# remington quality



## dlip (May 16, 2004)

well, im not really looking for a specific rifle at the moment, but im getting that itch again now that fall is underway, ive been looking at savages or remingtons but i nkow the quality of the remington shotguns isnt at its greatest state, they are reliable, but they dont have a good finish, so, is it the same with the rifles? do the rifles have good finishes? i want something that can take abuse, it would probably only be a target or a varmint gun


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## blackace (Jul 15, 2004)

I am also looking for a rifle for a similer pourposes. I was looking at remingtons and learned that the remington 700 is used by Snipers in several branches of the armerd forces. My thinking is that if it is good enought for the military than is should work just fine for you. As for the finish I have an Remington 870 and the finish is fairly nice for what I paid for it. I have a feeling that the rifles will be similer.


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## William lammers (May 6, 2009)

Remington, you'll be hard pressed to find a better value for the dollars spent. There are so many manufacturers, and so many models and options available, so yo might just use the K.I.S.S. theory: Keep it simple stupid...not being said in an offensive manner... Remington works, plain and simple...great hunting/shooting tools! Good luck and good hunting


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## NDTerminator (Aug 20, 2003)

I have a safe full of Remington 700 BDLs, CDLs, and VS made from the early 80's right up until now and all have uniformly high quality & finishes. If you go cheap & buy an ADL, or SP, then you will see the rough powder coated finish. THere's nothing wrong with it, but it's not the finish of a BDL/CDL. The rifle will also cost a lot less too.

The hard cold fact is that a Savage 110 can't carry a 700's jock and with good reason, it was never meant to be. The Savage is accurate out of the box but in regard to comparing fit, finish, and overall quality, the Savage isn't even in the ballpark with Remington.

Like the Ruger M77, the Savage is meant as an affordable mid-priced alternative to the more expensive rifles out there.

Truth be told the best value in mid-priced rifles going is the Tikka line.
The Tikkas I"ve owned (and still do) are the most accurate , best trigger, out of the box rifles, bar none. They have great fit & finish if you can live with things like plastic magazines and intregral trigger guard molded into the stock (on the synthetic).

Black is correct, the M700 ac tion is the gold standard by which all other rifles are judged in the military & LE sniper's world. I know because I am an LE sniper. When I went through Sniper School the 18 students in my class had 15 700's, 1 AR, 1 Savage 10FP, and 1 Ruger M77 Varmint. 16 were 308, 2 were 223.

My work rifle is a Remington 700 VS in 308 with a fluted heavy barrel. I replaced the factory VS stock with a custom from H-S Precision (not really needed, but a personal preference) It will print sub-MOA all day long...


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## KurtR (May 3, 2008)

blackace said:


> I am also looking for a rifle for a similer pourposes. I was looking at remingtons and learned that the remington 700 is used by Snipers in several branches of the armerd forces. My thinking is that if it is good enought for the military than is should work just fine for you. As for the finish I have an Remington 870 and the finish is fairly nice for what I paid for it. I have a feeling that the rifles will be similer.


They use the action and that is about it. Dont think that if you go buy a remmington off the shelf that you are even remotely getting the same thing that the military is shooting. That being said all i have is remm and love them but they are not the end alll be all of rifles. If you want to customize a rifle the remms are hard to beat with all the people that make stuff for them.


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## William lammers (May 6, 2009)

NDT...308 inside a Model 700VSF is a great "Workhorse"...have one. Prior to that I "built" a 700 that I call "THE FREAK", because I picked-up a used ADL, a used HS Stock at a show for an astounding $50.oo, skim-bedded the action to it, added Leupold STD "Bridge/Redfield style/one pc. mount, and med. high rings. After that, I simply added a Leupold scope, and what happened? Shooting 150 grain Nosler Ballistic Tips, handloaded to 2,808 fps, using IMR 3031 or VARGET, with a bullet set at Max. Cartridge Overall Length, and shooting in the prone, with the rig setting on a Harris 1Al bi-pod....An Honest to God RAGGED HOLE MACHINE! I have used this rig for all my hunting of big game for nine years out of ten, and brought home the venison each year, one shot-one deer....Oh yea, the other year, I used the VSF...311 long yards. The beauty of the Freak, is that it not only shoots wonderfully, it does so consistantly, and the whole package weighs in at exactly 8.0 lbs.. The VSF of course weighs a bit more, and has the 26"barrel, -vs- 22'. All said....Yes , Remington's are accurate, priced right, and durable...By the way, 90% of my shots have been at less than 100 yds., and I add that, before anyone thinks there are "ego issues". I believe in fair chase, and the challenge of a great Stalk. The closer I can work myself to the animal, the better the hunt!


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## huntin1 (Nov 14, 2003)

If you have several thousand dollars you can get a Remmington similar to what the military is using.

I too am an LE sniper.(well, was, I turned my stuff in. long story.) I've been to 3 sniper schools, yes the majority of rifles there were in fact Rem model 700's. Ask the sniper why he chose that rifle and the answer you'll get most often is, "That is what they gave me". Interestingly, my spotter took over the lead sniper spot, gave his Rem 700 to the new guy and took my old Savage. 

All of my sniper instructors where military snipers. When asked all said that they prefered the Savage 10FP. They ain't pretty like the Rems, but they work, and in most cases, better than the Remmington.

Would I like a George Gardner built Rem 700, yeah, but I don't have $3500 to spend on a rifle.

Get whichever rifle you want. You want pretty, go Rem, but if you want a rifle that will work, that will be accurate without sending it to a gunsmith for several hundred dollars worth of work, get a Savage 10FP.

huntin1


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## William lammers (May 6, 2009)

Not to turn this into a Sniper blog, but I think that most guys and gals that may want to, or are determined to spend the cash for a spendy Sniper Rifle set-up, would be served just as well in spending that kind of money on a really nice hunting rifle, and a real quality optic. Most rifles made today are of greater accuracy, than the Sniping Rifles of ten or fifteen years ago...and in the right hands, they match or come very close to the high-end stuff of today. On the other hand, I have gone back and forth in my rifle purchases, buying, building-up, and shooting many various hunting and sniping/target rifles. All I can say is that they are all fun to shoot, but can cost a LOT OF $. The other reality, is that MOST individuals are not capable. I say this not as a slam, but rather as a fact, not counting the need for a great amount of knowledge about external ballistics, and the real need for a likewise educated Spotter.Shooter...so the choices we make, are ours...good luck and good hunting


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## NDTerminator (Aug 20, 2003)

Very true, William. I don't have a sporter barreled 700 that won't print MOA or better, including my 338 Magnum. Several will shade my $1600 Weatherby Accumark in 257 Roy, which is an amazingly accurate rifle/round combo.

Of course, each has been bedded or uses a synthetic stock with bedding block, I adjust the triggers to my preferred 2-3.5 lbs (depending on application), all have excellent glass, and have a load worked up or a factory load that each likes...

IMO the single most critical piece of the puzzle is the trigger. A heavy creepy trigger makes it vitually impossible to realize the accuracy potential of any rifle...

Huntin1 and I have a long standing gentlemen's disagreement on Savage vs Remington as far as work rifles. I have used both the 10FPL and 700, and the difference in quality isn't even close. The 700 wins in a walk. My 700 didn't require several hundred dollars worth of work out of the box to shoot sub-MOA, all I did was adjust the trigger to 2.5lbs which is a 5 minute home gunsmith task. For that matter, I've never owned a Remington 700 Varmint in any caliber that didn't deliver sub-MOA out of the box with a load it liked...

THe 700 is nearly universal in our world for the simple reason that it's the best choice. You better believe that when it comes to a sniper rifle our military, particularly spec ops, can get & use what ever they want. If the Savage Model 10 was even in the ballpark, you would see it there.

In LE when you see a Savage, it tends to be purely a budget decision by the agency or a private purchase by an individual operator for the same reason, cost cutting. The only major agency in ND that uses the Savage is the NDHP Tactical Unit, and the HP Powers That Be are open about this being a money saving decision, not an issue of the Savage being the best production work rifle...

Now that's not to say that a Savage doesn't make a good work rifle or deer rifle, but the quality difference really isn't up for debate. If you are on a budget get a Savage or for a bit more, a Tikka. Better yet save a few more months and get a Remington 700 or Weatherby Vanguard MOA...


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## William lammers (May 6, 2009)

NDT, glad to hear from someone that agrees, I picked up a Kimber 8400, in 300 WSM, spent the best part of the day, yesterday, shooting quite a bit of different loads...finally found this rifles need(s)...sub MOA at 100 M, with once fired, neck sized brass. The Once Fired brass was the trick. This is representative of what I've been trying to convey on this chat. I do realize, that a lot of folks do not reload/handload, so as has already been said, try a number of factory loads, relax when you shoot, let the barrel be cool between shots, and go from there. Back to the original blog, I stand by Remington, as being a good Rifle. The old axiom...if I could have only one..., well if you do, learn what it does, how it feels, and shoot the darned thing, when you can...pays big dividends! Good lluck and good hunting


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## huntin1 (Nov 14, 2003)

NDT is right about a couple of things, the trigger is the most critical piece of the puzzle, and we have had a longstanding, friendly disagreement when it comes to Remington.

I have owned Rems in the past, as well as Winchesters, Rugers, Browning, and even a Thompson Center Aristocrat in .308 WIn. They all make good rifles, though in recent years Remingtons QC and CS seemed to have nosedived.

I've gotten rid of most of my rifles over the years for various reasons including medical, Mayo Clinic is expensive. The one I won't get rid of is the 10FP. It has out performed everything else at the range, although I will agree, it is butt ugly.  But, Savage will still do anything that that a Remington will do, it just won't look as good doing it.

There is no reason that we all have to agree on one rifle, if we did there would be no reason for the other companies to exist and the one that we all agreed on could charge whatever they wanted for their rifles.

I will admit that NDT, among others, has got me thinking about a Tikka. I decided I need to have a .223 bolt. I've settled on either a Tikka T3 Lite, or a Savage Weather Warrior. Just can't make up my mind.

Oh, and I prefer Nikon scopes over Leupold too, dang I'm such a rebel. 8)

:beer:

huntin1


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## ndm (Jul 22, 2007)

Get the Savage WW. You know it will shoot well, and you will help some guys in our country keep there jobs. Why help the Finns.


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## William lammers (May 6, 2009)

I agree about the trigger, it is amazing how much better a good trigger can improve accuracy. As for what you say about the Tika T3, that is the rifle I have in 7mm-08, and ironically, I put a Nikon, 3-9x40 w/BDC reticle on it. The action, and barrel are stainless, the stock synthetic. The only thing I find, in shooting it, is that you have to learn to control its' lighter weight. Other than that, it is a goody. My son in Montana, has a White Tail Hunter, in .270, which is a bit heavier, but what a shooter, and it is easily adjustable, on the trigger. Still, and only because of a long history with it, if I had to get rid of every rifle but one, it would be my 700, in 308. This is the reason I enjoy this forum...so many things to discuss, so much to do. Thanks for the sharing...good luck and good shooting


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## NDTerminator (Aug 20, 2003)

huntin1 said:


> I will admit that NDT, among others, has got me thinking about a Tikka. I decided I need to have a .223 bolt. I've settled on either a Tikka T3 Lite, or a Savage Weather Warrior. Just can't make up my mind. huntin1


H1, my go-to coyote rifle is a T3 Lite in 243. Simply an amazing little rifle, easily the lightest production I've ever owned, and one of the most acccurate out of the box rifles I've ever shot...


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## LeviM (Dec 3, 2006)

You can take any brand of rifle, and if you take the proper steps in breaking in the barrel, floating the barrel, bed the action, and use a quality trigger. You will have a very accurate gun on your hands. Even more accurate if you reload and find a bullet/powder combination your gun likes. It all depends how much time and effort you want to put into your gun!


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## bornlucky (Jul 24, 2007)

dlip said:


> well, im not really looking for a specific rifle at the moment, but im getting that itch again now that fall is underway, ive been looking at savages or remingtons but i nkow the quality of the remington shotguns isnt at its greatest state, they are reliable, but they dont have a good finish, so, is it the same with the rifles? do the rifles have good finishes? i want something that can take abuse, it would probably only be a target or a varmint gun


The information these guys offer is excellent. If you want a great deal more information on your question, try this website

http://www.chuckhawks.com/index2d.rifles.htm


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## jhegg (May 29, 2004)

huntin1,

Thanks for standing up for performance vs. looks! Next time I do kabobs, I hope you can attend.

(ps: bring Bruce with you - if need be, I have a huge couch!)

Jim


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## Plainsman (Jul 30, 2003)

jhegg said:


> huntin1,
> 
> Thanks for standing up for performance vs. looks! Next time I do kabobs, I hope you can attend.
> 
> ...


Now where is that licking my lips icon?

I have a half dozen Remingtons, some Winchesters, a few Marlins, Brownings, and one Savage Weather Warrior in 22-250. I hate that little rifle, it shoots the same groups with the same loads as my heavy barrel Remington XR100 Rangemaster. I hate it because I spent twice as much on the Remington so I figure the Remington should have half as big a groups. That's reasonable isn't it? 

Best rifle if you want to do some work is perhaps Remington, but I had to put $400 of smith work into mine to get it to equal huntin1's Savage. Then on the other hand I have a heavy barrel Remington Sendero in 300 Win Mag that will always group in the .3's, and often groups .25 and even down to .14, and I still can't believe it when I shoot it. The only thing I have done to that rifle is lap the locking lugs and replace the trigger. I only replaced the trigger because I was dumb enough to use locktite, and I used the wrong type. I messed up the screw and had to drill and remove it. Remington would not send me a new screw. I was so ticked I bought a Timney Trigger. 
Rifles are individual and you don't know what you have until you pull the trigger. Out of the box today I think huntin1 is right the Savage is very reliable. I like nice wood with a lot of figure, but nothing on a rifle is as pretty as a ragged hole group.


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