# Nonresident Hunting



## Amber Krapp

Hello to everyone!

I am new to the website and when registering, had no hesitation to include my last name. Oh heaven forbid, a "Krapp" offers her 2 cents.

I've been following the non-resident hunting issue and quite frankly, I think it is ridiculous that the people who have come to call themselves "Sportsmen" even think they have a reason to complain. If it were not for landowners who have taken great care of their land, these "sportsmen" wouldn't have a reason to complain. Think about it: great land offers great hunting, but great land does not come without great effort.

If you "sportsmen" want to buy land and nurture it to great hunting land, then by all means do it. You can have all the hunting opportunities you've ever dreamed of. Maybe then you'll realize that all your hard work may be worth a dime or two. What makes you think that someone's property is everyone's priviledge? As a Fargo resident, I know I don't see too many people strolling around in someone else's yard and above all else, feel "entitled" by their state of residency to do so.

As much as you get a kick out of bashing my parents and other landowners with any common sense, perhaps it is reality that they are the smart ones in all this, and after much hard work beat you to an opportunity you can only dream of. I guess as a ND citizen, I don't find it too smart to want to restrict visitors to a state that struggles with tourism in more ways than one. There are PLENTY of birds to hunt for non-residents and residents alike. We all learned in kindergarten that BIRDS FLY. Maybe they were born in another state and flew to the ND skies. I'm willing to bet they even flew over a few states in between. So whose are they? What makes a select few ND residents feel they are superior to anyone in our "United Country?"

The "Sportsmen" may hold a small chance of winning the battle of zoned areas, but they will NOT win the war. How many area landowners do you believe will let you hunt THEIR land after all the commotion and complaining you have done in the past year? After writing an editorial to The Forum in February 2003, I received many responses from residents who agreed with me. The underlying message was much to the effect of no "sportsmen" allowed. One northern N.D. farmer stated that one of his 3 questions to people asking permission to hunt his land was "Are you from Jamestown, Fargo, or Grand Forks?" And obviously a "yes" response to that question was a definite "NO" to the PRIVILEDGE of hunting his land.

With all that is going on in our world today, I find it sad that for some of you, the biggest worry is whether or not you'll get to hunt or not.

I know everyone is entitled to his/her opinion, but looking at this issue realistically might be helpful too. The reality boils down to the fact that everyone is entitled to do as they please on THEIR property.

Amber Krapp
Fargo, ND


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## bioman

Amber:

Welcome to the site, and for the record I am a non-resident. I believe your argument is missing one critical element, you as a landowner do not own that resource. The State and Federal government does (e.g., they manage the resource and set limits, season lengths, etc). Do yourself a big favor and become acquainted with the Public Trust Doctrine. Once you understand the doctrine emphatically, then maybe you will see where a lot of "sportsmen" are getting their ideals.


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## gandergrinder

Amber,
One of the major reasons that your parents get bashed is the fact that they are so very vocal in the way they stand. If you want to stand in the middle of the fire then prepared to get burned. This is just the way it is.

The question is will your parents have enough restraint to say no to money when the birds aren't as plentiful? Or will they sell sell sell as long as there is one duck left. :eyeroll: Without some limits the greed begins to take hold untill we sell off every natural resource we have.

No one says that they cannot make money off there land or even a few ducks. But if they do make money off the ducks that we all own. Are they going to send a check in the mail to the landowners who grew the ducks in another county or another state or another country?

How about the money that all the SPORTSMEN paid into the Game and Fish through licences or Ducks Unlimited or Delta or Pheasants Forever. 
They helped grow those birds.

My question to you is. Who is selling out all of the resources that we all helped to grow?


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## redlabel

How does the Public Trust Doctrine work in the following case?

In 1984 Mr. Smith and Mr. Jones purchased 640 acres of pasture. The area around this pasture has some game but not much and harldy anyone hunts in the immediate vicinity. Smith and Jones spend the next 10 years planting trees and shrubs on their new property. They also spend considerable time weeding, cultivating, tilling, and hauling water to those trees.

The area gradually turns into quite a haven for deer and upland game. The former pasture and the surrounding area become an area of excellent hunting and is utilized by many "sportsmen" because the land is unposted.

Mr. Smith and Mr. Jones, as well as most of the landowners in the area now start to post their property due to the increasing number of "sportsmen" now using the property and allow hunting to anyone that asks.

Over the next several years a few of those "sportsmen", (note the word few) decide to leave their garbage along the road, leave gates open, hunt in areas they were asked to avoid, left their unwanted game in a pile, and in a few cases left the female of the pheasant species where it was inadvertently, or not, shot. Mr. Smith and Mr. Jones reluctantly became a bit more selective in their policy of granting permission and some of the surrounding landowners just plain quit giving permission out of frustration and disgust with these few "sportsmen".

In 1992 and again in 1996 adjacent landowners sold additional property to Mr. Smith and Mr. Jones who again planted trees and rented the farmable acreage to an area farmer.

Mr. Smith and Mr. Jones have children that helped plant, weed, and water those trees and enjoyed the hunting in the area with their fathers. These children have now moved out of North Dakota and return to hunt with Mr. Smith and Mr. Jones on three occasions each year. They return for the pheasant opening weekend, Thanksgiving, and Christmas. This year Mr. Jones will have each of his children miss one of those weekends due to the legislature, with a very strong backing by many of the urban "sportsmen", changing the licenses to two 5 day periods. The twist now comes in that Mrs. Jones, a non-hunter, is now upset with the urban hunters because she will not see her grandchildren this year at Thanksgiving and has declared that permission should not be given to any hunters from (you've probably guessed it), Fargo, Grand Forks, Minot, or Bismarck.

Mrs. Smith, however, comes up with a suggestion to charge resident hunters and use that money to pay for the extra licenses that will be required due to the changes. Mr. Smith and Mr. Jones think this is a good idea an so this fall will be charging residents that wish to hunt on their property.

Mr. Smith and Mr. Jones know they do not own the birds and game on their land but they have learned the GOLDEN RULE of giving permission to hunt on their land.

HE WHO HAS THE GOLD, MAKES THE RULES

As stated neither Mr. Smith nor Mr. Jones think they own any of the game on their property, but they do know they game is their due to the habitat they have provided. This habitat was not provided by the Game and Fish Department, Pheasants Forever, Ducks Unlimited, or Delta Waterfowl.


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## kkrapp

The facts on the subject are these: 1. The birds are here NOW, regardless of what the future holds. 2. People are willing to visit North Dakota, god's land of tourism :roll: , and hunt for these birds. 3. Correct, the ducks belong to not one single individual or group of people. 4. Non-residents pay outfitters and guides for a SERVICE, not for the birds. Do you go to a car wash and pay them for the soap and water, or do you pay them for the labor? That is the principle of a service business.


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## Dick Monson

redlabel, if you know Smith and Jones, suggest to them that they replace Mrs. Smith and Mrs. Jones.


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## Amber Krapp

Gandergrinder, just curious how you have done your share to help "grow" the waterfowl you mentioned? Do you own land that you work year-round on, making sure the wildlife has just what it needs to survive? If you think it is an accident that certain landowners have wonderful hunting land, you're mistaken. I see first hand all the work that is put into it. If you're offering to do that work, then by all means do it. Landowners know very well that they do not own the waterfowl on their land, but that still does not change the fact that is IS their land and the work put into it entitles them to say who may or may not be on that land. I think those of you who call yourself sportsmen are digging your own grave. The Smith/Jones story posted is exactly where your battle is going to get you. Who in their right mind would allow groups such as yours access to their land after all the name-calling and bad mouthing you have demonstrated towards landowners?

As far as my parents being vocal, they along with every other landowner have every right to be. It is their hard work that until now, every hunter (resident and non-resident alike) have benefitted from. I know for a fact they have never denied access to a resident hunter who has first asked permission. The non-residents are the only ones charged. Although after this is all said and done, I think a lot of the residents should be prepared to be denied access or ready to pay an access fee, thanks to certain "sportsmen" groups.


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## gandergrinder

Facts
1. Will nonresidents pay for your services without ducks? NO
2. Did the Game and Fish supply a proposal to try and maintain it so you will have ducks for years to come? YES
3.Was this based on the opinion of professional biologists? YES
4. Did you lobby against this proposal? YES
5. Are you a biologist? NO

Yes the ducks are here now and we don't know what the future holds but that does not give us permission to lose sight of the long term. It is that short term ideology that I fear will destroy the wonderful resources we have.


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## Amber Krapp

Mother Nature will take care of the waterfowl population, not non-resident hunters. I've seen the reports from the professional biologists, but what you fail to mention is how biased that whole survey was. If you really want to call yourself "sportsmen" one would think you'd be more concerned about if the wildlife is being cared for more than if someone is benefitting from landowners' hard work. You should be thankful there are people who put such hard work into their land. Keep up your whining and you'll find yourself traveling to another state just to find access. Landowners aren't the right people to upset.

I'm still curious how you helped to "grow" the resource. You must have a plot of land somewhere that you put a lot of work into if you can honestly believe yourself.


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## gandergrinder

Amber,
Do I own land? No.
Have I ever bashed a land owner? No
Will I own land some day? Yes
Will I grow wildlife on that land? Yes

If you asked me if I was willing to come and help out on your farm for the chance to do a little hunting would I do it? You bet I would.

Do I think that your parents and you have every right to state your opinion? I sure do and I respect the fact that you and they are willing to put your name behind what you say. So I will do the same. Even if it means that a landowner may see this and not let me hunt.
Hope your having a great weekend.

Jed Fluhrer


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## Amber Krapp

Thanks Jed.

I'm glad you haven't ever personally attacked a landowner, but many memebers in groups such as yours have. One bad apple spoils the whole bunch, I guess. I would like to believe that not every member of sportsmen groups is as extreme as the few who have stepped up. The vocalists in your groups are going to ruin it for everyone, and that is too bad. I'm also glad you have enough courage to put a name to your claims, I know that with my last name I am probably automatically put on everyone's hate list coming into a forum filled with "sportsmen" such as this. 

I just want everyone to know that my parents are far from being greedy or selfish people. They are the kindest people you'll ever meet. Dad has lived on this land his entire life and he knows absolutely everything there is to know about it. His love of nature and wildlife is what keeps his land thriving and likely what keeps his hunters coming back. They just love my parents and the community and I know they'd come back to visit whether or not we had plenty of birds or if they were scarce. Not just anyone can go buy some land and have wildlife flock to it. Dad knows what wildlife needs to have for food, what they need to survive--everything.

I have never, ever seen my parents deny anyone access to their land if permission was asked. Even this past hunting season I was home to visit and given strict orders of what to tell a hunter who stopped to get permission to hunt (if my parents were gone). Dad always told me to give them directions to a spot that he believed would be the "lucky spot". You call that greedy and selfish? If greed and selfishness were involved, I think he would send me to the door with a money box. That is far from the case. My parents are genuinely good people who have worked their tails off to get to where they are today.

Until the uproar was brought up by sportsmen groups, I don't think I'd ever ran into a resident hunter who had problems accessing PRIVATE land. But now I know a lot of landowners are upset and sick of this going on, and on, and on. I think this fall you all will see a lot of changes and a LOT more land that is posted. It's exactly what you're asking for.

And yes, my weekend at the lake has been wonderful, even though I'm sunburned and exhausted!


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## Austin Bachmeier

If I wasn't a poor kid I would buy as much land as I could. I would invite anyone who asked to come out with me and hunt on it, and if they were decent, they could come back. Maybe someday....

The problem is not telling people what they can do with their land, the problem is people thinking they have the right to do whatever they want with the animals on their land.

Put it this way... You have 10,000 ducks sitting in an unharvested field eating whatever crop it may be.... can you just go out and kill them all because they are on YOUR land?? uh uh that just ain't gonna happen.. You would have feds at your farm door fast as the new High Velocity Steel...

So should you be able to take the birds away from the general public during the season and give them to a few high rollers from both here and god knows where?? I guess in my opinion, No. Freelancers, both resident and non should have equal opportunity at them as anyone or else NOONE should have them.

Maybe this is just the mentality I have from hunting pubilc land most of my days, as there it's whoever puts in the work and time gets the rewards... I am grateful to the few private landowners around here that grant me persmission, and I respect them and their property as much as the Birds I'm hunting....

All I can say is Im glad you people can't lease out the Sand I hunt so I will at least have one place to go..... until some greedy person attempts to pull that one off too, but you can bet if something like that happens I'll be there to put a boot to that silly idea.... :eyeroll:


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## kkrapp

You're right, you cant go shoot them all. But you could go out there and get a couple limits and they wouldnt come back, because they are smart and wouldnt go back to the same field that all their buddies got slaughtered at. I've never seen a flock of stupid birds like that.


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## Miller

So did you Krapps sell your business yet?


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## Austin Bachmeier

I was talking off season, but yeah, spin it however you want.... :eyeroll:


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## ND Gander

Austin:

Be careful what you post. If you are going to call a spade a spade then why is it you have been baned from your sisters land up by Wolford? Is it because you forgot how to ask permission? If I were you I would walk softly when talking about landowners and granting permission. Folks in the grass lake area know the truth.


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## nodakoutdoors.com

Amber,

I really don't think the outfitters and small town North Dakota are on the same "side". Small town North Dakota and outfitters are in competition to try to profit in every way they can off of the nonresident hunter.

Here's some services that small town North Dakota provides for hunters:

food and snacks, cafe, lounge, gas, shells and other equipment, etc.

Outfitters provide the same services (except for gas). Only difference between these two competitors, is that one has power to "muscle" the other out and that's the outfitters.

When an outfitter controls all of the land surrounding that small town in ND, and the only access is pay access, and all of the same services offered in that town are also offered in the lodge........what does that do for the town? The outfitters are taking the last profits the small towns could've been making away.


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## kkrapp

That right there is what's wrong with it all. You make too many assumptions on these outfitters. Hunters in the Pingree area are set up with a breakfast at no charge, the rest of their meals are bought at the Pingree cafe, or the 281 Stop, which those businesses are grateful for. They buy their extra shells from Gun and Reel or WalMart in Jamestown. And if the outfitters are such vultures, then why can there only be a dozen people there at a time when it'd be so easy to go and buy another old farmhouse and put another dozen in, so the outfitter could double his so called profit. To answer another question, yes, Oren Krapp has a loyal clientel that WOULD come back even when the bird populations are low. A man named Bert from Iowa pays the North Dakota game and fish department for a non-resident license, drives up here, spends cash in the cities on the way, just to ride around in a pickup truck with "the man", and would just assume not shoot any ducks. I know a man from Houston who visits every year, believe his name is Dickey, who likes to sit out in the field and just watch the ducks fly by his spread. I think he's killed one duck in all they years he's visited. There are many more of these examples, it's the hospitality that brings them back.


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## Amber Krapp

What does selling land have to do with hunting? Can you explain, Miller??

You think outfitters are in competition with small towns? Yeah, right. That must be why they all back our sides in this deal. For the record, we don't sell anything you mentioned, Chris. Not shells, not food, not snacks, not beer, not gas. They go to area towns, one being the hole we've come to call Jamestown. Hunters spend a lot of money also on their way through the state. Not just in the area they are hunting. I think you shoulda done your research before jumping to any assumptions like you did.

No wonder some of you are getting kicked off your own sister's land.


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## Ron Gilmore

For most of us that grew up in ND and left, then retruned we are well aware of the special place ND is to sportmen. Many of us either grew up on a farm or ranch or have famliy and friends that are in the business.Most sportsmen that I have met respect and cherish this state and the landowners in it.

I went from being opposed to caps on nonresidents to being a supporter of caps. Biggest reason was what no controls where doing to the sport and the local communities.

I do not know the Krapp business personally nor do I intend to. I like many are judging them by there actions as they are ours. I looked and listened to the testimony that was given in Bismarck on many issues regarding G/O and caps and came away with the opinion that they had one agenda and that was getting laws in place that benifited them and those in there business only. I then read the e-mail that was posted on this site and remember the pettion that they helped circulate and those that signed it. Once again a ME only attitude seemed to surface. Now with that being said, I took some time and looked back at my postings and others on these same subjects and you can come to the same conclusion about many of us.Both sides have been gulity of statements that could be interrputed in correctly from there intent.

I am speaking for myself here when I say that I do believe that a landowner should and always be the one to control who has access to thier land. I believe that a landowner should have the right to profit from the ownership of that land, but like any other business not at the expense of the greater good of all citenzens of the community or state or nation. Rules and regulations have and will be in place that limit things that can be done on ones property.

I live in Fargo and I have restrictions on what I can do with my home. I am restricted from opening a business, the type of fence I can erect, putting up a clothes line, planting of certain types of tree's on the berm, etc. A farmer and rancher may not have these same restrictions but a different set of rules to follow as this is what society and democracy gives us. We live in a country that recognizes more personal freedoms than any other nation in the world, but even at the time of the signing of the Constitution it set forth restrictions.

Today we face a growing trend of losing our young people to other area's that have more econmic benifits, with less and less people being able to find employment with incomes that will help them secure a future or retirement, some of us have made choices to sacrifice monetary gain with quality of life. When we do so we help in supporting the tax base that provides services to those that cannot provide for themselves. Our need for people to help with those in need of long term care, medical facilities and other nessasary community based issues are hampered by those that will seek only activities that benifit them solely.

I here the word tourism being used by opponnets of caps and G/O restrictions and cringe, because tourism in a state that is limited by climate like we are, it cannot be the single sustaining force to provide the needs for the above services. Agriculture use to provide this when we had farms that where under 600 acres average in size. They provided workers through familes to fill seasonal needs and local community support. Today with a large portion of farmers exceeding 2000 acres in operation and the manpower to farm those acres being less than before, it no longer is viable. Add into that the average age of a farmer today is over 53, and the problem becomes magnified

We as a state need to grow jobs that will attract and retain our young people to the state. ONe of the leading businesses in this state has used hunting quality as a drawing card to recruit new people, these people are what we need to grow and survive.

So restrictions that may limit a few but benifit the many are the direction we need to follow, and this is why maintaining quality of hunting over the econmic gain of a few is a much need boost in making sure that we have people to provide the services to and for the people of this state.

Without restrictions to discourage nonresidents from purchasing land and taking the revenues for rent outside of ND instead of having that money stay and be spent in ND every year, farms will continue to grow larger forcing more and more people to leave our state. Taking with them the potential of a famliy to be raised here and another generation lost. So to those that think my sole purpose in advocating restrictions is self serving look again.

Amber I admire your williness to defend what you think is right, but step back and look at this without your loyality to family and tell me if there actions better the state as a whole or hurt it over the next 10-20 years. Not them but the state and it's residents. Are the short term gains worth the long term destructions.


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## Amber Krapp

Trust me, there are plenty of things that I disagree with my parents on. This topic just happens not to be one of them.

Taking away all loyalty to my family and landowners all over, they are benefitting ND 10-20 years down the road, not hurting it. My dad has lived on that land all of his life, if you think it is an overnight miracle that wildlife habitates it, you're wrong. It has taken years and years of work for it to be where it is now at. You really think that he or any other landowner would just wipe everything out they have worked SO hard to get? I don't think so. Last year my parents won a land conservation award. Yet some of you think they are exploiting the resource? I guess I don't see that at all. They are by all means protecting the resource. If it weren't for landowner's work, the birds wouldn't be here in the first place. They are not about someone coming in and wiping everything out. They work hard to protect what habitates the land, and for some of you to belittle landowners for that is pretty low. There are strict rules that every hunter must follow, and never, not once have my parents or any non-resident hunters broken those rules. Yes, Game and Fish workers do go undercover to check these things out. Another thing you forget to look at is the fact that it is ILLEGAL for guides and outfitters to use public land. So what about the public land, what's wrong with that? Go ahead, hunt it all you want.

Here's what concerns me the most. My oldest brother is a pilot with the Air Force, obviously his time at home is extremely limited. So he grew up on this land, and spent countless hours himself working on it so that it is at where it is now. How about when he gets a break from duty? He loves to hunt. Now you say it is fair that he comes home to mom and dad's land and is not allowed to hunt because he is stationed in Spokane, Washington and not Grand Forks? That is far from fair. I know so many landowners who could care less about making money off the land, what is really important is family and friends who are no longer ND residents. Why shouldn't they be able to hunt if they want to? Or how about at NDSU, I know I have many friends who are out of staters. They come here and spend thousands of dollars to come to school here, live here, shop here. Yet they aren't allowed to hunt here because they live on the other side of the river? Is it fair that I cannot bring back a nonresident college friend to hunt even though he/she has spent a fortune to come to a ND college? Or that my military brother cannot bring his son to my parents' place to hunt since they are no longer ND residents?

I guess I know many, many landowners who will be posting and patrolling their land for the first time this fall in all the years they have lived here. It is too bad that for the resident hunters who have always follwed the rules, asked permission to hunt, and share that opportunity with their family may not get to come this fall due to a few vocal "sportsmen" who have upset the majority of landowners. Pretty sure you'll have a harder time then ever to find a place to hunt. I hope the public land produces a lot of birds for you this fall.


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## catman

DOES IT REALLY MATTER ANY MORE? TEN YEARS FROM NOW THE KRAPPS LAND WILL PROBALLY BE OWENED BY SOME CORPORATION.TEN YEARS FROM NOW THE POPULATION BASE WILL BE SO BIG ON THE EAST SIDE OF THE STATE THAT THE FARMERS AND RANCHERS WILL NOT HAVE THE EAR OF BISMARK OR WASHINGTON. ECONOMICALY AND ENVIROMENTALY YOU WILL BE CONTROLLED BY THE SIERA CLUB,P.E.T.A. AND THE EAST AND WEST COAST LIBERALS. DO YOU THINK I WILL GIVE A DAM? HELL NO. WHY SHOULD I? PEOPLE LIKE THE KRAPPS AND THERE OUTFITTER BUDDYS WILL HAVE TAKEN AWAY FROM ME THE ONE THING THAT HELPS KEEP ME IN THIS STATE. SOUNDS LIKE SOUR MILK? YOU BET. I AM TIRED OF THE RES-HUNTER GETTING THE BLAME FOR EVERTHING. I AM TIRED OF ALL THE THREATS I GET EVERY YEAR FROM THE FARMERS AND RANCHERS. SO WHEN NEXT DROUGHT, OR THE NEXT LOW PRICE SWING HIT, DO NOT ASK FOR MY HELP! HELL OPEN THE BORDERS UP BRING IN THE CHEAP FOOD. WHY SHOULD I CARE ANY MORE. IF THEY CAN NOT RUN THERE BUISSNES WITH OUT WELFARE SO BE IT. ENOUGH IS ENOUGH :******:


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## jimboy

Amber,
Have a nice day


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## kkrapp

[quote Now I ask, what has your family done to deserve $256,951 dollars earned from 96-01? [/quote]

The CONSERVATION reserve program might have contributed to some of those dollars.


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## Miller

Amber Krapp said:


> What does selling land have to do with hunting? Can you explain, Miller??


I was under the impression on your website that you were selling your operation. Maybe it was another outfitter?


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## nodakoutdoors.com

Amber Krapp said:


> You think outfitters are in competition with small towns? Yeah, right. That must be why they all back our sides in this deal. For the record, we don't sell anything you mentioned, Chris. Not shells, not food, not snacks, not beer, not gas. They go to area towns, one being the hole we've come to call Jamestown. Hunters spend a lot of money also on their way through the state. Not just in the area they are hunting. I think you shoulda done your research before jumping to any assumptions like you did.
> 
> No wonder some of you are getting kicked off your own sister's land.


I don't know what your operation provides and wasn't pointed directly at your operation but many in general, and I'm well aware of what the average lodge accomodates. I spend some time during the year in and around Logan county. The communities in that area are a great example of what I was referring to. I've heard the complaints from the rural business owners there, and my good friends who live there hear it most. They miss the customers both resident and nonresident they used to have before the local outfitter took the whole county over.



> That must be why they all back our sides in this deal.


Many businesses are now becoming educated on this issue, so "all" isn't a factual statement. Most have to see their revenues drop in the fall before they realize where it went.

I'm not about to get myself into a huge argument here, I just wanted to state my opinion. We won't see eye to eye on this one, we just disagree.


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## Amber Krapp

Nothing wrong with disagreeing either. 

Yeah you're right, Jimboy, the land will be posted up tight, but it wouldn't be if it weren't for the uproar certain groups have recently caused. Don't say you weren't asking for that one. Would you do someone a favor after they'd called you names and ran you into the ground? I doubt it. Go ahead and move out of ND, no one is stopping you. By the way I am glad you loved my statement on how the surveys were biased. I'm glad i could make your day there. Take a research methods class and you'll know that an accurate survey requires sampling from more than one area. Oh yeah, and about my brother being in the military, I'm glad you know so much about his situation. If you did you wouldn't of said the things you did, every situation is unique and don't you tell me what their deal is unless you know him better than I do. I see you had nothing to say about the out of staters who spend their money at ND schools. Yeah it doesn't make much sense does it? And so what if my parents got into the bison industry, that is COMPLETELY unrelated to the hunting industry.

As far as people who move to ND for the hunting opportunity and to raise a family here, why wouldn't we want to open that opportunity to others across our country? Maybe we'd actually get some people to live in this state. Why should we be able to deny a non-resident the chance to move here and raise their family, too? By restricting them to hunt here, closes a lot of doors. Many of dad's hunters have left ND with a great impression, one they never would imagine about ND. They get up here and realize it is not a big frozen waste pit afterall. Many bring their families back in the summer for vacation. And you know what, a lot of people come here in the fall and don't even shoot "North Dakota's birds". Many of them just love wildlife that much, they just want to come here and experience all there is about the wildlife. They love the small-town communities and the hospitality most of all.

As far as the earlier comment about hunting creating so many jobs for young people, why is it that 25% of North Dakota's population has moved out of the state since 1990, yet during those same years the waterfowl numbers have been at their highest? You'd think that these high numbers of birds would create so many jobs, right? It is not hunting that is going to keep young people from leaving North Dakota. I know I don't know a whole lot of people I go to college with who major in hunting. North Dakota simply cannot compete with jobs offered in other states, that is why they are leaving. Not if the bird numbers are high or not.

Miller, I guess I still fail to see how land for sale relates to the non-resident hunting issue? Pretty nice website my parents have, huh?

Happy Monday to you all!


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## Austin Bachmeier

ND Gander... I don't know who you are, and honestly don't much care. You aparently don't know the facts, and I don't know why you'd drag something like this onto a public message forum. I have my position and it is where it has been. I don't know how to respond to your garbage, since I don't even know who you are.

Whatever Big brother(inlaw) Carlan thinks is his business, and the fact that I haven't been up there hunting in 2 years should tell him and whoever else has a problem with me that I just as well don't need there land to enjoy hunting..... I do just fine on the public spots me and my friends worked to find and that is because of one thing: We know what we're doing, and we know how to kill our birds, might be a little more work but we can handle it... Run off and tell Slaughbaugh that.. :eyeroll:


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## jimboy

Amber,
Have a nice day! :beer:


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## David S Proffitt

I suspect this will not be a popular statement but I believe that if everyone here wants to maintain great hunting for the average guy, which I believe most everyone wants, then we are going to have to pay to keep it. Generally farmers are the ones who maintain habitat that is the MOST important thing for maintianing good hunting. In Texas, their is a financial insentive to maintianing great habitat. It is no accident that their is great quail and deer hunting there. I am skeptical that the hunting would be as good if the farmers and ranchers did not have an incentive to maintain the habitat that leads to such experiences. Yes incentive in many cases does mean money. I for one do not blame a farmer for charging access fees. If this encourages him to leave some standing crop or not to hay a spot so that his land is more valuable cause the habitat is so good that it ensures more game will live on his land and that sportsman will pay to access this quality spot then good for the game and good for the farmer. To secure future oppertunities for everyone, then everyone will need to chip in to help maintain a financial incentive for the farmer. This may mean higher licensing costs and other forms of taxation to allow the state to secure the access. Attempts to limit the ability of the farmer/rancher to earn a dollar by trying to limit the potential customer, or to force access, or to create barriers between the financial incentive to maintain and develop the best habitat is principly WRONG. It is not good for the Wildlife. It is not good for the economy. It is not good for the farmer. And eventually it will not be good for the local sportsman.


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## jimboy

Amber,
   :beer:


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## jimboy

David, easy for you to say. you live in Reno. most of the jobs in ND are minimum wage, do you even know what the minimum wage is. and now thanks to Bush we can kiss overtime goodbye. It is easy for most NR to say " i do not mind paying a little something for access" your little something is our monthly rent or house payment. these people are charging 200-300 bucks per day per gun. I guess I would be able to hunt 2 maybe 3 times a year. this state is starting to make me sick. snivlers to the left and snivlers to the right and the poor get the shaft. I forgot what side I am on. I am sick of the whole thing. I got a gut ache and I am going to bed, Goodnight everybody, you to Amber.


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## KEN W

One question Amber...where is the law that says G/O can't hunt on public land?I must have missed that one.


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## muzzy

Ken, she is right the NDGF does not allow commercial endeavors on land it owns or manages which includes guiding hunters. Most federal agencies have similar laws against commerical interests utilizing public property. The USFWS also prohibits this.


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## bioman

Konnie and Amber:

Since I live in California I was obviously not at the Bismarck hearings, but wasn't your name associated with the proposed requirement that all non-residents must use a guide/outfitter to hunt waterfowl in the State?


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## observer

Amber Krapp wrote
"Miller, I guess I still fail to see how land for sale relates to the non-resident hunting issue? Pretty nice website my parents have, huh?"

The land is being marketed as "Prime Hunting Land, Bison Herd and Hunting Business" 
http://www.landandfarm.com/lf/s/11/50997.asp

It could be argued that it pertains to the non-resident hunting issue because of the "Beautiful land, furnished guesthouse and many outbuildings. Complete with Website, promotional materials, client list, and wonderful potential to expand this hunting/nature tourism business. It is located in wetlands and can't be surpassed for hunting quality" part of the advertisement.


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## KEN W

Muzzy...so G/O cannot have clients on WPA's or PLOTS?


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## kkrapp

Bioman: you mispelled "Connie"


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## bioman

Connie, sorry I misspelled your name, please accept my apology. Care to answer the question???


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## kkrapp

I think you're mistaken bioman, I'm not Connie.


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## muzzy

Ken, that is correct.


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## Amber Krapp

Just have to clear one thing up, my mother Connie is NOT a part of this forum nor does she intend to be. I did this on my own, she knew nothing of it.

Ken, yeah you did miss something because just like muzzy said, I was right about that one. Thank you.

I can't believe it but Jimboy apologized to me!! Wow!

As far as the question bioman had for Connie, well I guess just like you said that is for her not for me so we'll leave it at that. I am almost positive you have them confused for someone else.

To the observer, about the question on land for sale, that still has absolutely nothing to do with this issue. Who cares if someone wants to sell something, it is completely unrelated. I didn't know they needed permission from anyone. 

Anyways boys, it's another work week and so I'm gonna say my goodbye's, I have too much else to do. Good luck!!
Amber


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## Amber Krapp

One more thing!

Jimboy the people you are referring to on the state school land near Woodworth are from Minnesota. One of them, Todd, lives around my parents' place in the summer working through a biology program through NDSU. They live out there and study birds. So the people you saw on the land were Todd, his twin brother, and their parents. They not and never were paying clients. But, they do hunt our land wherever they want, AT NO CHARGE.

Amber


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## jimboy

gee wiz amber i guess I must have halucinated those wisconsin plates with the 4 station kennel in the back. i appologize again. I guess I am getting old and senile :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :beer: see ya at the rail. But in my own defence I have 20/15 vision in my right eye and 20/20 in my left. it's the only thing on my body that is worth a damn any more. However I will give you that. Because in all fairness your Dad could have been helping out some non residents free of charge and that is what I like to hear. SALUTE :beer:

Goodluck in school and remember C's get degrees :lol: :lol: :lol:


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## Ron Gilmore

See Amber I asked you to step back and look at what they are doing would benifit ND in the next ten or twenty years. You should look at the decline in farm families, the loss of new people moving into small towns for retirement> Case in point my home town has had a 12% gain in occuppied houses and seasonal residents{summer and fall} these people moved here because of quality of life. Low crime adquate services, store cafe,gas station, etc. with the loss of the farms and businesses these people will not buy and maintain the houses that come up for sale. See when land becomes artiffically inflated in value from a nonsustainable resource it will drive young farmers out of the area, leaving only the larger older farmers to operate the land.

The property that your family has listed is overvalued as a farming operation by about 100%. This operation would and could support a family through ag that will benifit a number of other businesses.

Down the road we see the loss of elevators in many small towns because the farmer today has become so large that most have there own semi trucks allowing them to bypass the local service. THe same thing happens to the grocery store because they no longer can buy competively to supply the area residents with affordable products because they do not have enough people to support the business year around.

G/O do not add value to a community. Look at Gackle, Streeter, GlenUlen just to name a few. All of these communites are losing young farmers and ranchers because of the commerializtion of waterfowl and upland hunting. THe money that comes into the community from hunting will not replace the loss of these people. With this information can you still say what your parents want to do is good for ND?

I for one will continue to push for rules and regulations that will enhance the rural farms instead of a course of acttion that will drive the young from our local communites.


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## bioman

Okay Kyle, thanks for introducing yourself :wink:, would you care to answer the question I submitted earlier.


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## kkrapp

Actually the name's Kelsey Krapp, son of Oren and Connie. I'm surprised nobody has figured it out yet, since you guys do so much research on our personal lives. To answer your question bioman: my parents have testified against the HP concept bill and that is all. They have had no connections to any of the other bills. Yo Ron, I'm glad to see that you've cleared up some of the agricultural problems in the state. So it is the COMMERCIALIZATION of waterfowl hunting that has caused so many farms to fold, and the reason nobody in generation X is going back to the farm ......Cripes, I bet Roger Johnson would want to hear about that revelation immediately....We should call Ann Veniman too, as this guy is an expert on the farm economy.

Peace out, I'm done.


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## Dan Bueide

Kelsey, your folks also testified sort of for HB1307, a/k/a the Nelson Plan, and I belive it was during the testimony on that bill and not HPC that your dad made the comments about the need to moderate pressure on the birds, Minnesota hunters blasting birds out of ditches and potholes too often and that all nonresidents should be guided.


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## Amber Krapp

My mistake.

You are right Jimboy, they are from Wisconsin. Todd goes to college in Minnesota (Mankato) though, and works summers through the NDSU biology department. He did come back to hunt and he brought his family, who would of had the Wisconsin plates. My bad, I forgot it is just Todd who is now from MN!

Your vision did not fail you afterall.  I know my dad and I know him well, he is not that dumb to break a rule/regulation.

Have a great week, I'm done.
Amber


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## Fetch

You have said that - seems you Krapps like to stir the pot & leave


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## hansonni

Does ND have this land problem with deer hunting?! I hear alot about this topic of how the private guides are buying up all the land and the landowners that let people hunt freely are becoming less and less. What is the situation like during the deer season? Does ND have this problem during big game hunting as well and I'm just not hearing very much of it or is there less of a problem

-The view never changes unless you're the lead dog.-


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## Dick Monson

hannsoni, yes, more so in the western part of the state. Judiciary B had a survey that 86,000 acres were leased for deer in the Little Missouri drainage two years ago and that has multiplied since. When leasing occurs it often covers all species, even though some are not hunted.


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## deked

You Krapps are somethin else... i think it would be better if everyonce in a while you would yapper and listen. My .02


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## deked

"shut your yapper" that is


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## Dino

Ya know, I often read this forum, but rarely do I post anymore due to the treatment that is received by anyone who doesn't have the same views as the regulars on this forum. I would just like to add my opinion to this topic. Amber is absolutely correct in some of her statements as much as you "regulars" hate to admit it. On the other hand, Amber, they have some pretty good points as well. Bottom line is this, many of the people that live to hunt ND can be characterized as freelance nonresidents. Neither of you represent our interests. When I see a small country's worth of land tied up by an outfitter, I shake my head. What is this world coming to? Where will my kids hunt without spending more than they can probably afford? I don't want a guide or an outfitter. Frankly, I would much rather hunt on my own. But then you have the resident hunters who feel they are "entitled" to have first and best dibs on the game in ND even though they may contribute less to the long term sustainability of the resource than I do. If half of you put half as much effort into habitat development as you do into fighting each other, the _resource_ would be much better off. But every posting I have ever made toward improving habitat is met with an attitude that you have plenty. You couldn't be more wrong. You have barely enough. And in severe weather you are woefully short. ND is blessed with some amazing game populations. But mainly it is just a remnant population that is clinging to the last few pockets of habitat that remain. You want to increase hunting opps for all? Increase your habitat. And don't do it with a "me-first" attitude. Do it because of your love for ducks....or pheasants....or geese....or deer. Do it to leave you kids and grandkids something. Maybe a few less :beer: and a little more $$ in the coffers of a local sportsmens group or local chapter of PF or DU. Amber, maybe you have already covered this and if so, I apologize, but what does your family do for the resourse that doesnt directly contribute to your business? Are you involved with habitat projects that will not be hunted by your clientele? Are you active in sportsman's groups? How about the rest of you? And I don't mean spending $100 in a drunken binge at the annual banquet. What do you do? What do you give back to the resource?


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## KEN W

hansonni...ND has a 1% cap on non-res deer licenses.Half of those can go to G/O.That's only 500 out of 100,000 licenses.I don't know anyone around here who pays a G/O to hunt deer.Almost all the clients are non-res. paying $2500 to $3000 for a 5 day hunt.There are a lot of landowners who hunt deer,so they wouldn't think about leasing.

Whereas ducks to most of them are pests like blackbirds.


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## Fetch

Dino - did you donate to the ND Outdoors Delta project recently ??? Why not ???

I don't think if all of ND was turned into Habitat - it could sustain unlimited #'s of hunters.

& YES just cause we live here - it does make us Special


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## Ron Gilmore

KK
Would a list of people that have been forced out of farming by nonresidents buying land at 2-3 times the cash flo value that they could loan it for at a bank or credit uniion help? Would the loss of tax revenue to the state from cash rent and CRP payments going to IL MI IA etc help?

See this info is something that the propontents of no caps wnat buried or just stry and shout down. Roger Johnson is to busy trying to challenge Hoven that even if he would get out in front on this his party leaders such as Hietkamp and Froeilcih would keep him from moving on this issue. Which brings me to another point about hipocricy and self promotion at the expense of the state. Froelcih lawsuit is a prime example of this. But he was all for the hunters supporting the haydrive by hunters that went on last fall.

So once again is the dollars that come into the state from nonresidents of greater value than keeping the population of young farmers from dwindling.


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## djleye

Dino.... Lets hear what you do for the game and wildlife if you do so much more than we ND residents do. I for one am very tired of hearing that we do nothing as ND residents other than whine. I do plenty for the game and wildlife and to have you lump all of us as doing nothing, quite frankly, is insulting!!!! How are we not helping non resident free lancers?? We are trying to get the section after section of tied up land out the door. Isn't that what you want as a free lancer. Correct me if I am wrong.


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## Dino

Fetch,
No I did not contribute to that fund, it sounds like it is a waterfowl fund and I do not hunt waterfowl in ND. Is that a good enough reason? However, I have contributed to PF in ND, at the national level and heavily in my area as I am a committee member of 2 chapters. I have personally planted 5 food plots this year and 50 trees/shrubs. Some I will get to hunt, others I will not. In addition I am heavily involved in one of my chapters Youth day and I teach Firearm Safety. One of my chapters routinely sends money to chapters in many states to help fund projects (it doesnt pay to increase habitat in our chapter that much, thus we focus on youth and assisting other chapters). That is to say nothing of the hundreds of hours I spend being the banquet chair for one of them and heavily involved in the others banquet. So, you called me out, there is your answer. And how do you measure up Fetch? What exactly do you do? How about you others? I sincerely hope you put forth a significant effort. However, if you did, I would think we would hear about it more, as I for one love talking about habitat and anyone who is heavily into habitat does as well. Would in sustain unlimited #'s? Don't be ridiculous, but it would probably support tenfold or more. Maybe much more. With better habitat, you wouldnt need access to as many acres, thus opening up more for others. I cant even believe my ears that someone would criticize adding more habitat, that is the stupidest comment I have ever heard. Maybe I am taking it wrong, if so, I apoligize in advance.

djleye,
My apologies, I shouldnt have said resident hunters, that was unfair. What I meant to say was "the majority of resident hunters who are regulars on this board". Do I do more than you do? I dunno, I do as much as I can and it is no little amount. I dont want to compare hours or dollars, but I think it is apparent that I make a pretty good effort. However, and you cannot argue with this point, many people on this board keep saying ND has enough habitat and they dont want to put any effort into any more cuz it wont matter. That is what makes me and others frustrated. How are you not helping free lancers? Did you just pass the 2 period - 5 days each upland licence? Does that help me? Ummm, no. I will be restricted to 2 trips. No, I cant justify spending another $hundo on a second license. Did you want to cap the NR #s? Could that leave me without being able to go? Possibly. Didnt I also say that "On the other hand, Amber, they have some pretty good points as well."? Sure, in some areas you help us (limiting G/O), but the intent is not to help us, the intent is to help yourselves and if it helps freelance NRs, that is just ironic. I dont read every post hear, but statements that residents are sincerely trying to help out the plight of the NR freelancer are far and few between.


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## djleye

Dino, Personally I don't know if you can ever have enough habitat. I just think that we need to stem the tide of leased land first or the habitat issue would be only for bird watching. Once we reach that goal then hopefully we can turn our focus to more habitat issues.I personally would still fight for habitat even if I were unable to afford to hunt. I believe that the state of the animals, birds and big game and non game species, are a true barometer of our planet. I just wouldn't fight so hard to be able to continue hunting if it becomes a wealthy only sport. I really believe that our efforts are for the free lance hunters. There just has to be a way to restrict out of state hunters or they will continue to lease land and the G/O will proliferate like rabbits. If you have a better way for us to stem that tide than what we tried to accomplish then I, and I would guess all here, are all ears.
I also applaud your efforts at working for habitat and especially working for the youth. That is very important to sustaining our sport!! :beer: :beer: :beer:


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## Maverick

~KKRAPP~ Ron has actually been pretty correct about this statement


> G/O do not add value to a community. Look at Gackle, Streeter, GlenUlen just to name a few. All of these communites are losing young farmers and ranchers because of the commerializtion of waterfowl and upland hunting. THe money that comes into the community from hunting will not replace the loss of these people. With this information can you still say what your parents want to do is good for ND?


In these areas ( the area that all this has mostly started around) has lost a lot of farmers because the younger ones in that area don't have the $ that the G/O have to rent land. 
Do you really think that when the G/O's make some extra money that they give it the the old farmers that they are leasing from? NO! And It's rediculous to think that . They suck them dry for what ever they can, just as long as they are making more money , not the community! I'm not saying they are trying to hold the community down, I'm just saying that they are not going to help the old farmers when it's needed. They are not going to be there when the farmers need help rounding up the cattle or help fencing or even mow a simple lawn when needed.

My advice to you is to go hunting in the Streeter area and see how many fields you can hunt or how many watering areas you will get on. ~0~

I grew up out there and now you can only hunt out there if you own land (which is hard to come by these days) or if you pull togethor $200-$300 a day to go hunting on some of that land, and that's with a Guide. Fun Stuff, whenI'm still in College.Trying to better myself and keep hunting apart of my heritage also. A 3rd generation of hunters.

Mav....


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## NO-BS

Amber Krapp said:


> I've been following the non-resident hunting issue and quite frankly, I think it is ridiculous that the people who have come to call themselves "Sportsmen" even think they have a reason to complain. If it were not for landowners who have taken great care of their land, these "sportsmen" wouldn't have a reason to complain. Think about it: great land offers great hunting, but great land does not come without great effort.
> 
> If you "sportsmen" want to buy land and nurture it to great hunting land, then by all means do it. You can have all the hunting opportunities you've ever dreamed of. Maybe then you'll realize that all your hard work may be worth a dime or two. What makes you think that someone's property is everyone's priviledge? As a Fargo resident, I know I don't see too many people strolling around in someone else's yard and above all else, feel "entitled" by their state of residency to do so.
> 
> Amber Krapp
> Fargo, ND


I too am new to this forum. I have been biting me lip here for a long time watching what others have posted. I cannot do so any longer.

"If it were not for landowners who have taken great care of their land, these "sportsmen" wouldn't have a reason to complain."

Amber, don't flatter your parents or yourself honey. What have YOUR parents done to improve the land, please inform me. Let me restate that question more precisely; what have your parents done to improve the land that they WEREN'T PAID to do so? Being from a state that used to be like the Dakotas I can tell you this, farmers don't give a damn about the land unless they are being paid to. The only land they don't plow under is the land that the government gives them money to not do so. Alright, so you might have a bird feeder up or throw out a buschel of corn so you can watch the deer, but when it comes down to it farmers are NOT conservationists. If it was up to them they'd probably be farming from ditch to ditch with every wetland tiled and drained.

I too grew up on a farm. So I know where you're coming from. However I was able to escape the blind-sided-farmer's perspective that you obviously were unable to. Here's an example of what I'm talking about: There's a quarter section my parents own that now has a 100 foot wide strip of CRP bordering half of it, approximately 14 acres in size. Sadly it is the only part of the 160 acre parcel not plowed under. It buffers a drainage ditch (which is something you Dakotan's should thank god you don't see much of yet!). Why did my parents put those 14 acres into CRP? Not because they love wildlife like YOU ARE trying to imply; but because a soil & water board employee approached them to do so and offered them money---more money than they would have actually made by farming the land. Otherwise that land would be planted in soy beans just like the rest of it is as we speak. Yes my parents do enjoy the wildlife they have on it because of the CRP, but truth be told it's only there because they were paid to put it there. NOT because of their love for wildlife. So don't try to kid anyone, your parents are the same way. The only thing on their property that benefits wildlife was put there at taxpayers expense or because there's laws stopping them from draining it. If it wasn't for money, your parents would be farming from ditch to ditch; AND you know this.

Let's face it, all farmer's these days are basically welfare recipients. They plant a next-to worthless crop because the federal government sends them a check to do so. If they aren't paid to leave some land for wildlife, they plow it under because the government will then give them an even bigger check next time around for having even more land enrolled growing the next-to worthless crop. The more next-to worthless crop they farm, the bigger the check. You know this, and I know this.

It is important that you remember what segment of the population supports conservation programs every time a farm bill is renewed. If you were thinking it was the Ag community, I'm sorry but you guessed wrong. The biggest constituency who support it are the "people who have come to call themselves "Sportsmen"", as you so eloquently put it. They are the one's writing legislators in favor of conservation programs, and supporting conservation groups who lobby for programs such as CRP, and WRP. I highly doubt your parents have contacted their officials recently voicing their concerns over the possible delisting of non-navigable waters from the Clean Water Act. If the contacted their legislators it was most likely IN FAVOR of the new ruling. Which is quite funny considering that the wetlands on your parents farm (assuming there are wetlands there, a safe assumption for most of ND) and the wildlife they boast are there because of the CWA and swamp busters. Quite hypocritical of you and your parents when you think about it. Also, You do remember swamp busters right, it's that other piece of legislation that takes away farm subsidies (what keeps most farmers afloat these days) from farmers who drain wetlands on their property. Probably another reason your parents "cared for the land" as well as they have. :roll:

So to sum it up:
THE WILDLIFE IS ON YOUR LAND BECAUSE YOUR PARENTS WERE PAID TO PROVIDE HABITAT FOR IT. NOT BECUASE THEY 'CARED FOR THE LAND'. "SPORTSMEN" ARE THE ONE'S RESPONSIBLE FOR MAKING SURE THEIR TAXPAYER DOLLARS WERE USED TO PAY FARMERS TO PROVIDE THAT HABITAT. THEREFORE, SPORTSMEN ARE RESPONSIBLE FOR THE ABUNDANCE OF WILDLIFE TODAY. NOT FARMERS!

If it were up to the farmers, they'd plow from ditch to ditch and everything in between. Of course that is, UNLESS they are PAID not to. :wink:


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## tsodak

When I first read the above, it struck me as heavy handed. But I really have to agree with it. I have been farming and grew up on one as well, and I will say that it is a very rare farmer who makes decisions and implements changes that cost him money in favor of wildlife. And moreso without regulation than dollars, farmers would indeed farm fencerow to fencerow, draining ND to look like MN. It is slowly happening anyway, and that is mainly driven by the farm programs as well.

I guess that is at the root of why I dont often give farmers as much credit as they think they should get. Because the entire system is not more free standing than it is. When you take a check from someone you generally incur responsibilities for what you are doing. Same is true here. In many cases we all want to have our cake and eat it too. Farmers are no different. ANd you know what, many of them know that. They are the silent majority, I think. It is cool for farmers to beat up on sportsmen and wildlife right now, and the ones who are in the middle nod, and the ones opposing dont say a word. I thnk the grass roots feeling is there to fix this things, we just need the program to do it.


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## Dan Bueide

Blanket generalizations are dangerous and cause a lot of agnst. I suppose some/many landowners, like some/many other business people, are motivated most by the bottom line. I, however, know several landowners who employ farming practices that leave some money on the table for the benefit of wildlife. Most of these landowners are hunters themselves, but not all. A food plot here, a tree claim or cover patch left there that would otherwise be tilled. Some/many landowners definitely balance profit and wildlife stewardship, even those who do not profit from wildlife.

Same thing on the generalizations towards resident sportspersons: greedy, selfish, whiney city folks who don't want to share and who think they have the right to hunt anywhere they want, whenever they want. Boy, that gets me. Even among those that have been most vocal on these issues, I don't know of a single resident sportsperson who doesn't want to share the ND hunting resources with many thousands of our friends and neighbors or who doesn't respect a landowner's personal choice to allow access or not. Because you're in favor of some reasonable limits or because you favor the current posting law doesn't mean you want it all, and to yourself. This is just drivel, crap spewed by those who either fully understand, and don't care, or just merely have the wrong understanding of what mass commercialization of hunting will mean to ALL of ND's residents and economies.

And Amber, I need to address a comment you made earlier in this thread. Your statements about biases within HPC shows your biases on the issue. During the session, many rural legislators told me how sound and compelling they found HPC. They also told me they could not vote for it as they believed the majority in their district did not support any caps, but if there was to be a capping system, this is the one that made sense. Several told me they hoped it passed even though they would not be voting for it. Also, G&F officials from many other states made inquiries about and followed HPC, noting its innovation, logic and reasonableness.

We all have biases and perspective that influence our thoughts on these issues. Yours, like ours, come through loud and clear in your posts.


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## Dino

Hey, where is the response to my questions? You regulars called me out on my contributions and I asked for yours but it is suddenly quiet. Fetch? I see you have been posting on other threads, so you are around. What is the deal? I sincerely hope it isn't that you are just a bunch of metro sportsman complaining about how rural ND isn't doing the most for your personal success and your "entitlements".


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## Dan Bueide

Dino, don't know how many responses you're going to get when you come in hot like that, and I don't know if I'm one of the "regulars" to which you refer, but you asked and I'll answer. When it comes to personal elbow grease on habitat improvement, certainly "yours is bigger than mine." Great job on your personal involvement. I hope you and others can bring back habitat and hunting opportunities around home, the lack and loss of which now brings you to ND.

I have not been personally involved with plantings or other habitat efforts, but I know of at least a few on this site who have. Many of the sportspersons clubs around the state do these projects. This would be a great activity to do with my boys when they get a little older.

I do send my checks to the national conservation organizations. Also, I and other sportspersons did actively support HB 1358. This bill, in part, will require nonresidents to purchase multiple upland licenses, following the exact format SD has used for many years. It also, however, raised the Habitat Stamp fee from $5 to $10 for all hunters, res and nonres. These dollars, estimated at $3.3MM for the biennium, are targeted towards PLOTS and other PLI programs. Because the vast majority of licenses for which a Habitat Stamp is required will for the time being still be purchased by residents, it cannot be said that nonresidents have been tagged with habitat and access improvement. Residents will fund the bulk of the PLI additions, even though it has been the large spike in nonresident numbers that has caused the need for these additions, largely on the upland side of things.


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## Fetch

Dino

Sadly (today) I have probably done more to promote ND hunting than the Dept. of Tourism over the past 25 years. Especially on the internet.

I have helped more folks find places & learn how to hunt ND than I care to think about now - (But at the same time met & hunted with some fantastic folks - many are still & will be lifetime hunting partners & friends)

I was even a EVIL Guide for alot of those years - Helped a guy who took people out on Freelance hunts all over ND for $50 a day (many repeat customers were more like renting our decoys & we did the scouting for the birds. We even let anyone under 16 hunt for free. (I bet I've hunted with more women & Kids than anyone on these forums)

It mostly just helped pay for our addiction & obsession to hunting & because of it, I got to hunt the entire State. Every weekend plus 2 to 3 weeks vacation for over 20 years - & most of that money was spent in small towns all over ND (during the best years ND has had for waterfowling & upland & deer (both white tail & Mule) Predators etc. (Even helped with a moose hunt) BUT the entire time we never once even considered leasing land - but we watched it become, what it is today & I can see where were headed. (& that is SAD)

I will even be so bold to boast that we were some of the 1st innovators in field hunting SOB's (& we spent more than we made doing it :roll: )

I have not guided for several years now. & will never do it again. Not worth my Vac. time & valuable weekends, to try & please some of the shooters & low lifes that come here. That don't want to listen anyway - or are just using you, to then bring 5 or 6 guys the next year & then those 5 or 6 bring more & so on & so on etc. etc. That is why the Big Guides now want to controll & stop Freelance hunting.

I'm a rare ND Boat hunter for ducks now - that I learned about from one of my once customers from Minnepolis (I still hunt with him every year) Although some of these guys are now getting real old - I was 20 years younger than most. But imagine the education we gave each other (The good - true - hardcore waterfowlers I've met) Can you imagine how great it was to share ND with so many ???

At 1st most NR's wanted to see or shoot SOB's (I think the attention to the SOB Crisis & the Conservation measures did more harm to ND than good) Then after coming here for SOB's they saw all the ducks & after that - thats all they wanted to do (hunt ducks) & then they figured out the bonus upland out west - until were where were at today. :eyeroll:

By the way the Big Guides & Outfitters have done all they can, for many years to force out the small guides (like us) They hated the fact we were so reasonable & were so mobile & used every method possible to get & KILL some SOB's & used alot of the same SPIN & Tactics they are now to get their way on these issues.

I even worked the Minneapolis Sportmans show for several years. ND lets guides work the tourism booth - to give them breaks & it was FUN & Great to share our knowledge of ND with so many - (My friend even worked the Wisconsin shows & Illinois shows)

Plus have taken countless friends & Kids on trips all over the State to hunt & Fish - I have fished DL Region for 25 years almost to the same obsession.

Then the internet came along & I have been a participant on many (most major sites (especially in the begining) & thats how I learned how different ND was from all other States

That is where Chris & I 1st met (online) back at FB & few other sites - we both were the most enthusitic ND report givers & traveled the States best Waterfowl areas & freely helped all we could - But Sadly now we have to be more discreet, because of the effect the internet has had.

I could go on & on blowing my own horn & bragging about what I've done (& I have done it all & then some) Imagine putting over 10,000 miles on a Suburban during Oct & part of Novemebr for 25 years  & overall it has been a Blast & I met so many great people & shared & gave my best years to waterfowling & waterfowlers. Maybe that is why I'm so sad to see that kind of opportunity be lost for my son & his kids someday.

Thank God !!! we live so close to Sask. & Manitoba - I thought we were in waterfowl Heaven (& in many ways we were) but all that time I was living right next door to it  & only last year finally went up there to see what it was like & YES it's like ND 30 years ago - Maybe even better for reasons previously stated. So my hunting adventures have been rekindled & I doubt I can see every town & road & section line like I have in ND - But I'm going to give it my best shot 

I still LOVE ND there is no other place like it - I just want to see it remain as special as it's been.


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## Dino

Dan,
Thanks for your response. I regret coming in "hot", but after the treatment I received, what are you to expect? How come you didn't mention that to anyone else? There is a prevailing theme here that newcomers keep saying and many of you (not all of you) just ignore it. It is not a friendly place for newcomers. If you don't agree and take the same thought process as the regulars, you get beat up. I have had many people tell me this. Bottom line is this, you guys have some great experiences and some awesome ideas. And some ideas aren't so great. And sometimes you appear to be only out for yourselves. That is what irks me the most, is the attitude among many (not all), that if it doesn't make your hunting easier, you are not for it. Or put another way, you are only backing things that make your hunting easier/better. Hey, I would love it if they passed a law that said only I could hunt anywhere I wanted and everybody had to move out of my way if I showed up. But realistically, I want to focus on the resource and make it better for everybody because that will trickle down to hopefully helping me. And if there are more ducks and roosters, hey, how can anyone complain?

What really frustrates me is that there are obviously some real talented, informed, and educated people on topics we all hold close to our heart and I would love to see the efforts put towards something that would help the resource and not just tearing into each other. I can affect next to nothing in ND and I know it. The only reason I post is to hope that I can bring up a little different twist and maybe make some of you who can make a difference and are leaders in the "movement" to focus on habitat and the resource rather than zinging shots at others. After reading my posts, I apologize to all for some stinging comments. I guess I just feel strongly about wanting to make ND a better place for all.


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## Dan Bueide

Dino, there's room for different views here, and no different than in any other format, there's going to be times when things get a little heated and a person needs to develop some calluses.

Don't get me wrong, the nonresident hunter is not the first priority in our policy efforts. However, I can honestly say that neither do we go out of our way to unreasonably exclude or burden nonresidents. It's worth repeating that many of us at one time have hunted ND as nonresidents, and most of us have nonresident friends who hunt with us each year.

Most of us take the position residents should get preference on the issues, but there is and always will be room for a significant nonresident participation, just not at the level we've had the last couple years. We are trying to keep and make ND hunting better for all, but as with virtually all similar efforts in other states, that will (and should) give a level of preference to residents. That our efforts are supported by a fair number of nonresidents (especially those who have witnessed the effects of these trends first-hand in their home states) I think says we must be doing something right.


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## Fetch

:lol: 
I was going to close my last post with

What were you doing then ??? In Diapers ??? or a snot nosed kid ???  But that is just my Sarcastic - Bully - Cynical personality (persona online) - I'm really a softy old loveable teddy bear :wink:


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## Fetch

Just remembering the Minneapolis Sportsmen shows - Do you know what more people wanted to know about -more than waterfowl (especially during the drought years) which were actually GREAT waterfowling years for us.


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## NO-BS

Dan Bueide said:


> Blanket generalizations are dangerous and cause a lot of agnst. I suppose some/many landowners, like some/many other business people, are motivated most by the bottom line. I, however, know several landowners who employ farming practices that leave some money on the table for the benefit of wildlife. Most of these landowners are hunters themselves, but not all. A food plot here, a tree claim or cover patch left there that would otherwise be tilled. Some/many landowners definitely balance profit and wildlife stewardship, even those who do not profit from wildlife.


If it was such a 'blanket' statement then how come Ms. Krapp didn't answer my question? She had time to send me a snotty PM that didn't answer my question either (which leads me to believe I was right) so I guess I'll just have to ask it again. This time with a slight modification to it; What MAJOR improvements has the Krapp family done to their land without the government's assistance?

You can label what I said as a stereotype or a blanket statement if you want, although most of you know that it bares more than a shred of truth to it. Mr. Bueide you're right, some farmers do care enough to do some MINOR things to benefit wildlife like you said at their own expense. Leaving an acre lying in a gully aside, or perhaps planting a shelterbelt (although you can argue who these benefits are truly benefiting); but when was the last time you saw a farmer pull 160 acres of low grade farmland out of production and plant it in CRP at their own expense? You can argue all you want about the extent of what farmers do to benefit wildlife but we all know that the MAJOR benefits are done at the public's expense. I don't want to make another generalization so I'll rephrase what I said; 99.99% of the MAJOR benefits are done at the public's expense.


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## DAVID ERDMANN

FELLOW SPORTSMAN!!!!!!! I AM A VERY AVID SPORTMAN IN N.D. AND EACH YEAR I AM FINDING IT A LITTLE HARDER TO GET ON LAND,BUT I HAVE CHANGED MY TATICS A LITTLE.I can still go into any area and find a place to hunt.It takes a little more effort but the land is still open to those who respect the landowners decision to post or lease his land to guide services.I have even got on 2 of these so called off limit guide service parcels with out paying and all i had to do was ask.Have any of you so called sportsman ever tried asking,so maybe you dont get on your old favorite spot if your courteous they will give you a place to hunt.This so called no hunting zone in the Streeter-Gackle-Napoleon area because of guides is B.S. GET OUT OF YOUR $50,000.00 DOLLAR SUVS AND ASK .DONT ACT LIKE THE LAND IS YOURS ALREADY BECAUSE ITS NOTTTTTT!!!!!! TRY RESPECT AND HONESTY!!!!!!! THESE COMMUNITIES ARE STRUGGLING TO MAKE IT AND WITH OUT THE OUT OF STATERS WOULD STRUGGLE HARDER.AS ARE THE YOUNG FARMERS TRYING TO MAKE IT.WITHOUT THE PAYMENTS FROM THE GUIDE SERVICES FOR THE USE OF THERE LAND THEY WOULD ALSO STRUGGLE EVEN MORE.I HOPE WE CAN RESOLVE THIS ISSUE BEFORE WE THE SPORTSMAN HAVE DRIVEN THE FINAL STAKE INTO THE SMALL COMMUNITIES HEARTS.SO TRY KNOCKING ON THE DOORS IN THE SO CALLED NO-HUNTING-ZONES,YOU MAY SURPRISED AT HOW MANY DOORS MAY BE OPEN. 
THANX FOR YOUR TIME, DAVE ERDMANN DAVENPORT N.D. 
PS THANK YOU SHELDON AND TROY FOR LETTING ME HUNT YOUR LAND.


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## GooseBuster3

Thats why most of use call it the no hunting zone because Sheldon is puck!! None of use can stand him. Who needs 150,000 acres to run a guiding service???


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## DAVID ERDMANN

WITH AN ATTITUDE LIKE THAT,YOU WILL NEVER GET ON ANY LAND.I AM SORRY YOUR SO BITTER,TRY PUTTING IN SOME HOMEWORK AND MAYBE THE ACCESS WILL BE YOURS ALSO.HAVE YOU EVER ASKED ANY OF THE GUIDES FOR PERMISSION????I HAVE AND THEY'RE DECENT PEOPLE TRYING TO MAKE A LIVING.THANX DAVE


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## GooseBuster3

I know quite a few people from this site that have asked Sheldon to hunt on his land and return he uses them as for scouting. A person from this site had found a field by Tappen with quite a few lessor canadas and mallards in it. They saw the posted sighn asked to hunt and he said no. They watched that field until dark(with out seeing any other person watching this field. As they set up the next morning in an adjacent field hopeing they could pull som birds while they where leaving the roost and go back into to Sheldons field, Shelfon himself comes out with 8 clients and pounds the piss out of the birds. Which he did not scout. That is the most lazy thing I have ever heard of!!!! As you say I have a bad attitude??? At the age of 18 I have knocked on multiple farmers doors asking to hunt on there land yes I get turned down somtimes. But I know the ropes of the game down by Streeter, if you have $$$$ you can play the game. And thats BS!!!


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## Old Hunter

Erdman The idea that G O's will let the general public hunt free is rediculous . They let you hunt free and you become their good will ambassador. Tell me Erdman What money do Sheldons boys spend in Gackle, Napoleon, Ashley? 0 Thats right a big 0. With 140000 acres tied up its hurting the freelancer. The guys from Minn.Wis. ND wherever have less and less to hunt. I'm Seeing posts on large waterfowl web sites stating to stay away from Logan Co becauseof access problems. The Game and Fish should be renting that land. Then everyone could be hunting it..


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## DAVID ERDMANN

OK GOOSEBUSTER AND OLD HUNTER I DONT WANT TO GET IN A ARGUEMENT WITH YOU AS I DONT KNOW ALL THE FACTS.THERE IS A FEW THINGS I DO KNOW THOUGH.THAT THE OUTFITTERS IN THE STREETER-GACKLE-NOTONVILLE-NAPOLEON AREAS DO PUT PLENTY BACK INTO THE AREAS,SUCH AS BALES FOR NESTING,HEN PHEASANTS @ ABOUT $10..00 A POP,FOOD PLOTS FOR THE WILDLIFE,AND PLENTY OF MONEY IN THESE TOWNS.THE GUIDES MUST BY THERE GAS FROM SOME PLACE CLOSE AS I AM SURE YOU KNOW THERE ISNT ALOT LEFT OUT THERE FOR TOWNS OR RESTAURANTS/GAS STATIONS.I AM ALSO SURE THAT THE GUIDE SERVICE [SHELDONS] BUYS MOST OF HIS GROCERY'S IF NOT ALL OF THEM RIGHT IN STREETER,AS ME AND MY 2 BOYS WERE IN THERE BUYING SOME SANDWICH SUPPLIES, ONE OF HIS WORKERS HAD JUST CHARGED A HUGE AMOUNT FOR SUPPLIES.SO I KNOW FOR A FACT THAT YOUR WRONG!ALL I KNOW THAT THE PEOPLE IN THE STREETER/GACKLE AREA HAVE BEEN VERY NICE TO MY FAMILY AND I,I HOPE THE BITTERNESS THAT YOU CARRY WILL DIMINISH AS WE ALL KNOW LIFE IS TO SHORT.HUNT HARD GUYS AND MAY THE DUCKS BE WITH YOU.THANX FOR YOUR TIME DAVE ERDMANN


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## Old Hunter

Erdman Your right you dont have all the facts. Who do you think owns that grocery store? There are no guiding operations in Gackle. This means that the average Joe might find a place to hunt. Its the average Joe thats spending the money in Gackle. Not the guided hunter. You want to talk about guides providing food plots. I'm looking at a document obtained under the freedon of information act. It is concerning the North Dakota Private Lands Initiative. I will type a little of it you shoule get the idea. ( During a routine evaluation of your foor plots last fall I found three agreement infractions 1 two parcels containing Department assisted food plots were posted no hunting 2 one of the food plots which you certified as planted , sprayed and cultivated did not exist at all' and last ly two of the food plots had been harvested. ) These people were directed to pay back 1,936.00 to the game and fish or face criminal charges. These were guides doing this. This is from the office of the Private Lands Coordintaor of North Dakota. You are a pawn for a con and you dont know it.


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## KEN W

David...we can all read your posts without you screaming at us.Please don't use all Caps.


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## bowslay

I would first like to say that I have hunted the Gackle Streeter area for many years and think it is a great place and the people there have always been great for permission. A few years ago I started to see some orange signs around posting up land. Scouting one night I was watching a field from one side that was not posted and had seen a good slough that I wanted to hunt. Stupidly I sat there till almost dark without getting a back up slough for the morning. As the sun started to go down I drove around the section only to find the slough I had been watching on the corner of posted land. As we circled around I noticed an old pickup with a guy spotting our slough. We pulled up and asked for permission to hunt the slough. I explained that we were college students form NDSU and were out for the opener. Also expanded we put all our eggs in one basket that night only to find the slough posted. The man indicated that he guides the area and was planning on hunting the area the next day. As my heart sank he pulled out is map and circled two or three sloughs a couple of miles away. He said we could trust him if we want or do our own thing. What else could we do? We thanked him and as we drove away I had my doubts. The next morning when we pulled up and I rolled the window down only to hear the sound of ducks I was and am still grateful to Sheldon. We hunted his land for 3 days and it was great.

Later that year I was on another site and a guy on there was stating he had a giant heard of dear on his property and threw out a half *** invite to anyone to come and hunt. This was late Dec. And I had not shot a dear yet with the bow. I wrote him and he gave me his number. Two days later we pulled into Streeter and a man in an old pickup greeted me. I think we both laughed at the fact our paths crossed twice in one season. Story ends with me shooting a doe and seeing 300-400 deer a day. And shooting 3 or 4 pheasants. He put us up in one of his houses I think he only wanted 20$ or something. I think we left 50 on the table. Being a poor college student still probably should have left more.

Moral of the story, I probable talk to the guy once a year since then for different reasons. Great guy to me and I know others. Yes he does have a business; yes he does need to make money. Will he let a guy hunt in an area he does not have clients absolutely yes.

If you ask properly.

Thanks Bowslay,


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## Ron Gilmore

Seems so strange that people from out of the area get on Sheldons land but locals do not? I can give you account after acount from locals in that area that asked about deer hunting and where turned down flat or asked for money. Seems that his good will advertising worked on some.

Now did anyone ever hunt any of those phesants that someone pointed out the guides released? Wonder what ground they where let go on? Hmm' I do believe in the middle of a area that is completely controlled providing only the guide with birds, at gonna fly here.

Now that is not to say that some G/O do put back and some do it without thought of what they will gain. I even know a couple that are pretty stand up guys and are pretty good with locals.

But I guess just like Ted Bundy, Sheldon has fooled a couple of blokes.


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## bowslay

Lets be realistic and bond together with everyone who hunts and or who is involved in the industry. Farmers, hunters, nonfarmer land owners, Outfiters, and so on and so on. I have made some great peopple hunting and fishing. having an open mind even when you are dinide access helps. The land I bowhunt I knocked on the door of the farmer for three years and was turned down. after each time I would still sit and talk to the guy for a half hour or so. One year he asked if i was going to come back the next year if he said no. I said he could count on it. He said "well then you might as well hunt". I have taken two pope and young bucks since then. and the old farmer is more or a friend than a land owner. I know people who thought he was a real jurk. I truely belive some of these land owners are looking for friends not poeple who hunt there land.
we need realistic goals. what are they?

enough land for everyone?
just residents?
save the family farm?
increase waterfoul production?
illiminated Outfiters?
illiminated nonresidence?
increase WFPA?
Increase CRP?
Illiminate slough draining by farmers diring dry years?

what does everyone want see done to better the hunting system.

thanks, Gregg Larson


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## Field Hunter

Bowslay,

Congratulations on the deer hunting land, unfortunately sooner or later a G/O or a big $$$ hunter will over ride the relationship you have with the landowner and you'll be on the outside looking in.... again. Happens all the time, more frequntly from year to year. Farmers like all business people are opportunists, most will take the money over a relationship, although they may still allow you to hunt on oher areas. Guard the BIG buck area very carefully. G/O's are charging $2,000 - $4000 for NR trophy deer hunts....I'd bet the older farmer would welcome $500 in his pocket. Sorry for the cynicism but I've lived the relationship thing time and time again only to have someone out-bid me with more $$$.


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## DAVID ERDMANN

Bowslay,So iam not crazy whewwwwwww!!!!! I sure glad somebody see's the guides the same way i do.Hope to meet up with you out at the Gackle area some time.I dont own a house out there like a lot of the people do but i stay at the camp ground or rent one of guide services late in the year.Hope you have another fun year of hunting.Thanx Dave


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## dosch

ERDMANN! NOT EVERYONE THINKS YOUR CRAZY. BUT I DO www.carpenoctem.tv/killers/berkowitz.html


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## DAVID ERDMANN

Dosch,Why would that be,because we disagree? Oh ya i forgot to mention in my last email if anybody has heard about the DUCK DAYS in Gackle on Oct. 4 th.That should get alot of people in generating revenue into the area.From what i have heard they are going to have 4 man teams.Does any one have the info on it.Thanx Dave


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## Ron Gilmore

I wonder how many people will have a place to hunt. Greg maybe a slam dunk on winning with nobody to compete with but Sheldons hunters. I bet if I have the wife and uncle bird dog them with a camera there clients would not fill even that early with out some help in the shooting department. :sniper:


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## DAVID ERDMANN

RON,I have talked to some of the farmers in that area and they didnt seem to have the anomosity that you say.Do you have some of the names of farmers that are turned downed i would like to ask the guides in the area or maybe the famers if this is true.I just find a hard time beleiving they would let me on and not them.Thanx Dave


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## Miller

David, Are you aware of all of the game and fish violations he's committed? Hunting big game out of season, overshooting pheasants, cutting WPA fences so he could drive his clients down to hunt public water and the list goes on...

You're arguing with people here who have lived around Streeter for over 20 years in many cases (how long have you known Sheldon?). You're not going to change the forums opinion on Sheldon.


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## DAVID ERDMANN

MILLER-Lived or owned homes and say your a resident of the area?Seems to me a lot of the people emailing me on this are not from that area?Thanx Dave


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## Ron Gilmore

First and foremost Dave I was born raised and lived in Jud. I have hunted most of the area from Medina to south of Fredonia over to the Ellendale noth o the Dickey, Adrian area. The lake just west of Streeter that people fish for perch, I have seen that dry and hunted deer in it. As far as farmers and ranchers in the area most are willing tolet people into hunt, but more and more land is being posted with the owners and renters getting hard to find. They are to busy trying to get in the hay, harvest corn soybeans, sunflowers, or working cattle.

Many are posting because of the actions of Sheldon and some others in that area. Also many younger operators in that area have lost land to nonresident hunters that are paying unrealistic prices for land if it is ducky. One only needs to look at the Dohr land south of Gackle along 56.

Next time out stop in Clevland, or Medina or Gackle Kulm Fredonia at the bar or other business and tell them how nice a guy Sheldon is, but make sure that you have on a helmet and maybe even some kevalar. He is hurting many in those area's.

Gackle use to boast about being the duck hunting capital of the U.S. Now it and Streeter have the distiction of being the home area of one of the largest and slimiest G/O in the country.

I have no beef with you. I just think getting a true flavor of the tactics and behavior of this guy and the impact he is having would serve you well. Call me sometime I am in the book I can give you lots of places to hunt and names of people that would be glad to let you on, just make sure you don't mention his name when in there presents.


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## DAVID ERDMANN

Ron - I hear your opinions but find a hard time believing all of it,as i was in Danny's bar in Gackle a couple weeks ago while fishing out there he told me that a guide service like Sheldons would be welcomed in Gackle for the economic impact that it provides.#2 I consider Sheldon a freind now after getting to know him the past few years so i wont be afraid to walk in anywhere with him or talk about him.#3 I will look up your no.and give you a call in the next few days,i am being kept real busy as of late with my boys baseball.Looking foward to talking to ya and thanx for hearing my opinions even though its not beliieved by many on this forum.THANX AGAIN DAVE!!!!!


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## nancy

I don't understand why so many North Dakotans complain about land access. I've been back in Fargo for two years and have never had trouble finding a place to hunt. I have hunted in the southeast, south-central, and southwestern parts of the state. Game birds are plentiful, landowners accommodating, and rural business people and residents friendly and welcoming. Yes, I have been turned down, but in those instances, the landowner had already committed the land for the time I requested, often to family members and friends. Usually, however, they say it would be OK to hunt later in the season.

Regarding comments made about Sheldon. I and my husband, my brother, and his sons have hunted on Sheldon's land on several occasions. Each time Sheldon has said "you are welcome here". He showed us around, pointed us in the right direction, and our hunts were very successful and enjoyable. In fact my brother and his sons went out around Christmas and Sheldon's brother's dog was so happy to see hunters that she joined the hunting party for the day!

There is no need for accusatory remarks and finger pointing. North Dakotans are extremely fortunate to have an abundance of natural resources and I believe there are plenty of opportunities for everyone.


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## cityboy

I have hunted in and around the Gackle/Streeter area for over 10 years now. I have very raley been denied access to land, because I asked. I met Sheldon some time ago, and he not only let me hunt on his land, he went out of his way to show me other spots that I could hunt, and I've never paid him a thing. It seems to me that landowners are more willing to let non-residents hunt on their land then locals. There seems to be alot of animosity towards the so-called "sportsmen", who are trying to tell the landowner what he can or cannot do with HIS land. Outfitters like Sheldon are getting land handed to them to post. You "sportsman" (from Jamestown and Fargo) are just digging yourselfs a bigger grave. I bet you see alot more posters out there, and you have only yourselves to thank. As David Erdmann earlier stated "GET OUT OF YOUR $50,000.00 DOLLAR SUVS AND ASK .DONT ACT LIKE THE LAND IS YOURS ALREADY BECAUSE ITS NOTTTTTT!!!!!! TRY RESPECT AND HONESTY!!!!!!!" He hit the nail on the head. 
Have a nice Day


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## GooseBuster3

As you think all of use drive $50,000 SUV's I would think not!!! People like you who take one person from a Bigger city and think we all are rich makes me sick!!!! I am 18 and work all summer long so I have enough money to hunt in the fall, as for you, you must be one of those weekend warriors who hunt weekends and thats it!!! For most of the people on this site hunt over 100 days each and every fall and can see what is going on with the guideing and NR's that run around this great state, we can have views about every asspect of this issue. Like last fall I put on over 5,000 miles scouting geese all over the STATE!! Trust meIheard many differnt views about this issue. We hunt and hunt hard so come about this we have gold teeth BS!!! We ask to hunt fields that arent even posted evry time we plan to hunt a field with no posting sighns. People like you who I wish could follow use through out the year and see how much time we put into making good farmer/ hunter relastionships. Sounds like you scout the night before the hunt we start scouting months before opening day, so we can kinda get to know the land owners. Its kinda nice to BS with a farmer, they have soooo many great stories from the olden days, that what we are trying to preserve!!! Freelance hunting!!!


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## Miller

First off,

You will RARELY find me debating these issues, but when it comes to people portraying Sheldon like the saint of waterfowl hunting I feel I must let the truth be told. First I want to comment on 2 previous posts:



cityboy said:


> As David Erdmann earlier stated "GET OUT OF YOUR $50,000.00 DOLLAR SUVS AND ASK .


This pathetic stereotyping will hurt your credibility and few will take you serious. Welcome to the forum, just thought I'd pass along that tip.



DAVID ERDMANN said:


> I hear your opinions but find a hard time believing all of it,as i was in Danny's bar in Gackle a couple weeks ago while fishing out there he told me that a guide service like Sheldons would be welcomed in Gackle for the economic impact that it provides.


David, I'm glad that you took time to take a trip from your home in Colorado to come to ND for fishing. I know the owners and I can ASSURE you they do not appreciate what Sheldon has done to their business. They didn't know who you were when I called so I'm not sure where you got this info?

Sheldon Schlect FACTS:

1) He has taken money from the Game & Fish on the PLOTS program and didn't even put up for the public, but posted it for his clients. He was forced to pay back that money or be prosecuted.

2) Sheldon has been busted for hunting big game out of season. In fact, in a Game & Fish sting on him he was in the act of shooting a deer 2 months out of season and passing on that deer to a NR to fill his tag. That NR was an undercover MN DNR agent. Read the report sometime, you'll be amazed that he's able to still be in business.

3) He has cut Federal WPA fences so he could drive his clients down to the wetland. Not only is it illegal to cut fences, but illegal to drive on WPA land and outfit on public land.

4) He was quoted by the undercover agents for shooting a gross amount of pheasants and ducks, and even admitted to shooting a snow owl (protected).

The list goes on and this is what I have from memory but I can pull out the list again if you'd like more examples. He committed 12 violations in a 6-day span in one undercover sting, not to mention the other violations over the years. Imagine how many violations occur in a season??? I'm grateful that the Game & Fish now has added another warden to just oversee outfitter actions.

PM me and I personally make sure you get a full copy of all of his violations. This is public documents, I'm just quoting.

I feel it's important that people are aware of issues such as this to be able to form a reasonable opinion. To me anyone who's capable of this type of behavior is not only horrible for ND, but a horrible portrayal of the sport of hunting.


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## gandergrinder

Cityboy,
Its really nice that you can lump all of us Fargo people into one group. I don't happen to be the person driving the $50,000 SUV. I do ask permission and I am respectful. I also happen to be in college. Do I have a ton of money? NO.

I am so sick and tired of people like you saying that all the people from Fargo and Grand Forks and Jamestown are the enemy of the farmer. That is the biggest crock of bull****. There is not one person here that has said farmers are bad or they should only let resident sportsmen hunt or that we want to decide what they should do with the land that they own. So would you quit lumping me into a group because I live in Fargo. How ignorant can you be. :eyeroll:


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## Old Hunter

Bowslay Erdman Nancy You people keep avoiding the subject of criminal violations. How can any sportsperson support a person with a huge list of game violations? Where are your ethics ? You are supporting a person with many game violations so you have a place to hunt. Not one of you will address this issue. I can only assume that game and fish laws have no validity to you.


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## FACE

Just a quick comment: I thought the only ones who drove the $50,000 SUVs are the outfitters who can afford them to show off to their clients and also their clients who have the money to show off to the outfitters! It reminds me of some of the golfers that belong to a nearby country club that costs many thousands of dollars a year to be a member, they display the attitude that they are too good to golf the public course and don't want the common man golfing theirs!
Anyway, :2cents: [/quote]


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## lasalle

Are there any $50,000 SUV's out there? Maybe a really pimped out Suburban, or a H-2. Otherwise, an Expedition, Yukon, and Pathfinder new are all around 30-35K. Ya'll must not be in the new car market much. Take care, and focus on the important issues not the minor ones.


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## frosty

It appears from some previous posts (Nancy, Erdmann, Cityboy) that Sheldon is really doing some hard campaigning! Don't worry Sheldon, you are not fooling anyone.....your colors are much too bright to be hidden.


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## bowslay

Old Hunter,

I only speak for myself. I do have respect for the G&F laws. My statements in a previous post were stating only what I have known to be true. I was giving an argument to the accusations that he does not let people hunt on his land. In know way was I ignoring any facts about his character. I have met the guy two times in person like I stated earlier. During those two visits I did not see any violations. What he does for the rest of the year I have no idea. He does not have a clue what my record is, yet I bet he thinks im a good guy from the two times we met. I have not read anything in the paper or seen anything on the news about these crimes you speak of.

Millertime,

Don't get me wrong you probably are a great guy and we would probably get along, and have a lot in common. I will take your accusations seriously but will not condemn a man because a person named millertime on a web site said it is so. If I did, someone probably has some ocean front property for me.

If anyone thinks I told what have seen to get on land your nuts. I like all of you hunt a lot of other areas besides Streeter ND. It's a big state and the birds are everywhere. Even right here in Fargo!


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## cootkiller

I am not going to touch on this one that much.

However, it seems to me that this Sheldon Schlect is not a very honorable person and should not be aloud to guide. He gives guides an undeserving bad name. The guides that I work with and associate with up here in the Lake Region are of the finest quality.

gandergrinder,
Let me fill you in on why people from GF, Fargo, Bismarck, Minot, Jamestown all get lumped together. Partly it is because of ignorant self serving groups such as the unsportsman's alliance out of Jamestown and partly because most, NOT ALL, people who drive out of the city on the weekends (weekend warriors) believe that the landowners owe them something and that they have a RIGHT to hunt any land they want. Now don't jump on me yet. I know college student are wrongly discriminated against when it comes to getting access but it is you neighbors in Fargo that have made the bed for you.

Hunting is not a RIGHT, you have the Right to bear arms. To hunt you have to gain the privelege of access to land to do that hunting.

cootkiller


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## Dan Bueide

Coot, the " city hunter right to access" stuff is crap. I've never hunted with, talked to or even heard of a single resident hunter, city or rural, who thinks they have the "right" to hunt another person's land. Certainly everyone hopes to get access to good ground and more than you think work their tail off to do the right things with landowner relations to make that happen. But that "right" stuff is as mythical as saskwach. Makes for a really good rallying cry for those who want to broaden support for commercialization, but is flat out false.


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## cityboy

Thank you cootkiller, when I wrote "sportsman" from Jamestown, Fargo etc. I mean those organizations you mentioned. They know who they are. They lobby against outfitters all year and now they are going to find out they have less open land to hunt on, even if they ask. 
So don't take it personaly Goosebuster3 and Gandergrinder. For the record, I do hunt and scout all over this state and canada well over 100 days. (in a $3000. Suburban!)
Let's face it oufitters are not going away, no matter how many restrictions or regulations the g&f can put on them.


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## Ron Gilmore

Cityboy you are correct G/O are not going away. Nor do I want them to go away. What I do want is accountablity and ethics from them. We regulate many types of businesses some more than others,but the one thing that all have to do is follow the laws of the state city and fed goverment.

In todays world we lose site of values to often, and place monetary gain above all else. Today we have an abundance of wetlands and waterfowl, providing many places to hunt. Access can be found by calling and knocking on doors and the quaility is what we will be calling the good old days.

Know step back to 1985-1990. Duck numbers where at all time lows, many sporting good stores had stopped ordering duck decoys and waders. Very few acres where leased and duck hunting around Gackle Streeter and Kulm was just a memory for most. Some of us still knew where there was water and the late season hunting was good, but them we where sharing these spots with other duck hunters and 99% where ND residents.

When the conditions of the wetlands return to those times I will not be hunting ducks, because those waters will be leased and controled by people like Sheldon who will not be willing to allow hunting unless you have your pocket book out. When this happens next time it will be the end of waterfowling because many that hunt today and send donations and do other wetland conservation efforts will stop.

For those of us that have hunted from the 70's through today we have endured shorten seasons reduce bag limits etc and never lost faith or hope that the ducks would bounce back. great efforts where made across the country to restore and enchance habitat that when the water returned so would the ducks.

I doubt that same feeling will prevail the next time the PPR goes dry. Leasing and commerialization are singing the death song of the independant waterfowler. We will be as rare as mountain men whre at the turn of the 19th century.


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## gandergrinder

Cootkiller,
I only ask you one question. If the sportsmans alliance is ignorant and self serving what is the difference between them and the Devils Lake Chamber of Commerce or some of the guides that have lobbied so hard. The street runs both ways. They both have goals and both pursue them through legislation. No different in my view.


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## jimboy

Coot, Why do you insist on telling others what others believe. you know nothing except where your daddy's land is. Stop trying to be a fortune teller. there is no resident that feels that way. Maybe you should try to get along with the residents instead of throwing out untruths and bashing organizations that are trying to preserve the heritage for all to enjoy in the years to come. Look at MN and Wis. and what happened to their nesting populations. You don't think it will happen here if things get left unchecked. I will be laughing at you from another state. Why should I live here if I am going to be discriminated against for being a resident. My tax money will go elsewhere. And when you guys drive up the tax base and push the residents out. The money that filtered in year round will dry up and your precious communities will be screaming about it and you will only have youself to blame for alienating the resident hunter. Or the big cities will take over and rule the state just like they do in California. Why? because the residents will no longer care cause you did your best to discourage them. It was the resident hunter who came to your rescue over the corporate farming issue. If we can't hunt what difference will it make next time? And that goes for more than the coop. Subsidies and other stuff can get put on the block also. We need you guys to help us maintain a heritage. You need us to make a living. without us you will not survive. with out you we just have a little less to look forward to. :beer:


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## cityboy

Jimboy , your an idiot, youl'l always be an idiot. If you can pull your head out of your @ss long enough you would even see that your an idiot, you say "there is no resident that feels that way" where the hell do you think you can speak for every resident in this state. There's more to this issue than a bunch of whinning "sportsmen " from Jamestown.


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## GooseBuster3

Here goes Cityboy again foaming at the mouth!!! Not many people think the way you think. A regular sportmen would feel the rigt thing to do would be is back up other ND resident. So if you wanna have beef bring it because all in retrun you will get over powered!! Cootkiller at least thinks before he types, you sound like a complete idiot!!

your an idiot, youl'l always be an idiot. If you can pull your head out of your @ss long enough you would even see that your an idiot = Cityboy being a dumbass. GET A GRIP!!!


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## administrator

Please keep this civil please. Drop the personal attacks.


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## jimboy

cityboy, I think you did just fine expressing your intellect. When you don't have anything to say, you call names. That-a-boy. you got class :wink: Maybe you and coot can get together and count some ducks :laugh:


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## hansonni

Not everyone that has a different point of view is an idiot. I thought that forums are for people to talk to eachother and express different ideas and thoughts. I may hot agree with everyone, or for that matter a majority of people in this forum, but that doesn't make everyone else wrong, stupid, dumb, or an idiot for opposing my views. And the second someone starts calling me or anyone else idiots because they have a different stand on an issue, they lose all credibility and respect in my book. Just a couple of pointers on discussions or arguments that you might want to think of the next time you post a reply.


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## cityboy

That's it?? Well at least nobody disagreed with me. Thanks.


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## H2OfowlND

We need to work together to save the future of hunting in ND. This is not about an access issue, but it will be if we don't all work together to put aside our petty differences and realize what is at stake here...our heritage!! Landowners, hunters, businesses, and the state need to work together to perserve our hunting heritage, but still let the small towns survive. We all have our own goals, Everyone needs to bring them to the table and let them be known. Then work towards a common goal, and that will mean everyone will have to give something up in return. 
Yes the landowners(not all) can threaten to shut us out(residents), but that will only hurt them in the end. Us(residents) can boycott certain towns, but that will only give us a black eye. Businesses can hale the NR's, but don't forget the residents too, we have money also. The state needs to recognize when enough is enough and protect herself so she can provide for the future of ND hunters. 
Let's just work together, we don't get anywhere pissin' and moanin'

H2OfowlND


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## Maverick

~City Boy~
You say you have been hunting the Gackle Streeter area for 10 year. Well I have been a local out there for 24 years and I'm only 25. Now if you have been out there for all those years WE must have run into each other once or twice. either at the bar or the cafe, or maybe even at the Taste Freeze. I would love to actually meet you and talk of the area in person because I'm GUESSING that you either have worked for Sheldon or maybe in the industry, that's why you have had no problems in the past. 
P.S I was wondering if you even know the name of the bar?

P.s. s. Have you ever been to the Fargo Elk's club. I'm working there onThursday night. I'd be HONORED if you came for a couple of cold ones ON ME OF COURSE. I'll be tending bar!!

SO are you actuall sticking up for the one Guideing operation that has had more citation than any other 2 put togethor? I'd defend him also!! :withstupid:

Mav.....


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## cityboy

Mav, 
Thanks for the invite sport, but I don't get to Fargo much. I can't figure out why me knowing the name of a bar has any validity in this issue. I think you are finding it hard to believe that someone who does not have a problem finding good spots to hunt must be "in the industry". 
As I have stated in the past, I hunt/scout well over 100 days a year. I do this all over Central and Western N.D. and Sask. Canada. I meet residents and non-res all over this state and none of them including myself rarely have a problem getting on good land to hunt. Why? because I take the time to get to know the landowner/farmer/rancher. I build relationships. I go out of my way to ask permission posted or not. That is the bottom line here. 
Last year in Kenmare, during Goosefest, my buddies and I were scouting some land we've hunted in the past. The farmer who owns the land has never posted it. This time I noticed he had it all posted. I stop in to see him and over coffee we visited. I asked him "why all the posters?" He said that he "just wants to know who's on HIS land." He thought it was funny that since he put the posters up nobody has come or called to ask!. His phone number is on the posters. Another reason he gave was that he was finding more and more trash. Before we left he showed me a field that geese and Mallards had been feeding in for days. 
I sorry that you think that because someone can have access to good land to hunt that I must be "in the Industry" I am not. I respect the priviledge I have to hunt/fish in one of the best areas in the country. I respect the guides and outfitters who are trying to run a buisness, not take your hunting rights away. I am not "sticking up for anybody. As long as there are hunters(some would call them shooters) who have the financial means to pay for their hunts, then there will always be guides, no matter how regulated they get. 
I met a group of hunters your age in Medina last year. They we're from Chicago ( I think) They had saved up all year, took 7 days vacation so they could come here to hunt with a outfiter. I asked them why they choose an outfitter, wht didn't they just freelance? They said having only 3-4 days to hunt (after travel time) they wouldn't have time to put in to scout etc. Sure it was alot of money to them, but well worth it. They had good quality hunts and will be back this year. I know the bars in Medina, THE DECOY! or TEWY'S will like having them back, or maybe DJ"S in Streeter, DANI'S PLACE in Gackle or the ROADHOUSE in Tappen.
Maybe I will see you somtime, maybe at Gackle's Centennial next year, or Streeter's in 2005. I'll be the one drinking a Bud Light!

Cboy


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## Ron Gilmore

City boy I do believe that the attitude that you show is positve and prevelant with many out there. The area has seen a down grade in quality because of G/O. Many area's that where once hunted for deer both with bow and gun are locked up without any possiblity of access. This is forcing many to travel to other area's to hunt deer, causing even more land to be put off limits by posting or to much pressure around farms and people working th fields during and after harvest.

It was common to see lots of hunters opening weekend but less and less each week after. Today that situation is changing we see more and more people hunting the area's that are not under lease. They ask permision just like you but when asked why they are hunting this area it is the same response. The area they hunted with there fathers and grandfathers is now leased or what is not is posted for family.

We are lucky that most farmers are happy to have people in to remove the deer but more and more are saying NO because of the number of people asking and it is becoming a nusiance to them.

I grew up hunting the same area that you are talking about, I have 3 times the amount of time in that area and I have seen the change. My dislike for Sheldon goes beyond his leasing it is rooted in his diregard for rules and regulations. He may have treated you and others well but I have seen the other side of his character.

Keep doing what your doing, knock on the door ask permision take out what you take in. These are what we need the landowners to see, positive respectful taking of game. Remember that every ten to twenty of us that do this are nessasary to offset the one idiot that dumps his trash or leaves a gate open or shoots to close to a house.


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## DAVID ERDMANN

Ron,I am still going to give you a call but time has'nt been on my side.I can tell you have a bitter taste in your talk but i am glad you see the other side.Sheldon has been more than hospitable to me and my family,i really dont care what's happened or has'nt with his run in with the law!He and his wife have always welcomed me.So the Man that you know is 180 degrees from the one i do.Thank you for my time ! Sincerly Dave


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## cityboy

Ron Gilmore said:


> The area has seen a down grade in quality because of G/O. Many area's that where once hunted for deer both with bow and gun are locked up without any possiblity of access.


Ron, don't put words in my mouth. I never said anything about a down grade in quality, or area's without possibility of access. Nothing could be further from the truth. I have seen an increase of quality, mainly because bird pops are up. If it wasn't for Sheldon and other outfitters releasing Pheasants , the Pheasant population (around Streeter) would not be anywhere near where it is today. I don't see where that is a "down grade". Those birds don't stay on his land. Once out of the crate they're wild.
As for access, when I see posted land I think, how can I get intouch with the land owner to ask permission. Or, if it is an outfitters post I'll find out if he will have clients hunting there. It's all about respect. When you see posted land what do you think?........... another damn outfitter tying up all the land? There are thousands of acres, with prime hunting. Look at the big picture and stop focusing on the little one.

Cboy


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## Ron Gilmore

Sorry for the confusion I should have started a new paragraph with my second sentence. I was refering to 30 years of hunting in that area. Other than geese duck populations are not what they once where regardless of what the USFW are stating. Phesants have been better and so have the partridge populations. The only things that have increased in pop are grouse do to the sunflowers and beans and the deer because of increased cover from the CRP.

One only needs to look at the area from Clevland to Medina south to Streeter then back east to Gackle to see the big picture. This area was where many came to hunt waterfowl deer grouse. 80% of that land is not accessable to hunters regardless of the amount of time you spend knocking on doors.

Then travel south of Gackle west and east along 56 better but still the same issue. Go down in the Kulm area and the same thing is happening. I have stated over and over that commerialization is going to be the end of hunting because it will prevent new hunters from entering the sport, cost access are major hurdles that many young hunters will not have had the experience to overcome.

Last fall we had numerous hunters in on dads land that have been hunting other area's around us that no longer have a place to hunt. Many of them had helped with fencing and other activities with farmers and ranchers only to have the place taken out from under them.

I am not adovcating an elimination of G/O because they do provide a service for those that want to come here for the hunting. I do want that G/O to follow the game laws and ethics of hunting. Many hunters that travel to ND are coming from area's that leasing or G/O are the only way you can hunt, they are not familar with freelance hunting such as what you and I are doing. They marvel that they see no other hunters well of course not when all the land around them is leased.

You said to focus on the big issues I have been and will continue to do so, putting effective regulations inplace and having enforcement capablities for them is nessasary to maintain order of this industry. You have been hunting this area at a time of plentiful water, I wonder how you will feel when the water conditions return to those of the 80's and all ou see is the red signs and the hand out of the outfitter asking $300.00 to hunt ducks. Then if we see a reduced bag the cost of taking 3 birds would be $100.00 a piece. Why would anyone want to take their son or daughter out and spend that kind of money when it could go into a college fund or other nessasary family expendatures. That is the big picture to me.

We lost a generation of waterfowl hunters during the drought years of the 80's some of the partime waterfowlers have returned and are exposing the next generation to this wonderful sport, when the next down cycle in water and birds arrive we will lose more and those lost will not have an insentive to return to the field with barriers that are being put in place by the commerial side of the sport.

I am fortunate in that I have access to some very good hunting and will have for a long time to come, I am willing to share this without expectations other than simple respect for the birds and land. I want others to experince what I have it is what fuels my desire to sit in a blind or lay in a field when my teeth are chattering and my butt is frozen. I was not born with this it was given to me by others that had the willingness to pass the expericne of hunting on to others. They would not have done that if they would have the barriers that are being put up today.

So thank you Lyle, Andy, Stan, Pat, Wanye, Renae, Bill, Henry,Mike, just to name a few and all others that helped along the way.


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## TerryS

I guess I would like to churp in from a non-resident perspective. I've been hunting the Streeter area for about 20 years. When I first started hunting in Streeter, it was a rarity to even see a pheasant. You can thank Sheldon and NDSU for that transformation.

I grew up in North Dakota and just the last 5 years I have become a non-resident and after applying for 5 years I have finally been drawn for deer in 2I. I've hunted the land Sheldon leases before Sheldon leased it and I still do. This happens because my hunting party has always shown Sheldon the respect of asking weeks before we arrive. This is the same curtousy we offered the local farmer prior to Sheldon leaseing the land and we've never been turned down. Whether I was a resident from Mandan or Des Moines, Iowa common courtesy has always bridged the gap for us.

As for the illegal violations, thats between Sheldon and G&F. I'm not here to judge. I guess my point is, if your not being granted permission, take a look in the mirror. I'm granted permission to hunt and in return I spend hundreds of dollars in a small town like Streeter without handing over a penny to Sheldon. Someone commented that he owns the businesses in town, well good for him. Keep in mind in the many years I've hunted out there Sheldon has yet to serve me food at the cafe, so someone in that town has a job because of his prosperity. Instead of being mad that he owns the grocery store, you should be happy he has been able to keep it open.

I hope I didn't offend anyone, but that's my two cents.

Terry Sedivec
Des Moines, IA


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## Old Hunter

Terry S You state that Sheldons game violations should be kept between him and the NDGF. I believe that the public has a right to know when a guide commits many game violations. I believe that we have the right to ask why is he allowed to retain his guides liscense. I also believe anyone that supports a person of this nature has no ethics. thats my 2 cents


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## TerryS

I really wasn't trying to ruffle anyone's feathers, but I'm realizing that someone is always going to find the bad in anything you say. I did not say Sheldon's violations should be kept between him and G&F. I simply meant that if there have been any violations, G&F appears to be on it and handling it. 
My point to my last statement again was simply that he's not that big bad wolf many seem to be depicting. In other words Streeter would probably be a ghost town by now without him. Many people have jobs there because of him and something should be said for that.


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## Drakekiller

If you leased 150 thousand acres of land(250 square miles) would you let a few people hunt does or gadwalls so you could you use them for PR down the road. A freind of mine had someone tell that Sheldon called him and asked the Guy to get on this forum. Sheldon we are not stupid.By the way Sheldon how about the sticker that you have on all your posters that says "Posted in response to limiting NRs.If you belong to ND wildlife fed,Sportsmen All. ect. Don't even think of hunting or asking to hunt this land." Sheldon stand up for yourself if you can.
Kevin Hayer


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## Miller

Drakekiller said:


> Sheldon stand up for yourself if you can.


 :lol: :lol: :lol: Ya Right... The locals know the truth.


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## Maverick

~CBoy~


> If it wasn't for Sheldon and other outfitters releasing Pheasants , the Pheasant population (around Streeter) would not be anywhere near where it is today


Have you ever hunted those Pheasants? Evidentally not! Just east of Streeter they are not even real pheasants. They are the Black ones that he keeps caged up. The ones to the west are so posted up and patrolled by his crew that if you do, the game wardens will be on you in 10 minutes.

Now hows this for ignorance!!!

Sheldon is trying to start a hunting tournament out there. Great for business yes!!! But is there anywhere for them to stay!!! NO, so what does he do? He calls some people from from Gackle (mostly fargo natives) and wants to try to work something out for the hunter, so he posses that he'll open all his land to the people of Gackle/ Streeter. (Why because he never let's anyone hunt his land,that's not with his guides) But in return we have to open our house to his people so they have a place to stay!!!!WHAT KIND OF SH$T IS THAT. That's the only way he'll open it up! Only for the tournament. Anytime before or after you still won't beable to get on his land.

Sorry but I've had to many run-ins with alot of his possy. I've been having him down wind me, and set up in the same field as me since I was 8. I've also seen his crew place cars on private land(which he did not have permission to hunt), over night with the lights on to deture hunters away. Believe me.....my old man is always the first to a field.......but when you roll up to a empty cars in a field with it's lights on, and have his guides come out an hour later and jump start it to get it out......it's 100% 
unethical.

Bye the CBoy, if you told Danni, *Taylor* said "HI" he might get you free BUD LIGHT this fall....

Mav....


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## cityboy

Drake, 
Get it right. If your going to quote something provide all the text.

POSTED IN RESPONSE TO LIMITING

NON-RESIDENT HUNTERS

If you belong to United Sportsmen of North Dakota, Wildlife Federation of North Dakota or the Sportsmans Alliance of North Dakota, don't even think of hunting on this land and don't bother asking. You voted for a cap of 10,000 non-resident hunters. You can't lobby against us 11 months out of the year and expect to hunt our land the 12th.

What do you expect? That say's it all.

Mav, 
Those "black" pheasants east of Streeter we're relased by another outfitter, Mark Dockter. I never hunted any of them but I do hunt Sheldon's from time to time. I just let him know when I'll be in town and ASK! permission. I'm curious Mav, have you ever personally ask Sheldon about hunting on his land? Or, are you just going by what other have said. I don't know but I'm guessing the guides are just doing what they are told, unless you have made arrangements with Sheldon. I know a few "locals" in Streeter and they have never been turned down, when they have contacted Sheldon.

For the record: He does not own any business in Streeter other than the guide service. He does own at least 10 homes in town, pays for the upkeep/maintenence, pays the property tax etc., all on homes that would probably be vacant. He does employ up to 38 people during hunting season. These people look forward to that income and many count on it. 
Have you ever personally talked to the business owners??,( ie: Streeter Co-op, Streeter Cafe, Streeter Grocery, D.J's Bar.) Ask them how much extra income they get during that time.

I've noticed that most of the members of this site, not all, are mostly against G/O and there isn't much anybody can say to you-all to change that. That's too bad. This could be a good site to advance the natural resource and opportunity this state has to offer to sportsman from all over the country. Unfortunatley the one-sided views posted by it's members are going to drive people away.
Example: a Post from "mnhunter" just asking about guides services in the area and some members jumped all over him. What you did not know was that he was only looking for a fishing guide. His response:

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

What a fricken joke! I don't even know why I bothered. 
I have about 5 posts to this website and have never had an ounce of luck getting any positive anything from anyone on this site! I asked a serious question, I wanted to know about a guide service (actually they are a fishing guide service in MN) I was thinking about paying a guide to take my father on a trip when he comes up to visit, as I will be working a few of the days. I was looking for information, I will go to a site that will help me. 
I am very efficent in my use of the internet and talk forums and I have watched this site, given my input, and continuously am amazed at what a good job people on this site do of chasing people away. I will continue to contribute to other sites and get my questions answered there. As I have said before, Mr. Hustad you have a good intention just a bunch of guys here who ruin it. If you had any idea of some of the people you have turned off, and the potential that has been ruined due to ignorance on the site, you would be amazed. I know some big names have checked out the site as far as sponsorship and helping out, and yet people chase them off. I tried, more then once and feel bad as I had hoped to help the site. 
Good luck guys

Need I say more?

cboy [/u]


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## Old Hunter

Mark Dockter Great guy plays by the rules. Doesn"t downwind anyone. What a guide shoud be . Im guilty of spamming Good Luck


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## Drakekiller

Cityboy
Thank you for the right wording I could not remember it."Posted in response to limiting non resident hunters." Gee I thought Sheldon posted because he is an Outfitter making money off this land not because he is ****** about the nr issue.


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## H2OfowlND

Holy whips and chains batman!!

Cityboy, this fall will be my 15th year hunting in "Sheldon's" backyard. I have had a few encounters with the "man" you so admire and his henchmen. The most recent one was last fall. On a friday night I had scouted a field of snows, yes snows. On that saturday myself, my dad, and my uncle from Alaska proceeded to have one of the best hunts we have ever had, granted we didn't shoot a single snow, just ducks. That saturday night I scouted that field again, along with a few others that had seen the action we had that morning. Low and behold one of Sheldon's guides was among the ones. So sunday morning rolls around, the 3 of us head back out to the same field. Coming up the hill to the field I see a vehicle parked in the field with its parking lights on. We pulled up farther and were approached by two hunters kindly asking us to leave since they were just up the road in a fence line hunting this field. So we decided to leave the field and setup somewhere else out of that field. But the funny thing is, that vehicle in the field WAS NOT their vehicle, guess who's it was?? HMMMMM??? :******: 
Well we kindly proceeded out of that field the way we came, and came across some other "hunters" coming into the field. Well by that time it was almost legal shooting time, and the 'burb(GOOSPIG) and a MN Expedition made they're way in. I stopped them and told them that someone was already there, GOOSPIG kindly said that they had parked that 'burb in the field the night before, HOW THOUGHTFUL. I asked him why he wasn't hunting the 130,000 acres of land they have leased, he so kindly said that they didn't have any geese on their land(by the way we were hunting unposted, unleased private land and we had promission to hunt it). 
Now you tell me how in the HELL am I supposed to respect a man after pulling that kinda $hit??? Kinda makes the hair on the back of your neck stand up....ever felt that?? I will never ask that "man" to hunt any of his "leased" land and give him that satisfaction that he thinks he has control over the hunting in that area. But yet he comes to US and asks a favor for his lil hunting contest!!! :******: 
By the way, at the bottom of his website, what does the contact information say?? Does it say TEXAS?? 
One other thing, I kept seeing these posting signs last year, have you seen them....NO GUIDED HUNTERS ALLOWED, OTHERS WELCOME...if you don't believe me, I bought 3 of them from the bar in Gackle. I invite you and Mr. Erdmann to go ask Dani how the guide services so called help Gackle, trust me you'll get an earfull.

H2Ofowl
Mike Hannesson


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## Ron Gilmore

Well in regards to him allowing people to hunt his land with out paying as he has with Cityboy and MR Erdman, I do not doubt his response. It seemed interesting that the local people are turned down repeatedly for deer access. I hopefully wil have a list with there permission for posting here soon.

Most of them do not hunt upland or waterfowl and had doe tags the last couple of years. One area in particular was 1/4 section that was all farm land. The guys wanted to walk in to set up posters on the pasture and CRP area as the other two walked in from the down wind side.

This group had not in the past been to concerned about leasing or posting of there own land but I was told it will be this fall if this land is leased again. Because Sheldons boys used the wetland area on the CRP last fall and they thought it would be no big deal for him to let them go across the stubble to set up blockers.

The other thing is now that he has sold this will he have the power to grant permision or will it have to come from TX?


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