# Fear of Socialism plunges stocks



## Plainsman (Jul 30, 2003)

For those of you on you knees this morning praying to an effigy of Obama it isn't working so good is it. Even talk of nationalization causes those nasty rich people to start pulling their money. The only thing dumber than our current republicans is our current democrats. Downhill is always easier progress than uphill and Obama is leading the charge to the bottom.

I'm amazed that the republicans have a little bit of conservative left in them. The little resistance they offer has given the nation time to think and the support for Obama's pseudo stimulus plan is going downhill like a rocket. I see his popularity is sliding with it. I don't understand why, he is still promising the moon, Iran and Israel are hugging, problems between Pakistan and India have been resolved, and the Russians want to hug us. Oh, that's not right???? hmmmm.

I'm a little upset.  Right on this form we were assured all these things would rapidly come to pass. Come on fellas we need a lift, tell us again how all our problems are over. :rollin:

For the full story: http://biz.yahoo.com/rb/090204/business ... .html?.v=3



> Bank of America tumbles on nationalization worries
> Wednesday February 4, 5:31 pm ET
> 
> By Elinor Comlay
> ...


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## Bowstring (Nov 27, 2006)

Its awful quite on this board trying to get an opposing liberal to argue back isn't it. The trouble is we are all going to pay for it.


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## backhome (Oct 25, 2004)

Fear of Socialism Plunges Stocks? My portfolio was actually up nicely today. This "fear" treated me pretty well. I'll take it.


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## hunter9494 (Jan 21, 2007)

the pittance you may make in the stock market, Obama will taketh away in much higher capital gains taxes.....unless you are a democratic lobbyist in DC?
:lol:


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## omegax (Oct 25, 2006)

Bowstring said:


> Its awful quite on this board trying to get an opposing liberal to argue back isn't it.


There are all of like 4 of us, and trying to explain the nuances of economic theory is too big of a task.

Then, to top it off, complaining about socialism passes for a valid argument around here. So, here I am, trying to explain Keynesian economics, and all I get back is "Government BAD! Government equal socialism!" That's why I've been quiet lately.

There is such a thing as too much government involvement, but the hands-off approach to managing an economy _requires_ a perfectly rational economy, which doesn't exist. I'm tired of trying to argue fiscal policy with people who couldn't tell you on whose work their side of the argument is based.

It turns out that letting the "invisible hand" guide everything gets a lot of people hurt, and it's too bad the conservatives are making the rest of us pay for their delusion. Government regulation basically takes the peaks and valleys out of the economic growth chart.


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## Plainsman (Jul 30, 2003)

Keynesian economics didn't work in the past. Why would it work now?


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## R y a n (Apr 4, 2005)

omegax said:


> Bowstring said:
> 
> 
> > Its awful quite on this board trying to get an opposing liberal to argue back isn't it.
> ...


X2

Actually Omegax there are around 10 solid ones here. 2 are completely silent and rarely bother wading into what passes as intellectual debate here.

The other 4 rarely post here anymore. They too tried to provide some balance and different perspective to the masses here, but unfortunately their solid comments get washed away with rhetoric and cute little phrases much like the socialism argument you mention above.

If all 10 of us would get together and post more often, it would actually provide quite a shot of life (and truth & reality) into this forum.

Unfortunately they have been disgusted with their treatment here and likely wont' be back often.

(and no I am in no way speaking about myself)

Food for thought for the unwashed masses (once again)

Edit: Plainsman this is not directed your way whatsoever... you actually provide some passionate well thought out talking points with your replies.. I enjoy reading them, as it makes me consider a more conservative perspective, and you normally provide supporting links/points for your arguments. Now if we could just get others to do the same...


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## 4CurlRedleg (Aug 31, 2003)

R y a n said:


> Edit: Plainsman this is not directed your way whatsoever... you actually provide some passionate well thought out talking points with your replies.. I enjoy reading them, as it makes me consider a more conservative perspective, and you normally provide supporting links/points for your arguments. Now if we could just get others to do the same...


 :lol: :lol: Where is the butt kissing icon??


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## tlr (Feb 20, 2008)

There are actualy 11 of us. It is so bad that it is getting to sound like the"RUSH HOUR".


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## R y a n (Apr 4, 2005)

4CurlRedleg said:


> R y a n said:
> 
> 
> > Edit: Plainsman this is not directed your way whatsoever... you actually provide some passionate well thought out talking points with your replies.. I enjoy reading them, as it makes me consider a more conservative perspective, and you normally provide supporting links/points for your arguments. Now if we could just get others to do the same...
> ...


Nope not at all... I just feel the need to pre-emptively clarify certain statements I make, lest they be misconstrued to be directed the wrong way.

I wish we did have a select few conservatives here that would take time like Plainsman to offer substantive thought provoking replies rather than one liner quotes intended to be cute or snarky....

Case in point


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## 4CurlRedleg (Aug 31, 2003)

That's it!! I am going to hang it all out on the line. Ryan, some day we may be able to share a beer after a hammerin' of mallards and not come back with one warm body. 8)

I like the new tone. :beer:


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## R y a n (Apr 4, 2005)

4CurlRedleg said:


> That's it!! I am going to hang it all out on the line. Ryan, some day we may be able to share a beer after a hammerin' of mallards and not come back with one warm body. 8)
> 
> I like the new tone. :beer:


:beer:

It's always been there... that'd be cool with me ..


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## omegax (Oct 25, 2006)

R y a n said:


> I wish we did have a select few conservatives here that would take time like Plainsman to offer substantive thought provoking replies rather than one liner quotes intended to be cute or snarky....


No doubt!

A lot of that snarky BS just comes off like piling on, which also gets old. I totally agree about wishing more people would go in-depth like Plainsman. You can't have a civilized discussion with somebody who won't tell you why they think the way they do. It just devolves into monkeys flinging feces. Plus, I like finding common ground.


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## omegax (Oct 25, 2006)

Plainsman said:


> Keynesian economics didn't work in the past. Why would it work now?


How do you figure? Even if The New Deal didn't snap us out of The Great Depression, WWII did, and it was the biggest government spending program ever.


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## Bowstring (Nov 27, 2006)

OK no more "one liners" from me. I try to give a link to articles, sometimes it just my opinion.  I do think that most posters on this board have used a "one liner" a time or two.


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## Bustem36 (Feb 5, 2008)

omegax said:


> Plainsman said:
> 
> 
> > Keynesian economics didn't work in the past. Why would it work now?
> ...


Yeah but didn't that spending go along with TONS of new jobs and the war effort at home. (buildin planes, and tanks, and crap) In todays world we can not spend our way out of this because the money definately doesn't go to the people or the country. The money the government is spending goes to greed bastards who only care about themselves and their projects. This country is a great place to live but many parts of it have really gone down the $hitter not that there weren't soem of the same troubles before.


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## R y a n (Apr 4, 2005)

Bowstring said:


> OK no more "one liners" from me. I try to give a link to articles, sometimes it just my opinion.  I do think that most posters on this board have used a "one liner" a time or two.


Hey don't get me wrong... one liners when used occasionally are hilarious.. and add a bit of levity and humor to lighten up the political mood..

And when done sparingly ... and with good timing.. heck.. I'm all for a little humor just like anyone else you know? Heck I use one liners as often as anyone.. but I try to make strong logical points thrown into the mix too..

But some use it with every other post.. and it becomes nauseating

And drives away those of us looking to try and explain "the dark side" to the opposing view

Hope this makes sense?


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## Plainsman (Jul 30, 2003)

I don't use socialism as simple name calling. I look at when government starts to take over for self responsibility. In this world I know we have to accept some socialistic things like Social security. I don't think we need to accept socialized medicine.
I think the reason the stocks plunged is fear of socialism. If we nationalize banks and the government takes control of much of the financial institutions people want to unload those stocks before their value goes down.
We have to remember that as one passes through life we hopefully gain more in personal assets. For those fifty, sixty, and seventy years old we grew up in a time where people took care of themselves. We have watched other nations become socialist, and relatives in those countries our age don't like it. 
I think young people just leaving home and on their own for the first time are at the opposite end of the spectrum. They have not been on their own, and there is comfort in feeling that someone is looking out for you. When they began to emass assets they will all of a sudden notice the government is taking a lot more than they give back. 
So lets say mom and pop have $200,000 in savings. They will want to invest that and try live off the interest. They need to get the most bang for their buck, but with the government controlling interest rates it may not be possible. So get rid of your stocks now and go into something safer.

Well, I have to get ready for tomorrows coyote hunt so I'm cutting this short.

Oh, I might add that often one liners are relief valves for pent up frustration. Frustration often born when the elderly do not listen to the logic of the young, and when the young do not value the life experience of the old. Often the young have a new perspective and often the old have already experienced the change that the young thing is something new.


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## hunter9494 (Jan 21, 2007)

the other thing you need to remember, *after the bailout*, which will likely STILL exceed $827 bil, O will be bailing out the banks again......yes, round "3" of TARP, as it is a well known fact that the 2nd installment of $350 bil is not near enough to provide the liquidity needed, after paying bonuses and paying for hookers/prostitutes for the bankers.....and you though Spitzer was the only one :lol: . playing at a hearing near you soon and bailing out GM and Chrysler are still ahead of us.......damn, those printing presses better be working 24/7 to keep up!..keep printing those "Barackollars", soon to be worth less than the peso! :lol:


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## TK33 (Aug 12, 2008)

> I think the reason the stocks plunged is fear of socialism


That is one reason, also the job report and the fact that no one is investing



> We have to remember that as one passes through life we hopefully gain more in personal assets. For those fifty, sixty, and seventy years old we grew up in a time where people took care of themselves


The politics of these generations also drove us into the ground. For the first time in history this generation is leaving the US in worse shape than they got it. This is a big reason why people love Barack of Nazareth, because he is a fresh face.



> I think young people just leaving home and on their own for the first time are at the opposite end of the spectrum. They have not been on their own, and there is comfort in feeling that someone is looking out for you. When they began to emass assets they will all of a sudden notice the government is taking a lot more than they give back.


This is true to a point, the few assets I have managed to amass and the gov't has their hand to far in my pocket. I am not looking forward to not having dependents and the deducts that come with them. The problem is I also depend on the gov't to plow my streets, deliver clean water to my house, educate my kids, put out fires and so on.


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## Plainsman (Jul 30, 2003)

> The politics of these generations also drove us into the ground. For the first time in history this generation is leaving the US in worse shape than they got it. This is a big reason why people love Barack of Nazareth, because he is a fresh face.


I feel the opposite. My parents generation left us a very good nation. They died by the thousands in WWII to protect our freedom and this nation. It's my generation that started ogling socialism. Our parents worked hard to care for us, but maybe they did such a good job we don't now want to take care of ourselves. We look to the government to take mamma's place. We want to be guaranteed happiness and prosperity, not the freedom to pursue happiness and prosperity. Less guts and more dependence every year.


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## TK33 (Aug 12, 2008)

Ok I need to rephrase this,

The baby boomer generation is the first generation in history to leave this country in worse shape than they got it. My grandparents who fought in the war made this a great country, the boomers have all but destroyed it with terms like draft dodger, corporate welfare, hippy, nationalization, clinton, bush, etc.

I don't think that my generation isn't listening to the older generation it is that we take it with a grain of salt given the state we are in.


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## Plainsman (Jul 30, 2003)

TK33 said:


> Ok I need to rephrase this,
> 
> The baby boomer generation is the first generation in history to leave this country in worse shape than they got it. My grandparents who fought in the war made this a great country, the boomers have all but destroyed it with terms like draft dodger, corporate welfare, hippy, nationalization, clinton, bush, etc.
> 
> I don't think that my generation isn't listening to the older generation it is that we take it with a grain of salt given the state we are in.


I agree. Now what do we debate? 

Well, I think I agree. It's not the terms like draft dodgers etc. it's that they do exist. Even the men you mentioned. Clinton started screwing the system up, and Bush didn't do enough to correct it when he had the chance. He was to busy trying to reach across the isle.


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