# Now shes gun shy?



## mshutt (Apr 21, 2007)

My Pure-bread golden retriever now 8 months old is now gunshy  . When she was 3-5 months old she absolutly LOVED the guns, and then i was always to busy to take her out shooting from her 6 month b-day to the 8th. This is absolutly just sickening because early goose season is only 33 days away!!!! and my dog is now gun-shy!!! She hides in my car when i take her out shooting now, just lays down in the seat and looks scared. She doesnt mind the pellet gun, must be because it makes the smallest noise, but when i bring out the .22 she just goes back into my car and waits till im done. 
I've gotten to the point where I have actually been thinking about looking for a dog training facility to take her to, so she learns everything all over again but with a professional.

Much help needed.


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## NDTerminator (Aug 20, 2003)

My guess is something happened that turned shooting & subsequent retrieves into a negative experience (harsh correction, something like a bee sting hurt her, muzzle too close, etc...).

You're going to have to start from square one and re-conditon her so that the gun means retrieves and a positive fun experience, or send her to a pro and have him do it. If you do it yourself, go slow and be patient...


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## northdakotakid (May 12, 2004)

Start taking your dog out with just the gun...NO SHOOTING... when ever you take her for a walk or a run... BUT NO SHOOTING.

This will of course require you not to walk down main street but rather somewhere outof town... but this is ow I ensure that my dogs will not be gun shy..... let them associate the gun with pleasure well before they even hear a muzzleblast.

This has worked well for me ...


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## Chuck Smith (Feb 22, 2005)

like others have stated something must have happened. Now did she get scared during the 4th with fireworks or anything like that?

Now just take everything slow. If you do it yourself or get pro help. It is now a healing process. It can go quick or very slow. Just be paitent. Good luck. Chuck


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## duckcommand (Dec 19, 2006)

Go get a loud cap gun and use it in the house alot while playing fetch with a ball or something. In the house she will be comfortable in her surroundings and will get use to the loud noise. Once she gets comfortable with that start working up from there .22 then shotgun. It shouldn't take long. I started my dog with the cap gun and worked up from there and he does great.


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## Springer (Dec 21, 2004)

I would not use a .22 around the dog. There is a lot of whine after the bullet is shot. I had a ESS that would run to the car when I shot the .22.

She didn't mind the blank gun or shotgun.

I won't shoot any rifles around my dogs anymore.


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## mshutt (Apr 21, 2007)

Springer has an excellent point about the .22. After 3 weeks of the cap gun everyday, im going to take her out shooting with the shotgun and HOPEFULLY she will not run away :-? and be ready to retrieve her first ever goose!

Thanks guys, this is VERY helpful!


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## Gordon Guy (Jul 23, 2007)

Never just take your dog out to watch you shoot. Never! So many dogs have become gun shy because some well meaning dog owner wants to get their dog used to gun fire. Dogs should be introduced to gun fire around birds. Only shoot when your dog is chasing birds.


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## gonehuntin' (Jul 27, 2006)

After you kick yourself in the a$$ for doing something so dumb as "taking her shooting with you", figure out what, if anytihing other than this made her gunshy. Now I man be assuming a lot here, but I assume that since you're using her as a goose dog, you had her retrieve hundred's of pigeon's this summer. If so, you can probably cure the gunshyness using pigeons. If not, you'll probably also cure her forever of retrieving birds if you take her goose hunting to condition her to birds. I think you should buy a good book or dvd on dog training before you go any further.


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## NDTerminator (Aug 20, 2003)

I'm getting the impression you think your pup who, if you're following a program and if there were no glitches in her training, at 8 months old is realistically another 12 months training away from her first season, is going to be cured and ready to go goose hunting by Sept.

Wrong.

You have a serious problem to fix before the dog goes in the field.

You need to figure out, if you don't all ready know, why she suddenly went gunshy. A properly conditioned gundog doesn't just wake up one morning gunshy.

Then you need to re-condition the dog frome square one. This can easily take several months, training twice a day, particularly so as your dog now views guns in a negative light. You cannot hurry this process, if you do you'll likely ruin your dog.

I think you and your dog would be best served to consult a pro...


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## Bobm (Aug 26, 2003)

Gordon Guy said:


> Never just take your dog out to watch you shoot. Never! So many dogs have become gun shy because some well meaning dog owner wants to get their dog used to gun fire. Dogs should be introduced to gun fire around birds. Only shoot when your dog is chasing birds.


Thats the correct answer. I never shoot around any of my dogs, even the 11 year old hunted a million times ones, unless there are birds in the equation.

loud noise without an assocaition to game will scare many dogs. Consider how much better their hearing is than ours and the fact they dont wear ear plugs.

the solution...

Bring her out and get her enthusiatic about retrieveing dummies once again once happy again usaully after 4-5 short training sessions without a gun

Then,
start to intro the gun a 22 rifle not hand gun with mild blanks,

let her break and chase ( thats easy to fix later you have a bigger problem)

throw the dummy in a high arc so she will be right on top of it when it hits the ground

shoot right before it hits the ground when shes really focused on the dummy.

do this for afew sessions and gradually bring the timeing of the shot closer to the timeing of your toss, do it slowly over a week or so at least

if she shows any fear bring the timeing of the shot back to right before the dummy hits the ground.

You would be a fool to hunt this dog with anyone but you shooting until she understands the relationship between the shot and a goose fall.

Do not bring her with a bunch of your friends opening day.

If she was mine I would be the ONLY person hunting over her this fall.

Make your first shot count( practice your shooting skills without the dog around) when you do take her hunting.

Stake her behind you and shoot one so she sees the whole thing bang! goose falls in plain sight, then go set her up and let her retrieve. It would be even better if you have a friend that is a deadly shot that would do the shooting while you handle the dog but remember *he has to be willing to only take one shot* not two or more just one even if the geese are landing on you, this is a dog training exercise not a hunt until you cure her.

ANY shortcuts and you risk a permanently gun shy dog, I have a lot of experience fooling with gun shy dogs.


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## Thomas Dow (Aug 11, 2007)

mshutt,
I had a similar experience with my Lab Josey. She is the first dog I've ever had. I trained her myself and she is like my third daughter. When I screwed up and shot some grouse over her a little too soon, she turned gun shy. Not terrified, but she would skulk off if she thought I was going to shoot. I too was sick thinking I ruined my lifelong dream of having a hunting partner. I actually bought a CD called Master's Voice and followed the instructions to a tee. Then started off slow like many of the others have already said. I had my wife throw a dummy 80 yards away and fire a .22 pistol. I did this for a week then moved up 10 yards. When we could fire the pistol next to her, we started all over with a 20 ga 80 yards away, closing in 10 yards each week. I don't know if it was the CD, or just the slow re-introduction to guns but it worked. She's now three and she's a great duck dog (if I do say so myself)

Cut em


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## kgpcr (Sep 2, 2006)

One of the best ways to break or condition to gunfire is to take the dog to a trap range. start well out in the parking lot and let the dog lead you on the leash. when she walks toward the range let her go when she stars walking the other way just stop. soon the dog will be up next to the firing line and it will not even notice the gunfire. let her get as close as the shooters will allow. i have done this as at a trap range by my house and i knew many of the shooter and she would aproach wihtin 10ft on her own. DO NOT UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCES PULL THE DOG TOWARDS THE GUNFIRE. it may take several trips but it works great. If you start when the pup is young enough you should never have a problem with being gunshy. I started with my dog at 7 weeks the day i got her home. blank gun at 100ft. never had a problem with gunshy dogs. also i love to use a dummy launcher. my dog sees it coming and goes wild spinning in circles as she knows its fun time! She gets to retrieve and the sound of gunfire will bring her running every time. Gunfire =FUN to her.


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## hunter9494 (Jan 21, 2007)

i am sorry, but there is no way in hell i would start my pup out at a trap range! multiple shots, in the parking lot? there are much, much better ways to introduce noise and the sound of shots and this sure isn't one of them, period. asking for big trouble here folks!


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## gonehuntin' (Jul 27, 2006)

kgpcr said:


> One of the best ways to break or condition to gunfire is to take the dog to a trap range.


That may be one of the worst pieces of advice ever offered on this forum. Never, ever, ever, ever take a young dog to a skeet or trap range. Doing this and subjecting the dog to fireworks are the two major causes of gun shyness. When you take a dog to a gun club, there is NOTHING pleasant to associate the loud and unpleasant bang's with. As Bobman said, it's all about the birds. Only associate gunfire with a pleasant stimulus.


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## kgpcr (Sep 2, 2006)

You know Del Tone Kennels In ST. Cloud the home of Several National Champion Labs and one of the best lab training facilities in the US was right next to a trap range. I know i used to work there and when people brought in a gun shy dog they went into the kennel. you start out where the noise is not really even heard and let the DOG head that way. The sound starts out VERY low. They used that drill to cure some gunshy dogs and it worked great. I worked there during high school during the summers and after school. You cant argue with what works.


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## Bobm (Aug 26, 2003)

KGPCR

It may have worked for you you were just lucky it defineitely has not worked for many people, I have had to undue the damage done with this method on several dogs. I have almost 40 years experience training labs and shorthairs.

GH used to run a training facility with up to 120 dogs at a time in it. 
IF he gives you training advice you can believe its good advice.

Thats almost as many dogs as I've trained in my entire life.

WHen you are training dogs you use the highest percentage method available for success, what you never want to do is use something that is just as likely to ruin the dog and make a big problem.

The probable reason it might work for the kennel you mentioned is because of the very low continual sound and the fact that the dogs are surrounded by many other dogs that are already accustomed to it and show no fear.

Not many people have that setup.

*DO NOT BRING YOUR DOG TO A SHOOTING RANGE TO INTRO IT TO GUN FIRE THAT IS A VERY BAD IDEA *and just as likely to make the dog gunshy as heck. Read any training book watch any tape on the topic you will not see that suggested by any reputable trainer ever.

KGPCR
I am not trying to be demeaning you were just lucky with that "Particular" dog some dogs you could shoot a cannon over them and they never fear it, most you have to do it right or risk ruining them.

IF there is not a retrieve in the case of retrievers or no bird in the case of pointers there should never ever ever ever be a gunshot near them, even as adults.


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## Gunner (Oct 30, 2002)

If she is nuts about birds and a has a soft mouth, you can have a buddy stand 300-400 yards downwind and fire a blank or unloaded, primed shotshell while you send her for a retrieve on a wing-clipped bird. Again, let her brake as you throw the bird. Gradually have your buddy move closer, the minute that you see any reaction from her back up to where you have no reaction. This will take some time, but the distraction of the live bird will usually do the trick. I had someone return a dog that he made extremely gunshy and worked with her for a month, 3 times a week with this method and today she could care less about the noise.


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## mshutt (Apr 21, 2007)

THANK YOU who ever said something about fireworks!!!!(sorry iforgot who it was) But now that i try remember back at the 4th, She was TERRIFIED at the fireworks, she would go down into my room and lay under my bed until they were over. I dont understand how she wouldnt like fireworks though, BEFORE she was gun shy,she never flinched at me shooting at a bird with my shotgun no matter how close she was to me.

I've been working with her using a cap gun, but that still is keeping her away from me while i have the gun anywhere near me. I do this method atleast once a day, and i see very little improvment, but atleast its something.

I get to keep this dog until december, then she goes to a training facility for Service Dogs for America where she could end up doing one of numerous jobs. If she fails however, we get to have her back.

My new question to you is... Before she leaves in december, and is still very much gunshy, then she leaves to S.D.A. and fails there and comes back to us, should i myself still try work her out of the gun shyness, or take her to a professional?

I don't know how much they cost, but i'd be willing to pay 1,000$ (give or take a couple dollars)(hopefully they dont charge that much) to get her ready for the NEXT hunting season.

Thanks guys for all the info, its great!


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## Bobm (Aug 26, 2003)

thats the problem with service dogs you will fall in love with the dog. I can remember being very sad when I gave dogs back to their owners after training them, whats not to love about a dog.

On the fourth ofJuly and Christmas ( yes down here they shoot fireworks on Christmas :-? , and New years Day) I always bring my dogs into the room where my stereo is and play old rock CDs loud enough they can't hear the fireworks. Fireworks have made many dogs noise shy.

If you just shoot a cap gun you are just makeing things worse, you have to do the retrieveing stuff first then when shes crazy about retrieveing intro the gun like I suggested above. And pistols are loud so start with blanks in a 22 rifle if you have one.

PM me if you need anything explained in detail.

Just asuggestion but if noise shyness is going to disqualify her you need to tell SDA so they don't waste the money transporting her, thats the honorable thing to do. They will appreciate your honesty.


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## Bobm (Aug 26, 2003)

thats the problem with service dogs you will fall in love with the dog. I can remember being very sad when I gave dogs back to their owners after training them, whats not to love about a dog.

On the fourth ofJuly and Christmas ( yes down here they shoot fireworks on Christmas :-? , New years Day) I always bring my dogs into the room where my stereo is and play old rock CDs loud enough they can't hear the fireworks. Fireworks have made many dogs noise shy.

If you just shoot a cap gun you are just makeing things worse, you have to do the retrieveing stuff first then when shes crazy about retrieveing intro the gun like I suggested above. And pistols are loud so start with blanks in a 22 rifle if you have one.

PM me if you need anything explained in detail


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## mdaniel (May 2, 2007)

mshutt said:


> My Pure-bread golden retriever now 8 months old is now gunshy  . When she was 3-5 months old she absolutly LOVED the guns, and then i was always to busy to take her out shooting from her 6 month b-day to the 8th. This is absolutly just sickening because early goose season is only 33 days away!!!! and my dog is now gun-shy!!! She hides in my car when i take her out shooting now, just lays down in the seat and looks scared. She doesnt mind the pellet gun, must be because it makes the smallest noise, but when i bring out the .22 she just goes back into my car and waits till im done.
> I've gotten to the point where I have actually been thinking about looking for a dog training facility to take her to, so she learns everything all over again but with a professional.
> 
> Much help needed.


 As I had trained & breed goldens for years, this will happen to some. This is why, as young pups they are very,very scenitive to high tone, Fire Crackers are the worse. You will have to train with two people to break this as the dog thinks something is going to hurt it. You will also find that they are scared of a vacum.

You must find a big field, and have the gun about 150 yrds away or better. Play with him on a leash throw a ball real short, something he likes. After you take it from him, raise your arm for the person to shot. Hold the lead short and be ready to praise. Its ok, that a boy, his name, anything for excitement, to keep his attention. This will have to be done over and over, as he gets more comfort to the shot bring it in at ten yard incerments. I use a shot gun to do this with light loads. Just remember not to pull on the lead as all we want is to comfort the fear by praise.

This will fix the fear.


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