# why even buy a License ???



## Fetch (Mar 1, 2002)

this is a quote from another Forum about NR Restrictions in ND



> I ran into 2 hunters who in the past did not buy tags as a non residents . Why. The fine was cheaper. the judge was lienient.


I wonder how many do this ??? What are the consequences ???

Kinda like us & the old " it's easier to ask forgiveness, than it is to ask permission" :roll:

Thats not right - But I can see more & more of this kinda stuff happening

I once heard of people still using Lead - They said if they get caught the fine is cheap - they have saved lots of $$$ by using it :huh:

:eyeroll:


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## Goldy's Pal (Jan 6, 2004)

Ever wonder how many residents do it?? :bs:


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## 4CurlRedleg (Aug 31, 2003)

It doesn't matter if residents have or not on this post, the discussion was brought up concerning nr's.

The point is if nr's come here to take advantage of OUR resources they damn well better anti up!! They are already on thin ice with most residents so it would be in there best interest to police this kind of crap up. SCOURGE of the outdoors is not a good label.

Besides the resident law breakers also get there due. :-?


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## Goldy's Pal (Jan 6, 2004)

Don't you ever get tired of digging up garbage against N.Rs? What good do you think you're doing the sport by throwing this crap back and forth. Do you think it's helping your cause for better ethics or what?? So a couple of N.Rs get busted, what's the purpose of this topic besides making things worse than they already are :eyeroll: ???


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## 4CurlRedleg (Aug 31, 2003)

Keeps the fire lit!! 05 legislation session is rapidly approaching! 8) :strapped:


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## Goldy's Pal (Jan 6, 2004)

Guys like 4leg are exactly why many land owners in North Dakota are posting there land to NON RESIDENT HUNTING ONLY, they are getting fed up with this. So by all means keep the fire lit, your only hurting your own available resource. Thank you.


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## 4CurlRedleg (Aug 31, 2003)

Nice try. HEH HEH HEH!!! dd:


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## Fetch (Mar 1, 2002)

I have always been for more Enforcement (Lots more enforcement)

we don't even have a fraction of what is needed

The topic was about a NR's but could be about anyone - so lighten up

Does anyone know the consequences for any of these kind of things ??? (in ND) :roll:


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## Bobm (Aug 26, 2003)

The idea tha NRs are not buying licenses is silly at best. Most Nrs that come are just as law abiding as anyone else and just as intolerant of lawbreakers. You have to be a serious sportsman to spend the time and money we do to travel to distant places to hunt why risk the hassle for a $100.00. Thats 10% of what I spend for a week of hunting in any western state. Risk losing your hunting priviledges, vehicles, guns ect. I just don't think there are many people that stupid.


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## Fetch (Mar 1, 2002)

Bob got the tapes yesterday - thanks - have not had time yet to look at them - will try this weekend k:


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## Fetch (Mar 1, 2002)

Bob do you know any Minnesotans ??? :roll: :lol: :wink:


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## BigDaddy (Mar 4, 2002)

I think that most fines in ND are relatively low. I read a few months ago about how some non-residents laugh at the low traffic-related fines in North Dakota like speeding. A $25 or $50 fine for a resident making $20K is significant, but a person making living wages (i.e. a non-resident), this is chump change. The legislature has been reluctant to raise traffic fines, however, because they know the impact a $100 fine would have on a person living on ND wages.

I would hope that most sportsmen (resident or non-resident) do the honorable thing, buy a license, and follow the law. However, like with most things, there are going to be those that look for ways to cut corners.

I agree with tough laws, especially for hunting and fishing. If you break the law, the fine should really hurt and you should lose your hunting and fishing privileges, maybe permanently. As a MN native, I remember going to public auctions from time to time with boats, guns, and other things taken from poachers by the DNR. Does the NDGF ever confiscate things? If they do, why don't I hear about it?

There are many on this board who claim that we are selling our heritage and resources for too low of a price, and I tend to agree with them.


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## DuckBuster (Mar 18, 2003)

I do know of a few people that have done this... I no longer hunt with them because of it. What I don't understand is , How is it any different if a NR breaks the law by not buying a license or if a Resident does the same thing? The law abiding sportsman in ND (Res. and NR) are still being victimized by The people who don't follow the rules. The other thing that drives me nuts is the stereotype that MN res. have. I have never done anything to deserve this reputation (Set up too close to others, taken more than a legal limit, or tresspassed. We do what we can to find the land owners when we can and we are make sure to thank every one who let's us hunt.) I'd be willing to be that most NR are true sportsmen.

I agree with most ND residents that NR need to be controlled and that Minnesota's recent propasal to limit NR fishing is not right (It's not being done to better the resource, but to retaliate) I have no problem with the restrictions ND puts on NR. In fact, I think there should be a smaller cap than there was 2 years ago. Maybe set it at 20,000. As I have said all along, If I can't plan far enough ahead of time to get my license, then I deserve NOT to hunt that year.

Sorry I ran this so long... Fetch- I guess your last post got me a little upset. I know of a few ND residents that are complete jerks- BUT 99.9% of the NoDakers I run into out there and in my own state are extremly nice and polite. I don't saddle the entire state's population with a negative stereotype because of the actions of a few people.


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## Bobm (Aug 26, 2003)

I've seen a few minnesotan women I'd like to know, very easy on the eyes :lol: even my old eyes, but all kidding aside I have some customers in Mn and I think they are exceptionaly good people. Above average intellignence and decent to work with. I think this is generally true of all midwesterners.


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## zaconb (Feb 5, 2004)

Gentelman, I cannot speek for all NR's but I must say that a lot of the posts I have read on this site are enough to keep us away. Maybe that's what you want, and so be it, but first lets look into what an NR contributes to the ND economy on an average hunting trip (or at least mine).
For me to hunt waterfowl and upland I am looking at $203.00 for licenses, 7 days motel aprox. $350.00, 7 days of meals 210.00 (and thats not fancy dinning), there will hopefully be a few stops at local watering holes to celebrate the trip and buy a round or two 50-100.00 and aprox 100.00 in fuel, maybe another 100.00 in incidentals. For a total of 1100.00 now this is not exact but you get my drift, and this is a low estimate.
Okay so whats my point, maybe a lot of you have had some bad luck with NR's and I can understand your negitive attitude toward them. On the other hand, my friends and I, and most of the NR's I have met, have nothing but respect for both the land we hunt and the local people, after all it is a privilage to hunt as an NR not a right. When respectful NR's roll into your town we are spending a truck load of cash that is welcomed by your small businesses, not to mention the money that goes into the wildlife pot.
So give it some thought before you group us all together!
Now to those of you who have been nothing but kind to us, many thanks.
Cheers Rick


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## GooseBuster3 (Mar 1, 2002)

zaconb said:


> Gentelman, I cannot speek for all NR's but I must say that a lot of the posts I have read on this site are enough to keep us away. Maybe that's what you want, and so be it, but first lets look into what an NR contributes to the ND economy on an average hunting trip (or at least mine).
> ................................................................Here we go again. :roll: :roll: How many times a week do people bring this up? uke: uke:


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## zaconb (Feb 5, 2004)

It gets frustrating, being a NR and all, won't happen agian!
Cheers :beer:


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## GooseBuster3 (Mar 1, 2002)

No No Im not ****** it just gets sicking hearing it 6 times a week. Just my .02 :lol:


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## stevepike (Sep 14, 2002)

The money aspect gets old REAL quick. As a resident, I spend close to that for licenses. $100 in gas? I will be lucky if that lasts 2 weeks during hunting season (scouting and hunting eats it up quick). You got me on the motels. Food? Throughout the year I am stopping in small towns to and from fishing spots, scouting, hunting, visiting family, etc.

There are many residents like me that contribute to these small towns economies throughout the year, not just a week in the fall. The biggest problem with NR is the attitude SOME (not all) have that rural ND is there because of them and their big "contributions" during the fall. If there is a cap/quota/zone, get your license early and plan for it. I don't write/call the G&F and tell them how screwed up it is that I did not get a buck tag in my unit because I spent XXX amount of money in that unit. Or move here so you can vote on issues and contribute to the economy all year.

Come if you can, follow the rules and have fun. :beer:


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## zaconb (Feb 5, 2004)

stevepike, 
just trying to say as an NR I try to pay my way when I'm hunting/fishing away from home. If I should be doing more, educate me.

Move to ND, great hunting, great fishing, good people...
whats the job situation like, 
Cheers
Rick


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## stevepike (Sep 14, 2002)

> whats the job situation like


GREAT. I sell software nationwide, get to travel occasionally to "wonderful" areas like FL, NV, CA, etc. just to reinforce how great it is to live here. I have lived in many places while in the military so I do appreciate what we have and want to keep it special.


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## 870 XPRS (Mar 12, 2003)

hey, maybe we should start a thread on NR vs. Res. and the issues at hand, lol, sorry just had to say it


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## Fetch (Mar 1, 2002)

Sorry DB I included a :wink: & a :roll: - You are 1000 % correct & that is not what (seriously) I meant :roll:

But as restrictions get to be more & with the reaction of Minnesota Residents to the fishing proposal - how long before many just say to heck with it I'm going to go & do what I want if I get caught whats the big deal ???

I have had my License checked 1 time in 30 yrs - Never for fishing :huh:

And as things turn for the worse for Residents (& it sure appears to be headed that way) :******: - Heck I would & maybe will become a outlaw to be able to hunt ??? :******: Why be honset & try to stop all that is happening - & say we just get slapped in the face, down the road (hoven gets re-elected ) :roll: & ND passes a no trespass law ??? :******:

would you consider going the route of a outlaw ??? Tough to answer - I think I'd most likely quit hunting 1st (or after I get caught) :lol: :wink:

Heck if it's not much worse than a parking ticket ??? - (which goes up real fast if you don't pay it right away) - how many have had parking tickets ??? Does that seem as criminal as some of these outdoor offenses ???

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I'm being the Devils advocate :evil:


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## 870 XPRS (Mar 12, 2003)

wow fetch, you've only been checked once in 30 years. I got checked twice last year. Opening day of goose season and the first day i bought my sportsmen licencse and went out fishing. I've been checked at least 8 times that i can think of and i'm only 21. Maybe that has to do with the game warden living in my city i guess. I guess i can't say checked, just stopped, only been checked 4 times or so. After a few times he gets to know the habits and realizes that I am a law abiding hunter. Once in 30 years is not good though. I would really like to see more game wardens out there. There is definately enough crap that goes on and definately not enough wardens. The areas that they cover is way to large. We need to probably double the amount of wardens in my mind.


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## Goldy's Pal (Jan 6, 2004)

"Peace of mind in the blind" is all I've got to say. Who in there right mind needs to worry about legal $hit while hunting, and out of state hastles??? are you kidding, yeah right, just forfeit priveledges for who knows how long?? no way, nothing is worth it, nothing, whether I'm a RES or NON.


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## Fetch (Mar 1, 2002)

I have not even got to game violations yet - this is where I know many NR's cheat the system - Daily limits & possession limits - shooting & leaving many ducks - just so they can shoot more & many will shoot anything - maybe some Residents are the same ??? But I know NR's (& way to many) are this way - otherwise many would be going home after a couple days instead of two weeks


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## mallard (Mar 27, 2002)

zacnb,I wouldnt go to ND,I would go straight west of where you live and go to Saskatchewan!That seems to be the destination of choice for many North Dakotans to get away from all of the crap that happens here in October.


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## Goldy's Pal (Jan 6, 2004)

I'll agree that if you're not over poss. limit in your 2 weeks you are so sick of duck, or your shooting needs practice. But there are those like myself who scout as much as hunt to begin with, and strive to pick out your drakes. Don't be so negative fetch, there are a few bad apples on every tree wherever you go.


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## Fetch (Mar 1, 2002)

Goldy your in the Hot Topic forum - can't take the heat - You know the rest :roll:


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## Goldy's Pal (Jan 6, 2004)

:huh: :wink:


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## Fetch (Mar 1, 2002)

OK now lets compromise & do that to both ???

Although I don't think I'm as anti NR's, as you are so paranoid, as to think :lol:

& no way will it lower your license fees - they need to continue to go up - to help pay for as much public land, as we can get, as fast as we can get it - (ESPECIALLY with WATER !!!) 
Then find a way to better manage how many of you can be in an area - at a time & things would be better for all


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## Bobm (Aug 26, 2003)

I shot 3,000,000 ducks and 250,000 pheasants opening week smuggled them back to Georgia in a line of tractor trailers to fulfill my contracts with Kroger and several other grocery store lines. ( If you believe the rest of this thread than you ought to be dumb enough to believe this also)


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## callmecrazy (Feb 20, 2004)

do you acknowledge that some ND residents may break laws while in other states as well? should it be held against all people from ND?
back in the late 90's there was a case involving a man had a cabin in NW MN. he had been reported for numerous violations over a number of years. the local wardens had been trying to catch him for years. it wasnt until ND G&F finally searches this guys home in ND when he was found to be more than 600 walleyes over his limit. apparently he was taking them to his winter home in AZ and having fish fry for the otehr retired folks. 
how about your own CURT WELLS. he wrote an article for the MN Outdoor News, in his "view from the dakotas" column during the hot walleye bite on mille lacs in 2000. in this article he talked about the bad health of the fish, and stated in his opinion the fishery was ready to collapse, because the fish were underweight for their length. how did he figure this? because he caught a 25" walleye that weughed 3 1/2 pounds on his digital scale. they jiggled it around on the scale from 5 minutes thinking they werent getting an accurate reading, but it didnt change. the problem here is that MN law states all fish between 17"-28" must be immediately returned to the water. what part of jiggling a fish around on a scale for 5 minutes constitutes "immediately returned to the water"? apparently if one of your outdoor writers is breaking this law, ALL OF YOU MUST BE RIGHT?? should i then believe that all ND fisherman are doing the same thing, because of what one man did? i mean after all this post started with a comment about 2 hunters (out of 30,000!)


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## Fetch (Mar 1, 2002)

Who said that this is JUST NR's - Get over it - I meant everyone :roll:

I bet alot of ND'ers will fish Minn law change or not too

Bunch of OVERSENSITIVE cry babies :lol:

Like it or Not--- too many NR's spoils the paradise - there you happy now


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## callmecrazy (Feb 20, 2004)

Fetch,
why dont you reread the first 3 posts, and tell me it isnt about nonresidents!!
furthermore, if this is truly how the majority of ND's feel, whynot lead by example, and stay in ND? dont hunt or fish anywhere but ND. dont buy land anywhere but ND. dont take employment outside ND. then you will have a right to complain about nonreisdents in your state. 
we have a masssive influx of people from western WI who come into the twin cities for employment. they dont pay tax in MN, just take "our" jobs. should MN pass a law restricting nonresident employment in MN? i think all would agree thats ridiculous!
maybe it would be best if we were 50 individual countries instead of the united states.
nonresidents are a bunch of whining cry babies? do you read the posts from your ND brethren? come on!!
heres a novel idea. since the goal seems to be to protect hunting and make it much like it was in say the 1950's, why not go one step further and return it to the ways it was in the 1850's. unless your a native american from a tribe originally from ND you cant hunt and fish. i mean we have to share fishing rights in MN based on an 1837 treaty, why not step up in ND and do the same? if its really about protecting what ND had before the arrival of "outsiders"!!


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## Goldy's Pal (Jan 6, 2004)

:lol: O.K we can compromise a little on my proposal. :wink:


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## Fetch (Mar 1, 2002)

If it meant not screwing up ND & hunting - I'd rather see the Natives in charge :roll: But they can't manage their own reservations so that aint going to happen But if they owned everything - I'm sure it would be like your casino's all white people working for them - would they be worse than the leadership we have now ???

Ummm I started the thread - I should know what I meant :lol: You go re-read them :idiot:

Don't worry about me, ever going to Minn, to hunt or Fish 

In fact the only thing I ever go to Minn for is a Lottery ticket & that is about to end too :thumb:


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## KEN W (Feb 22, 2002)

callmecrazy...not taking sides here but your analogy is a poor one...It is against interstate commerce laws to bar non-res. from jobs.If it wasn't, ND would have outlawed non-res. from being G/O.So I guess those Wisc. people are still going to take "your" jobs.


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## zaconb (Feb 5, 2004)

Mallard, you are right the Saskatchewan trip would be great, but my trip to ND this fall will serve three masters. One, I have a good friend that moved to Jamestown 2 years ago, and have been getting some heat about not visiting. Two his father who was has fought in almost every military conflect in past the 70 years, has never been to his son's new house, can't drive and won't fly. It does seem however he doesn't mind ridding shotgun with me, two GSP's, and a very young DD. Three, hunting!
It will be an interestig 22 hours on the road.  
Maybe Saskatchewan next year!


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## prairie hunter (Mar 13, 2002)




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## Fetch (Mar 1, 2002)

WAKE UP PH !!! How ya been ???


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## RWHONKER (Dec 22, 2003)

I am a game warden in Northern Minnesota and I can tell you that North Dakota isn't the only state that people don't buy licenses. I catch about 50 people a year. It is always going to happen unless they make the penalties more strict. It is to bad that people want to take advantage of the resources that the midwestern states provide. 
As far as how nice the people are in North Dakota, I have been hunting out in your state for 10 years and I have never had a bad experience yet.


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## Fetch (Mar 1, 2002)

Hey!!! RWHONKER

Do you know what the fines are for some of these things ???

Why are they so low ???

How do you get them raised ??? (Legislature???) :roll:


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## RWHONKER (Dec 22, 2003)

I can tell you what every fine is in Minnesota right now but I would have to look into North Dakota. From what I got out of it North Dakota is much more leanient. I agree they are low for some things but other things they are pretty high. I really don't know how to get them raised. I don't want anything to do with politics, there is already enough of that around my job. I will ask my boss today, he will know.


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## win4win (Sep 8, 2003)

Was it last months North Dakota Outdoors Magazine where they listed the total infractions for 2003-04 season? I cant seem to find my copy but I remember seeing that "no license" violations seemed awfully low which leads me to think enforcement is lacking. I dont recall if any categories were broken down by resident and non resident, but the list at least gives you an idea of the most prevalent infractions.

A fine should be a deterrent and the $ amount of each fine should reflect this. When fines are low and enforcement is sporadic then getting hung with a violation will be considered just a casual "cost of doing business" in my opinion.


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