# THERE IS HOPE!



## Bronco (Aug 12, 2002)

Below I copied a topic I found from some unhappy NR Hunters who tried a ND resort/guide service. The topic is at www.huntingbuddy.com If only we could get all the guides to do this well- maybe they would put themselves out of business 8) :lol:

Beware of a resort called Lunds Landing in NW North Dakota, on Lake Sakakawea. We booked with them for excellent waterfowl and pheasant hunting last fall at the Sportsman's Show in Minneapolis. The owner did a wonderful job of decieving us by overselling what his accomidations were, and more importantly, the quality of the hunting. This resort is out of the flyway and is to far north for decent pheasant hunting. The accomidations were very overstated. Five guys paid $90 a night a piece, prepaid for 5 nights (resort policy), for three twin beds, a pullout couch, and a plywood loft (Yes, I paid that much money to sleep on plywood). The $90 did include meals. Their cabins did not have running water or toilet facilities, which were in the main lodge, 100 yards away. We could have accepted this if the hunting had been even half decent. We were promised access to thousands of acres of private land. Instead, he handed us a plot book and showed us how to find public hunting areas. We hunted hard for one day, with good dogs, and had very little success for pheasants or waterfowl. When we confronted the resort owner, he became hostile and would not refund our money. We cut our losses, drove east to the central part of the state, and had a terrific hunt. To make things worse, we ran into local people who said this resort has a reputation for this sort of thing. If you are like myself and only have a limited amount of resources and time, I urge you to be careful in booking anything that requires full payment up front and to help spread the word regarding Lunds Landing in Ray, North Dakota.


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## prairie hunter (Mar 13, 2002)

This lodge is out of Ray, ND.

Good waterfowl hunting area if you scout. Localized movement (water, weather, pressure) in any area of ND can result in high numbers of ducks or nonexistent numbers during the season. Flux is common. Moving to another area is always a good option.

The guy should have told them that pheasant populations in NW ND are about as low as they have been in the past 20 years. Freak blizzards and wet Junes have hit this area of ND pretty hard the past 4 - 6 years. The past winter was relatively minor. Maybe the birds will come back soon.


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## Fetch (Mar 1, 2002)

I am originally from Ray ND - I do not really know these people, but I have been to there place of business.

It has been 30 years since I lived out there & seriously hunted around there. But it was pretty good. Especially for sharptails. & there are pheasants around Springbrook dam & Williston Blacktail dam up to Crosby.

My duck hunting was all up north of Ray by Wildrose & it was fantastic. I never really hunted down by the river for waterfowl - I'm sure there has to be some - especially Canadas. Now as far as SOB's go - that area is not famous for them at all. I don't ever recall seeing any around there - back then- but as the flyway moved west - I'm sure they get some. But not hardly a real huntable population. & the last few years it has been tough all over ND. Even for those that have 1/2 of any county leased or posted.

Now there were tons of sharptails around there back then. I went to UND Williston for one year & practically lived on deer & sharptails & hashbrowns. 

This is exactly why I had to quit guiding - I hated the pressure to find birds for people to kill. Imagine doing it everyday - for the entire season. One new & fresh & fired up group after another. Wanting to kill. Each paying $90 a day & that is cheap nowadays. To me hunting is scouting & finding the birds. & to do that you need to cover some huge areas. I have done it since I was 16 & I'm 50 now. I am confident, I could go out there & find birds (both upland & waterfowl to hunt) in a 1/2 a day.

Now multiply this by what ??? How many guides are now working that area ??? Other areas ??? There is no way to sustain good hunting in any area, that is hunted like that. The birds are too unpredictable & weather etc.
Unless you release pheasants & that isn't hunting :roll: Thats shooting & training your dog stuff. (but you would be surprised how many do this & folks think it's hunting ND) :roll:

All this is why I hate to see ND become more & more of this kind of so called hunting. It is sad & causes nothing but problems.

I can remember making brochures to give out on our guide business. (before web pages) Sure you show your best of the best- But for any guide business. You have bad days.

Here is their web page http://www.lundslanding.com/hunting.htm Is it overstated ??? Compared to any ??? All we said in ours was, we would gaurentee you see birds - not that you will always get them. Now days the pressure is on & the competition is strong, to try to get high paying people birds. That it is screwing up hunting for everyone. With all the greed & expectations of pay to hunt - shooters. Add to that that most of these places profit from all aspects of the groups that come there - How is that good for Ray ??? Or any other small town ??? IT IS THE FREELANCE HUNTERS THAT BUY THE GAS & FOOD & ROOMS & DRINK IN THE BARS IN SMALL TOWNS !!!

SO IT SHOULD BE FREELANCE HUNTING THAT IS BEING PROMOTED & IMPROVED BY THE HOSPITALITY ASSN. & CHAMBERS OF COMMERCE - should'nt it ??? But that is not the case.

Oh well !!! you reap what you sow. Too bad there are so many that see hunting as things it is not.

I'm pretty sure that place started as a fishing destination & bait shop. I'm sure they have expanded to hunting ??? To try to stay alive yr round ???

==============================================
Hey Chris we need a smilie with a Halo - For us holier types


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## Bronco (Aug 12, 2002)

Fetch, I can understand where you come from-things have changed a great deal over the years. To be honest, I wouldn't mind having guides around if they "played on a level playing field". What I mean is if they took out their clients and scouted and ask permission and then hunted with the group. However, it seems around this neck of the woods the guides feel the need to post 1/2 the county and that is why they get so much heat from me. I guess it is just a hard pill to swallow-especially as I grew up in a small community where we had the run of the land.

I wish there was something we could do to help the family farmer, because this whole outfitter and guide thing is smoke and mirrors. I wish farmers and sportsman could form some type of organization, which would give the farmers a stronger voice to get farm policy changed and hopefully develop strong farmer/sportsman relationships. I don't understand farming much, but I do know there is a problem when a farmer gets $50 bucks for a whole hog, yet 2 pounds of thick sliced bacon costs me $8 bucks in the store :eyeroll: . I don't believe most farmers would buy into this outfitter/guide BS if they could make a decent living farming. I know enough about farming to understand the family farmer is getting screwed, but I don't know enough to change it. It seems the middle man has the farmer right by the old gonads though- and the guides jump in like they can solve all the landower problems with the great wealth from hunting. They say it is rural economic development-but guides can never generate the same cash flow in the rural communities as farming did in its hayday. Wouldn't it be nice if we could form a large Landowner/Sportsman organization under the NRA Umbrella! We would really have a strong voice then-Farmers could make a living-We all could keep our Guns & have land access to hunt on & the NRA would even be stronger! And the guides and outfitters would be at Job Service learning a new trade! Maybe its a dream-but it does paint a pretty picture.


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## tsodak (Sep 7, 2002)

You know, I started to say there awta be a law, but then I realized, there is. Outfitters and guides are not allowed use of PLOTS ground, or so I have been told in training. If any of you see this, REPORT IT. The wardens are overstretched, and they need you r help. Sign the complaint. Talk to them. And hey, lets be careful out there. Tom


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## Bronco (Aug 12, 2002)

I appreciate the info! I have one other question though involving CRP. I have been told (and it was bar-room talk, so take it for what it is worth), but someone once told me landowners are not suppose to post CRP?? Is there any truth to that?
Thanks


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## tsodak (Sep 7, 2002)

There is nothing in the CRP regs saying anything about posting. Wishful thinking my friend. Tom


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## Bronco (Aug 12, 2002)

Tom, just wanted to say I appreciate your insight and sorry if I see a little over bearing at times in these discussions. I support the Game & Fish and their efforts, but I also question things at times. It is no secret that I am against the outfitters & guides, but I guess if you have "radicals" on each side of the issue hopefully things will settle in the middle some place.

I agree with Scraper in the fact that you folks sell yourself short on some of your programs. I feel the PLOTS program is a huge success and you all need a pat on the back for your good work!!!


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## nodakoutdoors.com (Feb 27, 2002)

I have an interesting story...it's a little off topic, but you'll probably enjoy it.

My buddy and I had a talk tonight, and he said he was goose hunting down by the plant the other day. He got to the field at 4:30 and there was already a huge maroon excursion with a giant white trailer all decked out in advertising in the field. He had permission for it....but drove up, checked it out and moved to the adjacent field ( a far second from what he told me ). So they went on their way and got set up. They knew it was an outfitter by the trailer, and this was the first time in 12 years I've ever heard of an outfitter in this area.

The morning came and the outfitter's field sucked in all the birds, and he claimed they shot 25 to 30 (only 4 guys, but he's not positive on the number).

We know the guy well who's field it was, and he came out to check us out to see how we did. He saw the guy in the field so the landowner tore into the field with a 4-wheeler. He was ****** that the guide tore up his field with his tires, dug deep pits...and hunted without permission. The guide gave him lip to boot. So the landowner told him he had to carry every decoy, gear and birds out of the field immediately. The field was 1/2 mile from the road.

I don't think we'll see him around again.


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## Bronco (Aug 12, 2002)

Chris, I think we should all pitch in and buy this landowner a beer for doing that! It would have been nice to capture that scene with a camera, outfitter lugging all his decoys out the field with angry clients (I imagine), would make a nice screen saver :lol:


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## Field Hunter (Mar 4, 2002)

I hope the clients didn't help carry anything. It's been eye-opening this year when asking landowners to hunt unposted land as to how many say that nobody ever asks to hunt. We've been welcomed with open arms by farmers we've never met before for asking to hunt on unposted land. We had one morning that we left deeper than normal tracks in a barley field as it had rained the night before. The farmer said he normally gets mad when he finds tracks like that but because we asked permission he had no problem with it at all.


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