# Versatile Hunting Puppies: RESERVE NOW! (WA)



## greendog (May 25, 2009)

We are proud to introduce our "B" litter born April 19th. Come visit the pups on our new puppy page.

http://www.adelshaus.com

Shazam! &#8230; You'll see video of them riding in a caboose and of them feasting on goats milk. Meet their Dad, Dave March's Apollo: you would never be able to distract Apollo from that solid, intense point you see in his picture. Also, check out the Grand Dam, ZhaZha, in three spectacular retrieves (under "MOVIES"). ZhaZha may well be the last in "great female" in Ray DeJong's line of super SMP females starting with JoJo.

These 10 pups promise to be beautifully plated dogs with dramatically rich and contrasting coats. There is even a mantled male (#4) who is curious and independent: a great versatile hunting dog in the making. Both the parents, ZhaZha and Apollo, are relentless hunters; and the mother was in the National Invitational in 2005. Additionally, the parents are extremely mellow; it is a primary goal in this breeding to continue that tradition. For those not familiar with the breed, Small Munsterlander Pointers have it all: at about 50 lbs.(females~40-50lbs, males~50-60lbs) they're great Pointers and Retrievers. They do upland and waterfowl. They have no odor and negligible shedding (no undercoat,although they can take Arctic conditions (< -60 degrees F--windchill)). And they're great pets!!!

The litters are registered in both the AKC F.S.S. program (litter #SR558428) and NAVHDA (Litter #L-003713), where the puppies have been individually preregistered with NAVHDA. They are quite advanced for their age, in part, because we tried feeding the Esbilac goat's milk formula to the mother to let her process it into natural dog's milk--expensive, but effective in getting them off to a good start.

We believe in broad socialization and exposure to experiences that might otherwise prove upsetting at a later age. The litter is being raised close to us in our home; we have adapted a large double shower area with a custom built whelping box with room for play and poop. We and a stream of visitors regularly interact with them and their many toys. Too, In this beautiful weather they get to play outside in two separate areas on our property. They have lots of room to run and interesting things to explore. They are "called" to dinner with loud gunshotlike banging, and they have been exposed to noisy motors by going for a ride in our yard tractor (see movie displayed at startup of website). Soon they will be exposed to birds and bird scent as well as to water in various settings.

The puppies will be available at the end of June. The Deposit ($100) is part of a completely refundable (with interest) bond which will be returned to you as you test your dog's hips and hunting skills in NAVHDA. The tests are Natural Ability and Utility. You can learn contact info & more details at:

http://www.adelshaus.com/B Litter Puppy Agreement.html

Our purpose is to improve and popularize this breed, both with regard to bird hunting capability in American terrain and to temperament. We are not only a nonprofit operation, but we have, ourselves, invested intensively to produce a litter that will contribute to the breed gene pool. Is this the right time for you or some of your friends to consider furthering the Small Munsterlander Pointer Breed by making one of these great puppies a part of the family?


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## gundogguru (Oct 7, 2003)

How long have y'all been breeding dogs?


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## greendog (May 25, 2009)

We started in 2003, but the mating (in Germany) didn't take--turned out the male (who had fantastic prospects) had zippo sperm count. We returned in 2006 & bred again for a litter of 11.

http://www.adelshaus.com/peek/index.htm

We tried AI last year, but the viable sperm was only 10%, so this is our second successful breeding.


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## Bobm (Aug 26, 2003)

MODS
I moved this back from the spam forum after dicussing it with Ken please leave it,, this guys not a spammer. He has a interesting proposal for anyone willing to train the dogs for Navda level competition.

These dogs would be very good dogs for North Dakota IMO

Bob


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## ryanps18 (Jun 23, 2006)

If I did not already have two dogs myself I would be jumping all over this. I went to a Münsterländer trial a couple of years back and was very impressed with the breed. I will be bookmarking your site for future reference.

thanks for posting


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## greendog (May 25, 2009)

ryanaps18 & Bobm: Thank you for understanding what we are about. You guys seem to be in a minority.

I have been looking at the statistics on our website, and I realize that there have been many folks who went to the Puppy Agreement page and left. Additionally I've gotten enough feedback to realize that the Agreement is offputting and, I suspect, many who read it suspect some sort of scam hidden in all that "verbiage'. One of my realtor friends tells me that the more CCR's there are in a real estate contract, the less likely the house is to sell--same principle. :lol:

So, I'm reworking the agreement this weekend to be much simpler to understand. I'll post when it's updated. Meanwhile, we've got loads of great puppy photos & videos we need to get uploaded--only a few so far.

Finally, it's really hard to buy chukars around here these days. I hope to have some different game birds to expose to the puppies as well as take them out to a lake and a small stream later this week. Also, they need exposure to cats.:evil:


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## gundogguru (Oct 7, 2003)

greendog
I also looked at your puppy contract. My wife and I have been breeding showing and handling our dogs ( 3 bench champion Master Hunters)for almost 35 years. I could not make hide nor hair of what you wanted your buyers to do. There was so much STUFF that could not have any control of Even if you wanted to. Such as what feed to give them. I like what your trying to do and protect your blood lines. We do everything we can to see our pups only go to good homes and are well takin care of. IMO your contract is way to wordy and you are asking way to much from your buyers. Most people will look at your contract and just say hell no. Like I said I understand what your trying to do. You just mite have a hatrd time selling your puts. I'm not a back yard breeder i only breed my GWP's every couple of years along with our Labs. All our dogs get all the health cerf's and OFA'd and we only breed to better the breed than to make money. Good louck with your pups you have some very nice looking dogs


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## greendog (May 25, 2009)

Folks: The revised puppy agreement is posted. Opinions and suggestions appreciated. k:

Better yet--how about a dog? :run:


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## rand_98201 (Jun 14, 2009)

I am actually very interested in a puppy.I have had german shorthairs in the past.I loved my shorthairs but my wife and I would like to find a breed that can be a bit calmer in the house.

In your lines and the breed in general how are they in the house?


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## Slimpickins (Jun 9, 2009)

I'll stick to labs. They do what I want and I have fun with it!


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## greendog (May 25, 2009)

rand-98201: Aside from breeding for the obvious hunting talents, our main concern with this breeding was to take advantage of our *****'s mellowness and intelligence by finding an appropriate stud. We think we have succeeded. Our ***** has been called "the most intelligent dog I've ever trained" by one trainer, and "exceptionally mellow and elegant" by a vet in Germany where we made our first breeding (That breeding of 11 pups produced a NAVHDA Breeder's award with 4 Prize I's and 5 Prize III's in NA; the UT's are still pending.)

Anyway, Small Munsterlander Pointers (SMP)--the worst thing about the breed is the clumsiness of the name--are known in Europe as having the best pet quality of the versatile hunting breeds. Any well exercised SMP makes for a great house dog. In general, if there's nothing interesting going on, they just lie down and sleep.

There's a joke among SMP owners about their ability to teleport: You're sitting somewhere doing some activity, and your dog is lying a few feet away fast asleep. You get up and a few minutes later when your working on something elsewhere in your house, there's your dog, lying a few feet away, fast asleep!

We took our two SMP's to a DU meeting in Eastern WA a couple of years ago, and they stayed under our table. They enjoyed meeting the folks that came up to admire them, but after the dinner and activities started, they just went to sleep. Later in the evening folks came by, mostly Lab owners, and praised them for their temperament.

On the other hand, when they step out the door in the woods, they are hunting! Owners have "lost" their dog in their house, only to find them fast asleep on top of old hunting clothes.

Finally, there's one thing I'll mention that may or may not be an issue with you, but our ***** (and most SMP's) have a very soft mouth.

One anecdote: Our dog was trained for duck search in the Arizona desert! That's right. Her trainer, who normally lived in Oregon and Idaho, decided to take a winter break in Arizona. So he packed up the dog, ZhaZha, and headed down to an area about halfway between Tucson and Phoenix. When he got there, he managed to find a young duck for ZhaZha to practice recoveries on. The trainer would leave ZhaZha in a crate and head out about 300 yards in some random direction in the desert where he would deposit the duck. Then he would return to the crated dog, give her a direction and send her off. He said it was really amazing; usually within 5 minutes she was back with the duck. Apparently, the duck, who was never harmed by ZhaZha's soft mouth, really enjoyed the game. After the trainer returned to Oregon, the duck, now a fully feathered mallard, flew off, only to return a few days later to take up residence in the trainer's pond, where he took great delight in teasing the dog trainees.


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## greendog (May 25, 2009)

For some interesting new photos on water and gamebird exposure, see http://pets.webshots.com/album/572958658fUDrDG?start=22

[The four puppies we seem to still have available (pending firm choices by new owners) are 3 males: #2










#4










#7










and, astonishingly, 1 female (#6)


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## rand_98201 (Jun 14, 2009)

Labs are great dogs.They just dont do as well on Quail and Pheasant as pointing breeds.Well most pointing breeds.Duck hunting is definitely a Labs deal though.

When it comes to Duck hunting I actually prefer a Chesapeake but thats just personal preference.


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## greendog (May 25, 2009)

rand_98201: Labs are definitely great dogs, and when it comes to field trials with multiple marked retrieves, no versatile can touch them. However, when it comes to tracking a duck over water, through a marsh or similar terrain, I think the SMP can easily hold its own.

After all, versatiles were bred especially for game recovery as well as game discovery. (In Germany, if a hunter is found to have abandoned wounded game, he can lose his hunting license for life.) I wonder whether this trait has been deemphasized in Americanized breeds?


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## Canuck (Nov 10, 2004)

Other than size :-? is there any differance between small and large meunsterlanders??

Canuck


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## greendog (May 25, 2009)

Canuck: Large Munsterlanders are black and white dogs derived from German Long Haired Pointers. Small Munsterlanders are a distinct breed developed from some lines of local hunting dogs in the NW of Germany (the Münsterland region), and there is no black in their coats (there used to be some orange & yellow, showing the Britanny heritage).

These days SM's are almost exclusively liver & white and about 2'' shorter at the shoulder than LM's, which are almost exclusively black & white (although very occasionally a brown appears as a "throwback").

From my limited experience with LM's, the personalities are rather similar, as is that of the German Long Haired Pointer, but, because of their smaller size, SM's (SMP's) tend to be more agile.

The popularity of the breeds in Germany may give you some idea as to what the Germans think. Roughly speaking the yearly production of hunting dogb puppies in Germany (as I recall) is about 1400 Drahthaar ("Wirehair") pups, 1200 Kurzhaar ("Shorthair") pups, 1000 SMP pups, 700 Longhaired Pointers, 400 LM's, 300 Weims, & down from there, with most "English" breeds under 100.


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## Slimpickins (Jun 9, 2009)

rand_98201 said:


> Labs are great dogs.They just dont do as well on Quail and Pheasant as pointing breeds.Well most pointing breeds.Duck hunting is definitely a Labs deal though.
> 
> When it comes to Duck hunting I actually prefer a Chesapeake but thats just personal preference.


Don't tell either things to the people in my dog club. No breed could touch the labs in this club when it comes to pheasant hunting.

I'd like to see any other breed bring a 15 pound goose back through quicksand sticking mud. I guess a chessy could but who has extra 2x4's laying aroud the house to train it!


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## daveb (Jun 29, 2006)

quote]Don't tell either things to the people in my dog club. No breed could touch the labs in this club when it comes to pheasant hunting.[/quote]

Sorry, but that's the funniest thing I've read in a long time...and I'm a Lab guy.


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## ryanps18 (Jun 23, 2006)

daveb said:


> quote]Don't tell either things to the people in my dog club. No breed could touch the labs in this club when it comes to pheasant hunting.


Sorry, but that's the funniest thing I've read in a long time...and I'm a Lab guy.[/quote]

HA! I second that.


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## rand_98201 (Jun 14, 2009)

the world will never change when it comes to people with labs.if you like labs great.just dont be so close minded as to think your breed is the end all answer to all things upland bird hunting.this is an age old argument over whos breed is better.


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## Slimpickins (Jun 9, 2009)

No kiddin' bring your mutt to southern Minnesota and lets put on a show.

How bout' a triple with three blinds up the marks. Then if you can finish see who can find the chicken in the grass! :wink:

All I'm sayin is with the abilities preety hard to beat!


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## rand_98201 (Jun 14, 2009)

on the same note im guessing your dog wont sit on point for 10 minutes waiting for you to get a nice set shot,then retrieve it to your hand.if that was a lab it would have flushed it long ago and you would have just watched it fly away.this goes both ways.


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## Slimpickins (Jun 9, 2009)

rand_98201 said:


> on the same note im guessing your dog wont sit on point for 10 minutes waiting for you to get a nice set shot,then retrieve it to your hand.if that was a lab it would have flushed it long ago and you would have just watched it fly away.this goes both ways.


Not if you taught your dog to hunt under the gun. 8) Don't hunt with many "trained" labradors do you!

BTW, I have never hunted with a pointer that would deliver to hand either. Usually had to have my labradors retrieve the already shot bird! :roll:


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## rand_98201 (Jun 14, 2009)

yeah my german shorthair would retrieve to hand.though i agree that most do not unless they are force fetched.that is the huge draw with labs really,it doesnt take much training to make them huntable.with some basic and a little advanced obedience they work ok.obviously way better than ok in the retrieving part.

Now i would be on your guys boat if i did more waterfowl hunting.but i dont anymore so i use pointing breeds for quail and pheasant.just a preference.though i have considered getting a lab to slam the brush after the pointers went through the lighter stuff and the birds went into the thick stuff.


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## daveb (Jun 29, 2006)

Slimpickins said:


> No kiddin' bring your mutt to southern Minnesota and lets put on a show.


Calling another guy's dog a mutt tells us all a lot about you.


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## Bobm (Aug 26, 2003)

this thread is not supposed to be a debate about labs so please let it go and get it back on topic

thanks

this thread (the original part) is interesting, cool dogs!


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## tlr (Feb 20, 2008)

One of the fellows that I hunt with has a SMP. Last fall was his first year hunting and I was really impressed! The dog is not finished yet, but it didn't have any trouble with the haevy cover at all. He seemed to love the cattails. He worked slow and found birds and held his point until the owner got to him and flushed the bird.This dog has no professonal training at all. Like all young dogs he needs more bird work but overall I really liked what I saw. They want to please and are gentle dogs that like attention. :beer:


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## Slimpickins (Jun 9, 2009)

daveb said:


> Slimpickins said:
> 
> 
> > No kiddin' bring your mutt to southern Minnesota and lets put on a show.
> ...


I am saying it in general. I call my own dogs mutts! Not trying to put any dogs down here. If you knew me you'd know that I love any dog out there! :beer:


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## rand_98201 (Jun 14, 2009)

Im glad to hear what you have to sat about the sml because I am heading over on tuesday and picking up a puppy.I will keep everyone posted on the puppies progress.


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