# ND Oil Refinery



## zogman (Mar 20, 2002)

Do you think with all the new oil recently found should the state build their/our own refinery?


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## zogman (Mar 20, 2002)

27 views and no comments. Come on boys. You must have some thoughts. :bop: 
I posted this as a diversion from the National political disaster that is destroying our nation. oke: 
I haven't even voted yet because I wanted to hear your pros and cons. :eyeroll:


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## Burly1 (Sep 20, 2003)

To incur a debt that would far exceed even our healthy budget surplus would be a tough sell to conservative ND voters. My personal feeling is that it could prove to be a profitable venture, provided it is not saddled with any additional partnerships. Tribal governments have shown interest in such a venture, and in my opinion, their participation should be avoided at all costs. The reality is that to operate such a refinery, a management contract would have to be initiated, and that could prove to be a major hurdle, financially, that is. There are many companies that would jump at the chance to contractually operate a new refinery, but could we hire them and still expect to show a profit? We certainly have the people and expertise available to us to staff such an operation. Lastly, is this a good time to set ourselves up for potentially huge financial losses? Perhaps not. But then, if nobody initiates new sources of income, we may continue to stagnate into a land of corporate farming, where no one profits, except outside interests and a priviledged few.
Burl


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## zogman (Mar 20, 2002)

Burly 1, Thanks, good points and well thought out. One thing that concerns me is how much oil we (the good ole USA) consume.
And it seems to continue to increase. Some would say I am pessimistic, but I think we will see $4 plus gas prices in the not too distant future and they will NOT go back down this time. What is the answer? I don't know.
I agree about not having a partnership with the tribe. However constructing and running a refinery would create high paying jobs.


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## Burly1 (Sep 20, 2003)

High paying jobs would be a big plus. However, how many of those jobs would go to North Dakotans? A new refinery would need to be staffed with those who are familiar with the equipment involved. That well is pretty shallow in ND, and nobody leaves Mandan Tesoro unless they die or retire. Depending on the contractual operator, we may well see such an operation staffed largely by Texans. (not saying that's good or bad, just saying)
I can't disagree on the high fuel cost coming back, not that three bucks isn't high already.
To retain my sanity, I try to stay aware of what's going on in our state, but more often than not, our politicians dovetail right in with the rest of the misfits who laughingly attempt to run our country. 
Praying keeps me leveled off. Thank HIM!

Want to really get scared? Google Dearborn, Michigan. It's just a little piece of Islam, right here in America's heartland.

Burl


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## zogman (Mar 20, 2002)

Burl said:Want to really get scared? Google Dearborn, Michigan. It's just a little piece of Islam, right here in America's heartland.

Holy Moly I don't think I'll sleep tonight. That's down right scarry


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## Plainsman (Jul 30, 2003)

> Want to really get scared? Google Dearborn, Michigan. It's just a little piece of Islam, right here in America's heartland.


Hmmmmm, that's where our old friend Militant Tiger was from.

As far as a refinery I agree do not get involved with the tribe. Also, how is the State Mill and Elevator working out.

I would say offer business incentives. How about a percent reduction in taxes for every percent of their emplyee force is native North Dakotan. Mix it with a reduced taxes for ten years plus a reduced taxes for North Dakota workers. Train and employ a 90% North Dakota labor force and they have a huge reduction in taxes. That could also be limited in years.

State owned may be better than nothing so I have not voted yet.

Edit: Ok, I googled it. Yiiiipes.


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## TK33 (Aug 12, 2008)

Burly1 said:


> High paying jobs would be a big plus. However, how many of those jobs would go to North Dakotans? A new refinery would need to be staffed with those who are familiar with the equipment involved. That well is pretty shallow in ND, and nobody leaves Mandan Tesoro unless they die or retire. Depending on the contractual operator, we may well see such an operation staffed largely by Texans. (not saying that's good or bad, just saying)
> I can't disagree on the high fuel cost coming back, not that three bucks isn't high already.
> To retain my sanity, I try to stay aware of what's going on in our state, but more often than not, our politicians dovetail right in with the rest of the misfits who laughingly attempt to run our country.
> Praying keeps me leveled off. Thank HIM!
> ...


well given that the market is being driven up purely by speculation and not by demand that is a safe bet. Given that some of the huge refineries in Canada are having some of their biggest shutdowns ever.

I voted yes because ND oil is not making all that it can be worth. Someone correct me if I'm wrong here but oil that is pumped from ND and Eastern Montana is blended in with a lesser grade oil when it hits the pipeline and heads South. So the oil pumped out of the Bakken is getting the price that the lesser grade oil goes for. I think the oil that comes out of Canada is the shale or sand oil that is not nearly as good as the oil from the Bakken.

I also voted yes because we need oil and we might as well get it from here.


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## Ron Gilmore (Jan 7, 2003)

There are a few misconceptions regarding the oil in ND. First, we do get less for the oil, but a refinery would not make a bit of difference because the oil is not ours to decide what to do with! It belongs to the companies which have leased the wells. There is no guaranttee that any oil pumped would be prcessed in ND with a new refinery. Second is the pipeline for distribution again simply because the pipelines run across ND does not mean a new refinery would have access to them.

A couple people I know who worked hard on this issue have stepped back and said we had no idea as to what it would take, and how little real return we could expect.

This issue is dead other than courting a company that has the experince and knowledge and access to move here and build one.


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## TK33 (Aug 12, 2008)

Obviously you would want to have the crude leased before you built a refinery. And yes there would have to be oil companies involved with the construction and operations of the refinery.

I was never under the impression that the state could build or manage a refinery themselves. I was under the impression it would be more of an investment deal.


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