about it a little.


----------



## Dick Monson (Aug 12, 2002)

df, I have to disagree with part of your post. Outfitting is the death of hunting for most folks because of the expanding scope of it. Happened in most states around us and will happen here too unless we get off our a$$ and fight it.
Deer outfitters cause an huge loss to their neighbors crops and hay by concentrating deer. They cause more vehicle accidents also by their actions of concentrating large numbers of animals in one spot. Not to mention the increased chance of disease. It shouldn't depend on what end of the stick you are holding. Who owns the land has nothing, nothing at all to do with it.


----------



## KEN W (Feb 22, 2002)

dugie_fresh....not saying that G/O have to hunt their land .They just should not be able to lease land.


----------



## Field Hunter (Mar 4, 2002)

df....what grade are you in?


----------



## Dan Bueide (Jul 1, 2002)

dugie, the rest of the story please. After several years at this, a position such as yours almost always comes from someone with a very strong connection one way or the other to the o/g industry. With a "handle", no way for anyone to check, of course, but give us a little honest background for the reasons you've come to take your position on the last couple of posts.


----------



## buckseye (Dec 8, 2003)

Theres a guide near Devils Lake named dugie.... maybe this is him.

Hunting guides should only be able to guide their own land, but as an individual follow the same rules as everyone else. Fishing guides should have to pay for the fish they are making a living from. 8)


----------



## dugie_fresh (Jan 10, 2005)

Dick Monson and Ken W,

Thank you for your posts. There are several previous posts in this forum that state g/o should only be able to hunt on land they own. Those are what I was referring to.

I disagree about the leasing of land. (Hear me out) I think in some cases leasing can be good for everybody. Such as leasing land that contains a massive roost. This will help to keep birds in the area for all to enjoy. However, I see your point about leasing getting carried away. I don't think we have gotten to that point yet. There has to be some limits to the amount of land that can be leased. But for people to say that all g/o are bad just because they do what they do is not right. I'm not a g/o, I'm just a guy trying to make a point.

I see from reading my post that I may have come on a little strong. This was not my intention.


----------

