# Draft



## racer66

WASHINGTON - A widely circulated e-mail claiming that the Bush administration is trying to revive a military draft (search) is causing widespread panic in cyberspace, but Republicans said Wednesday that the conscription scare is a political ploy engineered by Democrats.

The e-mail says legislation pending in the House and Senate would reinstate the draft, claiming that "the administration is quietly trying to get these bills passed now, while the public's attention is on the elections."

The message, however, fails to state that the bill in question was authored by Rep. Charlie Rangel, D-N.Y., (search) and Sen. Fritz Hollings, D-S.C., (search) two of the most liberal members of Congress who are also staunch opponents of the administration.

"Clearly these bills are filed not by Republicans, not on behalf of the administration, but by those who are being partisan Democrats about this and trying to scare people," said Sen. John Cornyn, (search) a Texas Republican.

Rangel, in fact, has been a vocal proponent of the draft, claiming that only a draft would address the issue of the disproportionate number of working class and minority people serving in the military.

"I believe in the draft and this being a shared sacrifice," Rangel said. Rangel also acknowledged, however, that the legislation is also aimed at igniting more controversy and debate around the war in Iraq.

"It's a wake-up call as to the sincerity that people have to supporting the war," Rangel said. "If they believe in the war, they should be able to say that everyone's family should be prepared to make the sacrifice."

Rangel suggested that the threat of a draft could move public support away from the administration's Iraq policy.

"If the American people don't support it, they're not going to support the draft," Rangel said. "And the administration is going to have to take a different look as to how you get rid of evil people."

While the e-mail about the draft is anonymous, Democratic presidential candidate John Kerry has also told voters that the Bush administration is aiming to revive the draft. Kerry said that the Pentagon has been quietly collecting names to appoint to local draft boards. (search)

Secretary of Defense Donald Rumsfeld (search) hotly denied the charge.

"It's absolutely false that anyone in the administration is considering reinstating the draft," Rumsfeld said.

Despite the administration's denials, the scare has worked. There is no question that reviving the Selective Service (search) is being discussed in Washington and that legislation is being drafted. It's a notion that has many Americans, particularly parents of teenagers, inflamed. Several parents have contacted FOX News reporters regarding the e-mail. Most of the parents were shocked to learn that the proposal is coming from Democrats.

For now, parents should rest easy. Despite the political posturing, a reinstatement of the draft is not much more than an urban legend.

Hey MT, who is initiating the draft? Damn was that a backfire I just heard?


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## pointer99

bush said last night....NO DRAFT. hollings and rangle are two of the stupidist people in washington.

hollings made some fame a few years back when he said." those potentates from africa have to come over here every once in a while to get a good meal instead of eatin one another."

he had to do some serious back peddlin cause most of his constituates are black.

glad that dinosaur is retiring.

rangel shold have been idited for voter fraud for what he tried to pull in the last election.

pointer


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## Militant_Tiger

If I'm not mistaken this is the same guy who told us that there was no difference between al-queda and saddam. I will not trust my life on someone who lies.


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## SniperPride

widen your view, there are more terrorists who hate america then just al queda :roll:


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## Militant_Tiger

What does that have to do with the current issue?


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## SniperPride

Militant_Tiger said:


> If I'm not mistaken this is the same guy who told us that there was no difference between al-queda and saddam. I will not trust my life on someone who lies.


Read what you write, then read my comment.


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## Militant_Tiger

I gave a specific example as to this presidents lies, I made no assumption that al-queda was the only terrorist group out to get us, nor does that have anything to do with the issue of the draft.


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## SniperPride

Bush said no draft, end of discussion :wink:


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## Militant_Tiger

Again I fall back onto my earlier point. This president lies. You put far too much trust into the veracity of this man.

Wie glücklich für Leiter, die Männer nicht denken - Adolf Hitler


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## SniperPride

Your right, kerry never lies, never changes his mind, oh wait....
Im not amused :roll:


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## Ryan_Todd

:lol:


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## Militant_Tiger

I would prefer a president who changes his position based on new facts than a president who blatently lies and sticks with it.


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## Ryan_Todd

good point. honestly i think there both idiots.


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## pjb1816

SniperPride said:


> Bush said no draft, end of discussion :wink:


Amen


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## racer66

"[W]e urge you, after consulting with Congress, and consistent with the U.S. Constitution and laws, to take necessary actions (including, if appropriate, air and missile strikes on suspect Iraqi sites) to respond effectively to the threat posed by Iraq's refusal to end its weapons of mass destruction programs." - Letter to President Clinton, signed by Sens. Carl
Levin (D-MI), Tom Daschle (D-SD), John Kerry( D - MA), and others Oct. 9, 1998

"I will be voting to give the President of the United States the authority to use force-- if necessary-- to disarm Saddam Hussein because I believe that a deadly arsenal of weapons of mass destruction in his hands is a real and grave threat to our security." - Sen. John F. Kerry (D, MA), Oct. 9, 2002

"Without question, we need to disarm Saddam Hussein. He is a brutal, murderous dictator, leading an oppressive regime ... He presents a particularly grievous threat because he is so consistently prone to miscalculation ... And now he is miscalculating America's response to his continued deceit and his consistent grasp for weapons of mass destruction ... So the threat of Saddam Hussein with weapons of mass destruction is real" - Sen. John F. Kerry (D, MA), Jan. 23. 2003

:eyeroll :eyeroll:


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## Militant_Tiger

Racer I'm really confused as to how you see Kerry as a flip flopper. When he said that Saddam was a threat, he based his statement off the information stated at that time. However, as the faulty information was proven wrong, Kerry chose to admit his mistake and change his position based on the new facts. George Bush however stood by his claim that Saddam was a threat, even after it was proved false. I see Kerry as the better man in this instance.


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## racer66

http://billhobbs.com/hobbsonline/003523.html


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## pjb1816

Militant_Tiger said:


> Racer I'm really confused as to how you see Kerry as a flip flopper. When he said that Saddam was a threat, he based his statement off the information stated at that time. However, as the faulty information was proven wrong, Kerry chose to admit his mistake and change his position based on the new facts.


As you said earlier -- Right out of the mouth of the parrot.

Phil


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## racer66

Kerry is saying wrong war, wrong place, wrong time, so if everybody is going off of the same intel, what we knew at the time was right. He's also said he would have went to war, then he said wouldn't have, then he said he would have, then he said he wouldn't have, you go ahead and vote for somebody that doesn't have a clue between noon time and late in the evening. OOh well if he becomes pres., he'll give the Iranians nuclear fuel and see if they want to make a deal and if they don't, he'll just put sanctions on them. What an idiot. :eyeroll:


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## SniperPride

> When he said that Saddam was a threat, he based his statement off the information stated at that time.


yup the polls! 
:lol: :lol: :lol:


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## sevendogs

Our greart country is governed by a bunch of jack *****. However, they have a healthy instinct for self peservation. The draft is ruled out, because otherwise even Bush's unruly twins would find themselves under Rummy's command.


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## racer66

It's the Democratic party that has the legislation at the tabel for reinstituting the draft. 16 supporters for it, all democrats.


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## mr.trooper

* goes into seasure-like spasms at the democratic over-sights

JUST BECAUSE HE DIDNT HAVE wmd'S DOESNT MEAN HE WASNT A THREAT! he was a threat to out allies ( Isreal ) and he flat out destabalises a reagion that is know to be a hot-bed of terrorist training and recrutement! how can you be so blind!


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## Militant_Tiger

mr trooper before we invaded it was not a hot bed for terrorists, nor is it our place to wage an all out war on a country because they post a minor threat to one of our lesser allies.


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## njsimonson

Mr. Trooper.

--Israel - with friends like those, who needs enemies!

--I highly approve of the Ghostbear Clan emblem!  I piloted a Mad Cat for them for a few years...waaay back in the day.


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## pointer99

Militant_Tiger said:


> mr trooper before we invaded it was not a hot bed for terrorists, nor is it our place to wage an all out war on a country because they post a minor threat to one of our lesser allies.


mt.....

it may not have been a hot bed but it was a bed for terrorist. one of the hijackers of the achille laurel that shot an american and threw him over board was given sanctuary in iraq by sadam. he was captured there by u.s. forces.

you consider israel to be a lessor allie. really? go to u.n. votes and see how supportive they are of the u.s. they (israel) live in a region surronded by hostiles that all want to kill them.

they should have took out arafat years ago. they thought sadam was a threat when he built a nuclear reactor and issued a statement that he was going to build a nuclear weapon and take out israel. he thought he was going to be the champion of the middle east. israels air force had other plans and they took out his nuclear capabilities setting him back years in the development of an atomic bomb.

bottom line. don't mess with israel. they don't consult the u.n. before taking a preemptive strike.

pointer

pointer


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## Militant_Tiger

"it may not have been a hot bed but it was a bed for terrorist. one of the hijackers of the achille laurel that shot an american and threw him over board was given sanctuary in iraq by sadam. he was captured there by u.s. forces. "

Nearly all of the hijackers on 9/11 were saudi, you are telling me that a lone iraqi means more than all of those who took part in the plane hijackings? As far as Isreal goes, I really don't care how far they have their noses up our hineys, it only leads to more bloodshed and more lost American lives.


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## racer66

Back to the original subject of this post, it is the DEM'S that have brought forth the legislation for the draft. Also John Kerry was all for giving Iran nuclear fuel just to see what they would do with it. Democratic party is in a sorry state. :eyeroll:


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## SniperPride

Militant_Tiger said:


> mr trooper before we invaded it was not a hot bed for terrorists, nor is it our place to wage an all out war on a country because they post a minor threat to one of our lesser allies.


I posted this in the other thread but i will post it again to clarify it to the blind folded democrats, during the invasion, weapons cache's were found and some of them contained ALOT of Al queda training manuals. Go figure. Harboring terrorists is a weapon of mass destruction imho. And my brother who just got back from Iraq last week and was there for 14 months, is voting *BUSH*
:beer:


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## pointer99

Militant_Tiger said:


> "it may not have been a hot bed but it was a bed for terrorist. one of the hijackers of the achille laurel that shot an american and threw him over board was given sanctuary in iraq by sadam. he was captured there by u.s. forces. "
> 
> Nearly all of the hijackers on 9/11 were saudi, you are telling me that a lone iraqi means more than all of those who took part in the plane hijackings? As far as Isreal goes, I really don't care how far they have their noses up our hineys, it only leads to more bloodshed and more lost American lives.


listen up loli pop......

first stop trying to twist my words cause you ain't so good at it.

secondly the terrorist who shot the american in the wheel chair and threw him overboard while his wife watched was not iraqi. sadam granted him safe haven in iraq.he was a terrorist. now i know this is gonna be hard for you to grasp but a leader who gives terroist safe haven is guilty of spreading terror.

thirdly israel is the only one of our allies who show any gratitude whatsoever for what we did for their people in world war two. if you had people trying to kill your citizens every day you would most likely do what israel does without waiting on the u.n. to take a consensus of opinion.

finally look at all the members of the democratic party who urged both clinton and bush to remove sadam from power. the senate intellegence committee and i use that term losely had most of the same intell info that was provided to bush. guess what? they came to the same conclusion. they now have all developed a bad case of amnesia.

pointer


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## Plainsman

Mt

Remember this post?

Militant_Tiger
guest

Joined: 22 Feb 2004
Posts: 592
Location: Michigan
Posted: Sun May 23, 2004 11:50 am Post subject:

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

The media has really gone to the dogs, I dont see them as one sided anymore they just want to get viewers. They know that if they showed happy iraqis and safe americans they wouldnt get any viewers. They don't want to ease our fears they want to make sure that we feel that if we are not informed on the latest event we are not safe. I think your idea for a law which forced them to state whether it is fact or opinion would work quite well. It's good to know that we've all been in the same book the whole time, even though we haven't been on the same page until recently.

Tiger
_________________
If the women don't find you handsome, they should at least find you handy.

Back to top

MT, now for some reason you have chosen to believe people that mislead you. Remember the scam from CBS? You believed that, and now you believe that Bush wants the draft back. Two democrats have proposed it, and you think Bush wants it. I think you should abandon the news sources you have been using because they are damaging your credibility. If you are wrong time after time soon people do not put faith in what you say. It should be evident by now that this was just another rumor, but it somehow hurts you to let it go. Lets move on to facts. No one blames you personally that the liberals have a poor choice this fall so don't take it personal.


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## sevendogs

SniperPride said:


> Your right, kerry never lies, never changes his mind, oh wait....
> Im not amused :roll:


Changing his mind means thinking. Bush did a bunch of blunders, but cannot change his mind.


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## racer66

I like it Plains. :beer:


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## Mr. Creosote

One must look at Rangel's motives for advocating a draft and they certainly are not out of love for country sentiments. He sees an opportunity for political leverage. 
He envisions the "well connected" avoiding the draft, i.e. the sons of congressman and other high government positions. Rangel can then start hammering on his high chair tray, wave his plastic spoon around then say, "See! I told you so". Bush of course is the first to come to mind as an "evader" via the so called poltical connections of his old man. 
Wrong. 
While I abhor the thought of the "well connected" avoiding their obligations when nobody else can, there is a very sound reason, in some cases, for this. 
Again, lets take Bush for example. Bush Jr. would've been in Viet Nam at the same time that his old man was CIA director. This would present a national security compromise of the first magnitude and for obvious reasons. I wouldn't want to see the son of any CIA director in a situation where they could be singled out for capture while serving active duty in a foreign theatre of engagement
Those whose capture would present such a security compromise should be drafted just like anybody else, then assigned to a position that would prevent such compromise.
Of course Rangel is aware of this which exposes his nefarious motives, but what can one expect from a Marxist?


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## SniperPride

sevendogs said:


> SniperPride said:
> 
> 
> 
> Your right, kerry never lies, never changes his mind, oh wait....
> Im not amused :roll:
> 
> 
> 
> Changing his mind means thinking. Bush did a bunch of blunders, but cannot change his mind.
Click to expand...

Kerry changed his mind, several times, and its not about thinking for him, its about the polls. Bush no matter what the polls were saying, stayed his course. With people like you voting Im glad he did.


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## Militant_Tiger

You know why I don't trust Bush on the draft?

Bush: "America doesn't need a draft"

Kerry: "I will never reinstate the draft"

I have a feeling America might "need" one late november...


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## racer66

Again, I will restate, it's the Dems who have the legislation at the table for the draft, and some how you trust a party who has legislation in congress for the draft, rather than a party who doesn't and said they won't? You are absolutely more fried than I thought.


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## Militant_Tiger

You've got me racer, I am quite fried. After nearly a year of my "friars roast of" in this forum I'm quite toasted. I would like to see some proof on these dems putting this up for voting, however.


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## Mr. Creosote

How about today. It was voted down with Rangel voting against his own bill. With all the lib/comm propaganda foisting the notion of a Bush draft, the Dems had to back peddle on their own bill instilling a draft.


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## racer66

Charles Rangle and Hollings drafted the legislation and brought it to the table, both Dems, the rest of the supporters for the bill were all Dems. Of course everybody voted it down the other day, including Rangle and Hollings. This was nothing more than a scare tactic.


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