# Brass Sizing Question



## AdamFisk (Jan 30, 2005)

I'm reading a debate on another site about neck vs FL sizing. Before I even think about messing around with neck sizing, which I don't know squat about, I'd like somebody to elaborate on the following comment a little more.



> I FL everytime, I tried NS but didn't see any vast improvement in my shooting, having rounds that alway feed in more important to me than try to squeeze every last firing out of a piece of brass, invest in a headspace gauge to set up your FL die, and a decapping die, decapp the brass measure with the gauge, adjust your FL die so it reads .001-.0015 less, and use the instructions that came with your FL to wipe your ***, because that's all it's good for.


I've read before that you can set your FL die up for your specefic chamber. I think that's what this guy is referring too. How? And what are the benefits? Is it worth it? All I do at this point is set up my FL die per the instructions, and FL size everytime.

Thanks.


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## Csquared (Sep 5, 2006)

Adam, the info you've quoted is almost like I would advise. We've seen this here many times. Unfortunately the comment about what to do with the die instructions is sometimes the better idea 

A guy who wants to seriously reload needs to have his equipment priorities aligned so that he's not "ready" until he has a quality comparator/seating depth gauge...and a chronograph (another discussion)

Anyway, a fired case and your comparator will allow you to set up your sizing die perfectly...the first time. Simply start with your die too high, and gradually lower it while you check how far down on the case neck the die is sizing. When you get close to the neck/shoulder junction it will be hard to tell exactly where and if those points intersect, so that's where the comparator comes in. Measure to the neck/shoulder junction on a fired case, then when that number _decreases_ after run through the die you'll know you "bumped"it. And it doesn't take much. I've never gotten too wrapped up in an exact number for this, but I don't see any need for it to be more than .002", as stated in your quote. You can do this without the comparator by feel often times, since the fired case will cause the bolt to close with slight resistance until the shoulder is pushed back a bit, but w/o the ability to accurately measure you won't know how far back you're pushing it. I have a factory .280 that I was loading with a die set up per the instructions and found out after a near catastrophic head separation that I was pushing the shoulder back about .007" (hope my memory is correct)...and didn't know it. The head separated on the third firing.

But as to full length (when properly adjusted) vs neck size, that debate will continue forever. But at the risk of offending some I believe most who profess neck sizing (for a hunting rifle) believe it more as a result of reading it somewhere than from personal experience. I used to think I had to neck size because that's what all the gun writers said you had to do for optimum accuracy. But the truth is I never saw any real improvement in accuracy. Now if you're talking about a rifle that is a disappointment if 5 shots print more than one hole, now you might want to be neck sizing. I have 2 or 3 that the brass has never had the body touched by a die, but I also turn case necks, etc. But for a hunting rifle, set up your FL die properly and never look back!

Good luck!


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## KurtR (May 3, 2008)

i agree 100% with what was just said. Bump the shoulders just a little and move on just make sure not mix ammo between 2 differnt rifles as one chamber may just a littel differnt than the other then you will have feed problems


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## AdamFisk (Jan 30, 2005)

So what does bumping the shoulder actually do for me?


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## Csquared (Sep 5, 2006)

allows the case to chamber as easily as a factory round


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## KurtR (May 3, 2008)

with out working the case as much by setting it to the directions that come with the die set

fixed it for ya


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## Csquared (Sep 5, 2006)

You're doing more than just bumping the shoulder, Adam. The cases are tapered so as the case goes further into the die, and reaches the shoulder, it's also making the rest of the case slightly smaller. The point is you can do it all with the FL die supplied in the set, and do it in a way that will allow cases to last as long as the case neck/mouth or primer pockets.

Hey Kurt...sizing doesn't stretch brass....shooting it does :wink: oke:


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## AdamFisk (Jan 30, 2005)

Thanks for the info so far....So there is no accuracy gain out of doing this? Just expanding case life???


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## Csquared (Sep 5, 2006)

I think the "argument" is that _neck sizing only_ leads to more accurate handloads. Our point (or at least mine) here is that in a hunting rifle you need not deal with any of the negative side effects of neck sizing for your rifle to shoot great groups. And that the common misconception that FL sizing unnecessarily shortens case life is just that...a common misconception. :wink:


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## KurtR (May 3, 2008)

Even if it does take one firing of the brass i will take consistent function every time over one extra fireing. And you know it wont happen on the range it will happen when mr.180" is standing there and you need another shot


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## People (Jan 17, 2005)

Greetings

When neck sizing all you are doing is working the neck so it will have the proper tension on the bullet. An added benefit is your bullet will be more centered in the chamber. In most rifles with a good chamber your brass will last a long time if you anneal your brass every few reloads. A big drawback to this is your brass will fit your chamber better and better until it is very tight. At this point you will probably need to full length size your brass or you will really have to press hard to close your bolt..

Full length sizing as stated above when done properly only moves the shoulder back a thousandths or two. The die will also work the sides in a little bit so the brass will slide right into your rifle. Depending on your rifle once fired brass may or may not be a close copy of your chamber. I have two rifles where the chamber is so large I have to neck size my brass and fire it again so it fully reaches all of the chamber. My M1 fires Korean KA ammo without any problems and will constantly hit the 10 ring at 600yds. Being a semi-auto rifle I was always told to small base resize all semi- auto brass. In this rifle it is not needed. I just neck size about half the neck and then load with powder and a 168gr SMK and then shoot a match with it. Now at this point I use a 45acp casing that I put mouth touching the shoulder of the 30-06 casing then measure the overall length. I will then start screwing my die down until I get a reading that is .001 or .002 shorter than the original on a batch of brass. My original M1 barrel would require three firings before the casing was a good fit in the chamber.

Each rifle is different and so are applications. My bolt rifles I use for shooting PD I almost never FL size my casings. My hunting rifles I will always FL size then once they are a good fit for the chamber.

Chuck Norris can win a game of Trivial Pursuit with one roll of the dice, and without answering a single question... just a nod of the head, and a stroke of the beard.


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