# Kent Fasteel



## stolenbase (Aug 23, 2003)

Has anyone tried it? It's nice and cheap but I don't no too much about it.


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## GooseBuster3 (Mar 1, 2002)

I just bought a case of Winchester HV that go 1550 fps for $98. thats cheap in my book .


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## Ron Gilmore (Jan 7, 2003)

SB I did try some last year. They patterned OK out of my guns but the Fiocci shells where better. One thing to keep in mind is that the shells are not sealed. This does not cause a probelm unless they get wet. Misfires rusted shot that cause you to shoot slugs instead of shot. This can be prevented if you use some cheap finger nail sealer on the ends.

Dropped one into the water and put it in the gun, and it misfired leaving the shot cup in the barrel could have been bad if I would not have checked to make sure the barrel was clear.


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## grnhd (Jun 21, 2003)

I shot som of these last year and was impressed.I load my own shells but was curious abut these Kents.They all went as fast as they siad they would and I had great patterns in my BGH.The shot was uniform and weighed at what they were supposed to for the size.One issue I did have with them was the wad that they use.It didn't hold up well to BB's with a few scrub holes in the wads that I inspected.But using 2's and 3's they didn't have a problem.As far as the water proof issue my buddy hunted with them in the rain twice and they never had any problems firing then or later,although they aint gonna be lik Drylocks.Speaking of Drylocks I checked some of the Xperts that go 1550.They did go close to that speed but the shot was CRAPPY,pitted and pellet weights were all over.And the sot charge was closer to about 1 3/16.They also use a two peice wads which some guns don't like.


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## Decoyer (Mar 2, 2002)

I went through a case last year in Saskatchewan last year. I was really impressed with it.


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## FACE (Mar 10, 2003)

It's all I shoot now for non-tox stuff because for me and my setup it just works the best. Last year during my SD duck hunt I only had two shoot at three hit ducks a second time to finish them off. Otherwise they went down dead. I use a Berreta 390 with a factory skeet choke for decoying birds and 4 shot, and geese I use same gun with patternmaster choke and BB shot both in 2 3/4" shells. Also use the 4 shot on pheasants and ruffies.


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## T Shot (Oct 4, 2002)

3 1/2" inch 1 3/8 oz Kent 2's are what I shoot the majority of the year for canadas. Knocks em dead. 2's pattern very well through my gun and 1550 fps helps alot. I wouldnt shoot anything else now.


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## SJB (Jul 2, 2003)

Well Guys I am trying a bit of it all. Kents, Feds, Win Supremes, Drylocks and a couple of boxes of Cabela's brew thrown in. Do you think that this is going to mess with my leads or should I just stick to one brand? The last seven or eight years I've stuck to BB's with the exception on shooting 2's on opening day.

What do you think?

SJB


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## Old Hunter (Mar 8, 2002)

SJB You have several brands on hand. If you have the time go pattern these and see which load your gun shoots the best. Does speed make a difference in leed? I suppose there is some difference between a 1300 and a 1550 but I dont think it will effect the hitting that much With a good follow through either load will connect.Slower usually means more shot . There is merit to that also. Good luck


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## Dan Bueide (Jul 1, 2002)

Slower also generally means tighter, better patterns as the knuckle-balling and other ballistics effects of trying to push spheres through space that creates "pattern" is less sever at slower speeds. Remember how it was always easier to throw a curve-ball into the wind?

I'm a speed-freak convert. The new recent trend is to recognize speed as more of a marketing gimmick and go back to the slower/heavier loads, which the kill data of CONSEP has proven is far more lethal and results in much less wounding. Anything above 1300 fps is more gimmick than effective and often counterproductive in terms of payload tradeoff. The physics of spheres (as opposed to bullets) is such that for each 100 fps above 1300 at the barrel, only 3 fps is retained at 40 yards.

I know this is contra to all the marketing today, but there aren't a whole lot of doubters among those who have attended a recent CONSEP seminar.


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## T Shot (Oct 4, 2002)

This speed vs. shot thing has been argued over and over again. I have killed geese with super fast loads and heavy loads. In my honest opinion, I feel more confident with that little extra speed than more shot. I know many, many people who don't agree and thats alright. If the geese are close enough, however, it really doesnt matter what you use. Stick with the load you are most comfortable with and what works best through your gun. You should be fine. I also dont agree that speed is a "gimmick", when nearly every load out there is much faster has less shot than the comparable loads last year.


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## Dan Bueide (Jul 1, 2002)

T-Shot, like I said, I'm a speed convert. Make a point of hitting a CONSEP seminar. There was at least one just North of you this summer (Sissieton?) and will likely be a couple others in SD next summer. Roster has no particular axe to grind on fast versus heavy, and through thousands of kills observed, x-rayed and the autopsied, the data and his thoughts on the subject are pretty compelling.

If you want to kill more and wound less, you need about 1300 fps in steel. Above that speed, you don't trade speed for payload, because it's darn hard to make minimum pellet counts at longer ranges with lighter payloads.

Where we agree is with respect to shorter, more preferable shots. Because of the cone shape of a pattern, it's much easier to reach pellet counts and therefore "lethality" at shorter ranges with less payload. If you are religious about only taking close shots, by all means shoot the lighter/faster loads, as the lighter loads have the requisite payload to meet pellet counts at shorter ranges. If, however, you're looking for one load to meet "lethality" requirements at all ranges, at or above 1300 fps, payload is more "lethal" than speed.


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## Doug Panchot (Mar 1, 2002)

Dan,
Chris shot 3" BB's from Kent out of my BGH last early season with great success. I don't think he even had a cripple with the stuff. I bought a couple of boxes to use and it shot well. I'm into Winchester Supreme BB's with 1 3/8oz payload at 1450 and the 1 3/8 2's @ 1450 for Geese with my BGH 10. And for my 12 BGH I shot 3" 2's with a Payload of 1 1/4 with the Hi-Velocity Winchester Drylox's. This is also a good goose load out to 35 yds. All of these pattern well out of my gun. I have pattern my loads through them over the years.


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## Dan Bueide (Jul 1, 2002)

This lighter/faster stuff will work just fine if all shots are close, you never stretch, you kill clean on the first shot and never need to follow up at longer distances, etc. I don't know many folks that can say all of that is true all the time.

For shooting big geese at longer distances, CONSEP reccomends BBB to T. Over decoys, BB to BBB is reccomended. That's how I settled on BBB.

I guess what I'm suggesting is if you're looking for one load to do it all and always, most gun/choke/shell combos will require heavier and slower, contrary to all the marketing hype lately.

But don't take my word for it. Step back X yards (the longest shot you'll take) from the board and let fly with the stuff you like. If you can make 55-60 hits in a 30" circle, you're good to go.


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## gandergrinder (Mar 10, 2002)

This is kind of off the subject but... If I am shooting longer ranges I take a different gun. Long range take the ten. Decoying early canadas a twelve is fine. Late season decoying I switch back to the ten. I know this isn't possible for everyone to have two three or four guns but it is the best solution I think.

The idea of the one gun for everything is kind of bunk but it has been pushed by the manufacturers. A fast swinging light twelve with a shorter barrel on decoying ducks is awesome but that same light gun when trying to shoot long range geese with heavy loads is pretty terrible. Same thing goes the other way. Heavy tens are not good on close working ducks.


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## GooseBuster3 (Mar 1, 2002)

But GG we dont have the money like what you have to spend on guns!!


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## T Shot (Oct 4, 2002)

Been to one, and thats why I'm not saying that heavy loads are worthless. But I still will shoot what I feel most comfortable with and which works best for me. But lets think about something here, I said I use a 2 shot for most of the year at 1550 fps. In my 1 3/8 load, I have an average of 172 pellets compared to 97 in an 1 9/16 load of BBB. Now I know the shot is smaller, but by .04 of an inch. I also know that with an 1 3/8 BBB load you get 85 pellets, so I could see where there could be a problem with a fast, big load like that. I also use 1 3/8 BB, usually later in the year and on Snows, but that still gives me an average pellet count of about 100. So I am going to agree that in the bigger shot sizes (T and BBB), the lighter loads are not as lethal as the heavy loads. But, with the smaller size shot, you get a little extra speed (which, in my experience, has never "whiffled" while testing or patterning), and the same amount if not a higher pellet count. This is why I shoot the lighter, smaller loads.


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## Dan Bueide (Jul 1, 2002)

The name of the CONSEP seminar I attended was called a "wounding loss" seminar. The focus was to reduce the estimated all-waterfowl all-US estimated 25% crippling rate. In raw numbers, this translates into over 3 million wounded waterfowl in the US each year. The goal is through a variety of techniques, including proper shotshells, to make hunters more lethal and produce less cripples. As you can tell, I was very impressed with the seminar, methodologies and supporting data.

I know other guys who shoot a fair amount of dueces/bb's at big geese and kill a bunch doing so. The CONSEP data would suggest that dueces are not an optimal shot size for obtaining "lethality" on big geese, or even BB other than big geese at normal decoying ranges. I suppose, but don't know, that smaller shot sizes (to a degree) can also be lethal (not cripple-producing) at very close decoying ranges.

I guess only you can be the judge on whether you for whatever reason feel you're as or more lethal at your shooting distances operating outside of the CONSEP reccomendations. I've killed a lot of critters with all different shot sizes. I've also wounded more than I feel good about. For me, I'm going to give the CONSEP stuff a real go and see if I can get my wounding way down. About 4-5 hours at the patterning board told me the CONSEP methods will probably go a long way in helping me do so.


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## MRN (Apr 1, 2002)

Dan,

Glad Roster has upped the speeds to 1300 f/s - he used to talk 1100 to 1300 f/s and his CONSEP tables were marked 1225-1450 f/s. When you raised the velocity question he tended to point to the upper end of his scales as being fine for "good" holes, while he continud to preach about making "enough" holes.

M.


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## Dan Bueide (Jul 1, 2002)

Mark, for lead, the reccomended speeds were lower. For steel, 1300'ish was what he said was a good threshold. He didn't have any beef going above that point (although he was very clear that the benfits were minimal) so long as you weren't trading payload needed to make minimum pellet counts to do so. With only so much room in a shell, it get's progresively harder to make the pellet counts the larger the shot size and the faster the push, as invariably faster means less payload.


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## prairie hunter (Mar 13, 2002)

Marketing - just like the videos that sell the latest hot call. Use what works for you, but be careful not to pay too much for too little.

High velocity was essentially accomplished by selling shells with less steel. Did they change the amount of powder or type(S) of powder also?

Now if steel was the most expensive component in my shot shell manufacturing process, I would be looking to reduce that cost.

If I can market my lower mfg cost shells at a higher sell price or as improved performance than I really have a winner.

Note now that Federal is offering their heavy high velocity shells as an inbetween shell.

HV = 1550 fps
HHV = 1450 fps
classic magnum = 1325 to 1350 fps


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## Ron Gilmore (Jan 7, 2003)

While pass shooting last fall I had some loads of Fiocci 3" 2's that where 1300 fps and 1450 fps. Allowing for human error and the fact that I had pattern both loads. I was suprised that the 1450 tended to produce clean kills at the 30-40 yard range better than the 1300. I realzie that this is not a true test but it was windy so I contributed the better perfomance to the speed.

Now Dan you are making me think I could have bought a few more boxes of shells, as one dan never have enough with the extra money I would have saved.


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## T Shot (Oct 4, 2002)

I still dont see where moving down to a pellet size that is at most .01 inch smaller (From BBB to BB), while gaining speed and a having an equal number of pellets, is going from a goose on the ground to a cripple that you wont recover (with a smaller, faster load). I have witnessed geese fly away with nothing more than a few lost feathers after being shot at with the "heavy load". I believe that little 150 fps would have made the difference. Steel loses velocity so quickly, you should take every little bit you can. But to each his own, we all have our beliefs and we should stick to them. All I know is that Monday reeeeeeally cant come soon enough, I need something better to do than debate about this. (Not that it wasnt interesting) :beer:


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## Old Hunter (Mar 8, 2002)

I like the Faststeel and shoot it. The price is right. Im with Doug P I would rather shoot all Winchester Supremes but they are too spendy. I believe they retain their downrange speed very well . I think this is due to the fact that Winchester produces a very round pellet. Add to that the copper plating which which rounds and fills voids on the pellet. A nice round and smooth pellet flies straight and has better airodinamics. I actually shoot everything. I work the sales a lot. Its all in the leed.


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## DaveM (Oct 8, 2002)

A simple law of physics is the faster it comes out, the faster it slows down. You gain nothing. Speed may cover someone's inability to properly lead (at close range, remember, it slows down faster).
Down range killing power is all that matters. 
I've been using HEVI-SHOT. It kills everything...less wasted follow up shots. 
Consider the expense a fact of hunting and it's painless. After the Benelli, fancy boat, highly trained dog, motels, fuel, food, decoys, yadda, yadda, yadda (yah, tell me only the rich guys buy these expensive toys)... the cost of HEVI-SHOT for one year is worth one shot, clean kills (and you won't wear out your dog).
If you want to increase pellet count, HEVI is the way to go. A #6 HEVI will blow away the performance of a #2 or BB steel load.
I don't know anyone that tried it and went back to steel. Check the facts all over the web. I tried it (the last 2 seasons), it's true, don't waste your money on steel. :2cents:


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## tb (Jul 26, 2002)

Try the new Federal Ultra-Schok. The 3.5 inch 12 loads are pretty heavy (1.5 oz) and plenty fast (1500+ fps). They really rocked the geese this weekend. I was using Ts.


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## FACE (Mar 10, 2003)

DaveM

What physics class did you attend!?

Didn't you get the example of two cars weighing the same, one going faster than the other, and both starting to coast at the same starting point?

I seem to recall the faster car went alot farther and that when the faster car reached the starting point speed of the slower car it slowed down at the same speed.

Maybe you learned that what falls down must go back up? J.K. :wink:

I have used Kent Fasteel now for three years and have very rarely needed follow up shots. Shotgunning ability should be the number one factor in wing shooting. And keep making shots you know you can take. I've always thought that the Mn Skybusters were a group of hunters trying to see how high they can cause birds to fly! :wink:

From Ballistic Products, Status of Steel--"A #3 steel pellet launched at 1300 fps will retain duck penetrating energy out to approx. 41 yds....at 1400 fps will retain same penetrating energy to 47 yds....at 1500 fps will retain same energy to 49 yds."

A slower moving object will never catch up with a faster one. Obviously! This isn't the rabbit and the hare story.


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## DaveM (Oct 8, 2002)

Face,

1) Your car story doesn't apply. Two cars that wiegh the same...good point, HEVI-SHOT is heavier than steel.

2) This is a story of two little #2 pellets. One of steel, the other of HEVI-SHOT. They both leave the barrel at 1350 fps. Ten yards from the end of the barrel the steel #2 is already over 100fps slower than the HEVI. At 25 yards from the end of the barrel the steel is 150 fps behind the HEVI. At 40 yards the steel is still 150 fps behind the HEVI. At 110 yards the HEVI-SHOT could still kill a duck (and I am by no means saying anyone should take a shot further than 40 yards). At 55 yards the steel has nothing left (and doesn't have much before that)!

3) I'm glad you pay attention to Ballistic Products documentation of steel performance. If you go to their web-site you can read all their steel/HEVI-SHOT comparisons.

4) A slower moving object with more density will retain it's energy for a greater distance than a lighter (like steel shot) object. Are you saying that a ping-pong ball launched at the same speed (or faster speed for that matter) as a golf ball will keep up at the 20 yard mark? Which one would hurt more if it hit you in the chest (launched at the same speed, I would prefer to get hit by the ping-pong ball)?

5) Lead out performs steel. Right? Go figure. Why is that?

Look, steel works fine. I'm a conservationist and I believe in "killing" the game in the most efficient manner. Every day we have new advances happening all around us. HEVI-SHOT is one of them. As I said in my first post, don't believe me. Check out the available data and try one box of six's...you'll love 'em.

Dave :wink:


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## FACE (Mar 10, 2003)

DaveM

I in no way stated steel retains more or the same energy as lead or heavy-shot. I was commenting on you law of physics when you said the faster something come out the faster it slows down which is not true.
I know lead and heavy shot have more knetic energy but they also have less payload. I prefer using Kent because for the amount of shot combined with speed and my patterns all of my shooting is under 40 yds, no exceptions! I have used all of the non-tox stuff out there and I do agree it all works very well but is just too pricy for me for my shooting ability. My decoy wing shooting is about 85-90% because of being a proficient shot and being selective of my shots as well.

Believe me I'm not tryung to tell you your way is not any better than others but what you must realize is that each one of us must select what works best for ourselves both ethically and economically as well.I am happy for you that you have found Hevi-shot to work great for you I just hope you understand that it is'nt for everyone, same goes for Kent's stuff.

Anyways...good hunting and stay safe and ethical!
FACE :beer:


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## Dan Bueide (Jul 1, 2002)

As was explained to me, another interesting note about HS is the shot shape. I've never seen it, but supposedly it's not round - more tear dropped or light bulb shaped. This was not intended, they just couldn't get that alloy to round up using typical shot mfg methods. As luck would have it (not design, luck), the HS shot shape flies more like a bullet and less like a sphere, producing quite a bit tighter patterns. Because of the tighter patterns, you can probably get away with a lower payload and still make pellet counts.

But, I'm sticking with good old steel. I'm pretty convinced that steel loads with enough payload and quality steel through tested tubes are every bit as lethal as the more expensive shot at all reasonable ranges.


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## Ron Gilmore (Jan 7, 2003)

Cost per shell of HV $1.60. AVG Effective range 80 yards.
Cost per shell od ST $0.50 AVG Effective range 50 yards.

Skill level of shooter? The real issue in mortality or effectiveness of any load is the ablity to accurately place the shot consistanly in a manner lethal for the load being used.

Would HV provide an advantage to someone that has lower skill levels and provide more clean kills and less loss of wounded birds? I do not have an anwser to this.

I would encourage everyone to take only shots that are within your capability not the capablity of the load.
Be aware of your own limitations and work to become better, do not try and do it by improving the range of the load you use only.

Now to only personally live up to these words of advice


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## SJB (Jul 2, 2003)

Thank you Ron! I agree about the shooting distance issue. I have made a commitment to shooting ducks over decoys at 25 to 35 yards. My opinion is that at 40 yards and above is taking a chance at wounded game. At 30 yards, it dosen't matter.

SJB


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