# Why no party hunting in ND?



## BigDaddy (Mar 4, 2002)

Has NDGF ever allowed party hunting in ND? It would seem to me that allowing it would be a great way to reduce doe numbers.

I have hunting in MN for many years (where party hunting is allowed), and it is a great way to fill tags. Most years, we let the youngest of the group fill most of the tags or a person that hasn't had much luck recently.

It seems to me that it goes on with some groups of hunters anyway, so why not make it legal?


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## smalls (Sep 9, 2003)

It would only encourage people to apply for tags under other peoples names (family members, friends who don't hunt, etc.). Most likely, all of these tags will be applied for as buck tags. I think a better idea is to make doe tags an over the counter sale(with a limit on the total number of tags for sale). These tags would be nontransferrable and nonsaleable. That way, a guy can shoot as many as does that he wants without justifying guys who end up with mulitple buck tags under peoples names who have no intentions of hunting.


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## KEN W (Feb 22, 2002)

Nope...not in favor of party hunting...GNF has stated the kill rate on bucks would increase a lot...meaning they would issue less tags.It is tough enough to get a buck tag now in some units without lowering chances.


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## Booster (Sep 8, 2003)

I'm with Ken on this one. NO party hunting cuz of the buck tags. However, over the counter doe tags would be great! It would get rid of some of these stupid deer that continue to hang out right in the middle of the highway. Driving at night sucks! Kill em all! :sniper:


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## BigDaddy (Mar 4, 2002)

I like the idea of doe tags being over the counter sales. It would certainly encourage folks to go out and shoot a few. In the unit I hunt in MN, we could have each purchased five bonus doe tags.

Ken, I see your point with increased harvest of bucks. What if party hunting was only allowed for does?

Next question: Why does ND still have a lottery system? A person can buy an over the counter tag in MN, WI, and most other neighboring states. The entire state of MN is divided into four zones, each with a different season depending on success rates. Does NDGF really have the expertise to manage deer populations in the large number of deer zones in ND?


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## Ron Gilmore (Jan 7, 2003)

I know Ken goes and a lot of others on this site attend them also! I am talking about the Game and Fish Advisory meetings. If you attend them you will find many of the threads pertaining to deer hunting IE party hunting,buck/doe tags, QDM, etc etc... are answered by our pro's who have science,experience and a general understanding of what most hunters want in our state.

We all have this opportunity coming up again in a few weeks. Take these issue to them and it will get addressed. They truly want to hear from us. Take a look at unit 2B. Those holding doe tags that did not get filled during the early season will be allowed to hunt this weekend. This was the result of suggestions from hunters and landowners at the spring and fall meetings.


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## DJRooster (Nov 4, 2002)

Personally, I like our present system and with the high number of tags that are available because of a healthy deer herd hunters can pretty much do whatever they want as far as kind of deer and what unit they would like to hunt. The point system is a very workable solution for those that don't get their preference. I don't really see any advantage to legalizing party hunting because I think that there is plenty of it that goes on anyway. I really can't see why a hunter that applies for a deer tag needs to have someone else shoot their deer. If you want the meat, apply for a doe tag or get a doe tag as a second tag and if you want to hunt for a buck then enjoy the hunt and shoot your own. After all, it is called hunting and not killing.


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## smalls (Sep 9, 2003)

Ron is right, we've been pushing for changes in 2B for over 10 years now, slowly g&f is coming around. The advisory meetings are a great tool for us sportsmen to talk to the decision makers.


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## KEN W (Feb 22, 2002)

I guess I don't really see an advantage to buying doe tags over the counter.Almost every unit had doe tags left after the first lottery.What's wrong with the way it is now?

Or are some of you saying that doe tag would be good statewide like the bow tags are?....If that is the case ...it would not let the GNF put the most hunters where the most deer are.


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## smalls (Sep 9, 2003)

Ken, OTC could promote "spontaneous" doe tag buying. The less impediments there are to getting a tag, the more likely they will be purchased and used. I am sure many hunters that fill out quickly wish they could get more tags and make the rest of the hunt more fulfilling. Having OTC tags would help eliminate someone purchasing a tag through a 3rd or 4th lottery several months before season only to have conflicts that cause that tag to go unused. More tags would end up in the hands of active hunters who have a higher success rate.

My proposal for OTC tags would be such:

Continue to hold the first lottery as-is.

Hold the second lottery for hunters who did not draw a tag in the first lottery.

Take the remaining unit specific tags and make them available over the counter within said units, obviously selling only the quota set by g&f. A move to electronic licensing vendors would aid tremendously in this.


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## gaddyshooter (Oct 12, 2003)

Ok, ignorant NR here. Someone please explain what you mean when you say "party hunting." Things are very different down this way. Never heard that term before. Thanks.


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## smalls (Sep 9, 2003)

Party hunting is when a group of hunters will pool their tags and everyone shoots to fill the pool, neglecting which tags were theirs. So if you had one buck tag, but the group of hunters you were with pooled their tags and there was 4 buck and 6 doe tags, you could legally shoot all 10 deer legally.


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## Bushwacker (Mar 30, 2003)

I'd like to throw another angle into the mix. Say party hunting is legal. You have two buck tags left but lots of doe tags so everyone can still hunt. Because of the terrain or other circumstances your "party" "accidentially" shoots four bucks. Now what? Two of them are illegal, right. You have just killed more deer than you are licensed for. For you Mn hunters, what's the call in your state? I agree with other posts. We got enough trouble with guys getting licenses in their wives name or grandma's name and the result is a person who really wants to hunt bucks doesn't get a buck tag.


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## BigDaddy (Mar 4, 2002)

Bushwacker: In MN, a "party" is defined as a group that is in close communication with each other. If you have guys hunting several miles away, I would not call that a party. Also, it is up to the holder of the tag to decide if he wants to fill it or not. For the most part, overfilling tags is not an issue the first few days of the season. However, as we get close to filling the tags, the holder may tell people that he wants to shoot a certain kind of deer, or if somebody does shoot the deer, he quickly tells the rest of the group.

I guess that the fundamental issue here is that obtaining a buck tag is ND is valuable. In MN (and every other state that I have lived in), a person can buy a buck tag over the counter. However, in most years, you have to obtain an anterless tag through a lottery so a doe tag was more valuable. Recent years have been the exception, and your license allows you to take either sex in MN, with the allowance to buy additional bonus doe tags in certain areas.

In my first post, I suggested using party hunting for harvesting more does. If the intent is to knock down deer numbers in certain areas, why not allow party hunting for does? I would like to see over the counter doe tag sales too.


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## KEN W (Feb 22, 2002)

I guess I still don't see any advantage to buying doe tags over the counter.

Would only 1 place in each county have them?Otherwise if you lived in a larger city...you would be driving all over the place to find some still available.

What is easier than using the phone or internet to get a license...I can have 1 in 10 minutes and would know instantly if there are still some available.


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## DJRooster (Nov 4, 2002)

We already have much party hunting within group of hunters, albeit illegal. It certainly causes enforcement headaches for the GFD. Their philosophy seems to be towards maintaining accountability within the hunting ranks with the addition of carcass tags. I do believe that our present system does encourage people to get out and hunt for a deer rather than just harvesting a deer for others in their group. I also have questions concerning that last deer and the possibilities that one too many deer could get shot. What do the people in Minnesota think? They work within this system and what do they think about party hunting? Large parts of Minnesota are shotgun only so I don't know if this is a factor in their philosophy behind party hunting.


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## dakotashooter2 (Oct 31, 2003)

I'm not a big fan of party hunting legal or otherwise. In the open country of ND it promotes deer drives which encourages shooting running deer, often at long ranges and often beyond the skills of the average shooter. This results in many wounded and unrecovered deer. You will find most of the people who support party hunting are the ones that do most of the shooting. I've also seen too many occurances where too many bucks or too many does were shot and left to lie. Remember... In ND the tagholder has to accompany his deer and technically if your tag is filled you cannot carry a weapon. However most people get around this by buying a furbearers tag and claim the are carrying for that purpose.


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