# is there a dr. in the house



## swampbuck (Sep 19, 2007)

*I have...*​
decided to vote for paul, he's our only choice to save this country what is there to think about633.33%never heard of ron paul15.56%heard of him he's crazy844.44%not made up my mind yet15.56%would love to vote for him but worry that my vote will be wasted211.11%


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## swampbuck (Sep 19, 2007)

has anyone heard of dr. ron paul? he's running for president. he's a congressmen from texas an obgyn dr delivered 4000 babies, has never voted for an unbalanced budget, and wants to repeal the 16th ammendment and get rid of the income tax. he also wants to abolish the federal reserve and restore the constitution in this nation. just wondering if anyone is catching on to this guy. he's taking on the world bankers and big government and has grassroots movements all across this country. on nov. 5th 37000 donors gave over 4.4 million dollars to his cmpaign thats less than 120$ per person, and a single day campaign fundraising record. he's mobilizing people, what do you think?


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## Plainsman (Jul 30, 2003)

You should have given us more choices. I don't think he is crazy, but that was my vote. I have heard of him, but isn't it a bit early to think he is the savior? I'm not against him, I just prefer logic to emotion and everyone appears to be running on emotion. I'm not one of those idiots in focus groups that can't make up their mind the night before election. You would have to be a total moron or lacking any conviction to not know who you were going to vote for by then. However, when we still have time lets let these people lay all their cards on the table so to speak.

My concerns are:
Who will provide the best security for America?
Who will support the second amendment?
Who will secure our borders?
Who will put America before their party?
Who will stop strangling opportunities with taxation?
Who will stop putting every fringe group ahead of mainstream Americans?
Who will steer America off the path of socialism that it is on?

I have many other important prerequisites that I would like a president to have, these are just a few of them. I am realistic enough to know I will not get them all in any one person. Maybe Huckabee comes the closest, maybe Ron Paul does. Sorry I'm not up to speed yet.


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## swampbuck (Sep 19, 2007)

My concerns are:
Who will provide the best security for America?
Who will support the second amendment?
Who will secure our borders?
Who will put America before their party?
Who will stop strangling opportunities with taxation?
Who will stop putting every fringe group ahead of mainstream Americans?
Who will steer America off the path of socialism that it is on?

[/quote]
for me its not too early i've been following dr. paul since july. i started by trying to study each candidate in the debates and checking out their websites even the dems. and the more I heard dr. paul speak the more I realized this is the real deal you have an excellent list of concerns i would suggest checking out the ron paul page and watch him on you tube there are a ton of clips. his constitutionalist platform is bullet proof its demonstrated every time someone tries to attack him


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## FlashBoomSplash (Aug 26, 2005)

I think he is crazy. No offence swamp buck. But I have been researching him a lot lately and as a conservative I would never vote for him.

On the other hand I am having a hard time with the other candidates also. I just cant find a guy I agree with 100%. Huckabee is pretty good and I used to like thompson but his lack of aggression is making me turn towards huckabee.


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## adokken (Jan 28, 2003)

Huckabee would be the first president to go to the Creation Museum in Kentucky. Would you want that?


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## adokken (Jan 28, 2003)

Incidently Ron Paul so far is the only candidate that has come forth with some sensible solutions to the problems that this bunch of Neocons got us into.


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## Plainsman (Jul 30, 2003)

adokken said:


> Incidently Ron Paul so far is the only candidate that has come forth with some sensible solutions to the problems that this bunch of Neocons got us into.


Sorry Swampbuck when a liberal endorses Ron Paul it scares the daylights out of me. a liberal speaking well of a republican candidate is the kiss of death for me. It will be a real hard sell getting me close to the line again.

A year or so ago we had a fellow on here that was a good barometer for a good or bad candidate, or a good or bad bill. I knew that if I had fallen behind in keeping up with information that I need only look at this political form and see what he thought. It was with nearly 100% confidence I could be against a bill if he liked it, and against a candidate if he liked them, or for them if he absolutely hated them. Nope, not you adokken, but you can guess.

I miss that guy because he served a good purpose. He showcased the total lack of objectivity that afflicts some liberals. Passion/emotion will get you into trouble, I prefer thoughtful logic every time. When he looked for information he looked for only the information that would support his hypothesis. I can remember only one debate where he finally seen the light. He was angry that society was so concerned about the Jewish genocide of WWII when his people the Armenians has suffered so much more. We were able to show him data that proved the comparison was not even close. Not even 10%. He could rarely be swayed with facts.

We need another like that to fill his place this coming election.


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## adokken (Jan 28, 2003)

I said Ron Paul had some sensible solutions, that does not constitute a blanket endorsment No one can be perfect .
So all I have to do is say that I do not Like Hillery and you would support her because a 82 year old Liberal said so.


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## Plainsman (Jul 30, 2003)

OK, you got me.


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## adokken (Jan 28, 2003)

I will never put a political party ahead of my country, I was the biggest critic of Lyndon Johnson Vietnam debacle, and apparently history proved I was right. My most fervent desire is to see our country regain its stature and respect in the world.


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## Plainsman (Jul 30, 2003)

adokken there is no doubt in my mind that we want the same thing, but we often see getting there down different paths. I may strongly disagree with you at times, but rest assured I know your motives are honorable. I may in this next year become frusterated with you, but I will never disrepect you.


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## R y a n (Apr 4, 2005)

I added a couple choice that I think many people would choose as an alternative option...

I really love Ron Paul. Based on what I've seen to this point, he is the best choice of all the candidates, irregardless of political affiliation.

I think I echo the thoughts of a LOT of younger Americans who have a genuine frustration and distaste for how the president is elected thru the electoral college, and how both Repugs and DemoNazi's refuse to allow a 3rd party candidate to be an official choice/option at every step of the way of the political process.

The sad thing is... apathy is so high because of this, that many youth just give up voting at all....

America sucks right now. In soooooo many ways. I truly feel that I have no real option to elect a 3rd party candidate who doesn't need to cave in to Political Correctness, nor is that candidate bought and paid for by special interest groups.

If it wouldn't be for my friends and strong family ties in North Dakota, I wouldn't be a citizen of this country, and instead would be living overseas somewhere.

I think many of my peers feel exactly the same way.

Ryan


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## fishless (Aug 2, 2005)

R y a n said:


> If it wouldn't be for my friends and strong family ties in North Dakota, I wouldn't be a citizen of this country, and instead would be living overseas somewhere.


Ryan did you ever think that this type of attitude maybe part of the USA problem. Me I am not ready to throw in the towel yet. If you feel so strongly about living overseas go right ahead, maybe with out your personal freedoms you enjoy here in the USA you will open your eyes. You are either part of the problem or part of the solution.


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## Plainsman (Jul 30, 2003)

Ryan, I was listening to a show yesterday that was talking about a poll that indicated 80% of democrats are fed up with party politics, and 75% of republicans are. Your anger is shared by a vast majority of Americans including me, and I would guess many on this site.

When I started posting on this site a few years ago I considered myself republican, not today. In 1979 I voted nearly straight democrat. Within four years that had reversed. I didn't change, the democratic party changed, and now the republicans have also changed.

Both parties are rapidly moving left, especially fiscally. That was my reason for posting the stages of democracy. When people learn they can vote themselves wealth was the key phrase. This relates to the millions of illegal aliens crossing our border. If they came because they loved freedom and opportunity they wouldn't fly the Mexican flag over schools in the south. Their attitude in the streets indicates they are simply here for what they can get. The political parties are running scared and both are trying to out do the other in what they can do for the illegals. When the number of people taking from the pot far outnumber the taxpayers putting into the pot this nation will be bankrupt. We are so close right now, that if millions of illegals vote it's over with.

Some people may think this is all a joke, but before they laugh they better look at history. This isn't just radical thinking it is supported by history and the man who addressed it has a PhD and is a professor of political history. If we don't apply brains instead of emotion to this problem a place to hunt will be a minor problem.


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## fishless (Aug 2, 2005)

Securing Americas borders is one of my greatest concerns. What part of ILLEGAL dont these politicians get. Someone needs to take control and send the ILLEGALS back. Everyday they are here they are stealing from not only us the taxpayer-citizen. But the greatest loser in this is are kids. Any one who backs ILLEGALS is a thief!!!!!


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## gentleman4561 (Jul 16, 2007)

Over Hillary or Obama yes i would vote for him but as of right now hes crazy he want to pull our troops out that are fighting for i right to bear arms! crazy vote for huckabee


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## swampbuck (Sep 19, 2007)

Qoute 
Sorry Swampbuck when a liberal endorses Ron Paul it scares the daylights out of me. a liberal speaking well of a republican candidate is the kiss of death for me. It will be a real hard sell getting me close to the line again.

Plainsman, don't take this the wrong way but this is not a republican democrat issue put your loyalties to parties aside and listen to what ron paul is saying. wouldn't it be great if the parties would work together and serve the people that is part of what voting for ron paul is all about don't compromise your values and vote for the lessar of the evils that only enables the broken two party system if you think dr. paul represents you then vote for him don't let a few people from abroad the spectrum voting for him be your reason to not vote for him


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## wiskodie1 (Sep 11, 2006)

Wow plansman
I read your post and can only think to myself? Why is he saying the things he is saying and not willing to vote for Ron Paul? I'm not trying to rub you the wrong way or anything, but you, with every post on this page sounded to represent him. Had you simply not referenced him in your post, I would have been sure you supported him. I truly hope you look into him more. He is saying a lot of the same things you are. At least that's how I read it.

Spend a few hours on youtube. Sometimes seeing him in action is better then reading his words. My favorite types of vids are of him getting interviewed by the big media boys, they all try to rip him apart and he always seems to walk away smelling like a rose. I just love it.

I am guessing that your stance on military presence being the most viable way to protect our foreign interests will be your biggest hurdle when supporting Ron Paul. And I share some of your misgivings on that score, but when I compare my misgivings for Ron's plans against our current ones and the formation of the NAU then I find I am far more willing to error on his side then on their's.

Note: I do not consider preemptive war and occupation as Military presence.
My definition of Military Presence is: an agreement between two nations, allowing for peaceful presence of armed troops for the Mutual benefit of both nations

-over and out


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## R y a n (Apr 4, 2005)

fishless said:


> R y a n said:
> 
> 
> > If it wouldn't be for my friends and strong family ties in North Dakota, I wouldn't be a citizen of this country, and instead would be living overseas somewhere.
> ...


I have several thoughts on this...

I don't have an "attitude" on this first of all... It is my opinion (and the opinion of many of my peers) that has derived from what we have witnessed happen to politics since the Bush/Clinton era.

My "attitude" is a result of my feeling of powerlessness to change a system that has become corrupted, broken, and fixed by those in power.

Do you have any idea about overseas freedoms or liberties? Honestly? Have you ever lived overseas? Any close friends who live/work overseas? If so where? I have a list of 5 countries off the top of my head who have tremendous benefits over the USA.

I think you drink the Kool Aid a little too much, and don't have any idea about what truly exists outside of the North American continent....

I have been offered jobs in 3 other countries that have superior conditions to ours. (Austrailia, Netherlands and Germany if you are really curious) Each of them have positives and negatives. Then again so does living in America.

I'll be your Huckleberry... tell me. What specifically is better about America than those countries? I'm waiting...

Nice cliche by the way...

Ryan


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## R y a n (Apr 4, 2005)

swampbuck said:


> Plainsman, don't take this the wrong way but this is not a republican democrat issue put your loyalties to parties aside and listen to what ron paul is saying.
> 
> wouldn't it be great if the parties would work together and serve the people.
> 
> ...


Spot on Swampbuck!

Might I suggest you start using punctuation in your posts so that we can follow along better?


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## Plainsman (Jul 30, 2003)

Swampbuck, you have some good points, and your absolutely correct pulling out of Iraq is one of the hurdles I have in accepting Ron Paul.

You are also right that it is not a democrat/republican issue. I started writing this before I looked at my other posts, and I know I was thinking about writing this but I can't remember: When I started writing on this site a few years ago I considered myself republican. Not anymore. Back in, I think it was 1979 I voted nearly straight democrat. Four years later I had reversed. I have moved from neither party, they have moved away from my standards.

I do think in conservative/liberal yet. Now don't get me wrong, I have tremendous respect for adokken, but when he thought Ron Paul was good it scared the heck out of me. Adokken is a great guy, but lets face it we don't see eye to eye on politics. I would guess we want the same thing, we just see different roads leading to the same destination.

OK, you make some good points, Adokken is a very good person and I agree with him on just about everything but politics so I will give some more time to thinking about Ron Paul. Huckabee is still at the top of my list today, but this is early, and there is a long time left to figure out who really is the best person.


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## cwoparson (Aug 23, 2007)

Between military service and working for "American Systems Engineering Corporation" I've spent time in Germany, Australia, Japan, Taiwan, Ireland, Great Britain, France, Italy, South Korea, Thailand, Cambodia, Hong Kong, Malaysia, India, Philippines, Oman and a few others I don't remember off the top of my head. I never had a bad experience in any of them and enjoyed my stay in all of them but none of them cam compare to the freedom we have in this country.

Try going down to a gun shop in Australia and purchasing any gun you want. You can't. Try going out and hunting anywhere you want with the gun of your choice in Australia. You can't. Same thing in Japan. No hand guns allowed for anyone. Rifles and shot guns if permitted are subject to police inspection at all times.

If a person likes a tax rate as high as 45% plus 5.5% solidarity tax then they may like to work in Germany. But since corporations are charged a 39% tax guess where the recoup that tax. In total you may very well see as much as 60%-65% of your earnings go out in taxes. But they have one hell of a free welfare system. Japans tax system is even worse. Never been to the Netherlands but their taxes are as high as 52% before all the other taxes are piled on such as profits, social security, and pensions. Not to mention that value gains in owner-occupied homes are treated as personal income for tax purposes.

I would recommend anyone thinking about living in another country other than just as a retirement to really look close at what they are getting into. You have to ask yourself why people are not trying to get into those countries as they are here.


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## R y a n (Apr 4, 2005)

I need to take a moment to apologize to those I might have offended on this thread.

My remarks on living in America vs another country were my own thoughts about the merits of different rights, liberties and limitations of different countries of the world. It was done as attempt to show the level of my enormous frustration at the corruption that has taken hold in America.

In no way was this supposed to offend those who love and support our country. As I've mentioned in earlier posts here on Nodak, I have tremendous respect for those who serve (or have served) in the armed forces. This post was in no way meant to disrespect their sacrifices and hard efforts at keeping this country free. It's taken me about an hour to write this post. I'm at a loss for words thinking I might have damaged friendships here.

To those I've offended, I'm truly sorry.

Ryan


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## adokken (Jan 28, 2003)

Ryan you have a perfect right to think about things like that, after nearly 16 years of the crap going on in DC and if I were in my twenties instead of my eightys I would hightail it to New Zealand.


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## Plainsman (Jul 30, 2003)

New Zealand????????????????? I have heard there are so many deer that they are a problem and there is no limit. I also heard that you can sell them at the docks for $200 and they are shipped to Germany and Japan. When do you suppose we should leave?


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## fishless (Aug 2, 2005)

I have couple of coworkers that are from New Zealand. They have told me about the hunting there, it sounds fun. But they all choose to stay here for there kids. A quote from one of my coworkers " if I went back to New Zealand my kids would be highly educated poor people" Take it how you want but this is the greatest country on earth!


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## wiskodie1 (Sep 11, 2006)

Ryan
I wouldn't get to hard on yourself about your post. I FEEL the same way you do about the corruption in this country, and since I happen to be a vet. I will say that I didn't find your post at all slanderous or disrespectful to our military members, their's is to do and to die, not to question why. Our jobs as citizens are to question why and to do our best possible job to see that they are not stuck in a position that they are required to die. I pick my presidents based off of a wide range of issues that I hold to be important, one of those issues I hold most dear when deciding my vote is who will be the best commander and chief when things go bad.

I am voting this year on Ron Paul! And wish to hell he would have been the president 8 years ago when all this mess started.

Now!!! When are we all headed to New Zealand, I got a buddy/coworker that has a huge olive farm there and started the local co-op that makes olive oil. He knows all the local land owners  WOHOOO!!
Can you say "in like flint" 
:sniper:


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## adokken (Jan 28, 2003)

WiskodieI, Do they have age discrimination in New Zeeland? Anyway would like to visit there even for a couple of weeks.


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## wiskodie1 (Sep 11, 2006)

Sorry Adokken
Don't really know much about New Zealand, other then the stories I have heard form my old supervisor. And most of those were dealing with olive oils and his new press  all very riveting really. I did get to see a lot of pictures of his farm and all of his olive groves, it's a beautiful place. He did talk about deer a few times, but he doesn't hunt and I never really thought to ask him any questions on the topic. I can send him an email and see if they have any age discrepancies for hunting, right?

Sincerely
Matt


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## sdbaydogs (Jun 11, 2004)

Ron Paul has never voted to raise taxes.

Ron Paul has never voted for anything that wasn't 100% backed by the US Constitution.

He is 100% pro 2nd Amendment.

He is 100% for a smaller Federal Govt. Remember "A Government that is big enough to give you everything is big enough to take everything away"

He has my vote


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## Whistler31 (Feb 1, 2007)

First I want you to know I do not believe in black helicopters or other such conspiracies. That being said....I can't help but wonder where he is getting his money. (George Soros????????????) In an effort to split the conservative vote ala that twirp Ross Perot which gave us eight wonderful years of the Arkansas Mafia.


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## swampbuck (Sep 19, 2007)

Whistler31 said:


> First I want you to know I do not believe in black helicopters or other such conspiracies. That being said....I can't help but wonder where he is getting his money. (George Soros????????????) In an effort to split the conservative vote ala that twirp Ross Perot which gave us eight wonderful years of the Arkansas Mafia.


on nov. 5th 37000 donors gave over 4.4 million dollars to his cmpaign thats less than 120$ per person, and a single day campaign fundraising record. he's mobilizing people,

is it so hard to think there is a polotician out there that people are moved enough by to go join a group and do some volunteer work to get their candidate some exposure that is what is happening with this campaign


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## wiskodie1 (Sep 11, 2006)

you got it right swampbuck, anyone that doesn't believe it can go to Ron Paul's web page and watch the contributions come in. he is the only candidate that is showing where his money is coming from in real time, all the rest wait until the end of the quarter to publish there contributions. Which gives people like Hillary plenty of time to cook the books, but don't worry about here she wont get in any sort of trouble, the Clintons just pin it on there finance guy and keep right on going 

www.ronpaul2008.com

you think he made a bunch of money?
wait untill decemebr 16th and see what you think.

here comes the money bomb!


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## adokken (Jan 28, 2003)

Wiskodie, just kidding about the age thing, I meant would they hire me at my age. I hope to be done working for the rest of my life, but would like to visit New Zeeland some day.I don't dare say anything positive about Ron Paul, But he seems to be doing real well.


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## wiskodie1 (Sep 11, 2006)

Hi Adokken
LOL sorry I missed the joke I guess, as for my job. Well my friend it's a bit out of the norm, I work offshore and live in Fargo, so that's were I meet all these strange guys that grow olives and stuff  and whatever you do please don't go back to work!! It would rune me, not only would you more then likely outwork all the young bucks, but I would also lose any hope I have for one day getting to retire  as for your opinion on these matters, I would only hope you share your thought with all of us. My dad always say's "don't let the gray hair fool ya" meaning those old boys know a thing or two about a thing or two  the stories I have heard about New Zealand are great, I hope you find the time to go, I would love to hear about the trip. I hear it's a land of beautiful women and big racks, deer racks that is  but I have no idea if you could work there 

happy hunting
Matt

and of course
GO RON PAUL!!!


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## Csquared (Sep 5, 2006)

Plainsman.....sorry to be behind on this, but I'm curious about the guy you mentioned back on 12/5 who was your yardstick for "good" vs "bad". Was his nickname, by chance, also a model of a shotgun....an over-and-under shotgun? Has to be either him or the guy named after a feathered farm animal! I've "enjoyed" conversations with both!

Just a hunch...


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## Plainsman (Jul 30, 2003)

PM sent.


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## R y a n (Apr 4, 2005)

wiskodie1 said:


> Ryan
> I wouldn't get to hard on yourself about your post. I FEEL the same way you do about the corruption in this country, and since I happen to be a vet. I will say that I didn't find your post at all slanderous or disrespectful to our military members, their's is to do and to die, not to question why. Our jobs as citizens are to question why and to do our best possible job to see that they are not stuck in a position that they are required to die.


Thank you Matt and Mr. Dokken

I really appreciate the thoughts.

Ryan


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