# grain?



## splawndrew (May 2, 2006)

I just recently took up interest in handguns, and figured one of the best and most convenient way to learn would be to join a forum, so all help is appreciated.

I understand that the grain of a bullet means the higher the number the more force behind it. I have heard though, that it is possible in a self defense situation that if the grain is to high, the bullet will pass through not inflicting optimum damage. If this is true can anyone reccommend a good all around self-defense grain for my .45 ACP?

thank you to all!


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## Bore.224 (Mar 23, 2005)

Grain of bullet does not mean force behind it at all! Grain of bullet is the weight of the bullet. Heavier objeckts at same velocitys have more force behind them but I will not get into Physics right now!

As far as a good load for self defence, well that really depends on your firearm. Is it an Auto or a revolver? If you have an auto pistol find a cartridge that feeds good "does not jam often" and then any hollow point should be good. I like hydroshock hollowpoints. 185 grn or 230 grn if you shoot straight your target will never know the difference its all about strait shooting!! Good luck and welcome to the world of GUN NUTS :beer:


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## splawndrew (May 2, 2006)

bore.224

thank you for clearing that up for, and thanks for your help.


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## Dave_w (May 25, 2005)

I just plain old have a thing against getting into the sport straightaway and jumping into a cartridge like the .45ACP. Compared to a lot of ammo, the cost-per-round is pretty high, and recoil might not be as manageable as you thought it would be when you started. Even if you sampled one .45 and felt okay shooting it, another one might not be as easy-going. For example, I have a 9mm automatic that kicks a hell of a lot more than any .45 I've ever shot. Revolver or pistol.

If it were me, I'd start off with something like 9mm Luger. It's cheap, it's plentiful, and the guns that shoot it aren't too pricey, either. It's a round you can really afford to shoot often. Even better would be .22LR, if only to work on proper technique.

As for .45 being a self-defense cartridge, well....some people, some places, some situations. I can see people and places where a .45 would be desirable, but I really don't think that the difference between .45 and .38+P is enough to turn me off to the .38. Most .45s are a little big for concealed carry, and if I'm going to have a gun for home defense (very different from self-defense) it's going to be a stubby 12-gauge shotgun with a flashlight. Now, for all-the-time self-defense, I like .32, .38/9mm, or .38+P and .38 Special. I'm rather fond of .38+P revolvers for this purpose...small, light, and a hell of a lot of stopping power combined with the ability to practice on cheap .38 ammo.


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## Whelen35 (Mar 9, 2004)

Here are some numbers to rember when learning about the sport of shooting and reloading. 1 pound=16 oz = 7000 grains. Some of what you are talking about is KE or the energy delivered to the target by the bullet. More weight usually means more momentom or better penatration when all else is equal to a point where velosity is reduced to a point where the energy pushing the bullet is pushing so much wieght that it does not have the momentum to penatrate more than a lighter weight bullet. Now with some of the supper bullets that we have available to us some of the old school way of thinking is not as meaningfull as it was in the past. Best advise is get a good 22lr. I truely think the most expensive gun you own should be a 22lr. It is what you learn on, train on, and will shoot the most. You are doing a diservice to yourself if you purchase a low quality 22. Read as much as you can, and talk to people that actually do the gun related things that you are interested in. For example, my ideas of ideal hunting bullet performance and a bullet used or intended for self defence are very differant. Infact they are almost reversed in how I think they should work. Others will have differant views. No one is 100% right or wrong, you have to decide on what works for you, and hopefully by some first hand compairsons on your part. Shoot, explore, learn, and have fun. What a great sport.


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## Remington 7400 (Dec 14, 2005)

Good self defense loads for .45 ACP

1. 230 grain Hornady XTP
2. 200 grain Remington Golden Saber
3. 220 grain Federal Hydra-Shok
4. 200 grain Speer Lawman
5 230 grain Barnes X-Bullet


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## Dave_w (May 25, 2005)

lol If you wanna know things about .45, Rem's the guy to know.

I'm backing Whelen up on his opinion about buying a good .22LR. I've seen good ones, I've seen great ones, and I've seen ones that just plain old sucked. I wouldn't go so far as to make a .22 my most expensive gun (my personal money pit is a modified AR15, and I've got a custom Ruger 10/22 for use as a smaller, auxilliary money pit), but dollars spent does come into play. I can put the Walther P22 and the Beretta Neos in the list of .22s to avoid, and I'd advise against the S&W 22A for no reason in particular other than a Ruger Mk II or III is a much better gun for about the same money. Nothing on the Browning Buckmark or that Beretta .22 (which I've been meaning to try out, although it is somewhat pricey).

A base Ruger Mk III runs in the region of $260-$300 around here, used ones are less. Don't believe the hype about the older II being better. I've shot both and I can't tell the difference. The II, however, has better aftermarket support since the III is fairly new on the scene. An old S&W .22 revolver is also pretty good...they last forever if well taken care of.

And another reason to go .22 while you're learning...a 500-round bulk box of el cheapo Remington is $8 at Wally World. Can't do that with any other ammo. Even CCI Standard--certainly one of the best match .22s available to the non-professional shooter who doesn't have a Masserati--costs just $24 for 500 rounds, less if you shop it well. Also, it's pretty easy to get into .22 bullsete league meets, which are great places to hone your skills to perfection (or at least adequacy) and build yourself a network of knowledgeable gun friends, and perhaps try out a number of different pistols if you ask nicely. If you want a decent .22, find a .22 bullseye meet, go down, hang out, shoot the breeze, and see what everyone has and what they paid for it.


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## Alaskan Brown Bear Killer (Feb 22, 2005)

splawndrew said:


> I just recently took up interest in handguns, and figured one of the best and most convenient way to learn would be to join a forum, so all help is appreciated.
> 
> I understand that the grain of a bullet means the higher the number the more force behind it. I have heard though, that it is possible in a self defense situation that if the grain is to high, the bullet will pass through not inflicting optimum damage. *If this is true can anyone reccommend a good all around self-defense grain for my .45 ACP?*
> thank you to all!


Remington 7400 Posted: Wed May 03, 2006 11:44 am Post subject:

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Good self defense loads for .45 ACP

1. 230 grain Hornady XTP 
2. 200 grain Remington Golden Saber 
3. 220 grain Federal Hydra-Shok 
4. 200 grain Speer Lawman 
5 230 grain Barnes X-Bullet

splawndrew,
See Remington 7400 post above; IMO he's right on.
That was your question right; *Good self defense loads for .45 ACP*?


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## MTGrinder (May 29, 2006)

Remington 7400 said:


> Good self defense loads for .45 ACP
> 
> 1. 230 grain Hornady XTP
> 2. 200 grain Remington Golden Saber
> ...


Any one of these listed above with Taurus' Stellar Tracker .45 ACP Trail Gun which I own in the 4" unported titainium model that weighs only 23 oz. and am considering another purchase of a 2" snubby stainless Taurus Tracker that weighs 23.8 oz.

These are found in their compact line up


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## Spyider (Nov 11, 2005)

I believe he said he appreciated any help. But saying he should of got a .22 pistol when he already has a .45 isn't going to do any help. To me, .45 ACP ammo is cheap as hell. Can get some surplus stuff for as low at $7 a box of 50 rds. More better stuff for plinking - $9-15 per 50 rds. Self defense rds - hella lot more up to what? $20 for a box of 25?

Anyways, recoil is recoil, I wouldn't downgrade to a smaller pistol just for the recoil. 45. ACP recoil really isn't that bad..(maybe its because my USP reduces some of it). I would rather get something bigger like a 9mm or .45 ACP for my first pistol (which is what I did) and get used to the recoil faster.

Oh and, with that $200-300 spent on a 22 pistol, you could skip the pistol and buy a **** load of ammo. If I am correct, there are reduced recoil rounds out there for the .45 auto and they arn't expensive at all.


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