# 17 hmr?



## yotehunter93

is the 17 hmr a good gun for coyote fox possum raccoon?
or is the 22 wmr better? i want one thats good 4 the hides,and ammos cheap but deadly :sniper:


----------



## Gohon

The 22 mag is the better choice for the game you listed except for coyote. Neither the 22 mag or 17HMR are a good choice for coyotes. Move up to centerfire for coyotes.


----------



## chuck stemig

For fox, possum,*****, and coyotes out to 100 yards, the .17 HMR should be just fine. Beyond that, I would opt for a centerfire.

Years ago, Remington made a .17 centerfire rife that was the cat's meow for fox and coyotes out to 200 years. It left a very small hole, without damaging the hide.

You can still find these rifles and at gun shows. The last one I saw was at Alhman's Gunshop in Morriston, MN. www.ahlmanns.com


----------



## R Buker

The .17hmr is too small for coyotes, period.... You'll kill some and some will run off on you.

The .17rem, the centerfire mentioned above, is still made and it's a wonderul round for foxes and on the small end of OK for coyotes. It's a good compromise though if all the game you have listed must be hunted with the same rifle.

Your list of critters is where the kicker is. There's a lot of difference in how much killin' a 'possum takes vs what a coyote takes.

Make the right choice for the game you are after. They deserve it.


----------



## nitelite18

i AGREE with Chuck. The .17 Hmr is only adequate out to 100 yards. But for short range it is ideal. I've only taken one yote with it and he dropped on the spot. It was about 80 paces. When I first got the gun I shot a fox at about 170 yards and he dropped too. But I wouldn't try it again. YOU do owe it to the game to make a clean kill


----------



## mr.trooper

chuck stemig said:


> ...Years ago, Remington made a .17 centerfire rife that was the cat's meow for fox and coyotes out to 200 years. It left a very small hole, without damaging the hide...


Hey there Guy. 17 Rem is still alive and kicking.

http://www.remington.com/products/firearms/centerfire_rifles/model_700/model_700_LV_SF_specs.asp


----------



## R Buker

nitelite18 said:


> i AGREE with Chuck. The .17 Hmr is only adequate out to 100 yards. But for short range it is ideal. I've only taken one yote with it and he dropped on the spot.


You've shot one coyote with it but that was enough to make you agree that it's adequate for coyotes?????? :roll:


----------



## chuck stemig

Good shot placement is the most important thing, no matter what caliber you are shooting. With a .17 HMR, a well placed shot out to 100 yards should drop any coyote.

Would it be my first choice for hunting coyotes, probably not. But, if I was presented with an opportunity to shoot a coyote at 100 yards or less, and all I had was a .17 HMR, I certainly would not hesitate to do so.


----------



## MattS

chuck stemig said:


> Good shot placement is the most important thing, no matter what caliber you are shooting. With a .17 HMR, a well placed shot out to 100 yards should drop any coyote.
> 
> would a neck shot at a hundred yards be better than a chest shot at a hundred yards be better with the .17 HMR I know that a head shot would be best. Im just wondering what you would do? This ? is open to anyone. I would love to here everybodys opinion. Im not asking anyone if a HMR is a good coyote gun i know enough of that. Thanks for the info
> MattS


----------



## Gohon

> But, if I was presented with an opportunity to shoot a coyote at 100 yards or less, and all I had was a .17 HMR, I certainly would not hesitate to do so.


Why not? Just because you have a gun in your hands doesn't mean you have to shoot. A good hunter knows when to take the shot and when to pass and any shot with a 17HMR on a coyote is one that should be passed on. The 17HMR is simply not a coyote gun.


----------



## mndemohead

Im really surprised to see soo many people opposed to using the 17hmr as a coyote gun. Im curious if the people oposed to the 17hmr are just saying so because they have no experience with the gun. I am new to the sport but not to guns. my buddy and I have each shot a few coyotes using the 17 hmr. Granted our shots have all been at about 125 yrds or less but every yote we have put the cross hairs on has dropped dead in its tracks. The 17hmr is a awesome round. The areas I hunt it would be fairly rare to get a shot over that 150 yard range so we found the 17 hmr ideal. Its been a great all around gun.


----------



## Gohon

I've got two 17HMR's and have been shooting them regularly since their introduction. You may have gotten lucky and as you said taken a couple coyotes with the round, but sooner or later you are going to hit bone and the HMR will not drive through. The result is a suffering dog that should not be. Lots of people like to talk about the Coyote they have killed with the 17HMR but none tell you about the one's that ran away. Truth is, in the rimfire class the 22 magnum is a better choice. But why use either when there are guns that will do the job properly. The 17HMR is a fun and very accurate load to shoot and performs great on game it was intended for. But the coyote is not one of them. As a word of caution, I recently broke down and bought a range finder that I had been wanting. Know what I learned real fast the first time I use it? My range estimations all this time really sucked and I thought I was good at it.


----------



## mndemohead

Ive been using a range finder for 2 years, Im not estimating when I tell you the yards we shot the yotes. Im fairly sure that we didnt get "just lucky" 7 or 8 times in a row. As far as hitting a bone this also has been done, My buddies 17hmr blew apart the shoulder on the very last yote we shot a couple of weeks ago. Ive got a million people who would disagree with you the 22mag round being a better round. As far as ethics go, We are about as ethical of hunters you will find, Ive yet to leave an animal in the woods, be it a deer, squirell, racoon, or a yote. Anytime you pull the triger on an animal (no matter what gun your shooting at it) you take the chance of wounding the animal. Thats why its so important for the hunter to be confident of his firearm and shooting ability. For every yote we have dropped we have passed on 3 more because we just werent quite confident of the shot. Im not looking to start a argument, im just simply stating what works for me. I know several guys who have been leaving the bigger guns at home lately in favor of the 17.


----------



## Gohon

Let me see now...... you go from *about* 125 yards to having a range finder and now know exactly what the distance was. You go from a *few* coyotes to 7-8 in a row, and they all dropped dead in their tracks hmmmm. Since you let three go for everyone shot that means you called in at least 32 dogs and all this time you are new to the sport. You have a *million* people lined up to contest the 22 magnum over the 17HMR for coyotes. And your buddies little 17 grain bullet tore through a coyotes shoulder bone with just 125 FPE, at least that is what it would be assuming it was another 125 yard shot. Oki-doki......... I fully understand now...... :wink:


----------



## nitelite18

k


----------



## RWH

I didn't purchase an HMR because I already owned a .22 mag. If I would have, I would have left both at home as far as the yotes are concerned because they really do deserve a centerfire.


----------



## mndemohead

Not sure WHAT your problem is, but I have absolutely nothing to prove to you, If you want pictures (including the blown apart shoulder) I have them. No I dont take a range finder every single time I hit the woods but I have had it in the spot we hunt most frequently HUNT several times and I can just about tell you the yardage of every tree, rock or patch of weeds within 200 yard of where I sit. Sorry I added a about or an aproximately to a few sentences. The total is 9 yotes, as of today (we shot another one on tuesday night). and 6 of the dogs were taken from the very same stand. Yes I am new to the sport (started last june). And I hate to give you any glimmer of hope of being CORRECT but the last dog did not drop dead in its tracks, It ran about 65 yards (not exact, thats an estimate, I may be off + or - 5 yards, I apologise. I must have missed the post that made you the god given expert on coyote hunting and guns, and range finding. But by the looks of the amount of replies you make on this forum you should probably spend more time in the field and a little less in front of the computer. Oh well, there is one in every forum. Oh by the way the last dog was also killed with a 17hmr, round did I mention that?
I live in the south of the twin cites metro area about 35 miles. yotes have become a real problem in the area, I most frequently hunt a sheep farm that has had several lambs stolen. Anything else you would like to know or feel I need to prove to you? Well gotta go, Its about that time of evening again, ya know the time when I go to the field to hunt and you sit in your underwear in front of the computer.


----------



## Gohon

Sonny I don't have a problem but you do if you think everyone is going to buy your cock-in-bull story that the 17HMR is such a terrific coyote round. Now take your ground squirrel gun on out and go mangle a few more dogs and you should feel better. Did it ever occure to you why as you stated in your first post "I am really surprised to see soo many people opposed to using the 17hmr as a coyote gun" exists? At least try to keep your story straight next time. :lame:


----------



## MOGLEY

I do not know if I dare venture into this or not...................
I have a 17HMR. It was a Christmas present from wifee. I have been trying different ammo and have shot some island flying rats for determining what bullets do what damage. I also visited Varmit als homepage and found supporting finds in there. Althought here is not a lot of diiferent ammo for this caliber, I have found the CCI TNT rounds really penetrate with out much expansion in the first 4 inches. I think it would be good for bigger game as compared to the hornady v-max and the federal v-max bullets which REALLY fragment on impact. These I like for the smaller stuff Like the wild cats around here. Pop and flop they don;t know what hit them. I think these same bullets would be to lite for coyote rounds THOUGH I HAVE NOT SEEN FIRST HAND. As with other caliber guns I think the choice in ammo can make a difference as to wether a caliber is right or not


----------



## mndemohead

Well I went out for a short 30 minute session tonight and came home to find just what I thought, The coyote god was online again and reesponded virtually imediately. This is really a foolish argument and Im done with it.
I never stated the 17hmr was a awesome coyote gun, but it does a great job for the type of hunting I do, It has proven itself to me several times (9 to be exact, we all need to be precise when we speak of numbers from now on). I would agree that if your going to be taking frequent shots over the 100 yard mark you may want a bigger gun, nowever the place I hunt most frequently a shot of 150 yards would be rare due to the type of cover, so when I went to buy a gun, being the rookie I am I asked several reputable hunters and gun shops (oops I dont know the exact number, shame on me) and had several shops tell me the 17hmr would be a fine choice for what I wanted to do, and so far it has. But what do they know. As far as it being a squirel gun, obviously you have never shot a squirel with one, because its not a wise choice if you plan on saving the animal, it makes a mess. As far as my story being a "cock-in-bull story" I really could care less who believes me, L,ike I said Ive got nothing to prove Im sitting here rite now staring at picutes of 8 dead coyotes, (film to the 9th one not back yet). I know what I have killed with the 17hmr, and so does the tannery and my taxidermist. I also know that the place I hunt has alot to do with the number of yotes we see and harvest, because the lord knows its not my calling skills that bring them in. I take offense to you stating I should "mangle" a few more yotes, every coyote we have taken has been taken humainly and did not suffer. I really like how people can sit behing a keyboard and be an expert at anything and everything. Just how many yotes have you killed this year sir? It really doesnt matter, I dont care, I know what works for me and I will continue to do it, I just really dont understand why it bothers you so much. I know if I work at it really hard that maybe, just maybe some day I could be a keyboard coyote god to. Nah, probaly not. Again, im sorry that something that works for me so well ****** you off soo much. Like I said before, by the number of posts you make online I find it hard to imagine you have time to hunt and become the expert you think you are. Enought of this foolishness, Im gone, so you can get your last licks in now and save your reputation.


----------



## Gohon

Mogley, you're going to find the 17HMR is a lot of fun to shoot and hunt with if used as intended. That little 17 grain bullet is like a laser bean and will be instant lights out on game up about the size of jack rabbits and maybe even raccoons if the shot is placed right. Some people have shot coyotes and killed them but a lot more have run off to die someplace else. I've know a few people that have been pretty successful on fox out to about a 100 yards but these guys were excellent shots and a fox is not that big. Every once in awhile someone like mndemohead will come along with tall tales about all the one shot kills they have made out in never-never land distance on coyotes and expect people to swallow it. Then they have the gall to claim a 33 grain 22 mag with 172 fpe is not as effective as a 17 grain HMR with 126 fpe on a yote at 125 yards. And they know a million people that agree with that to boot.

Here is what my experience has show with the 17HMR and I probable put more lead through that gun in a week than what's his name does all year. The little 17 grain pill is a weird duck to say the least........ out to about 25-30 yards it just drills a small hole through squirrel size game unless it hits bone. From that point to about 100 yards it seems to explode with a nasty exit wound. Somewhere around a 125 or so yards it again reverts back to that little small hole without the exit wound but usually extensive internal damage. Now if you think about that, a squirrel is not very thick but there is no exit.....just internal damage. At about 150-175 yards all you get is a entry hole with very minor fragmentation or a little mushroom effect. I've seen to many PD's and ground squirrels crawl back into their holes to use this round past that range. Advantages, accurate, flat shooting, equal to or slightly less noise as the 22 mag and deadly on small varmints. Disadvantage, horrible in windy conditions, and loses it effectiveness out past the 150 yard mark. Personally I limit my shots to game 20 pounds or less and 150.......maybe a 175 yard stretch. Some guy over in rimfirecentral was claiming hits on PD's at over 350 yards. I no more believe that than these 125 yard one shot kills on coyotes. This is simply my experience with the 17's I shoot...... your mileage may vary. Enjoy the gun, it's really a lot of fun to shoot.


----------



## killadoe

I have shot squirrels and rabbits with mine and even when it dont hit bone it still tears a hellacious hole. I have also killed two hogs with mine. They were about 50lbs, but one was about 150 steps. It ran about 10ft and fell over. I am not on here to pick sides or anything but I have a 17hmr, and I have killed everything from Hogs to stray dogs squirrels rabbits crows and armidillos. I know what kinda damage it does to small game, its bad. I know that if it can kill hogs especially one out to over 100yds, there should be no reason it cant kill a coyote. Bothe hogs were shot behing the shoulder. The first about a 75yd shot the bullet went all the way through. If the man is shooting coyotes with it and is doing it consistantly, you would think it would be a good coyote gun. I dont see why he would have any reason to get on here and lie about it. Coyotes hide and flesh and bones arent that dense to where a 17hmr bullet cant penetrate and be successful. Again I am not taking side here, cause I have never killed a coyote with a 17hmr, but I have killed with it and I know what the damage is. Tis is not to say I have never killeda coyote, I have killed my share......


----------



## mndemohead

I just want to let everyone know that if anyone is in minnesota and gets the outdoors news (paper) We have sent a pic of us with the pelts of the yotes we have killed with our 17hmrs, maybe someone can cut it out when they see it and put it on here for whats his name to see. Then we will see who is telling tall tales. Let me guess, the next one will be that we are lying about what gun we used to kill them. The proof is on its way. To anyone who is inquiring about the 17hmr, dont let our bickering sway you one way or another, they are a relatively inexpensive gun to buy, and a cheap round to shoot, All I can say is give it a try, Id bet you wont be disapointed.


----------



## StLCardsFan

Check out this guys video clip, then read the discussion thread below. He's using a .17 exclusively. The may inspire me to try one of these out.

http://www.huntingfootage.com/showphoto.php?photo=1810&sort=2&cat=533&page=1

Jeff


----------



## Gohon

He's using the 17 REM, not the 17 HMR. Night and day difference.........


----------



## StLCardsFan

Gohon said:


> He's using the 17 REM, not the 17 HMR. Night and day difference.........


Sorry, I'm not very familiar with these two weapons. I just looked up the differences on the web. 17 HMR is rimfire cartridge, and 17 Remington is centerfire cartridge.

If anybody cares, here's a couple quick low downs:

Remington:
http://www.reloadbench.com/cartridges/17rem.html

HMR:
http://www.shootingtimes.com/ammunition/17_hmr_0508/

After reading the HMR article, I would agree with the others about it not having enough punch to do the job on yotes, but in comparison, the Remington does.

Thanks for setting me straight,
Jeff


----------



## RedRabitt

I just can't leave this one alone with out saying anything. And I dont give a rats *** what the opposition thinks. Me and a friend of mine each bought one of the .17 hummers just for the pupose of shooting coyotes and we new the risks that the 17 gr being to light for penetration but at the time thats all they had for that round, and Im not afraid to admit this coyote did get away it was the only coyote that we used it on. I was the caller he was the shooter I didnt get to see the hit, but from what he said he hit him behind the shoulder. I could hear the pop then the coyote crossed in front of me full speed I tried a follow up with my .223 H&R single shot, but thats all I got my buddy tried one too, but no cigar. I ordered 5 pounds of modling clay and made about a 4"x8" block to do some penetration test so we placed the block at aproximately the same distance that the coyote was standing. About 20yrds. Using the same bullet the result was not surprising. It made a dime size entry hole before making a little bigger than golf ball size pocket with no channel about 2- 1/2" deep, but apon this test I obtained some 20 grainers and they made about the same size entry but while it expanded it opened a channel about 2" mid point and then tapering to almost exiting the 8" block it made a perfect little mushroom of the bullet. I don't know what that 17 gr bullet did when it hit the coyote but from all the little fragments found in the clay I can say they just dont have what it takes to put em down. I still will use my 17 hmr on coyotes but I will opt for the 20 grain bullets. I did the same test using the 20 gr at 100 yrds and with the same result, so I trust it will work...It has enough punch to get to both lungs, but here again were talking good shot placement, it still is a small pill.


----------



## duckhunter55

mndemohead said:


> Im really surprised to see soo many people opposed to using the 17hmr as a coyote gun. Im curious if the people oposed to the 17hmr are just saying so because they have no experience with the gun. I am new to the sport but not to guns. my buddy and I have each shot a few coyotes using the 17 hmr. Granted our shots have all been at about 125 yrds or less but every yote we have put the cross hairs on has dropped dead in its tracks. The 17hmr is a awesome round. The areas I hunt it would be fairly rare to get a shot over that 150 yard range so we found the 17 hmr ideal. Its been a great all around gun.
> 
> I couldnt agree with you more i have one and have dropped plenty of coyotes with it and OH so accurate is it with a 3-9 nikkon i can place 3 within 1MOA of anything i wanto at 100 yards and it has plenty of nockdown all these people talking propbly are just going off what they have heard i have shot around 15 coyotes with mine and its never fells to drop a coyote dead and if anyone wants to challenge that i will take them on 1 yote within 130 yards droped dead!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!:strapped: And no Gohon i dont want to seriously challenge you ok :eyeroll: but im not here to start stuff thats just what i have done with mine you can believe what you want to but honesly i dont care i will continue to nailem with mine :sniper:


----------



## duckhunter55

Gohon said:


> I've got two 17HMR's and have been shooting them regularly since their introduction. You may have gotten lucky and as you said taken a couple coyotes with the round, but sooner or later you are going to hit bone and the HMR will not drive through. The result is a suffering dog that should not be.
> 
> 
> 
> Well if you are a good shot you shouldn't hit bone now should you??? if you cant aim then yes i would recomend a higher caliber maybe a 50 cal or so then when you miss maybe it will nock him down with the blast so you can shoot again???? Just joking but i do agree with you about not making good shots some people just shoot and wound which makes the dog miserable and nobody wants that. The truth is you are right nobody talks of the ones that get away but when im shooting if im not 100% sure i can make the shot i will not shoot.
Click to expand...


----------



## duckhunter55

Gohon said:


> The 22 mag is the better choice for the game you listed except for coyote. Neither the 22 mag or 17HMR are a good choice for coyotes. Move up to centerfire for coyotes.


Im sorry gohon but im going ta haveta call :bs: on that one i dont want to but its wrong man i mean i have seen it done and done it. Im tryen not ta start stuff but i mean you are wrong! Did you ever think maybe you missed with your 17??


----------



## RedRabitt

mndomohead, or anyone Im curious just what bullet are you using to shoot at these yotes with that hummer? cause I know form my test with clay and water filled cans and gallon jugs of water the 17 grainers just disintegrate apon impact....


----------



## duckhunter55

RedRabitt said:


> cause I know form my test with clay and water filled cans and gallon jugs of water the 17 grainers just disintegrate apon impact....


Um i use regular 17 grain for all my yotes but i was wondrin did you ever use tha real thing in your little fifth grade science exper... jus wondrin because the inpact on clay and water isnt anywhere near the real yote!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

jus tellin ya lataz!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


----------



## hill billy

I agree with duckhunter,


----------



## RedRabitt

hum my little 5th grade experiment? you say that like an insult. Your just going to have to settle down COWBOY im not demohead. I don't Oppose the use of the HMR for coyotes if you can read you can see that. Im only giving you my experience on the coyote that got away from being hit by a 17 grain bullet and the subsequent test that followed I realize that water does not represent a good comparison, however the clay does, cause its alot denser of a material than a coyote. By the way the two bullets behaved just like there intended design when use in the clay medium. If you do the same test using water medium and shoot it with a 20 grain bullet it will zip right through. Don't you hate it when the answer is right under your nose one bullet holds together the other explodes. I know dam well that the HMR is very accurate and you say your hitting them at 100 to 130 yards we dont need a rocket scientist here to figure the inevitable outcome. I witnessed it first hand from about 20 yards and I do know it was a lung hit cause we could see the the spray on the snow every leap for half a mile. Try your own experiment its simple. You do the math the results are the same......PERIOD!


----------



## Gohon

> Im tryen not ta start stuff but i mean you are wrong! Did you ever think maybe you missed with your 17


Yes you are, but putting that aside if you think every shot you ever take is going to be perfect then you are fooling no one but yourself. You've made two poor choices&#8230;.one being the caliber you chose and two being the 17 grain round. There are to many hunters in this forum that hunt coyotes year around for pelt money. Pay attention to them and you just might learn something, or you can continue to be the little strutting bantam rooster. Makes no difference to me because I know better.


----------



## RedRabitt

Oh! boy I pitty the prices for them summer time coyotes if their hunting them year round. There are alot of well intened shots people make year round at animals. Do they always do a humane job..... I think not. If you can't stomach a wouded animal but at the same time tell everyone how much there inards were blown out and not wince one I-O-da you need to go see a shrink or your in the wrong room go to a craft chat and talk about making some flower baskets.......


----------



## Jaybic

I have been watching this post for a while now and can no longer help but throw in another voice.

First I would say I am impressed with redrabbit. The fact that he cares enough to even try that type of "5th grade science experiment" speaks volumes about his willingness to make a quick clean kill. It is also a considerable step farther than anyone else has gone to come up with an answer to the "is the 17hrm big enough?" question so Redrabbit, my hat is off to you! :beer:

Secondly I would put this out there. Its kinda like buying a luxury car. If you have to ask what its costs, you cant afford it. Period. If you have to ask if the 17hrm is "enough gun" and you can see all the controversy about it on this site, then its not. Do the honorable thing and be sure. Get a gun big enough to be sure. It could be a .219 zipper or a .458 win mag but be sure. I have read the ballistics in several major gun mags and I forget the precise numbers but If I am close the 17hmr hits at 150 yards with about 100-125 foot lbs of energy. Thats pathetic if its correct but I am no expert. Just reading tests done by people who make a living doing them. I am also nearly willing to bet that assuming you could hit him, a bow and arrow is more deadly at that range based on the size of the broadhead alone and even your muzzleloader is a better choice. If you were going to hunt cape buffalo would you hope you had enough gun or would you be darn sure. It might cost you your life to be wrong.

I do not wish to offend anyone and I am sure we are all trying to take well aimed shots but until we all have ice running thru our veins when a coyote comes in and we call from a benchrest and the coyote promises to stand dead still and broadside while we line up our shots, poor shots will continue to happen and having a little extra gun could make all the difference. I am also sure many of you that are using the 17hrm on coyotes are getting the job done right but even here in SE MN I get the occasional 200-300 yard coyote and I will bet my bottom dollar we all get excited and try that long shot, hoping we can "luck" one in there and he will tip over dead. Most of the time we will be wrong. I also can tell you first hand about the misery of being shot and wounded and I have the prosthetic leg to prove it. Its no fun and I wouldnt wish it on any creature alive.

There are many knowledgeable people on this forum and I have learned a great deal here. There are also a few that might think it was a "Well place shot" from a 17hrm that knocked over the world trade center. I would just say to all who choose to poke and hope with a questionable gun, if you have all the ethics and sportsmanship that you say you do, you will eliminate the question and use the right gun.

Jaybic


----------



## Gohon

RedRabitt said:


> Oh! boy I pitty the prices for them summer time coyotes if their hunting them year round. There are alot of well intened shots people make year round at animals. Do they always do a humane job..... I think not. If you can't stomach a wouded animal but at the same time tell everyone how much there inards were blown out and not wince one I-O-da you need to go see a shrink or your in the wrong room go to a craft chat and talk about making some flower baskets.......


RedRabbit, I'm not sure if all of your post is directed at me or not. The comment of hunting year around was to imply that there are very experienced hunters here that know their stuff. Someone of them don't just hunt in their back yard during a certain season but all over the country, all year whether it is prime pelt season or not.

As for the blown out innards and the sarcastic comment that followed, who is that aimed at. I don't recall anyone making that kind of comment but maybe I missed it.


----------



## killadoe

Thats the best way to shoot coyotes, that way you dont have to haul them off. Shootem in the guts and let them haul themselves off. In a few days you will see the buzzrds flying and you know you got him.....


----------



## Fallguy

Killadoe

If you were serious about that last comment you should have left this site like you said you were going to...for good.


----------



## ReKooH

Ok you guys will be figting over this for.. the rest of your lives this is like Is Xbox or Ps2 better. Its all a matter of opinion Some people say NO the 17 is not good enuf and others say YES i have dropped every coyote i have ever shot at with it... its all opinion


----------



## RedRabitt

I primarily use a .223 for the majority of my coyote hunting simply because the .17 hmr isn't enough gun for "smart coyotes" that are doing everything to keep there distance. That coyote must present himself close preferably new coyotes to the game that give that chance to me, then I opt for the 17 hmr, but when the coyotes get smart It leaves no choice to go to my .223 My partner shoots a 6mm Rem. and we both knew it was over kill, so we thought we could nudge it into a fur friendy rifle using FMJs The 17 hmr on the other hand has the 20 grain bullet now, but still 100 yrd max will be the limit I push it. I sure wish they would make an X bullet or some kind of bullet that is controled expansion. Perhaps we can nudge it even more into a close range coyote rifle...... Thanks for your input there Jaybic. A hat nod to you too...


----------



## killadoe

yeah you are right,


----------



## RedRabitt

There are pros and cons to using the 17 hmr and I apoligize if I clouded this topic with any senseless argument, even though good information can come from debate. I hate to see arguments on these forums, or to get too involved in them that we steer the subject so far off that nobody wants to add there possible good points to the use of a 17 hmr on coyotes.. I supose the question should be re-phrased, so that we don't start a fire and just throw more fuel on it....its like a big pissing contest.


----------



## Bore.224

It all comes down to this. A coyote stands broadside at 75 yards you have yer 17 HMR and put your crosshairs right behind his front shoulder, you have a steady rest for your rifle and their is no wind. You squeeze the trigger the high pitch crack eccos throught the air as you see fur fly right ware you where aiming BULLSEYE and then the coyote runs away never to be found. You then wrap your rifle around a tree in disgust and curse yourself. DONT BE THIS GUY!!! :******:


----------



## RedRabitt

It all comes down to this we pick up our coyote and go to the next stand and repeat the same procedure at anytime 365 days a year. Cause this small but elite fraternity knows what the hell were doing. And there is nothing you can do about it. Don't lose any sleep pal....


----------



## yooperyotebuster

And he tried to make me feel bad!


----------



## harvy

I HAVE SHOT MANY FOX AND COYOTES WITH MY 17. LIKE ANY OTHER GUN BULLETT PLACEMENT IS VERY IMPORTANT.


----------



## R Buker

The coyote (any animal) deserves better than to be shot with a caliber that may cause undue crippling.

Given a perfect shot under perfect conditions, a .22lr will kill a coyote too. Seldom does a coyote offer a "perfect" shot.

Anyone who shoots enough coyotes will realize they take quite a bit of killing. The hummer doesn't offer it. Anyone who argues the contrary typically doesn't have enough experience to say what is or is not true. I'm not pointing any fingers here, just talking in general terms.

Randy


----------



## RedRabitt

hummm a coyote that doesn't offer a perfect shot.... were not talking about all the coyotes who are obscured by some vegetation or are at some ridiculous distance or position as not to offer a decent shot, but only the ones that present themselves at 100 or less yards. The majority of the ones I called in did'nt have their head (target) up their a$$ either, and I feel more than confident with my shooting and hunting experience to be successful every time......


----------



## R Buker

RedRabitt said:


> I feel more than confident with my shooting and hunting experience to be successful every time......


Wow, you must be really good. I don't know anyone else who is successful every time. Good job!

Randy


----------



## RedRabitt

One thing you should understand is that ive witnessed coyotes harassing deer during the spring time till they give in and let the fawn go, to allow the other fawns to be born. This all seems "NATURAL" but since the absence of the wolf the coyote is KING PREDATOR, so what is natural anyway. I have found birthing areas where many fawns have been killed by predation and this particular area is very low in deer populations, so to take this in to consideration I have become KING PREDATOR around here. I have atleast 5 weapons of predator on predator methods that I use one bieing the 17 hmr. I dont feel too sorry for the few coyotes that run off when wounded although I can count on two fingers it has happened one was with my .223 Now its not that I don't belive they have there place in the wild, but I belive its my resonsibility to do my part too. Since my coyote hunting in the areas I hunt, Ive noticed more upland birds, rabbits and deer... do I feel sorry for the coyotes? not one bit......In fact if they could thank me they would....


----------



## RedRabitt

Okaaayy!! ill try not to let my EGO get in the way. I can admit I miss sometimes.


----------



## Bore.224

RedRabitt said:


> It all comes down to this we pick up our coyote and go to the next stand and repeat the same procedure at anytime 365 days a year. Cause this small but elite fraternity knows what the hell were doing. And there is nothing you can do about it. Don't lose any sleep pal....


GEEZE!! calm down, I would use at least a .22 hornet or maybe even a 22 mag. But hey sounds like you have shot more coyote than me.


----------



## nutt

so would a daisy bb gun be sufficient for a yote? of a pellet gun at 100 yds?


----------



## killadoe

Yeah I think the BB would offer better penetration than the pellet, because the pellet is lead and it would mushroom upon impact. There are alot of formulas and theories that back it up but I dont want to bore you all with the statistics. But the only down fall the BB has is its steel, and it dont mushroom, not the most lethal load but hardly any fur damage. The little daisy red ryder BB gun isnt enough, I know I am going to catch hell for saying that guys but its true. You need to step up to one you can atleast pump 6 times, and if you are lucky it will maintain the required 8000fps to take down one of these tough creatures. I prefer BB's over pellets.

Whoever said a 17hmr wont kill a coyote, apparently is talking from hearsay and not experience. I have yet to read a thread about sombody having one get away after being shot with the 17hmr. Everybody on here talks like they know from experience. They are full of it. I know first hand they will kill one over 100 yards with a behind the shoulder shot. No more stating your opinions on hearsay, if you have experienced a bad shot with a 17hmr learn to shoot. The next person to downs the 17hmr needs to have a reason other than what you have read or somebody told you.


----------



## mossy512

Yes the .17 Rem is still alive and kicking, Remington is stilloffering the 700 BDL in this cal. , and the ammo in 20 & 25 grain. I know you can get the ammo through Midway USA. The rifle is listed on Remington's web site.
:sniper: :sniper:


----------



## RedRabitt

Wrong thread Mossy were talking hmr here........ Killadoe Ok you agree. If you read the first page I talked about my partner losing a yote to a 17 gr bullet shot at around 20 yrds, and I mention I did some simple but valid test to prove to me that the .17 hmr is big enough provided the proper bullet ie 20gr and shot placement at reasonable distance is used. Thats my take on that, but since that "one" bad experience ill take into consideration and limit my use of that cartridge....


----------



## mossy512

Redrabbit 
I was refering to mrtrooper's conversation on page 1 about the .17 Rem still being alive. As for the HMR I personally don't feel well enough about it to trust it very far on coyote. Maybe a fox. I know I came in late for mrtroopers comment I should have refered back to it in my first reply.
:-? Sorry :-?


----------



## RedRabitt

no problem Id like to get one of those 17 rems myself.... as far as hmr goes on coyotes there really isn't much to a coyote their skin is still thin and not if any fat to speak of. Their body we won't count the hide here is not very big so close range shots would do plenty of damage to the boiler room 20 gr bullets of course....


----------



## killadoe

How fast does a rem .17 bullet travel?


----------



## price403

The 17 Rem. travels at over 4000 FPS...  :sniper:


----------



## RedRabitt

there is some data that suggest you can get that .17 rem to go 4400 fps.


----------

