# VP Shoots a Man



## DeltaBoy (Mar 4, 2004)

I just heard that our VP shot a man while hunting in Texas. I thought the press was going to tell us he had a heart attack.

It just goes to show you... Hunter safety is very, very important! I don't care who you are... If your hunting you always need to think about safety.

Curty also posted this in the Open forum...

http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20060212/ts_ ... ccident_dc


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## seabass (Sep 26, 2002)

Just what gun opponents like to hear... this isn't good!

I think the guy he shot is okay...


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## Plainsman (Jul 30, 2003)

It sounds like the guy will be out of the hospital tomorrow. I guess some guy (78 year old attorney) left the group, then returned from behind without announcing himself just as a second covey of quail broke. They say the secret service went to the mans aid. They say he was peppered with a 28 gauge.

I don't like hunting with more than three four other people. Can you imagine trying to hunt with the secret service and the rest of the entourage that accompany them?


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## DeltaBoy (Mar 4, 2004)

Plainsman said:


> It sounds like the guy will be out of the hospital tomorrow. I guess some guy (78 year old attorney) left the group, then returned from behind without announcing himself just as a second covey of quail broke. They say the secret service went to the mans aid. They say he was peppered with a 28 gauge.


I heard he took a few in the face - ouch!

I noticed the news is all over this story...


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## Plainsman (Jul 30, 2003)

Yes, face and upper torso. I hope he was wearing eye protection.


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## jacksbrat (Feb 12, 2006)

Here is the way I see the gun issue. Eventually, guns will have to be controled. Here's why I think so. When I was young, I could walk outside my house and shoot my rifle in any direction without a danger of hitting anyone. I could go into the woods and walk for miles and shoot anything I wanted to. Today there is houses all around my home place. Most of the woods is gone and people live there. I can't do that any more. Eventually there won't be a place in the country where it will be safe to shoot a high powered rifle in any dirrection but up without a danger of hitting someone. I know there are many places in the country where hunting is still safe, but they will keep getting smaller, and more hunters will be there. It will be nick and tuck for a while yet, but eventually the majority will be against them.


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## racer66 (Oct 6, 2003)

Man, you picked the wrong site to bring that crap to.


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## Plainsman (Jul 30, 2003)

Thank you lord.


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## DecoyDummy (May 25, 2005)

Jacksbrat wrote:

Eventually there won't be a place in the country where it will be safe to shoot a high powered rifle in any dirrection but up without a danger of hitting someone.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------

Jack ... did you ever hear of "The Law Of Gravity?"

Some guy named Newton ... only he was dealing in apples at maybe fifteen feet high at the time.

These "high powerd rifle bullets" ... they eventually return to ground where us folks are.


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## zogman (Mar 20, 2002)

Huntin1,

Time to bring in those Black Helicopters :sniper:

Find Jack's honey hole. Some where in Massechutes :toofunny:


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## Plainsman (Jul 30, 2003)

I would be very surprised if sites like this didn't have two or three anti gun pro animal rights lurkers just to fowl us up. Unfortunately jacksbrat may be right about where we are going with gun control. The funny thing is he has unwittingly alerted those that would protect it. We know who the anti gun politicians are, and they are the people jacksbrat is loyal to, the radical left. So Jack, keep talking you will convince many more people than I had hoped I could.


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## jacksbrat (Feb 12, 2006)

There is nothing "radical" about common sense. Being radical is buring your head in the sand and letting your *** stick up.


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## Gohon (Feb 14, 2005)

In that case Jack you really should come up for air.

I suppose the media will have a field day with this starting tomorrow. Saw a picture of the hunt on the news tonight. Looked like about 5 or 6 hunters maybe 30 yards apart stretched out in a straight line with the VP on the end. Just a guess but most likely the other guy came up on his open side unannounced. All were wearing nice hunting gear and blaze orange but it just shows accidents can happen even to the prepared.


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## Gun Owner (Sep 9, 2005)

During my hunter safety course, it was stressed that bird hunting in a group was by far the most dangerous of all hunts, for exactly what happened. Im very glad there were no serious inuries, and in the end, it is taken as a lesson that bad accidents can happen to anyone.

Gohon, you are correct in regards to him coming up unannounced. I cant recall where I read that particular article today, but that was the long and short of it.


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## jacksbrat (Feb 12, 2006)

When I went hunting years ago, when I shot a squirrel or game bird, I would bring it home and mom cooked it. I wonder if Dick Chaney eats the birds he kills to keep from going hungry?


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## mr.trooper (Aug 3, 2004)

Nobody is imune to carelesness.

But the again, his buddy is also a dumbass for not making his position clear.



jacksbrat said:


> When I went hunting years ago, when I shot a squirrel or game bird, I would bring it home and mom cooked it. I wonder if Dick Chaney eats the birds he kills to keep from going hungry?


when i browsed forums years ago, when i posted a reply or a inquiry, i would submit it to my peers and we would have meaningfull dicussions. I wonder if jacksbrat posts the replys he writes to try and further the discussion?

:beer:


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## Gun Owner (Sep 9, 2005)

jacksbrat said:


> When I went hunting years ago, when I shot a squirrel or game bird, I would bring it home and mom cooked it. I wonder if Dick Chaney eats the birds he kills to keep from going hungry?


Just what, exactly, does going hungry have to do with hunting? I hunt for food, but I dont hunt because I have to.

I reckon there are still quite a few folks in our country that do hunt for survival, but thats not a prerequisite for the enjoyment of our sport.


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## indsport (Aug 29, 2003)

I heard about the Cheney firearms incident. I guess his accuracy during hunting is about as good as his accuracy for finding WMD or Osama. I guess that means he will not be appearing in any commercials for hunter safety for his favorite charity, the NRA.


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## Bobm (Aug 26, 2003)

Actually he woud be a good candidate for a commercial, hes speaking from experience. What the big deal anyway?? he shot a lawyer, the season should always be open on them! :lol:


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## racer66 (Oct 6, 2003)

Love it Bob.


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## BigDaddy (Mar 4, 2002)

First, we should be thankful that the gentleman experienced what have been described as minor injuries. Hopefully, people will learn from it to prevent similar accidents in the future.

From the media that I have seen, people are not raising issues with this unfortunate event as a gun control issue. Instead, the media is asking questions why the VP and the White House did not make this event public immediately. Instead, the owner of the ranch called a newspaper, and it was not reported for more than 24 hours after it happened. This does not look good, and gives the impression that people were trying to keep it from becoming public knowledge. This lack of openess is the only reason why this story will not die within a day or two.


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## Bobm (Aug 26, 2003)

shoosh be very, very quite :lol: :lol: :lol: 
maybe you should demand a commision to investigate it :lol: :lol: :lol: :roll:

talk about grasping at straws :lol: :lol: :lol:

anyone have a good recipe for lawyers....not too may people can claim they shot a quail and a varmint with one shot :lol: :lol: :lol:


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## DJRooster (Nov 4, 2002)

Open season on lawyers? That is funny, Bob!


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## BigDaddy (Mar 4, 2002)

Bob:

I'm not calling for a commission. If you re-read my post, I am saying that this could have easily been a non-story akin to the incident when the President had a bicycling accident a few years ago or when Bush Sr. yakked all over the delegation in Japan. Accidents happen, and it is nobody's fault.

The only part of this incident that the media was even talking about this morning was the fact that it was not disclosed for 24 hours. If the White House or VP would have simply alerted the media immediately and explained the situation, the media would have nothing to talk about, and this would be forgotten within a short period of time.


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## indsport (Aug 29, 2003)

Bobm,

Ah now I understand why he did it


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## DJRooster (Nov 4, 2002)

I heard that Cheny, was having an affair with this guys wife and she would collect a huge life insurance and accidental death payment if he were dead. Oh, and Hillary is involved in there somewhere too but I havn't got the details but will let you know as I get them.


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## Bobm (Aug 26, 2003)

I'm not really sure but I think the ambulance and hospital folks are the ones reponsible for reporting gun shot accidents. I'm sure there was of good bit of good ol boy networking going on. From the accounts of that rancher she sounds like a ol texan, probably doesn't think its that big a deal. You know the old "stuff happens" theory.....

A friend of mine hit me in the head with a single number six shot years ago  ( explains a few things about me doesn't it :lol: :lol: :lol: )
it flattened out on my forehead and we just popped it out like a pimple :lol: gave me a heck of a bruise and I was lucky not to have been hit in the eye.

I never even considered reporting him we just kept hunting. And I never was or will be a stander in a pheasant drive again :lol:


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## zogman (Mar 20, 2002)

I think the reporting time is about the same as Teddy's regarding Maryjo.
Enuf said.....................


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## KEN W (Feb 22, 2002)

Big Daddy is right....and even the conservative talking heads on Fox agree.Robert Novack and Mort Kondracke said ....this is typical of this White House....don't say anything until forced to.Someone including Rove evidently didn't want this as a topic of discussion on the Sunday morning talk shows.Typical of the Bush White House.their words not mine.

The sad thing is that Cheney had a Texas non-res. license but did not have the upland stamp necessary to be hunting there.And he wasn't ticketed.Do you suppose they would be that nice if one of us ordinary hunters didn't have the appropriate tags and stamps?I don't think so.


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## Bobm (Aug 26, 2003)

> Big Daddy is right


no hes left, far left, and sometimes I wonder about you :lol:

Talk about making a mountain out of a molehill :eyeroll:

Cheney shot his friend and probably feels real bad about it so pile on uke:

Ken, as for the new quail stamp That requirement just started and guess what I didn't know anything about it either ( still wouldn't if you wouldn't of been whining about it ) and I didn't buy one this year either. No one said anything to me about it when I bought my license either and I specifically asked if there was anything else I needed. So I bet it was just an oversight, or maybe Cheney couldn't scrape up the 7 bucks .....

With all the legitimate things you could complain about this is ridiculous, it didn't surprise me with Big daddy but I figured you would be a little more reasoned. The idea that there some kind of Whitehouse coverup over a minor hunting accident is silly and I'm being generous because I like you.


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## zogman (Mar 20, 2002)

Yea , Bob as long as we can still take a joke I bet Leno and Letterman will be howeling material tonight.

Big Daddy, Do you think Teddy should of called in right away?????


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## Plainsman (Jul 30, 2003)

Actually they or the hospital need to notify law enforcement of any shooting accidental or otherwise. After law enforcement checks it out they report it. Law enforcement normally will notify the states attorney within 24 to 48 hours. No one else really needs to know. More than likely the states attorney will report it to the state to go into their hunting accident data base. 
Today the media think they have the right to know everything.


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## Gohon (Feb 14, 2005)

As you said Bob it is something new for 2006. Probable a lot of hunters are unaware of it. Besides, he received a citation today for not having the stamp. Yes, mountain out of a mole hill....


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## Alaskan Brown Bear Killer (Feb 22, 2005)

Cheney should go to the house of rep and ask the Democrats who wants to go hunting? :lol: 
There be some takers   :lol:


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## Bobm (Aug 26, 2003)

Notice the double standard, :eyeroll:

the same crowd that was howling that Clintons XXXtracurricular activities were "his personal life" now somehow think someone going hunting isn't. And on a hunting web site no less 

Now Clinton that was a cover up, I wonder where all the knashing of teeth was then........and I happen to agree it was his personal life.

As for the "talking heads" in Washington, who cares what they think??? 
They are so pompous that they are indignant that they weren't notified in time to blah blah blah about it on the Sunday shows, darn the inhumanity of it all :lol: :lol: :lol:

too funny!!!!!!!


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## BigDaddy (Mar 4, 2002)

zogman wrote:



> Big Daddy, Do you think Teddy should of called in right away?????


For what offense? Be being liberal, a drunk, or being involved in a drunk-driving death of a woman several decades ago? Clarify, please.

If you would read my posts, I'm not calling for Cheney to be taken in. I stated plainly that this is a NON-STORY. The only thing that is giving anybody an opportunity to talk about it is the fact that the White House didn't comment on the incident until they were asked. That gives the impression, right or not, that they were trying to hide something.


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## zogman (Mar 20, 2002)

Big Daddy,

Here the short version. Your so young I forgive you for not remembering.
Do a search on Ted Kennedy and Mary Jo you'll have tons of reading.

July 20, 2004, 9:44 a.m.
Remembering Mary Jo
35 years later: Ted Kennedy's under-investigated scandal.

This week we may hear a little about the 35th anniversary of Neil Armstrong's moonwalk, but there is another anniversary that has alreeady gone unnoticed. On July 18, 1969, a couple of nights before Armstrong took that "giant step for mankind," Ted Kennedy took a turn onto a narrow bridge in Chappaquiddick. The passenger in his car that night was Mary Jo Kopechne, a pretty, blond Capitol Hill secretary, just about to celebrate her 29th birthday. The two events are inextricably linked in my mind because my husband, who was a correspondent for a British newspaper, instead of reporting on our glorious odyssey into space, ended up at police headquarters on Martha's Vineyard covering that sordid story.

In case you have forgotten or never knew the details, Ted and five of his pals and six women known as the "Boiler Room Girls" who had worked in Bobby Kennedy's presidential campaign, cut short by his assassination the year before, were weekending together. Afterward, the men claimed it was just a couple of days of innocent fun to thank the girls for their help, though the six guys were all married but partying without their wives, and the young women were all single. One of the "Boiler Room Girls" is now big-time New York literary agent Esther Newberg, who was Mary Jo's roommate for the weekend. Like everyone involved in the incident, Esther remains close-mouthed about what occurred.

What everyone testified at the time was that Kennedy and Mary Jo left the party before midnight. Kennedy said he was driving her back to the ferry to Edgartown, and took a wrong turn, though he was very familiar with the roads on the island. His car toppled off a narrow wooden-planked bridge, a bridge that is in the opposite direction to the road that led to the ferry but is on the way to the beach. The car landed upside-down in eight feet of water and, Kennedy claimed that after escaping, he tried unsuccessfully to rescue Mary Jo. He then staggered back to the party, called out his cousin Joe Gargan and his pal Paul Markham, to return to the scene. What he didn't do, inexplicably, was seek help in a lighted house only yards from the bridge or use the fire-alarm phone at a fire station he passed on the way back to the party.

Right from the start, the reporters who arrived at the scene were skeptical of his story, skeptical even of how he claimed he got back to Edgartown that night. Markham and Gargan said when they drove to the ferry landing - the ferry had stopped running by then - Kennedy took them by surprise by jumping in the water, and swimming across the channel towards Edgartown. They assumed, they said, he would report the accident that night to the police. Instead Kennedy went back to his hotel, ostensibly to change his clothes but instead, went downstairs to complain about a noisy party that was going on.

The next morning Markham and Gargan were waiting for Kennedy when he arrived at 9 A.M. on the first ferry. The ferry operator said Kennedy appeared to be in a jovial mood, but probably only until he was told that his car had been found. Only then did Kennedy return and report the accident.

Some reporters, primarily the foreign press, did ask tough questions. For example: Did Kennedy really swim back to Edgartown that night? No one saw him with wet clothes and my husband, for one, interviewed a young man who had tied up his rowboat at the Chappaquiddick dock on Saturday night. When he got there on Sunday morning, he said, it had been retied and with what he called a "land lubber's knot."

But the whole incident was overshadowed by the worldwide coverage of the moonwalk. Besides, all the people involved had, by midday, left Martha's Vineyard and headed home. When the police went to the cottage where the party had taken place, all they found were some washed Coca-Cola bottles. There was no one to interview and no one who would talk then - or ever. Besides, Kennedy was treated like Massachusetts royalty by the local police chief, Dominick Arena, who even gave up his office so that Kennedy could make telephone calls to advisers and lawyers in privacy.

It may have been the last time when a scandal was so under-investigated, so quickly dispatched - and the man involved seemed to get off so easily for what he had done. A week later, Kennedy, who arrived in court wearing a neck brace, pleaded guilty to leaving the scene of an accident and was given a two-month suspended sentence and a year's probation.

Next week Ted Kennedy will be center stage at the Democratic convention in Boston. "It will be a celebration...of the work of Ted Kennedy.... There will be a lot of appropriate attention paid to a person who has been at the center of national politics for the past forty years," his colleague Senator Christopher Dodd has enthused. And last year Boston Globe reporter Charles Pierce commented, "If she had lived, Mary Jo Kopechne would be 62 years old. Through his tireless work as a legislator, Edward Kennedy would have brought comfort to her in her old age."

It would be funny - if it wasn't so sad.


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## Bobm (Aug 26, 2003)

this is not the first time a vice president has shot someone. On July 11, 1804 vice-president Aaron Burr shot Alexander Hamilton in a duel in Weehawken, New Jersey. Hamilton died the next day. Burr was indicted for murder, but never prosecuted.


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## g/o (Jul 13, 2004)

For once I have to say Plainsman is correct. I had a accident at my place a few years ago. The hospital informed the authorities not me or anyone else. What happened with Cheney I don't know other than what we read. What I can't believe is how political people are and can't leave there bias for one minute. We are looking at CRP being reduced which is being reduced big time. As sportsmen we need people like Dick Cheney not only is he the VP he is an active sportsman. He hunts pheasants every year in SD he loves hunting as many of us do. We need people like him from both parties. Use some common sense fellows or we will be the big looser here.


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## Bob Kellam (Apr 8, 2004)

g/o

Sorry my friend Mr. Cheney is far removed from what many of us consider a hunter. Even without any CRP in the entire world he would be able to hunt in his own particular style.

I get kind of a kick out of everyone bashing Kennedy, He is an IDIOT. The fact remains he is not the only one. Congress is full of examples of behavior "unbecoming" a leader.



> In recent years, members of Congress have gone to jail for child molestation, fraud and other charges.
> Our research found 117 members of the House and Senate who have run at least two businesses each that went bankrupt, often leaving business partners and creditors holding the bag. Seventy-one of them have credit reports so bad they can't get an American Express card (but as members of Congress, they get a government-issued Amex card without a credit check).
> 
> Fifty-three have personal and financial problems so serious they would be denied security clearances by the Department of Defense or the Department of Energy if they had to apply through normal channels (but, again, as members of Congress they get such clearances simply because they fooled enough people to get elected).
> ...


What Cheney did was wrong but the "brotherhood" of Washington DC has an image problem IMO.

Like Bob M said whats the big deal it was just an attorney! :lol:

Bob


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## zogman (Mar 20, 2002)

Bob K,

I don't think I am bashing Teddy the Great, just exposing or keeping the true Teddy in the limelight, Here's sort of a factual site. I do agree with you they are all rotten. When in doubt throw the incumbent out. IMHO

http://www.ytedk.com/

Very long but all facts..................

Big Daddy, Enjoy :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:


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## Bob Kellam (Apr 8, 2004)

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

:beer:

Bob


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## g/o (Jul 13, 2004)

Bob, again I will disagree big time. Dick Cheney is the VP do you expect him or anyone else in there position to be out walking PLOTS with the rest of the crowd? A couple of years ago I was involved with a hunt for Sen, John Thune and Gov. Rounds in SD. I was asked in Sept. and Sen Thune wanted to go pheasant hunting after the election if he won or not against Daschle. Remember Thunes remark to the press after he won," I'm going pheasant hunting". Now I was to keep this quiet and they trusted me, why? The last thing they want is a bunch of reporters running around following them and taking pictures. Let me tell you Sen Thune is a hard hunting individual it's a passion of his. You can't expect people as these to go out with the general public.

I know the he only shot a lawyer was in jest. I find no humor in these kind of things sorry. I have seen hunting accidents and it's not a pretty picture. I can only imagine what you guys would be saying if he had shot his guide.


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## MSG Rude (Oct 6, 2003)

g/o said:


> ....I can only imagine what you guys would be saying if he had shot his guide.


 :gag:


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## KEN W (Feb 22, 2002)

This is not about Clinton or Kennedy.It is not about shooting someone accidently.It is strictly about the White House not discloseing what happened.

Bob....you can say what you want,but the White House kept it's mouth shut until the Sunday Morning talk shows were over.As conservatives on FOX said it continues the pattern of secrecy in this White House. :eyeroll:


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## seabass (Sep 26, 2002)

Of course shooting someone isn't funny of itself... but...

TV joke writers take shots at Cheney

LOS ANGELES, California (AP) -- Television talk shows took aim Monday at Vice President Dick Cheney's accidental weekend shooting in Texas of a hunting companion. Here are a few of the jokes.
"Late Show with David Letterman," CBS

"Good news, ladies and gentlemen, we have finally located weapons of mass destruction: It's Dick Cheney."

"But here is the sad part -- before the trip Donald Rumsfeld had denied the guy's request for body armor."

"We can't get Bin Laden, but we nailed a 78-year-old attorney."

"The guy who got gunned down, he is a Republican lawyer and a big Republican donor and fortunately the buck shot was deflected by wads of laundered cash. So he's fine. He took a little in the wallet."

"The Tonight Show with Jay Leno," NBC

"Although it is beautiful here in California, the weather back East has been atrocious. There was so much snow in Washington, D.C., Dick Cheney accidentally shot a fat guy thinking it was a polar bear."

"That's the big story over the weekend. ... Dick Cheney accidentally shot a fellow hunter, a 78-year-old lawyer. In fact, when people found out he shot a lawyer, his popularity is now at 92 percent."

"I think Cheney is starting to lose it. After he shot the guy he screamed, 'Anyone else want to call domestic wire tapping illegal?' "

"Dick Cheney is capitalizing on this for Valentine's Day. It's the new Dick Cheney cologne. It's called Duck!"

"The Daily Show with Jon Stewart," Comedy Central

The show's segment titles included "Cheney's Got a Gun," "No. 2 With a Bullet" and "Dead-Eye Dick."

"Vice President Dick Cheney accidentally shot a man during a quail hunt ... making 78-year-old Harry Whittington the first person shot by a sitting veep since Alexander Hamilton. Hamilton, of course, (was) shot in a duel with Aaron Burr over issues of honor, integrity and political maneuvering. Whittington? Mistaken for a bird."

"Now, this story certainly has its humorous aspects. ... But it also raises a serious issue, one which I feel very strongly about. ... Moms, dads, if you're watching right now, I can't emphasize this enough: Do not let your kids go on hunting trips with the vice president. I don't care what kind of lucrative contracts they're trying to land, or energy regulations they're trying to get lifted -- it's just not worth it."

"Late Late Show with Craig Ferguson," CBS

"He is a lawyer and he got shot in the face. But he's a lawyer, he can use his other face. He'll be all right."

"You can understand why this lawyer fellow let his guard down, because if you're out hunting with a politician, you think, 'If I'm going to get it, it's going to be in the back.' "

"The big scandal apparently is that they didn't release the news for 18 hours. I don't think that's a scandal at all. I'm quite pleased about that. Finally there's a secret the vice president's office can keep."

"Apparently the reason they didn't release the information right away is they said we had to get the facts right. That's never stopped them in the past."


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## buckseye (Dec 8, 2003)

> "He is a lawyer and he got shot in the face. But he's a lawyer, he can use his other face. He'll be all right


." 
:lol: :lol: :lol:


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## g/o (Jul 13, 2004)

Ken, I always love the political bias you guys have when it comes to outdoor issues. I do not blame the White House for this, but you can if you wish. As I stated before there have been accidents on my property and it is the hospitals responsibility to report these things. But I'm sure you feel there is some kind of conspiracy here.


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## KEN W (Feb 22, 2002)

G/O ....not really a conspiracy....just typical of the way this White House does things.Damage control is everthing....and they wonder why the press is out to get them.


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## Gun Owner (Sep 9, 2005)

I dunno.... Seems we heard about Cheney shooting this guy in the face a helluva lot sooner than we heard about Clinton shooting Monica in the face....

Seriously though, if the white house had rushed out a news report, we'd all be hearing how they were so wrapped up in damage control that Cheney didnt even know until 24hrs later that his friend was ok.


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## KRAKMT (Oct 24, 2005)

Here are a few more not funnies!
Just glad the guy is all right and the talk shows have something new to wrangle over.

CHENEY'S POSSIBLE MOTIVES
Bob Geiger's blog.

10. Sick and tired of Whittington's "Hey, I'm having a heart attack" jokes

9. Pushed over edge by Dixie Chicks and Streisand blasting on pick-up truck stereo

8. Ongoing dispute over whether it's acceptable to torture quail before shooting them

7. Thought he saw Scooter Libby on other side of tree line

6. Bombed out of his gourd on Wild Turkey and Lone Star Beer

5. Companion's ill-advised decision to wear Moveon.org sweatshirt

4. Was trying to impress Jodie Foster

3. Whittington's repeated ribbing that Bush is actually the "real president"

2. Targeting scope on rifle made by Halliburton

And the number one excuse given by Dick Cheney for almost blowing away hunting companion Harry Whittington&#8230;

1. Because he's a wartime vice president, damn it


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## g/o (Jul 13, 2004)

Ken, And the Clinton administration was so forth coming on everything? It would be nice if some of you guys could leave your political bias out when it comes to discusion about outdoor issues.


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## Ron Gilmore (Jan 7, 2003)

Ken the press is upset plain and simple because they did not get to break the news! The more that comes out the more it seems proper procedures where followed. One also has to take into account what TX state law is, not ours or other states. I saw someone post what happens in ND, but that may or may not be the same for TX!

If you want to see this as a cover up, nothing anyone says will change that in your mind. I see this as a reminder to all of us that regardless of years spent hunting we can all be involved in an accident if we slip up on gun safety even for a moment!


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## Ron Gilmore (Jan 7, 2003)

This comes from a poster on the Fuge!

Let's check the facts...
The accident happened at 5:30 PM Sat.

First Aid was rendered immedately, and when it was clear that the man was in no immedate danger, he was transported back to the ranch house by 6:30 PM.

The Kenedy County Sheriff's Department was notified at that point and then in turn notified Texas Parks & Wildlife since it was hunting accident.

The shootee was then transported to the nearest major medical facility because of concerns about his age and to err on the side of causion. They could have taken him north or south....either way it was 100 miles. They took him north to Corpus Christi where he was check out and found to be in no danger.

At that point, the President was notified which was around 9:30 PM.

The news media normally gets their reports on such matters from the local law enforcement office, but the sheriff's department regarded the matter as a common hunting accident without life threatening injury, so they didn't take a n on-site report until the next morning (Sun.).

Katharine Armstrong, the ranch owner, called Ms. Powell at the Corpus Christi Caller-Times around 8 a.m. Sunday and left voice mail messages to return the call. Powell, who was in Austin, did not immediately receive the messages.

Unable to reach Powell, Armstrong called the newsroom at about 11 a.m. and told reporter Kathryn Garcia about the shooting. After that conversation, Armstrong called Powell again, this time reaching her on her cell phone, and also recounted the accident for her.

The Corpus Christi Caller-Time broke the national story at 1:48 p.m. Sunday.

Then Ms. Powell called Ms. Armstrong again at the hospital and said she wanted to talk with the vice president. Cheney came to the phone and briefly spoke with Powell.

References...

Katharine Armstrong to Caller-Times reporter Jaime Powell: 'I trust you'

We got the quail-hunting accident story the way dedicated journalists have tracked down news for years - through strong, consistent old-fashioned reporting.
February 14, 2006

The next time someone argues that newspaper journalists are dinosaurs headed for extinction, I'll remind them of Vice President Dick Cheney's shooting accident on the Armstrong Ranch.

Radio stations and cable news channels didn't break that news; neither did local television news stations. You didn't see it first on national news Web sites or blogs or on the Sunday morning political talk shows.

Our own Caller-Times reporters were first with the story that Cheney had accidentally shot Austin attorney Harry Whittington during a quail hunt in Kenedy County.

We broke the national story at 1:48 p.m. Sunday with an e-mail alert and a story on our Web site Caller.com, 48 minutes before the Associated Press moved anything on the story and a full hour before CNN issued an e-mail alert.

We got the story the way dedicated journalists have tracked down news for years - through strong, consistent building of sources and good, old-fashioned reporting.

As on most weekends, we operated with a skeleton crew this past Sunday, with most staffers scheduled for work in the afternoon.

Because of the Armstrong family's long-standing professional relationship with reporter Jaime Powell, Katharine Armstrong called Powell around 8 a.m. Sunday and left voice mail messages to return the call. Powell, who was in Austin, did not immediately receive the messages.

Unable to reach Powell, Armstrong called the newsroom at about 11 a.m. and told reporter Kathryn Garcia about the shooting.

After that conversation, Armstrong called Powell again, this time reaching her on her cell phone, and also recounted the accident for her.

Driving back to Corpus Christi, Powell talked to Armstrong in detail, and Garcia reported the story fully. She confirmed the shooting with the White House, checked on Whittington's condition at the hospital and called the Kenedy County Sheriff's Office, who said at the time that they had no record of a shooting incident at the Armstrong Ranch.

Garcia contacted her editors and wrote the story, which then went through a quick editing process before being posted on Caller.com at 1:48 p.m. by New Media Manager Trent Spofford.

Once in the newsroom, Powell spoke to Armstrong again and said she wanted to talk with the vice president, whom she had met last year at the funeral of Katharine Armstrong's father, Tobin. Cheney came to the phone and briefly spoke with Powell - so far his only public comment on the matter.

Online Editor John Allen worked with the newsroom throughout the day and night Sunday, updating the story several times on Caller.com.

In Monday's paper, we provided more details, maps and photos for those readers who wanted more in-depth news. We continued to follow the story Monday on Caller.com, with news that the sheriff didn't investigate the accident until Sunday, and in today's newspaper.

The Associated Press and CNN picked up the story after us on Sunday afternoon, and news media organizations throughout the country, including The New York Times and ABC's "Good Morning America," credited the Caller-Times with breaking the story.

We fielded dozens of media calls Monday, with Powell and Garcia granting numerous radio, television and print interviews.

Meanwhile, the national press corps grilled White House press secretary Scott McClellan on Monday about why news of the shooting wasn't released by the White House or Cheney.

The vice president's main concern, McClellan said, was for Whittington's well-being. And he said that it was with the vice president's knowledge and consent that Armstrong called her hometown paper and Powell.

"You had a relationship with my father," Armstrong told Powell. "You and I had a relationship and that relationship had grown stronger after my father's death, and my family was comfortable with calling the hometown newspaper." 
Maybe it's the pride in my staff talking, but I believe the White House press corps is whining just a bit because this news came first through a local daily newspaper's Web site and not following a mass press briefing thousands of miles away from the accident.

We got the story first by consistently working hard and professionally and gaining the trust of our sources. And because we did, the rest of the world got the story, too.

"We knew we needed to make it public," Armstrong told Powell. "It was a private weekend hosted by a private family, and we were comfortable calling the hometown paper and you. I trust you."

Caller-Times' employees work hard to establish that trust every day, and that, coupled with aggressive, thorough and accurate reporting, will secure our existence for decades to come.

Whether we deliver the news through a printed newspaper delivered on your lawn, or a Web site or the new technology of tomorrow, we'll still be the ones who gather the news and report it.

And if we do our job right, we'll still be the ones you trust.

Libby Averyt is vice president and editor of the Caller-Times. Phone: 886-3681; e-mail: [email protected].

Cheney accidentally shoots fellow hunter at nearby ranch 
By Kathryn Garcia and 
Jaime Powell/Caller-Times
February 12, 2006

Vice President Dick Cheney accidentally fired upon and injured a hunting companion during a weekend trip to the Armstrong Ranch in Kenedy County, peppering the 78-year-old with shotgun pellets while stalking quail.

The vice president sprayed prominent Harry Whittington with pellets from a 28-gauge shotgun while shooting quail at about 5:30 p.m. Saturday at the Kenedy County ranch, where he is a frequent visitor...MORE

http://www.caller.com/ccct/local_new...461615,00.html

Sheriff's department didn't investigate Cheney incident until next day

Ambassador to Switzerland was along; no one was drinking, host says
By Jaime Powell Caller-Times
February 13, 2006

The Kenedy County Sheriff's Department did not investigate the accidental shooting of prominent Texas lawyer Harry Whittington by Vice President Dick Cheney until the next morning.

Cheney, Whittington and U.S. ambassador to Switzerland and Liechtenstein Pam Willeford were hunting quail on the Northwest part of the 50,000-acre Armstrong Ranch Saturday afternoon, when Cheney, firing at a covey of quail, sprayed Whittington with shotgun pellets...MORE

http://www.caller.com/ccct/local_new...463408,00.html

Whittington had not made presence known
By Jaime Powell Caller-Times
February 13, 2006

Shortly before Vice President Dick Cheney accidentally shot Austin attorney Harry Whittington in a Kenedy County hunting mishap Saturday afternoon, Whittington had stepped away from the hunting party to search for a downed quail in a mesquite thicket.

Both men are regular visitors to the 50,000-acre Armstrong Ranch and had hunted on the terrain, which includes mesquite trees and huisache brush interspersed with tall native grasses and pastures. MORE...

http://www.caller.com/ccct/local_new...462927,00.html

Whittington to be moved out of intensive care
He will remain hospitalized for several more days
By Neal Falgoust/Caller-Times
February 13, 2006

The 78-year-old man Vice President Dick Cheney accidentally shot Saturday will be moved out of the intensive care unit this afternoon, Christus Spohn Hospital Memorial officials said.

"He's in stable condition doing extremely well," hospital administrator Peter Banko said of Harry Whittington's condition. "There's no need for him to stay in Intensive care." MORE...

http://www.caller.com/ccct/local_new...463078,00.html

Cheney injures a friend during South Texas hunt
Austin lawyer, 78, is stable after shotgun pellets hit him at Armstrong Ranch
By Kathryn Garcia and Jaime Powell Caller-Times
February 13, 2006

Vice President Dick Cheney accidentally fired upon and injured a hunting companion during a weekend trip to the Armstrong Ranch in Kenedy County, peppering the 78-year-old with shotgun pellets while stalking quail.

The vice president sprayed prominent lawyer Harry Whittington with pellets from a 28-gauge shotgun while shooting quail at about 5:30 p.m. Saturday at the ranch, where he is a frequent visitor. MORE...

http://www.caller.com/ccct/local_new...462925,00.html
__________________


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## racer66 (Oct 6, 2003)

What all this hype has accomplished is to show the true colors of the press and the dem's, I have 10 year old with more values.


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## BigDaddy (Mar 4, 2002)

> What all this hype has accomplished is to show the true colors of the press and the dem's, I have 10 year old with more values.


Sorry, racer, but this is bullsh$t. As usual conservatives are making this story into some sort of media conspiracy and Bush administration witchhunt. This is straight out of the "divert and slam" playbook, while throwing in a little of the "liberal media" crap for good measure.

KenW is right on with this one. This isn't about who shot who or people convinced that the gun control advocates are going to use this as ammo for their cause. This is a result of the Bush administration's repeated disregard and alienation of the media core, and the distrust that has resulted from it.

The media is asking why didn't the VP or the White House announce this immediately after they knew the injuries were not life-threatening? Instead, the ranch owner called the local newspaper the next morning. Think of how much a non-story this whole thing would be if the White House press secretary would have issue a simple statement outlining the basic facts of the incident and promising more information once the Sheriff had investigated it and more facts became available... that's all it would have taken.

I am convinced that there is no coverup conspiracy here... the VP was involved in a hunting accident. However, Bush's reluctance to be forthright and open with the press has created an environment where the media simply doesn't trust him.

It is well accepted that Bush holds fewer press conferences and has less interaction with the press than any president in modern history. Furthermore, when a major story does hit the media like the alleged illegal wiretapping project, Bush lashes out at the press for disclosing the news. I don't know if it is out of stubborness or arrogance, but the Bush administration seems to think that the media will receive whatever information he darnwell thinks they need to know, not necessarily what they should now.

Now, conservatives are casting allegations that the media is making a "mountain out of a molehill". Sorry, but Cheney made the mountain by not proactively alerting the media to a minor incident. If you or I are in a hunting accident, we can wait to see of the media picks it up from law enforcement records because it isn't news. When the VP is involved in a hunting accident, it is news, and it is foolish or arrogant to think that it is nobody else's business.

Feed the dogs and they will be happy. Tick them off, and don't expect them to be on your side. What could have died in a day or so will now linger for weeks.


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## g/o (Jul 13, 2004)

Big Daddy come on give us a break. Cheney has just shot a buddy and the first thing you want him to do is call a reporter and say "hey I just shot a guy" come on. Yes I agree if the White house knew at 9:30 that evening it should have been reported then. For people to keep blaming the press, the white house whatever is just petty party politics. Makes me sick, for Gods sake a man was shot. Leave it alone all you are doing is adddings fuel to the anti hunting crowd.


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## Bobm (Aug 26, 2003)

Screw the media, its not Cheneys or anyone else's job to "inform them" its their job to be informed though their own channels with souces in the local hospitals and local authorities, the big national news outfits just have the butts on their shoulders because they were scooped by a little local news outfit. One I might add, that took the time to get the story correct and double check a few things unlike our wonderful main stream :eyeroll: media. 
The proper authorites were all informed as required by law, *Cheneys not obligated to tell the media a damn thing*. :******:

All you leftists just want to make this into something it wasn't just because of your usaul and thankfully losing agenda. If you shot your hunting buddy I'm sure the first thing you would do is run to the local news outlet to talk about it :eyeroll:

G/O is absolutley right these people deserve some privacy! :beer:

I know I wouldn't want to be under the constant surveilance of the media picking apart everything I do or say.

And yes the lawyer jokes were in jest,
apparently the old guy is having some major unexpected heart problem from this incident and maybe needs our prayers.


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## Gohon (Feb 14, 2005)

> the press is upset plain and simple because they did not get to break the news!


BINGO


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## always_outdoors (Dec 17, 2002)

g/o and Bobm are correct. I don't think the media has any rights here. I didn't read through all the posts, but if they contacted authorities that is ALL THEY HAD TO DO.

I noticed someone was trying to compare this to Clinton. You can't. That dip$hit was using an intern which to me is work related, not personal. If he was seeing some girl out in Arkansas on the weekends, different. He bumped an employee which is not personal.


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## KEN W (Feb 22, 2002)

You conservatives can put any kind of spin on it you want.But the fact is....don't sit here and complain about how the press always attacks the Bush White House.This is just another example of trying to keep things damageing out of the press.Looking at the timeline Ron posted above....Bush clearly knew about this at 9:30 Sat. night.Their objective was to keep quiet long enough to keep it off the Sunday morning talk shows.

Just another examlpe of why I really don't trust these people.It doesn't matter if I agree with their policies and actions.But be up front about them.


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## racer66 (Oct 6, 2003)

KenW, you are of the lowest, typical liberal, I guess we shouldn't be surprised though.


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## Bobm (Aug 26, 2003)

> He bumped an employee which is not personal


 sure ain't business :lol: :lol: :lol:

Ken, you are full of beans ! :wink: What this is is another example a really good shining example of how the press does attack the Whitehouse! 
Show us the law that wasn't followed Ken. 
Is there one that says Bush should now be announcing hunting acccidents Ken?
Is it you opinion that he should butt into Cheneys personal life to that extent, Ken?

Maybe he should of went down there to personally manage this supposed "crisis" to keep the precious media happy. You can bet he really cares what your precious leftist media talking heads think if he listened to them he would be a typical Democrat with his finger up in the air looking at the latest poll :eyeroll:

You seem so exercised about the Sunday morning talk shows, exactly what is your point?? Oh I forgot thats right another Bush conspiracy :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: "Quailgate"

"Oh, no don't tell the press on Sunday they will tell everyone". :withstupid:


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## Plainsman (Jul 30, 2003)

I think the media's real problem was a Texas new paper had the story first, and they think they are so important that they should have had it first. This isn't a problem of none reporting, there was no requirement to report it to the news. This is a problem of arrogant national media. They are trying to make it a political football, but the truth is it is a media problem. It is an imaginary problem, by arrogant, spoiled, self important media. It can only be a real problem if we let it be.

By the way I enjoyed the jokes. My favorite joke was: it's part of the Bush Social Security Plan. At age 78 booooom your out.


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## Gohon (Feb 14, 2005)

This is really amazing.... who really cares if they learned about the accident Saturday night or Sunday evening. I sure don't, didn't alter my life. Has anything in your life been changed. The only two groups that are upset over this whole thing is the White House Press because they didn't get the story first and their little feelings are now hurt and, the usual liberal Bush haters that want to grasp anything they can and make a mountain out of a mole hill. It's not like the VP or the President themselves had been shot. The public doesn't give a rats hoot about this story but some of you Bush haters sure want to make it sound that way. It is a non story and the only thing that may have been accomplished to have it reported the evening it happened was to turn the hospital where the friend was taken into a circus, and for what. Probable Cheney thought about that himself when he decided screw the cry babies, I'll take the heat to give him a nights rest. No, it isn't the conservatives making anything but simply the same group of liberals trying to turn a non issue into a legitimate issue. Thank you Mr. VP for having the guts to think of your friend first.


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## Alaskan Brown Bear Killer (Feb 22, 2005)

The T.V.news guys were going on and on about the VP not having the required tag ........... I didn't know they had those in Texas, maybe they could make some extra money for the state by selling democrat tags, I'd buy as many as they'd let me have :lol: :sniper: :sniper:


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## Plainsman (Jul 30, 2003)

Well, for myself it's time to look at the silver lining in this cloud. I feel sorry for the VP and the fellow that got shot, but I don't feel sorry for the media. One good thing to come from this is the media is making a fool of itself, and that isn't all bad. They may be liberally biased, but do you think the liberals will entirely trust these guys anymore. They may say they do, but in the back of their mind, no not entirely.

The media is on a feeding frenzy, and there is no meat to be had.


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## DecoyDummy (May 25, 2005)

Gohon Wrote:

Probable Cheney thought about that himself when he decided screw the cry babies, I'll take the heat to give him a nights rest. No, it isn't the conservatives making anything but simply the same group of liberals trying to turn a non issue into a legitimate issue. Thank you Mr. VP for having the guts to think of your friend first.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I hadn't really thought about it in those terms, but it's pretty "plausible" thinking there.


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## racer66 (Oct 6, 2003)

Exactly Plains, these guys look like bunch of 8 year olds on the playground, it couldn't have been scripted any better.


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## DecoyDummy (May 25, 2005)

KenW wrote:

Bush clearly knew about this at 9:30 Sat. night. Their objective was to keep quiet long enough to keep it off the Sunday morning talk shows.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I think GWB should have called a national news conference at no later than 10:30 pm ... :eyeroll: :eyeroll: :eyeroll:

From all I been hearing over the past few years ... GW turns in early ... he might well have been awakend up from a sound sleep to get the news ...

It may simply have been an incident of a personal nature ... that has no effect on how the Administration Governs the country ... so it's no ones business

Hmmm that has a familiar ring to it ... someow the word "Lewinsky" comes to mind


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## Gun Owner (Sep 9, 2005)

Which brings us back to what I said earlier...

WE heard about Cheney shooting his friend in the face a helluva lot sooner than we found out about Clinton shooting Monica in the face.

Besides, exactly WHAT Sunday morning talk shows are there that could cover this in such a way that that argument has any merit?


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## Alaskan Brown Bear Killer (Feb 22, 2005)

Yea, and Cheney never denied it!


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## DJRooster (Nov 4, 2002)

Let's get on with it. There are more important issues at home and abroad. Even though my bias is against this party it is a none issue and let's spend our time running the country. It was a hunting accident. No more, no less!


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## buckseye (Dec 8, 2003)

more jokes please....


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## seabass (Sep 26, 2002)

buckseye said:


> more jokes please....


Okay, fine:

Donald Rumsfeld is giving the president his daily briefing. He concludes by saying: "Yesterday, 3 Brazilian soldiers were killed."

"OH NO!" the President exclaims. "That's terrible!"

His staff sits stunned at this display of emotion, nervously watching as the President sits, head in hands.

Finally, the President looks up and asks, "How many is a brazillion?"


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## buckseye (Dec 8, 2003)

Thanks I'm smilin now :lol:


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## DJRooster (Nov 4, 2002)

Cute!


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## Alaskan Brown Bear Killer (Feb 22, 2005)

A zoo in Georgia, had a female gorilla that became hard to handle.

The vet determined that she was in heat but no male gorilla was available.

The zoo keeper thought of Bobby Lee, a part time cage cleaner.

Bobby Lee, like most red necks, had little sense, but could satisfy a

female of any species.

The zoo keeper asked Bobby if he would mate with the gorilla for $500.00.

Bobby said yes, but under four conditions:

#1 I ain't going to kiss her on the lips.

#2 You can't never tell no one about this

#3 I want the kids raised Southern Baptist.

#4 You gotta give me some time to come up with the $500.00.


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## buckseye (Dec 8, 2003)

hehehehe... thats a good one :lol: :lol: :lol:


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## Bobm (Aug 26, 2003)

Killer Cheney
By William F. Buckley

Feb 20, 2006

This commentator rations himself to only one prediction every 15 years. Mine now is that there is going to be a devastating backlash in the months and years ahead in the matter of Cheney and the quail shoot.

Some critics of the administration are arguing as if Iraq were a subsidiary concern. What has been brought forth in the plains of Texas is the venal character of the vice president of the United States.

One columnist for The New York Times headlined his column, "Mr. Vice President, It's Time to Go." Resign, "for the sake of the country and" -- one inhales the purity of the writer's motives -- "for the sake of the Bush administration."

Now that gentleman's concern for the well-being of the Bush administration is on the level of his concern for the quail that Mr. Cheney did or did not kill (this is the only detail of the event unexplored by the historians). Why did the critic want Cheney to resign? Because "Mr. Cheney is arrogant, defiant and sometimes blatantly vulgar." Oh? Yes -- the critic arrived with documentation in hand: "He once told Sen. Patrick Leahy (news, bio, voting record) to perform a crude act upon himself." You do not say! Well, that's the kind of thing one would expect from somebody who goes about crippling his friends while ostensibly aiming only at quail.

It is to the credit of the newspaper of record that a few pages before the call for the resignation of Mr. Cheney, a careful reporter, Ralph Blumenthal, gave a detailed account of what had happened on Saturday at the Armstrong ranch.

Who all was there? Well, Pamela Pitzer Willeford, ambassador to Switzerland and Liechtenstein, and her husband, a physician; the hostess, Katharine Armstrong, and her sister, and her husband. Also Nancy Negley, an art philanthropist; Ben Love, a West Texas rancher; and the victim, Harry Whittington, a 78-year-old lawyer, and his wife. Also several outriders, whose duty was to flush the birds. Also a dozen American pointers and Labrador retrievers. Close to 5:30 p.m., the two shooting groups had bagged about 40 quail each, and were working now on the last covey.

About 100 yards away from the Jeep carrying the hostess and her sister (daughters of the fabled Anne Armstrong, whom Gerald Ford had once asked to run for vice president), "Mr. Cheney, Mr. Whittington and Ms. Willeford were walking in a line in a low spot on gently sloping ground. After Mr. Whittington bagged his birds he dropped out of sight, along with one of Ms. Armstrong's bird dogs." (Her name -- not originally disclosed to the press -- is "Gertie.") "Then, suddenly, he was in a dip about 30 yards away against the sun just as Mr. Cheney fired a blast from his Italian-made 28-gauge Perazzi shotgun." That is when Mr. Whittington "caught the spray of birdshot on the right side of his face, neck and chest."

Mr. Cheney is recorded as having said, "Harry, I had no idea you were there!" The exclamation point is mine, and will offend only those who refuse to believe that Cheney was startled at finding that his friend stood in a line between him, Gertie and the setting sun.

We all know what then happened. But the only thing that then happened that seemed to catch national attention was that the party drove not to the nearest newspaper, but to the hospital. :lol:

An account was filed with a local newspaper, and the doleful news came from the hospital that one pellet had entered the heart of the victim. There is little doubt but that he will survive. Mr. Cheney has said that what blame there is, is Cheney's. That detail, by the way is also not fully explored -- conceivably the victim had failed to identify his position when moving forward from the firing line established by hunters moving in parallel.

We can't celebrate a backlash until Mr. W. is back home and well. But here is one observer who predicts that Mr. W. will chuckle over the misadventure, unless, after years of friendship with Mr. Cheney, he only now discovers that he is arrogant, defiant, and that he uses vulgar language. :beer:

William F. Buckley, Jr. is editor-at-large of National Review, the prolific author of books such as Miles Gone By and Elvis in the Morning, and the editor of National Review's Treasury of Classic Children's Literature.


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## R y a n (Apr 4, 2005)

seabass said:


> buckseye said:
> 
> 
> > more jokes please....
> ...


NOW THAT right there is funny.... I don't care who you are!

I laughed out loud at that one... first time in a long time i've done that!

Thanks!


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## Lvn2Hnt (Feb 22, 2005)

Don't know if it's been posted anywhere else, but I got a kick out of this:



> WITH HUNTING BUDDIES LIKE THIS, YOU DON'T NEED ENEMIES
> 
> If you want some insight into Dick Cheney's recent hunting "accident," check out this bizarre excerpt from Trance-Formation of America, a book written in 1995 by Cathy O'Brien, a woman who claimed to be a victim of brutal mind control experiments carried out by men in the highest levels of the American government. In one excerpt of the book, O'Brien tells how Cheney used to traumatize his victims by taking them on his hunting trips: "Dick Cheney, then [assistant] White House Chief of Staff to President Ford ... was the reason my family had travelled to Wyoming where I endured yet another form of brutality-his version of 'A Most Dangerous Game,' or human hunting ... Dick Cheney had an apparent addiction to the 'thrill of the sport.'" He appeared obsessed with playing A Most Dangerous Game as a means of traumatizing mind control victims, as well as to satisfy his own perverse sexual kinks." Check out the entire strange tale at http://www.Trance-formation.com


- From the Boise Weekly -


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