# A sign of the times??



## Chuck Smith (Feb 22, 2005)

http://www.msn.com/en-us/money/markets/ ... id=DELLDHP

This article talks about how eating out for lunch is getting to expensive....ie: $12 for a sandwich and beverage, and how lunch establishments are seeing a decrease in revenue over the lunch hour.

So what do you think will happen when Minimum wage hits $15 ????


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## north1 (Nov 9, 2010)

Haven't paid a lot of attention to the particulars. How does it apply to establishments whose employees get tips? My son works at red lobster and he says he has not seen a drop in customers or tipping decreases. Only time will tell. People eating out in large metropolitan areas seems like a way of life and would be very, very hard for them to give up. I mean, for my wife and I it is a treat to eat out once every couple of weeks. I think for most it is essential in their busy schedules. Have to replan and organize your day. With both of us working we use the crock pot....A LOT.


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## alleyyooper (Jul 6, 2007)

I never did eat out much at lunch. May go in the with the guys and order a half dozen pizzas some one had to run and to pick up every once in a while. Place always gave us a discount by ordering a half dozen or more at a time. Way I look at it is if the fast food chains have to pay 15.00 and hour to those employees who do not get tips the price of a burger and coke will rise but those people getting a bit higher wage will take some of the heat off parents trying to send a kid to college so they would have more to spend by going out. May a new car/truck to replace a 10 to 15 year old they drive right now. Just because those Minimum wage earners are getting a bit more money do believe it is just going to go in their savings accounts.

 Al


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## Chuck Smith (Feb 22, 2005)

North and Al....

This article is showing that the higher costs of things are affecting them in NYC at lunch time...

With the min wage...

The servers wont be the only ones getting $15 an hour. The people who load the trucks with the food, the people who deliver the food to the restauraunt, the people who picked the tomatoes, lettuce, etc., the baker who makes the buns, the hired man at the farm who combined the wheat to make the buns, etc.

You get the point... all of the costs will trickle down.

I also think that it is geographic right now..... But if you have been around long enough.... you know when things hit either coast it takes about 5 years to hit the Midwest. :bop:


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## north1 (Nov 9, 2010)

One problem in that scenario. I will preface it by stating I am not complaining or aiming for sympathy. Nothing trickles down from a farmer. Prices for commodities and input costs are set by others. So if his hired man gets a raise, the price of wheat won't go up to compensate for it. He will have to either cut back somewhere, downsize and do the work himself(that is what I have done) etc. But the middle man on up will pass those increased prices onto the customer. Then people will switch to cheaper food sources like Mexico, China and the prices of U.S. commodities will fall more because we have a surplus. Then food sources will shift back, etc and so on. Just always has been this way.


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## alleyyooper (Jul 6, 2007)

Around here it is the workers mostly at fast food joints, fast oil change places with only get minimum wages. The farm hands gets a salary so can't get a raise when the minimum wage is raised. Same with warehouse workers, either on a salary or make more than minimum wages now. Waiter staff in restaurants have a totally different minimum wage which tips are supposed to make up the difference.

Ya the farmers screwed them selves when they let the brokers set the price of the commity, instead of them setting it them selves.
Was a group in this area tried to get the farmers to stop that practice but didn't get anywhere because of the greed.

 Al


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## Habitat Hugger (Jan 19, 2005)

Alley and North are right. I've always maintained that Farmers are at the bottom of the wage tree in that they can't unionize or strike for higher wages. It's hard to determine exactly what the hourly wage is for farmers, and they can't pass along their rising costs to the consumer. Too many middle men in between. I suspect their hourly wages, if it could be determined would var widely from below minimum for some all the way up to a few with Neurosurgeons hourly wages, even more. 
From what I can find out by cruising websites with fairly objective economist types expounding, the jury is out when it comes to raising minimum wagers. They all use specific relatively cherry picked examples to try to make their points. Like farmers overall wages, things are so valuable and murky it's tough to REALLY know. You definitely can't find an answer on the usuL BIASED WEBSITES OR TALK SHOWS. 
Like North, eating out to us is a kind of treat andf I find myself usually overtipping if anything. That said, now with chipped cards, when the waiter brings it over, it UTOMATIVCAQLLY CALCULAtes whatever percentage you want, and ita possible I'm tipping less now, but more in the normal range. 
When. We travel we tend to buy a loaf of unsliced breads, some cheese and a bag of nuts, andkeep driving. We hate fast food places, maybe not hate but kind of dislike the high fat, sugar, diabetes causing and artery clogging foods. LOL


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## Chuck Smith (Feb 22, 2005)

North...

I agree with you 100%. Farmers or "independent" contractors are the ones not seeing benefits but just the negatives. (by contractors I mean anyone who isn't getting a wage or salary)

But I could go on and on with a rant about this minimum wage thing.... But it is Friday.... duck season starts tomorrow for many people and no need to get my blood boiling. I would rather think of wood ducks buzzing me in the backwaters than this.... LOL


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## Habitat Hugger (Jan 19, 2005)

Yeah Chuck, get your blood boiling over some ducks! Nothing you or I can do about mi I mum wages anyhow, other than vote, and more than 96% of people already know who theory are going to vote for anyway. Good luck in thre duck blind this weekend.

On the eating out topic. We just came back from a 500km European bicycle ride from Amsterdam thru Paris with a lot of side trips to Dunkirk, Flanderd Fields, the bleachers of Normandy. Got tired of seeing crossed but that's off topic. One thing we did notice that it seems most working Europeans seemed to brown bag it. In the evenings, outdoor restaurants we're pretty full, but there seemed more McDonalds and KFC's and fast food places in China's thsn Europe. Just an subjective impression.....far fewer Wal Maers, too. Not that this has anything to do with minimum wage, but it doers illustrate that attitudes and values are a lot different. Tremendous numbers of people biked to work, too. In large cities, far more bikes thsn cars. Gas and Deisel about 5 - 6 bucks a gallon. 
FWIW, most of the locals we met seemed very happy, many questions about the upcoming election, high medical costs, education, etc. I have no idea what minimum wages are frtom place to place though. Different culyutr than bavk home, so impossible yo objectively compare anything. No ducks for me. I might tr5y bow hunting a bit. Lots of pheasants around, saw no grouse the other day but my dog is still pounding about flushing so many pheasants and me nbot firing at a single one! 
Take no duck prisoners this weekend you water4fowl hunters!


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## Habitat Hugger (Jan 19, 2005)

Wow! What terrible typing! Looks like I must have been drunk, though haven't imbibed for 30 years down! 
I'm an idiot! The day after I got home I ran my UTV over my right knee (don't ask me how???), blew out a medial ligament! So typed the above lying on my back with a keyboard on my chest flat on my back! Some days I'm an idiot...some days even worse! LOL 
Might try sitting in a deer stand today if I can stagger from the pickup into it, or have a buddy drop me off with his UTV.


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## north1 (Nov 9, 2010)

Sorry to hear about your injury habitathugger. Hope you are on the mend. Yes I can believe your story because I also did that! I ran over my leg when it slipped off the peg on a four wheeler. Nearly split me in half. Nothing was torn, but didn't walk right for a week. Life certainly is interesting. Yesterday I walked out of a storage shed and a muskrat cut me off from the shed and chased me to my pickup lungeing, jumping and hissing at me the whole way. Luckily, due to my quickness and superior reflexes I was able to avoid injury. Imagine an eye roll emoji which for some reason site won't let me insert. Just never know what life will toss at ya.


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## Plainsman (Jul 30, 2003)

Heal fast HH. 
Chuck, I can remember in spring breeding season when muscrats get real sassy they would come up on the hay wagon and dad would discourage them with a pitchfork.


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## Chuck Smith (Feb 22, 2005)

HH, Heal fast so you can enjoy the fall. Also I just figured the bad typing was because after your European Vacation you forgot "English" and took over the native language of the country you were in at the time.... and now just needed to reaclimate. HAHA... Also I cant type or spell worth a crap anyways. :beer:


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