# GF Herald letter to the Editor



## Hunter_58346 (May 22, 2003)

North Dakota can keep its hunting all to itself

WINSTED, Minn. Having been born in North Dakota and owning land there, being a fourth generation owner and with immediate family still on the farm and having spent several thousand dollars restoring wetlands and associated uplands on that property, to be denied the flexibility to hunt at times of my choosing is an insult.

I bit the bullet last year and paid the fees, missing the good duck hunting because I chose the first two weeks. I will not do it again.

I know the money I won't spend in North Dakota in 2004 will not noticeably impact anyone and that the other landowners, especially those getting the government handouts, could care less. I have family and friends all over whom I enjoy hunting with, but after going online to buy licenses this year, I made the decision, "no more."

One day. North Dakota will join the 21st century.

Jerry Gray


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## 4CurlRedleg (Aug 31, 2003)

Good bye Jerry Gray, you will be missed like a chapped you know what!! :roll:

There is no I in WE, and WE have decided not to let the 21st century ruin OUR quality of life in ND!

Simple solution, join US by moving to Nodak!!


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## Field Hunter (Mar 4, 2002)

Hunter 55346,
Question for you? What do YOU thnk would happen to hunting in ND if non-resident land owners were allowed to hunt ND as a resident. I'll tell you. Every TDH that has a little money would be buying up land for hunting and the landgrab would be intensified greatly. I appreciate the fact that you own land and pay taxes in ND but you're now a MN resident. Get over it.

And, MN doesn't allow me the same oppurtunities as residents because I own land in MN. Move back to ND....it'll solve your problem. There are no caps on waterfowl hunters. Have your immediate family call you when the hunting picks up and buy your license then...get off the MN NR band wagon that thinks the best waterfowling is opening weekend.


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## KEN W (Feb 22, 2002)

No sympathy for you Jerry...you don't live here any more.

I was born and raised in Minn. Lived there for my first 25 years....should I expect to be treated like a resident of Minn. just because I was born there????I am now a non-res. of Minn...I pay their NON-RES fees.Guess you will have to do the same...or do as you threaten...stay home. :eyeroll:


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## buckseye (Dec 8, 2003)

woohoooo .... where's your hot spots I'll take care of them for you!!! :fiddle:


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## PSDC (Jul 17, 2003)

"And, MN doesn't allow me the same oppurtunities as residents because I own land in MN."

Field Hunter,

Please futher explain your quote.

Big difference if we are talking waterfowl and upland
between the two states for restricting NRs!

How about deer hunting, don't recall a lottery in MN!


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## Dan Bueide (Jul 1, 2002)

PSDC said:


> Big difference if we are talking waterfowl and upland
> between the two states for restricting NRs!
> 
> How about deer hunting, don't recall a lottery in MN!


Big difference is right. In '02 MN sold a grand total of 23,142 (all species) NR hunting licenses, of which a whopping 2,502 were to ND residents. When all NR hunters represent 2.77%, and all ND huters represent .3%, of total MN hunting pressure, not much in the way of NR restrictions will be effective to materially improve MN resident opportunities.


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## buckseye (Dec 8, 2003)

Hey Dan some people are going to make you remember hunting stats like they are your birthday or something. Thanks for constantly reminding people of the facts. You are a patient man, hang in there 8)


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## Hunter_58346 (May 22, 2003)

Field Hunter,,,,I have hunted here for over 40 years so I have a pretty good idea what would happen! Maybe ND should get into the 21st century like Montana has. We applied for Antelope in Montana this year and had to pay $9 for a permit to hunt public lands. This is mandatory wether you are drawn or not.
We were turned down, and that is the way it goes. But we at least have a permit to hunt public lands, wether we have anything to hunt or not.
Lets see,,,,,$9 x 30,000 NR waterfowl licenses,,,what could we pay for with that? :beer:


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## Dick Monson (Aug 12, 2002)

The boys in Montana aren't thrilled with commercialization either. From the Montana Wildlife Federation website:


> Montana's fish and wildlife resources must be kept as publicly held resources, managed by the State of Montana in perpetuity for the long-term benefit and enjoyment of everybody. We advocate strongly for no diminishing of this right.
> This campaign is crucial and it will be contentious. Commercialization and privatization has already gained serious momentum. There will be backlash from those who wish to commercialize and privatize our fish and wildlife for their own personal gain. Montana Wildlife Federation believes it is time to put a stop to these trends. MWF will need your help (political, financial and moral support) in order to defeat these interests.


Signup for the ETREE at http://www.nodakoutdoors.com/signup.php


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## PSDC (Jul 17, 2003)

Thanks for the information Dan.

But, I don't understand were that has anything to do with
restricting non-residents landowners.


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## Field Hunter (Mar 4, 2002)

Maybe MN should get into the 21 Century....you guys have more giant honkers than anyone.....try to get on the land if you drive in with a ND plate on your car. I really don't need to get into the 21st century if it means paying to hunt and generally not being able to fnd a place to hunt.
"9x30,000", keep the money! If you actually think the way huntng is in MT would a good idea then I would contact the State of MN....Hatch and Pawlenty are evidently into interstate commerce.....so hey, turn the whole state of MN into a big money making operation. You'll make a bunch of money but your residents will be the ones to suffer. Otherwise...leave it alone, How many days do you really have to waterfowl hunt. The average ND guys hunt about 2 weekends, the average NR hunts 4.7 days (2002 stats). There's NO CAP. You're welcome to come when the huntng gets good. Buy as many pheasant stamps as you wish. We welcome your money. But don't think that just because you own land in ND and moved to MN that now you should enjoy the best of boths worlds.


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## PSDC (Jul 17, 2003)

Relax Field Hunter!

Just answer my first question.

What are the differences in restrictions for waterfowl, upland
and deer for each state for NR landowners!

Can't help you if no one in Mn will let you hunt geese.

Maybe you are not asking the right people, ask the board

for some help!


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## Goldy's Pal (Jan 6, 2004)

> How many days do you really have to waterfowl hunt. The average ND guys hunt about 2 weekends, the average NR hunts 4.7 days (2002 stats


The average ND duck hunter hunts 4 days during the season??


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## gandergrinder (Mar 10, 2002)

You don't get a sample of the average ND waterfowler on these forums. You get a good sample of the out of control waterfowl freaks who spend 3/4 of there spendable income on equipment but not the average guy. If your checking this place out chances are your not the average hunter no matter where you come from.


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## Dan Bueide (Jul 1, 2002)

PSDC said:


> Thanks for the information Dan.
> 
> But, I don't understand were that has anything to do with
> restricting non-residents landowners.


Let me start by saying virtually all on this board wish there was no need for any restrictions. Really enjoyed the day that hunting talk amongst friends and acquaintances was limited to hunting stories. No one seeks to exclude any one person or any one group, just some of all, so that our state remains something different than what apparently makes us so attractive compared to where people come.

Many look for a sub-set that should somehow give them preferential treatment. So, you're an NR ND landowner. Why do you get special dibs over the the guy who spent 28 years here and just moved away 2 years ago? Or the guy who's lived in EGF his whole life, works in ND and spends all of his disposable income at Columbia Mall? Or the guy who's lived out of state his whole life but has coming back to hunt with his uncle and cousins for 30 years, long before ND was hunting was "in"?

Most everyone has a "tie" that could be used for a form of preference. Really hard to start justifying the "better" of one over another. So, the distinction probably needs to be a simple R/NR. And "land ownership" would be a horribly bad was of creating a preference. Sort of fuels the commercial fire, don't you think?


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## Bobm (Aug 26, 2003)

> You don't get a sample of the average ND waterfowler on these forums. You get a good sample of the out of control waterfowl freaks


Maybe you should amend that and remove the word waterfowl :lol: 

I can't believe anyone would use Montana as an example they should be the poster child for the direction hunting should run away from....our friends on the commercial side have really skewed things in their favor there.


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## PSDC (Jul 17, 2003)

Dan, I am not asking anyone for a preference.

I am asking for Field Hunter to give details of his
1st post.

It seems he is side stepping my questions.

Obvious, there is a BIG difference in owning land in 
Mn vs. ND when it comes to NR hunting restrictions!

Would you like me to go futher.........


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## Goldy's Pal (Jan 6, 2004)

gandergrinder said:


> You don't get a sample of the average ND waterfowler on these forums. You get a good sample of the out of control waterfowl freaks who spend 3/4 of there spendable income on equipment but not the average guy.


 :lol: Your probably right GG. I guess I was under the assumption that as a non-resident I was part of the pressure problem to a much larger scale of waterfowlers. Now that I know I'm only affecting you guys I feel better. 8) :beer:


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## Field Hunter (Mar 4, 2002)

NR deer license approximately 150.00
NR Bear license approximetely 160.00
NR fishing license, 42.00 family NR and 35.00 each for kids over age 15.
(why should I have to pay more for the fish than my next door neighbor from MN? Obviously I'm kidding)
NR youth are not allowed to hunt during MN youth season (ND doesn't make that distinction...by the way) Shoot, I would have spent a couple of hundred dollars that weekend in MN.
NR Waterfowl and Pheasant license...a bargain at 71.00, although I don't know why I'd want to put up with the 50 or so different rigs on opening morning just because the lake I have property on has an abundance of wild rice. And I'll say again, it's a bargain because I COULD hunt the whole sesaon. (But as Dan so elliquently says...there's not many of us that do hunt in MN so it's really not significant compared to NR's that visit ND)
I'd love to Moose hunt but like us you restrict the NR. If the lawsuit is successful, I'm sure Pawlenty will push for ALL NR restrictions to be lifted.
I can't spear fish right out my front door...I've been on the lake paying my taxes, enhancing the habitat and generally being a good steward of the land and lakeshore for 20 some years...shouldn't I get a break for that?......NO I'm not a resident.....you have some things in MN that are just as restrictive to NRs in MN but It's the way it is! I can live with that.

Ok Ok.....I'm relaxed now! Just a little tired of trying to explain to SOME NRs and residents, for that matter, why the hunting shouldn't be about the money. It should be about watching your dog hunt the cattails for pheasants, it should be about watching the look on a 13 year olds face when his first mallard hits the water, it should be about the enjoyment of the outdoors.....NOT ABOUT why someone feels that WE could be making a bunch of MONEY. Hunting is a SPORT!!! and there are just too many people ruining that sport by exploiting the resources.

"North Dakota can keep it's hunting all to itself" We don't want that. We just want some restrictions on a number of aspects of the hunt to decrease the pressure on the resource and make huntng BETTER for all concerned.


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## buckseye (Dec 8, 2003)

Name all the sports that the opposing team is killed for me fieldhunter. After that tell me why hunting is a sport, I just can't see it that way. It is much more important than any sport ever has been, we help keep a balance in nature with hunting. Name a sport that affects the balance of nature for me please, I can't think of any. :lol:

I for one am not into hunting for a sport, I don't do sports because I'm to busy hunting. 8)


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## PSDC (Jul 17, 2003)

Good Reply FH,

One thing, you can spear in Mn. Opens May 1 of every year.
Anyone with a valid fishing license can spear suckers!

Your state got it right when it comes to hunting, in the midwest,
it should not be considered a "sport", it should be consider part
of our heritage, PERIOD.

The only thing that divides us, is our resident address and a river!

The current problem is both sides are ignoring the "Heritage"!

The sad thing is politics will be the deciding factor, not common
sense, for the good of the habitat!

When we all lose, no one wins!


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## Field Hunter (Mar 4, 2002)

Where's Fetch when you need him?


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## Bob Kellam (Apr 8, 2004)

buckseye

I am going to jump in and give you my opinion as to why hunting is considered a sport.

I am sure that during your life you have had a bead on that trophy buck and missed just like me and probably everyone else, "fair chase". The winner in most sporting gets a trophy just as in hunting. Hunting involves exercise and stamina. Hunting involves patience. Hunting requires skill.

I for one know that if I counted up all of my missed shots vs. the game that I have harvested and used them as points in a sport, Wildlife wins!! 

I agree with your philosophy to a degree. One of the saddest things that I have ever seen was after the March 1966 blizzard, there were so many dead animals around that took cover in shelterbelts and were covered by 20 foot drifts, spring was nasty that year. There is no question that hunters are required to help keep wildlife populations in check

Have a good one!


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## buckseye (Dec 8, 2003)

Another reason it is not a sport, being a sport insinuates it is a game. All games have a start and a finish, if this were the general mentality what stops the game from being called off or coming to an end. I say hunting is so much more important than any game that has ever been played, unless you consider war a game, God instructed us to take care of his animals and garden and no where did he say call it a game. 8)

Thanks for the responce Bob K, I just don't want the non-hunting majority in this country to think we are just doing this for fun, it's more important than we are.


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## Field Hunter (Mar 4, 2002)

Come on get real! You go hunting to do your part in the never ending struggle between man and the creatures that were put on this earth for our manipulation? I go hunting because it is FUN! As long as it's legal and part of our heritage, I could care less if some tree hunger thinks otherwise. I enjoy the outdoors. I enjoy the wildlife. I also enjoy the rewards of the sport, an occasional animal to put on the table. If you're hunting just to harvest and maintain the balance of nature, which is part of the sport, then you are missing out on a big part of the over all picture.

The game starts at a specified point in time, most of us try to plan a strategy, many times there are missed shots, but eventually there will be a shot that hits the target, maybe, the game is over at a specified time. Sounds a lot like any number of sporting events out there, doesn't it? Or it could be an outline of the deer season.

I think that anyone saying that huntng is not a sport is just trying to make hunting something that it is not.


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## buckseye (Dec 8, 2003)

I guess I am more concerned with management of the resource than killing the resource so we definitly stand at opposite ends of this.

When somebody blows the whistle and your fun is over don't cry, it's only a game. WOW!!!! I am amazed at the childlike answer I recieved, I think you need to take a more serious approach to hunting or you will probaly become a non-hunter. Someday you will understand what I am saying, I hope it is not to late for you. :lol:

Oh and hunting is a sport in Europe, look at where it has taken them. Only the rich get to play the game over there. 8)


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## Field Hunter (Mar 4, 2002)

You're exactly right on one thing...when hunting is no longer enjoyable, all we'll need is a bunch of wildlife managers, like yourself running around maintaining natures balance. I don't think my answers were "childish" at all. You evidently think you are entitled to be one of God's choosen wildlife managers that has a obligation to thin out the herds and flocks. A little scary if you ask me, especailly if you don't get any enjoymet from the hunt.


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## buckseye (Dec 8, 2003)

FH wrote



> You evidently think you are entitled to be one of God's choosen wildlife managers that has a obligation to thin out the herds and flocks


I think we were all chosen by God to be wildlife managers, I guess I thought everyone cared about management. I enjoy the thrill of the kill as much as anyone and the hunt leading up to it even more, but that doesn't make it a sport somebody can pull the plug on.

You sport hunters sure do alot of complaining about each other, thats one more of the reasons I choose to distance myself from that way of thinking. 8)

Have a good one FH, I enjoy reading your thoughts  :lol:


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## MOSSBACK (Jun 10, 2004)

Field Hunter said:


> If you're hunting just to harvest and maintain the balance of nature, which is part of the sport, then you are missing out on a big part of the over all picture.
> I think that anyone saying that huntng is not a sport is just trying to make hunting something that it is not.


You have it backwards field hunter. Hunting is a natural survival tool that is born into mankind.

If you think hunting is a sport YOU are the one who is missing the big picture. YOU are the one who is making hunting somthing it is not!

Two of my biggest passions in life are hunting and football. I take both very seriously. They are not related in any way.

Hunting is a natural instinct it makes you feel alive, you are part of nature, you are a preditor in the balance of nature. IT IS NOT A SPORT !

Sadly people like you have made it a sport and have lost all sense of nature and reality.

The nuts and bolts of football or basketball or hockey or baseball is to score more points than your opponent.

Wildlife does not keep score they are in survival mode and we are also in survival mode or preditor mode.

The reason hunting is fun and we get so excited about it is that it is a natural instinct that basicly we don't need anymore.

Those of us that are lucky enough to hunt get to use the instincts that we were born with.

You can compare sports to hunting, like sharpening your skills through practice like shooting your weapon or shooting a basketball. Or your main goal is to shoot a trophy animal like trying to win a trophy in sports. Do you think humans 200 years ago did'nt practice with their weapons and hold a huge bull buffalo or elk in high regard as a successful hunt. Today if we pursue a trophy buck or a limit of 4-curl greenheads it does not mean its a sport its a product of a successful hunt. 200 years ago humans made tools, jewlery, headdresses, from their trophys to show them off to show what great hunters they were and were also valuble for trade. But do you think humans hundreds of years ago thought of it as a SPORT?? I think not.
So if a modern hunter displays a mount of one of his prey that he is proud of it does not mean it is a sport. 
There are people that think that way but they are wrong.

People that treat hunting as a sport or say that they just do it for sport are doing an injustice to hunting and giving animal rights freaks more ammo in their fight to take away humans most basic survival tools.


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## buckseye (Dec 8, 2003)

:bowdown: MOSSBACK...excellent. I am happy you understand the forseeable consequences of making hunting a sport. Thanks


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## gandergrinder (Mar 10, 2002)

Now before you go ripping my head off I am all about hunting and like it for many aspects.

Is hunting necessary today for you to eat? No. It is much cheaper to buy your food. Think gas, license shells, time etc.

Do we need people to regulate game animals? In most instances no. If we let the natural predators come back like wolves and bears and the like we wouldn't need people to shoot them. Predators and nature have a biological level that they can sustain, starvation and predation are all part of this.

If you think of yourself as a part of the predator prey cycle. Then hunting is not a sport. But if you looked at it that way then you wouldn't have any problem with shining a deer with your headlights and shooting it. You are a predator and predators use whatever means necessary to survive. Predators kill for survival. But you don't need to shoot stuff to survive. You do it for fun and food. Which means recreation or sport.

I personally don't give a rip what the animal rights people think. If you eat meat then you are no different than a hunter. The only difference is that a hunter has a shorter distance between the death of the animal and his plate. Any one who is a meat eating person and is anti hunting is a hypocryte and anything they argue with is by that definition ilogical.


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## buckseye (Dec 8, 2003)

gg wrote



> You are a predator and predators use whatever means necessary to survive


So very true that is why I have taken time to write this stuff, for the survival of the predators/hunters. And thank you I am a predator, it's been a long time since I was so hungry I had to kill an animal to eat, but I reckon it still happens in a lot of places for alot of people yet today.

The world will always need hunters but won't always need sports players.


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## drjongy (Oct 13, 2003)

Whether hunting is a sport or not is really a matter of semantics and makes no difference. Some of us hunt for different reasons, and as long as you are following the law, what does it matter...really?

Some people on this forum just like to think they are better than other because of their "philosophy", but it's just a bunch of bunk!

You hunt the way you like--I'll hunt the way I like, and we're both happy!


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## Field Hunter (Mar 4, 2002)

Any room in the lurking area? You guy's brains work a little differently than mine does. It's been fun but this is going no where fast.


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## buckseye (Dec 8, 2003)

come on guys this isn't about judging each other, it's about sharing ideas and opinions, you shared yours, I shared mine, nothing more. 8)


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## MOSSBACK (Jun 10, 2004)

drjongy said:


> Some people on this forum just like to think they are better than other because of their "philosophy", but it's just a bunch of bunk!


I don't know if you are referring to me when you say some people think they are better than others. If so thats not the way I want to come across.

Saying that hunting is not a sport is not my "philosophy" its a fact of life.

Hunting is not a game someone thought up thousands of years ago, it is a natural means of survival. It is not a philosophy, Thats just the way it is.

Hunting is hunting and sports are sports we love them both Lets just try not to confuse the two.

If hunting was a sport don't you think we would be watching it on the Olympics now?


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## drjongy (Oct 13, 2003)

Not referring to anyone in particular, just a general feeling I get from some posts on the entire site...if you don't hunt the way they do, then you're not a real sportman.

There are various reasons for hunting/fishing, and as long as you are doing it legally, any reason is legitimate.


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## Goldy's Pal (Jan 6, 2004)

Main Entry: 1hunt 
Pronunciation: 'h&nt
Function: verb
Etymology: Middle English, from Old English huntian; akin to Old English hentan to seize
transitive senses
1 a : to pursue for food or in sport <hunt buffalo> b : to manage in the search for game <hunts a pack of dogs>

:justanangel: :beer:


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## redlabel (Mar 7, 2002)

According to Webster's New World College Dictionary a sport is 1) any activity or experience that gives enjoyment or recreation

I basically hunt for enjoyment, recreation, and mostly to watch my dogs, therefore according to Webster and me hunting is a sport.


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## MOSSBACK (Jun 10, 2004)

I see you guys pulled out the dictionary. I found one in the office and looked up the word "hunt" this is also a webster's dictionary that says it's specially designed with modern definitions for home, shcool and office. I don't use it much as you can probably tell by my poor spelling on most of my posts.

Anyway this version of webster's dictionary gives the definition of the word "hunt" is - To search or look for food; to pursue with the intent of capture; to look in an attempt to find. There is not one mention of the word sport anywhere in the definition. dd:

I will let it go at that since this is another topic that not everyone will ever agree on.

HAPPY HUNTING


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## Field Hunter (Mar 4, 2002)

Compromise! What's the definition of "Sport Hunting". Since most don't hunt for food.


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## buckseye (Dec 8, 2003)

FH wrote



> Compromise! What's the definition of "Sport Hunting". Since most don't hunt for food


Nothing personal FH...Please don't say that outloud at the wrong place, thems some pretty good bullets for the anti's. We all need to learn to say how important hunting is for nature not ourselves. Gotta start somewhere sometime 8)


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