# A New Generation of young Democrats will change everything



## R y a n (Apr 4, 2005)

New Democratic Coalition, and a New Generation 

*This article* in The National Journal is well worth a read. It looks at the demographics of this year's surging Democratic turnout and finds the makings of a new Democratic strategy, a new Democratic generation, and a new Democratic governing majority:



> From New Hampshire to California, and from Arizona to Wisconsin, exit polls from this year's contests show the Democratic coalition evolving in clear and consistent ways since the 2004 primaries that nominated John Kerry. *The party is growing younger, more affluent, more liberal, and more heavily tilted toward women, Latinos, and African-Americans&#8230;*
> 
> The implications for the general election could be significant. *If Democrats can maintain the allegiance of the constituencies now pouring into their primaries - especially young people - they could seize an edge in November's election, and potentially well beyond.*
> 
> "These are long-term opportunities that could change a generation of leadership in the country and give the Democrats a huge leg up on obtaining or achieving elective office," says Matthew Dowd, _the chief strategist for President Bush's 2004 election campaign and now a consultant for ABC News._ "But it all depends on how they conduct themselves."


The most dramatic change has been in Democratic voting by young people, something that Dowd, in a the article, says could hurt Republicans well beyond this election.



> In 2000, under-30 voters split about evenly between Bush and Gore, according to exit polls. In 2004, they preferred Kerry over Bush by 54 percent to 45 percent. In the 2006 House elections, they backed Democrats by 60 percent to 38 percent. In a race between Obama, 46, and McCain, 71, even many Republicans wouldn't be surprised to see that wide a gap among the young.
> 
> "If you look at Ronald Reagan and how he performed among youth, he created a generation of Republicans that was able to sustain itself," Dowd says. *"Well, what Bush has done in his presidency is almost the opposite: He has won elections and lost a generation. Now this generation is emerging*, and if Democrats end up winning this election, and then govern in a way that gives people a sense that it is a new politics, they will have a generation. *It will be the reverse of Reagan*."


Words to consider....


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## hunter9494 (Jan 21, 2007)

ok, not surprising as our colleges and universities are pandering to the left wing, but let's just see how many well heeled dems and affluent young dems feel when they see their wealth shrink with the proliferation of entitlement programs.

not once his Obama addressed the national debt and how he is going to pay for these many entitlements......ever wonder why? i will help you with this.....he is going to rape your paycheck like never before and after pulling the wagon for many years, he will expect you to pull some more, because the wagon is about to get loaded up with those that don't work hard enough to really succeed. i think it's just time to get in the wagon and ride with the sick, lame and lazy.

America is about to change for the worse, not better. no need to teach the pledge of allegiance or cover your heart or honor the flag or any of those corny patriotic things people have died for....yeah, we will get it right with Obama running the show... uke:


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## R y a n (Apr 4, 2005)

hunter9494 said:


> ok, not surprising as our colleges and universities are pandering to the left wing, but let's just see how many well heeled dems and affluent young dems feel when they see their wealth shrink with the proliferation of entitlement programs.
> 
> not once his Obama addressed the national debt and how he is going to pay for these many entitlements......ever wonder why? i will help you with this.....he is going to rape your paycheck like never before and after pulling the wagon for many years, he will expect you to pull some more, because the wagon is about to get loaded up with those that don't work hard enough to really succeed. i think it's just time to get in the wagon and ride with the sick, lame and lazy.


How will their wealth shrink? Specifics please. I don't give credence to someone who only talks in generalities, as when the facts are laid out, those types of misconceptions are bare and pointless.

Do you really believe that these "well heeled affluent young dems" got to be that way by being naieve and dumb? What are they missing that you know? And you know this because ... you have had training in... or have read xxxx?

Why does the national debt exist in the amount it does today? How much has it grown in the last 8 years? why would that be? what has been happening in the last 8 years that is so expensive?

The government runs primarily off your Federal income taxes. How that money is spent is where the rub falls. Different political groups handle it differently, hence their different philosophies.

The problem we have, is a government or a political party rather, that spends forward, instead of spending current.



hunter9494 said:


> America is about to change for the worse, not better. no need to teach the pledge of allegiance or cover your heart or honor the flag or any of those corny patriotic things people have died for....yeah, we will get it right with Obama running the show... uke:


Being democratic (which I am not, in case you didn't catch that little ditty in an earlier thread), does not equate to not teaching the pledge of allegiance or not covering your heart. That is a whole new discussion that involves political correctness. There are a LOT of people (DEMS & R's & L's) that are very angry with this. It crosses political and demographic lines.

I'd suggest to be careful cutting a wide swath with the accusations. Generalizations do not make for accurate assessments.

Ryan


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## hunter9494 (Jan 21, 2007)

ryan-

apparently you don't listen to Obama very closely. he talks in sweeping generalities as well, with no specifics of how to get it done. since that resonates true for you, why should you expect me to paint a picture with a smaller, more detailed brush?

sure, we know why the debt is there, tons of money spent on fighting terrorism and the war in Iraq. right or wrong is not the issue, the issue is how the hell does he pay off any debt and still engage in the biggest entitlement program in history, at the risk of totally bankrupting the country?

he does not have an answer for this, just plunge ahead and do it now and pay for it later.....he is no different that any other politician, not a bit when it comes to spending money on programs/entitlements we can't afford. change......what change?? tax and spend and invite more illegal aliens to enjoy our prosperity at the price of law abiding tax payers?

on second thought, maybe he could sell pot with the government logo and raise some cash to help pay off the debt or fund his proposed health care program. :eyeroll:


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## R y a n (Apr 4, 2005)

hunter9494 said:


> ryan-
> 
> apparently you don't listen to Obama very closely. he talks in sweeping generalities as well, with no specifics of how to get it done. since that resonates true for you, why should you expect me to paint a picture with a smaller, more detailed brush?
> 
> ...


H9494 (I don't even know your name... what is it?)

I'll attempt to put some "substance" to the questions you've continally offered here. Mind you I say "questions" in a relative sense, as you've instead made a bunch of sweeping generalities, jabs and accusations towards Obama without anything but emotional opinion to back up the claim. You make a veiled attack at my polical acumen that if I like Obama's inspiration, I _must_ like sweeping generalities with no need for specifics. Thus it absolves you of any need to backup your claims with specific examples. Nice. You get to make accusations. We all need to answer your rhetoric. Excellent approach. You think that will inspire people to try convincing you? Do you really believe I am that stupid or naieve? Have you read the majority of my posts/replies in this forum over the last few years? Shall we compare intellectual horsepower? Do you really want to go down that path?

You pass off any accountability for the mess of debt we are in, justifying it with your own brand of "right or wrong", and insinuate that he must first account for his predecessors shoddy accounting, before getting to enact his own method for bringing the country back into order. You are saying Obama doesn't get to start with a clean(er) slate like Bush. Bush inherited a bunch of "things" that allowed him to start off his presidency running in the direction that he saw fit to pursue. He didn't have a staggering debt, deflated dollar, recession prone economy, stagflation woes, or mortgage crisis to deal with upon entering office. But I digress... I"ll try not to go down that path, and instead focus on this narrow line of logic to start with....

I looked up Obama to review his record. I looked at the bills that he both authored and introduced. Anyone who has been around politics, and is honest, realizes that there are a lot of reasons why a Senator votes one way or another on bills (or misses votes). However an examination of the bills that Obama cared enough about to author and introduce revealed much to me: what he cares about, what his priorities are, how he tackles problems.

And the list of co-sponsors showed something about how he leads, inspires and works with others.

Finally, looking at which bills actually passed is pretty indicative of how effective each would be at getting things done.

*Before I get into the nitty gritty, let's all be honest here. It is damn hard to get anything through Congress these days.*

Here is a few of the highlights of what he has done recently:

Three bills on energy including 
*• S.1151 :* A bill to provide incentives to the auto industry to accelerate efforts to develop more energy-efficient vehicles to lessen dependence on oil; 
*•S.115 :* A bill to suspend royalty relief, to repeal certain provisions of the Energy Policy Act of 2005, and to amend the Internal Revenue Code of 1986 to repeal certain tax incentives for the oil and gas industry; and 
*•S.133 :* A bill to promote the national security and stability of the economy of the United States by reducing the dependence of the United States on oil through the use of alternative fuels and new technology, and for other purposes. Obama wants to "repeal certain tax incentives for the oil and gas industry". Clinton sees the answer in a "temporary oil profit fee" and to "expand certain energy tax incentives" for alternative energy. Obama's alternative energy bill (S.133) was co-sponsored by Harkin, Lugar and Salazar. Clinton's bill again had no co-sponsors.

On health care he introduced ten bills/amendments, including one amendment that passed: *S.AMDT.1041 to S.1082 *To improve the safety and efficacy of genetic tests. Other issues addressed in his proposed health care legislation were AIDS research (*S.823 *), hospital report cards (*S.692 - the V.A., and S.1824 - Medicare*), better emergency care (*S.1873*), and drug price controls (*S.2347*). He also had one of his health care initiatives passed in the Senate, the aforementioned amendment to Kennedy's *S.1082*, the FDA Revitalization Act.

I was simply blown away when I started going through more of his record. I've already mentioned his bills on health care and energy.* In addition he had introduced bills on Iran, voting, veterans, global warming, campaign finance and lobbyists, Blackwater, global poverty, nuclear proliferation, and education. *

*On Iran: S.J.RES.23* : A joint resolution clarifying that the use of force against Iran is not authorized by the Authorization for the Use of Military Force Against Iraq, any resolution previously adopted, or any other provision of law.

*On voting :* Passed out of Committee and now on the Senate Calendar for Feb. 22, 2008 
S.453 : A bill to prohibit deceptive practices in Federal elections Please check this out! This is a great bill. We need this. I can't believe that this time voter intimidation is not already illegal.

*On veterans and military personnel: S.1084 :* A bill to provide housing assistance for very low-income veterans;

*On global warming : S.1324 :* A bill to amend the Clean Air Act to reduce greenhouse gas emissions from transportation fuel sold in the United States;S.1389 : A bill to authorize the National Science Foundation to establish a Climate Change Education Program; S.AMDT.599 to S.CON.RES.21 To add $200 million for Function 270 (Energy) for the demonstration and monitoring of carbon capture and sequestration technology by the Department of Energy. (This last one passed both the House and the Senate as part of the budget bill.)

*On campaign finance and lobbyists S.2030 :* A bill to amend the Federal Election Campaign Act of 1971 to require reporting relating to bundled contributions made by persons other than registered lobbyists; and S.AMDT.41 to S.1 To require lobbyists to disclose the candidates, leadership PACs, or political parties for whom they collect or arrange contributions, and the aggregate amount of the contributions collected or arranged.

*On Blackwater S.2044 :* A bill to provide procedures for the proper classification of employees and independent contractors, and for other purposes, and S.2147 : A bill to require accountability for contractors and contract personnel under Federal contracts, and for other purposes.

*On global poverty S.2433 :* A bill to require the President to develop and implement a comprehensive strategy to further the United States foreign policy objective of promoting the reduction of global poverty, the elimination of extreme global poverty, and the achievement of the Millennium Development Goal of reducing by one-half the proportion of people worldwide, between 1990 and 2015, who live on less than $1 per day.

*On global nuclear proliferation S.1977 :* A bill to provide for sustained United States leadership in a cooperative global effort to prevent nuclear terrorism, reduce global nuclear arsenals, stop the spread of nuclear weapons and related material and technology, and support the responsible and peaceful use of nuclear technology.

I counted nine education bills, but I've grown weary of trying to prove more to you.

Ahem. You were saying H9494?

You have been s3rved.

Ryan

edit: Here is an add'l list of his fait d'accompli:



> Obama's Success:
> S.AMDT.1041 to S.1082 To improve the safety and efficacy of genetic tests.
> S.AMDT.3073 to H.R.1585 To provide for transparency and accountability in military and security contracting.
> S.AMDT.3078 to H.R.1585 Relating to administrative separations of members of the Armed Forces for personality disorder.
> ...


*Added:* I realize, of course that several of these amendments are exactly the same. They were added to spending bills. My only reason for including them is for completeness. They are not here to pad out Obama's record. Furthermore, I want to make clear that I only looked at one single year, 2007. This is not meant as a comprehensive review of Obama's entire Senate record. If you are interested in doing your own research, please go to http://thomas.loc.gov and look it up.


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## hunter9494 (Jan 21, 2007)

ryan-

you have the time and ability to access info on the Internet. your fingers have found the keyboard, but i don't have time to play that game, it simply proves you can find his website and you have the ability to "cut and paste". congratulations. does that make you feel superior? if so, it takes very little to validate yourself, as you simply have taken info off a site to validate what you like about a candidate. that is fine, but the exercise falls far short of validating your perceived super intellectual ability. :eyeroll:

here is what i know and what i see in Obama that makes me extremely skeptical.

he slams whatever the flavor of the day is in the state he is campaigning in and the voters he seeks to woe.......like all the rest, no change here.

he says he is against big oil and *the NAFTA agreement in its present form, yet behind the scenes he dispatch's a campaign organizer to Canada to sooth a Canadian trade ministers nerves, BEFORE the debate with Hilary in which he says he would renegotiate the agreement.....like all the rest, he tells the big lie and what the voters want to hear.*

he has irresponsibly campaigned to enact the biggest entitlement program we will ever see in this country, with no mention on how to fund Medicare and Social Security, which are in big trouble, in case you don't follow the stories, with no plan to balance the budget.

granted, i can't see how he can be responsible for the mess that Bush has left, but if he chooses to ignore the deficit and plunge head long into a reckless social spending program, the results could be disastrous.

finally, i don't support allowing illegal aliens the right to schools and hospitals in this country (much less a driver's license), when the tax payer must pick up the bill. you should experience this in Texas, directly, as i live it and deal with it daily, maybe then you would understand.

finally, don't you find it interesting this "wonderful orator" has an answer for everything, every problem, every issue that people want solved??

don't you find it intersting that he blames everything (including an economy that is reeling from a subprime crisis and record oil prices) on the republican incumbent? yep, business and politics as usual with this guy. he claims to have been correct or everything and all his programs will be the best and all his bills introduced have been the best, and , and..
and Hilary is exposing the myth, finally.....people are beginning to see what this guy is about.......tell 'em anything to get their vote!

i am suspicious how much you can understand and appreciate being tucked away in a state that has more cattle than people (no offense to any other residents of the great state of ND) but the fact is until you live and deal with people in major metropolitan areas of the US, as i have done, you are simply "shooting from the hip" and showing me very little concerning your wonderful intellectual experiences.


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## Plainsman (Jul 30, 2003)

> It looks at the demographics of this year's surging Democratic turnout and finds the makings of a new Democratic strategy, a new Democratic generation, and a new Democratic governing majority:


That's exactly what happened in Minnesota when they elected Jesse Ventura. What a nut job he was. The same thing may happen nationally this year. The college crowd fed a diet of liberalism each and every day will vote strong towards Obama. Then they will grow up, go out and get a job, and find that their hero is taxing the crap out of them.


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## R y a n (Apr 4, 2005)

hunter9494 said:


> ryan-
> 
> i am suspicious how much you can understand and appreciate being tucked away in a state that has more cattle than people (no offense to any other residents of the great state of ND) but the fact is until you live and deal with people in major metropolitan areas of the US, as i have done, you are simply "shooting from the hip" and showing me very little concerning your wonderful intellectual experiences.


Ahem...

you must be new here and haven't read any of the earlier posts...

You do realize H9494 that I live in Washington state correct? I am originally from North Dakota, (a Red state that had 2 Blue Senators for most of my youth.)

I now live in a state that is overwhelming Blue in the western half (where I live in Bellevue/Redmond/Seattle, and vastly more Red in the Eastern half of Washingtion state which is a LOT like North Dakota in culture, socioeconomics, industry, and politics).

FYI to you... other than Berkley/San Francisco, I live in the most liberal, hippy, birkenstock wearing, granola crunching part of the country. Did I mention that the population of this county is a shade over 2,000,000... that is *this county*.

Which county did you say you lived in again?









I work at Microsoft (in one of the legal and security departments) in Redmond, and live in Bellevue, WA.

Here's some info for your review:

http://money.cnn.com/magazines/moneymag ... 05210.html

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bellevue,_Washington










I live and work with some of the brightest, sharpest minds in all of America my friend. During that time, I've travelled in 44 of 50 states, and 8 foreign countries before the age of 30. I have an advanced degree, and am currently considering applying for law school for fun. Not that I'm sure you care, so I won't go into further details, however it is fair to say that I'm just a *bit* involved in politics locally.

Would you like to know my SAT or better yet my recent LSAT score too?

I *might* have a bit more knowledge, experience and perspective than you might think :wink:

whatta ya say? Maybe so?

Hmm?

:roll:


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## Lil Sand Bay (Feb 2, 2005)

Its the Republican base that's the story of this election cycle. The true conservatives, and religious right who backed Bush for eight years feel justifiably betrayed, and have no where to go. Tough lesson.


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## zogman (Mar 20, 2002)

Ryan,

Let me lighten this up a little with a real important question.
What is your sporting clays average?
and we welcome you to GF if you deside on UND Law school.
I do enjoy and appreciate all the reading you provide us. :beer:


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## R y a n (Apr 4, 2005)

zogman said:


> Ryan,
> 
> Let me lighten this up a little with a real important question.
> What is your sporting clays average?
> ...


LOL ouch.

I'm not sure I'd like to find out right now. It has been awhile since I've been able to shoot a few rounds! 

Thanks for the kind words Zogman. I'm glad to see that some here have been enjoying all the postings as of late. I just figured this was a "down" time for hunting/fishing for a few weeks until the snows move back in and the ice melts.

My folks have been trying to persuade me to come back to ND for school. I definitely considered it. I wish the Law School was in Bismarck instead of GF. Those winters up there are bitterly cold indeed.

Seattle U has a great night law school program here. I might take courses over the course of 4 years at night, as that would allow me to continue the day job too.... of course I've got more than a few buddies and girls that definitely are influencing me to stay here too...

I'm just kickin around different options.

I plan on driving the Harley back to ND this summer, so maybe I'll be able to stop in and meet a few people along the way, and maybe if I'm really lucky I'll get a chance to shoot a few clays again! 

Ryan


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## Ron Gilmore (Jan 7, 2003)

Ryan, I am not disputing the impact that the young voters have been coming out in large numbers and much of it is the newness of Obama and his charm.

But primary and gen election are a lot different. Even old hat political people are pointing to the fact that nothing has come out to cause the charm so far to be tarnished. Young voters tend to not be long term motivated voters as well they get hot in the cold of winter and spring then come fall are more engaged in other things like school or their jobs.

McGovern was the last primary recipient of youth vote and come Nov they bailed even with the war in Vietnam raging and riots and demonstrations being held across this country.
Once the primary season was over and the message shifts back towards the center as it will with either Obama or Hillary those young people become disillusioned and feel betrayed.

Time will tell if this carries over. I am betting it will not at least to the extent we see in the primary. Plus while primary numbers are up they still a lot lower than the gen election and remember caucus voting does not represent anything but grass roots voters.

It will be interesting to see the national polling in the next couple weeks with the NAFTA issue and it appears a possible Hillary victory in OH and maybe in the primary in TX as well. See if McCain once again appeals to the national numbers above Hillary and Obama.


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## cwoparson (Aug 23, 2007)

Here is all 152 of his bills. I don't see anything there that is earth shattering. Actually other than some attempts to give more money to non workers or low income workers, I don't see much of any of them doing anything for the average American. I could be wrong but I believe one of his bills actually passed and became law. Guess his colleagues didn't think much of his bills. Most of them died in committee. They can be viewed here. http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/bdquery/? ... ma++Barack))+01763))


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## R y a n (Apr 4, 2005)

Ron Gilmore said:


> Ryan, I am not disputing the impact that the young voters have been coming out in large numbers and much of it is the newness of Obama and his charm.
> 
> But primary and gen election are a lot different. Even old hat political people are pointing to the fact that nothing has come out to cause the charm so far to be tarnished. Young voters tend to not be long term motivated voters as well they get hot in the cold of winter and spring then come fall are more engaged in other things like school or their jobs.
> 
> ...


I agree Ron. It will definitely be interesting.



cwoparson said:


> Here is all 152 of his bills. I don't see anything there that is earth shattering. Actually other than some attempts to give more money to non workers or low income workers, I don't see much of any of them doing anything for the average American. I could be wrong but I believe one of his bills actually passed and became law. Guess his colleagues didn't think much of his bills. Most of them died in committee. They can be viewed here. http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/bdquery/? ... ma++Barack))+01763))


I agree that much of his legislation is not really earth shattering type stuff. But then again... that is exactly what is frustrating those who run against him, as they don't have anything to use against him. He keeps a low profile in certain ways, that could be intentional or not if he knew he was preparing a run for president. On the other hand, it could be constued that he lacks substance, wont' vote on the hard issues etc etc..

Presidents exist to be party leaders, cheerleaders, policy makers, and motivators. They need to have good vision, the ability to articulate that vision, and the ability to work both sides of the aisle to gather bi-partisan support for controversial issues.

Obama has that ability. I'm not concerned that he didn't have much ground breaking legislation passed. I look at his resume, his work prior to joining the Senate, the types of issues that drive him, and his ability to inspire a whole new generation of citizens who haven't had a voice in politics, or an inspirational leader that they can rally behind.

There are those (even on this forum) who will take great efforts at bad mouthing him at every opportunity. They are not seeing the bigger picture about what the candidacy of this man represents to millions of US citizens who haven't had a candidate they can call their own.

Now they do. Politics is changing. Change doesn't always go the way we want it to unfortunately. We can gripe all we want, but let's face it. Forces are happening in this country that most of us have no ability to control.

The United States as a nation is changing. It's economics, it's culture, it's very fabric.

Either learn to adapt to changes and make the best of them, or face a future of disenfranchisement.

Or so it seems to me....


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## cwoparson (Aug 23, 2007)

I agree with Ron Gilmore on this one. We see this kind of reaction from the young generation almost every election at different levels of participation. Today we have the American Idol and Let's make a Deal crowd that love the hooping and shouting atmosphere with partying thrown in after the excitement. They love the festivities offered by the primaries as it mimics their life style of electronics and television heroes. But when election day comes around in November where they have to walk into a quiet hall or room to pick up a piece of paper, step into a booth and mark or punch in a name choice without so much as being allowed to give a small shout of hooray, they are noticeable absent. As much as I dislike the guy, Clinton was right, it is a fairy tale.

History has shown time after time that less than 40% of those that vote in primaries show up to vote in the general election, especially the young voters while at the same time the number of people that do vote in general elections is more than 3 times as many as those that vote in primaries.

There is still 8 months to go in the election which is just now getting started in earnest. Eight months is a eternity in politics and the old devil is in the details action will start to kick in. I expect the halo around Obamas head will start to get dimmer and dimmer before November. It very well may disappear altogether. We shall see.


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## Bgunit68 (Dec 26, 2006)

Man! Ain't political discussions great? LOL. Now a more important question. Ryan, why does my Excel keep crashing. LOL J/K


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## Plainsman (Jul 30, 2003)

I don't know what it is about the far left that is alluring to many of our young people. When my son was in Korea the college students demonstrated in the fall to join North Korea and go communist. I guess colleges stimulate the young that way, because they do it every fall when college begins. 
Give me Hillary any day before Obama. I see she won Texas yesterday. Come on Hillary. Just how liberal do you have to be to get conservatives to pull for Hillary?


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## R y a n (Apr 4, 2005)

Bgunit68 said:


> Man! Ain't political discussions great? LOL. Now a more important question. Ryan, why does my Excel keep crashing. LOL J/K


:lol: yes they are indeed. I'm just glad I was able to spark some life into this forum in the past few weeks.

Excel... hmm... not enough RAM... everything on a computer has to do with not enough memory that the application wants to borrow. (You should be able to look at your Application log in your System event viewer in Administrative tools. Cross ref your time of crash with the timestamp there, then find the Red error associated with that Excel dump. Take the wording of the error and plug it into google. That will get you started down the right path.


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## cwoparson (Aug 23, 2007)

> why does my Excel keep crashing


Trying to tally liberal figures will do it every time. :lol:


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## Bgunit68 (Dec 26, 2006)

Hey Ryan. I was just kidding about Excel. When I saw you worked at Microsoft I couldn't resist. I actually just bought a new pc with 2GB Dual Channel DDR2 SDRAM and a Core 2 Duo E6550 processor. And yes, I am one of the three people in the world that actually like Vista. I had my Road Runner Boosted up to Turbo. But the funny thing is I don't know why I did. All I use it for is paying bills and hanging out on NODAK!


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