# You always hate to find these when your out shed hunting.



## goatboy

We had passed him up during the archery season in hopes he'd make it another couple years, guess not.


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## bretts

yeah that's rough, I know how you feel, I have found a few bucks over the past few years that didn't make it. How's the shed hunting going...I think Im heading out this week to do a bunch of looking


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## goatboy

Most have their racks yet but some are losing them.


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## bretts

Most of the big ones have lost atleast one, if not both, we picked up a nice 4 point about 3 1/2 weeks ago.


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## kase

my uncle shot what he thought was a huge doe the last weekend of muzzle loader, but when he got up to it, it was a buck that had dropped both antlers already. when they rolled it over to gut it, one of its testicles was hanging by a thread. he said it looked like it had been shot during rifle season in the sack. he said that if they're wounded, sometimes they'll drop their antlers early.

kase


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## kase

bretts

have you ever found a shed before? do you even know what you're doing or what you're looking for when you get out there?

kase


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## bretts

I try


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## goatboy




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## drjongy

What's the deal with blocking out the face?!?! :huh:


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## goatboy

My buddy was born that way. :lol:


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## bretts

What's with being so secretive?


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## USSapper

Thats really unfortunate but it happens every year and nothing can really be done-let me take that back, if people would choose their shot more wisely this would cut it back but i am sure the fever would hit a guy when one like that gets up. that boy had alot of potential in the coming years


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## Tator

hey goat, too bad you had to find that. Me peronally, I would've shot that critter opening day if he walked by me!!!!! not sure how you could hold off!!! good for you.

I"ve always said the deer you pass up around our area, they'll either get shot by someone else the next day, or the last day. we don't see many 4 1/2 year old deer.

but than again, I"ve been just as guilty as the next. **** happens

tough luck though, he would've been a beaut next year!

Tator


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## kevin.k

yeah alot of bucks still have their horns... i was out by my bowhunting spot the other day (their is a coyote problem out their) :sniper:

and out in the field was the monster buck i had been seing in sept/oct and 2 nice buddies of his.

i know it was him because his horns are a thick golden yellow hopefully they fall off and i find them...


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## goatboy

Hope you find his sheds, would love to see them!
:beer:


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## kase

i don't even pick up sheds like that one your little guy is holding. why waste the effort carrying a little antler like that back to the pickup. just leave them for the squirrels :wink: ......unreal

kase


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## papapete

To me thats why you don't pass on deer that nice. There is no gaurentee that you will ever see him again. I've heard people say many times "You should've passed on him. He would've been really huge next year." Well I shot him this year because he is huge now. You don't always get a second chance at nice deer. Our area is hunted really hard come gun season. Most of our really nice deer are shot. Usually if I don't shot when I get my chance, someone else will.

I suppose it would be different if I had control of a large chunck of land, and could dictate what got shot.

At least you know what became of him.
:beer:


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## USSapper

> There is no gaurentee that you will ever see him again


It at least gives them a chance


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## bretts

I have to agree with papa...also that buck that was found dead in my opinion I don't think that's a buck that you let go it just wasn't a deer that is going to be huge. It will gain some mass, but after 3 1/2 yrs most bucks don't gain much more height and IMO that buck is 3 1/2...I would have shot it because it was nice, and If was my land, it would have been also for management purposes.


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## kase

how can you judge age just by looking at a rack?

kase


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## Tator

you can never know for sure JUST by looking, the best way would probably be aging their teeth, but you can get a GUESSstimate on about how old they are, and probably only be off a year.

some 1 1/2 year olds have a decent size rack on them by that age, most usually don't, but some do, and some 3 1/2 year olds rack isn't quite there yet, just all depends on the conditions.

not much help, i know..........but eh


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## kase

that's what i'm saying. a rack can differ so much much from deer to deer and year to year. the only way that you can get a good estimate on the age of a deer (besided killing it and examining his teeth) is to see it's body. does his back dip? how big is his body? is he gray in the face? i just don't think that you can judge the age of a deer just by looking at his antlers...not close anyway

kase


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## Scott Schuchard

how did you pass up on that deer? I dont think I ever could have


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## bretts

you easily..with some exceptions...can judge a deer by it's rack if you know what you are looking for, if you spend a lot of time looking at deer you can grow to understand what the general age is for certain racks, non-typical's would be tough, but with a main frame buck you can judge deer age IMO...also, body size is sometimes a way to judge deer age but a lot of times it is not a good way...some canadian 2 1/2 yr olds dress over 200, some 5 1/2 yr olds dress at 150-160....some bucks just don't get big bodies.


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## bretts

Pretty good piece about deer maturity, I know a lot of it focuses on the deer physical appearance, but it shows it's rack also as he ages from 
1.5-6.5....gives you an idea on how to judge a deers age with it's rack size and character....im sure most of you know this but it's cool to look at anyway..(couldn't find anything good for midwest so we will have to look at a good ol' southern buck) :-?

http://msucares.com/pubs/publications/p2206.pdf


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## headhunter

Bretts, Theres no "half accurate" way to judge a whitetail's age by his antlers. the variance in antlers makes it impossible .....I however know what you are getting at...., I can distinguish if its a 2 year old vs a 4 year old......but not a 3 vs a 4 year old or a 5 vs a 6yr old....thats impossible. Once a buck is mature, (3.5 or older) judging a buck by rack is sketchy and shouldn't be uttered out loud in front of anyone who knows a thing or 2 about Whitetails GRIN. IMHO.

Who knows what Goatboy's dead "possiblility" would have been next year..... The buck looked to score in the 130's pretty easy this year.....Next year he very well could have grossed in the 150 range....very easy.

I know of a particular buck, whom I've found 3 years of sheds off of, that has gained 30" per year! THIRTY INCHES PER YEAR......Not Bad.


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## USSapper

thanks for the site brett, i have been looking for something like this just to get some others opinions on rack size from year to year


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## goatboy

No he never would have been a monster but a nice buck non the less in two years. We had photos of him from past seasons and he was 3 1/2, thought he'd go 145ish next year.
Like I've always said deer are like us, not everyone is going to be 7ft tall when they get older.
Boy the past couple days the deer have really been out eating early getting ready for the big cold snap in big groups, weird how they know that better than most weatherman!


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## headhunter

Goatboy, so what was the verdict, I assume somebody hit him during rifle season with a poorly placed shot (whats new) and he died later ? I found 2 dead deer this year, friend found 1. Its too bad people have to take running shots who don't know how to shoot. I'll bet that buck would have been a good 145 next year, he just had week g4's but they sometimes "pop up" from year to year.

Goatboy, what is the most growth you have seen a buck put on in a year, or in several years in a row....ever followed a huge buck from back when he was a pup?


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## bretts

oh for sure...it's super tough to judge rack by age past 3.5 but you can get a ball park figure from character/mass etc.etc.. 30 inches is insane....I have followed a few bucks from the sheds that I have and it's weird because for the majority they haven't gained a whole lot of antler from year to year. I had a shed from a 2 1/2 year old 5 point 125'ish and he was shot 3 years later and he prob grossed 130-135 tops.


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## bretts

Here's a few that would make a guy sick for a long time....


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## mmnk

bretts,

That website you provided is good information, but says nothing about judging bucks by their racks. Did you read through that article, it only says what percentage of their antler growth depending on age, which could differ and vary with each deer. So just looking at a picture of a rack it is nearly impossible to judge a deers age, unless like you said you've been tracking that deer in years past.


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## bretts

We already established that....what I was showing was there is a definite difference from year to year, and you can get a ball park figure of it's age. On average a deer show's it true frame by 3 1/2...and there is usually a noticable difference between a 2.5 and a 3.5 and usually you can see diffence between a 3.5 and a 5.5-6.5 because of mass and usually character builds with age. BALL PARK, that's all Im saying.


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## Tator

bretts wrote:



> you easily..with some exceptions...can judge a deer by it's rack if you know what you are looking for, if you spend a lot of time looking at deer you can grow to understand what the general age is for certain racks, non-typical's would be tough, but with a main frame buck you can judge deer age IMO..


 :withstupid:

from what I read there, I'm understanding that you can totally judge a deer by the horns, I guarantee you you can't use JUST the horns to judge a deer, sure you can look at horns, body weight, mass, and all that other crap, but that doesn't mean nothing in reguards to knowing for sure.

some deer make a big jump from 2 to 3, sure, but some deer look pretty damn nice at 2 1/2, where some people think it could be a 4 year old, by no means am I saying that I"m an expert, I just throw out my usual guestimate on a buck, and if I'm wrong, don't really care, but horns alone is quite rediculous for geussing accurate age as easily as you may think it is............. but that again,  I don't spend as much looking at deer's horns as you you (as stated above) I'm just an average guy :-?


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## USSapper

tator, dont mean to pick on you but brett just stated that the you can get a BALLPARK figure on the age. I gueess pp know what they are looking for in a deer, and simply if its big enough they will shoot it, if not, well then theyll wait til a bigger one comes by whether its older or younger than the first one that came by.


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## Tator

I understand that, but he did say "you can easily, if you've been spending a lot of time looking at deer by looking at his horns" 

Yes, you can get ball park, but that statement there kinda isn't ball park IMO, it's saying you can get an accurate measure if a deer's age, which I think most of us realize is a little tough.

I mean, obviously most deer you see, you'll probably be able to tell a decent age on them by horns, but there are a few who look young, or heck, even look old, that you'd be way off.

My father in law shot a deer bout 5 years ago, 5x5, looked like a 2 1/2, except for that fact that it had nearly none of it's teeth left!!!! This deer was old, and on his downslide.


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## rossco

i think im gonna have to agree with bretts on this....you can definetely get ballpark estimates of deer age if they are normal mainframe typical deer. bretts said that he thought the buck looked like a 3 1/2 yr. old buck....and goatboy later confirmed that it was from his trail cam pics. if im not mistaken the north dakota game and fish proclamation has pictures of the progression of a buck's antler size in regards to its age....im pretty sure they would have more experience than any of us in this subject, and they dont put that in the proclamation to take up space


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## Tator

well from the deer I see in your pic avatar, I'd say you took a good and upcoming 2 1/2 year old out of the system, nice work. :lol:

btw, I'm laughing out loud, just made a good funny to myself......


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## bretts

Tator...You have to stop with the personal attacks...people aren't going to have the same opinions as you, by the way that buck shot by Rossco is a 4 1/2 yr old we have the sheds to from years before and it grossed low 130's, picture doesn't do it justice to the mass.


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## USSapper

O brett, tator isnt attacking you, he is just having a bad day :lol: Regardless, you hate to find those types or any deer after the season


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## bretts

Oh for sure, I have found a few but nothing of that size. It's a long wait till we get to be back up in the tree...and this cold weather isn't making it any easier


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## Tator

thank you sap, I agree with you for that one. drunk by 2 pm never does any justice, however a 4 hour nap did!!! I'm good now, I'll quit picking on you then, until you find some thicker skin to wear from now on.

have a good weekend and god bless brett


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## bretts

haha gotta love a good ol' hunting argument


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## Triple B

bretts, 
were those dead bucks all around the land you hunt? if so i'd say theres a problem?


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## USSapper

bretts said:


> Oh for sure, I have found a few but nothing of that size.


Trip, i dont think brett found those ones- I could be mistaken though


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## bretts

They are all from northern minnesota, absolute monsters. That first buck has an unbelievable rack.


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## goatboy

Yes giants no doubt, what a shame.


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