# Hard mouth



## tlr (Feb 20, 2008)

It seems that at the end of the season that my lab has been getting a little hard mouth. I noticed that some of the birds had teeth marks on the breasts when I cleaned them. Early in the year I didn't notice this as it happened only once in a while. How can I get this hard mouthing the birds to stop or is it something that has to be worked with on a younger dog? Codee has 4 years hunting under her belt. She listens very well and is well behaved except for this problem of late.


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## Sasha and Abby (May 11, 2004)

Does your dog have toys that squeak at home? Get rid of them.

My oldest lab has a tendency to "tenderize" birds that have been shot up a bit...


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## gonehuntin' (Jul 27, 2006)

Unless she starts tearing the birds apart, ignore it. Controlling hard mouth is a very lengthy and unpleasant proceedure. I also believe that hard mouth can NEVER be cured, only controlled.


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## tlr (Feb 20, 2008)

Thanks for the replies. She doesn't tear them up, they just have one tooth mark usually. I know that the hens she caught weren't tore up she just squeezes them until they quit wiggling. Codee has no squeek toys either so hopefully it won't get worse. Thanks :beer:


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## Guest (Jan 5, 2009)

I was hoping someone would direct you to the answer. My guy Kody, has decided that he should chomp on the birds and the habit is getting worse. I want to stop this before next season comes around and would love it if there is someone (BOBM BROWNDOG) that could assist.


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## Labs4me (Mar 14, 2008)

It could be from your dog having to jump through the snow to bring it back to you. The jarring when he lands might be causing the tears.
I know cockers that will only put a hole in a bird if there is snow on the ground.


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## BROWNDOG (Nov 2, 2004)

I trust GH advice.

All I know is it all falls back on a strong OB and FF program. Tough to correct in the field but if one of my dogs gets mouthy with a bird while training or hunting, all I do is give a firm "SIT" and it is stopped. Sit not only means SIT but stop whatever you are doing. Tough to correct if the dog doesn't understand inderect pressure or hasn't been throught a solid FF CC program from the start.


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## Guest (Jan 6, 2009)

My boy is 4 and has a good background. ie: one jr and 2 sr hunt passes. He was in the works to be a trial dog but didn't mature fast enough for the trainer. So I bought him. I already had one of his litter mates (his sister Sophie). He just last year started to chomp and it got worse this year. NO! doesn't stop him. In the 06 season he and the female would both bring em back alive but now he is set on killing them. Perhaps he got a live one that gave him the business last year and decided there will be no more of that. Where do I go from here? Help and guidence is appreciated. He is kind of a softie and I don't want to break his enthusiasm. :beer:


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## Canuck (Nov 10, 2004)

Tough habit to break. My last dog only started getting her licks in when she got older. Usually chomping down just before delivering to hand. I lived with it. All I know is the year I was between dogs and bird hunted without a dog I missed the little bite marks.

Canuck


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## BROWNDOG (Nov 2, 2004)

I would say you have to go back in the off season to your "yard program' with fresh birds and renforce hold and give. If you can't get good results in the yard then it will be hard to get any results in the heat of the hunt.

I would go back to the begining and start with bumpers and go from there and insist on good bird or bumper handling. If done enough times it will form a habit good or bad.


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## Guest (Jan 6, 2009)

I think after pondering for a couple days, deny my bride from "playing with him". I believe she let him get away with too much. Retraining is in the works (for both Kody and my better half I think)


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## gonehuntin' (Jul 27, 2006)

The only answer is to totally re-force the dog and even then, results are not a guarantee. As I say, you may control it, you'll never cure it.

The entire secret lies in contolling jaw movement. You have to start him on a ff table or plank and start with "HOLD". If he moves his jaws at all pop him under the chin ( I use a cut off quirt handle) and command "NO, HOLD!". You have to be very precise with this and tolerate no adjustment in the jaws at all.

Once you have that down, proceed to a walking hold, walking the dog at heel while he hold. Same deal. If he moves a jaw, pop him under it and command "NO, HOLD"!. Work him about 15" twice a day in all of these sessions.

When he has that, start throwing it a few feet and having him return to heel. Same correction.

Now proceed to throwing it 20' with a return to heel. If he's a collar dog, this is the point you nick him when he works his jaws and command 'NO, HOLD!" If not, keep him on a cc and give a sharp jerk when he works those jaws.

Now we go through all the proceedures again, only using different birds. Pigeons, pheasant, duck. Don't use frozen birds, only fresh. Frozen birds only avoid the problem.

This is a very difficult and unpleasant thing to stop and is best done by a COMPETENT pro that has done it before. The old cures of barb wire around a bird or a cattle prod wired to a bird don't work.

The best thing for you to do, is to start working on it and come back here for help as you progress.


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## Guest (Jan 7, 2009)

Thanks GH, I have to try, I just don't like a hard mouth. My best would hold a raw egg w/o breaking it. I don't expect that but I don't want my birds chewed. I'll keep you posted on the progress.


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