# Thurs the 16th. Did I break the Law??



## Leo Porcello (Jul 10, 2003)

Well had a field all scouted out. Made one more drive around it and sure enough there was one posted sign. Was not sure if it was for that particular field so I decided I would hunt the field next to it just to be safe. We were running behind due to the frosty roads. The geese decided to start flying about 15 minutes early. I went and parked the truck by the other field in hopes it would act as a block and that it did. The first flock circled that other field and then headed our way. Looked like they were going to keep going and then the locked hard to us. We kind of got caught so we were still outside of the blinds. They were about 25 yards and they made us so I called the shot. The guy I was with got one and I missed. Next here comes a pair right in. Cupped very hard. Had some other flocks behind us and the pair was about 15 yards out flying over the landing zone. Looked like they may try to join the flying birds so I called the shot. Two empty guns and two geese lived another day. Then a flock of 15 or so. I drop one hard and hit another. It flies about 200 yards and drops. It looked like it was still full of life so I decided I should go with Bella just in case it tried to fly off. By time we got there the bird died on its own and it was a bloody mess. On the way back I see my partner flagging (he can't call.....well neither can I). So I run for the tree row. He has two land and 9 cupped in. He jumps up and drops two out of the 9. 5 down and 1 to go. Next was a flock of 7 I think. Its going to be my bird. The birds are in and I empty the gun. I know I hit a goose but they all fly off like they were all fine. They they start getting eratic. One peels off and glides about 2 miles or so away. It glided into a valley. Most would have left it but I just can't bring myself to not try. Its just the way I am. So I tell the guy I was with to start picking up the decoys cause we are done whether or not I find the bird. I know it had to of died so it counts to me. Here is where the breaking the law stuff comes in:

I get the truck and drive over to the area. I am on gravel roads with street signs. I stop every 40 yards or so and glass. The area is posted tight. I am on the final leg of the square and see what may be the land owners pulling in their farmyard. I drive past cause I was not finished driving the whole way and was not going to bother them if the goose was not on their property. I get to the end and decided to drive it again. Go by the farmyard and they are gone. I spot something that looked like a goose but was not sure. I go and get my partner. He looks and says it could be the goose. So I go and park just off the main road. Me, him, and Bella with NO GUNS crawl under the fence and head towards the object. Ends up not being the goose. Start walking back and here comes a truck. They guy says "you know your hunting on private land?" I said I was not hunting as we had no guns and I explain the situation. He says he is calling the warden and says I should expext a call from the warden. I said its the law that I must retrieve downed game to the fullest extent and the way I understood it was if I did not have a gun I could access the land. He agrees and says he is still turning me in????? I said well I am sorry, I did not intend anything wrong, just don't want to waste a bird. He said he is calling. I said I understand. I give him my name. I offer to give my phone number and he don't want it?????? He was really being jerky like he was trying to push me. I stayed calm and polite. I know he took my plate #. Oh and he says I could have came and asked. He said he saw me driving all the section lines. I did not know section lines had bonified street signs and were maintained????????? I told him how I saw them there at the farmyard the first time I drove by but not the second. He agreed that they left but says he is still calling. So I gave him my name again and said have a nice day and waved as he drove off.

So my question is did I break the law? I was retrieving a bird and I was gunless??? If he does call me in what can I expect? The more I think about it and how the guy was treating me I kind of wished I would have popped him. Any suggestions????


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## PSDC (Jul 17, 2003)

I believe you are ok, since you didn't have a gun.
The only difference if the landowner in the past told
you to never come on his land, no matter what 
circumstances, then you would be breaking the law.


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## Remmi_&amp;_I (Dec 2, 2003)

You are fine. I am almost positive he won't call the warden anyways. Most of the landowners that have naturally "jerky" dispositions just like to see you squirm a bit. If your story is true and accurate, you have done nothing wrong..........and actually should be commended for trying to recover the downed bird! :beer:


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## FLOYD (Oct 3, 2003)

From G&F:

It is illegal to hunt on posted land without permission. Upon conviction for a violation of this law, the court shall suspend the defendant's hunting, fishing, and trapping privileges for a period of at least one year. Only the owner or tenant may post land. Signs must give the name of the person posting the land and be placed not over 880 yards (one-half mile) apart around the land. Where the land is entirely enclosed by a fence, posting of signs at all gates is sufficient. It is illegal to deface or destroy posting signs.

Any person may enter upon legally posted land (without a weapon) to recover game shot or killed on land where he/she had a lawful right to hunt.

It is illegal to hunt in unharvested crops without the owner's consent. Crops also include alfalfa, clover, and other grasses grown for seed.

It is illegal to hunt upon the premises of another within 440 yards of any occupied building without the consent of the person occupying the building. This does not prohibit hunting on land owned by neighbors (private or public) even if the land is less than 440 yards from the occupied building.

Failure to close gates upon entry or exit is illegal.

I've only lived in ND for a few years, so I have a question. I notice it says "any hunter may enter legally posted land.............". So if the farmer had told you previously to stay off, that overrides the law as its written? Not that I'd try it, just wondering.


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## Leo Porcello (Jul 10, 2003)

Its true and accurate. Also I had a truck behind me most the way home. I pulled in for gas and he followed. He was looking at my geese and asked where I was hunting. I told him the story and he said he knew who I was talking too and said he has had problems with the guy as well. He said the guys brother is a bigger jerk. There was two guys in the truck. One never said a word.


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## Leo Porcello (Jul 10, 2003)

I have never met the landowner or been by his land before so no he never told me to stay off his land. Maybe its my Alaska plates or my military sticker on my truck? Honestly if I had to do it again I would do it the same. If I was in the wrong and get a ticket or something then to me that is better then wasting an animal.


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## 4CurlRedleg (Aug 31, 2003)

Game and fish rules that you can retrieve the bird, state trespass law says you are in violation. If it is posted and your caught on it they can press charges, gun or no gun.

Hopefully he is bluffing!! A guy must always secure permission to enter if its posted.

Things are changing in this state too fast. Good ol'boy thinking is all but dead!!

Good luck to ya chopper!


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## cbass (Sep 9, 2003)

You deffidently broke the law no doubt about that. Need to have permission regardless. If he doesn't give permission need to call a warden and have him come out to talk to the land owner and get you permission to go in. Had it happen to me deer hunting a few years back, finally got permission and the warden wasn't needed. Good Luck.
By the way every road on a square mile is a section line.


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## Ron Gilmore (Jan 7, 2003)

Relax and breathe deep. We have conflicting rules in our state to some degree. However if no damage was done to the property and you left when asked, most Prosecutes will not want to have charges filed.


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## Leo Porcello (Jul 10, 2003)

> Good Luck.
> By the way every road on a square mile is a section line.


Thanks I appreciate it. I guess when he was giving me crap about the section lines I felt like he was talking about the unmaintained ones with prairie grass growning on them. I am still learning all this quarter of land, section line stuff. Thanks for making it a bit clearer.


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## wmcpartland (Dec 13, 2004)

talk about a landowner that needs to lighten up. Maybe this guy needs to find himself a girl. In fact, I'm sure that's what he needs because he sounds as if he needs to be beat down a few notches and lord knows a woman can do that.


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## Acemallard (Sep 30, 2003)

I would not worry to much about it. I would have and have done the same thing many times even came walking out with a bird in had while the farm came driving up he never said a word when he seen I had no gun in hand. THis guy needs to get a life from what I can tell.

HARDCORE WATERFOWLER


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## wmcpartland (Dec 13, 2004)

like I said...a beat down. Whether by woman or man. Some people, no matter how polite and nice you are, will always have a problem with somebody.


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## johnsona (Dec 4, 2003)

I'm pretty sure that you were alright. You can retrieve game from posted land if you do not take a weapon with you. Also, good job trying as hard as you did. Landowners can definitely be jerky sometimes. Last fall I was out grouse/partridge hunting, and came across a good looking piece of land, TRIPLE checked to make sure there were no signs, parked to the side of the gate, and proceeded to hunt it. Well about a half hour later here comes the landowner barreling through the field, and he pulls up and tells me that I do not have permission to hunt this. I apologized and said that I didn't see the signs, and he said it didn't matter if it was posted, that I still needed permission. I even offered him the bird I got. He insisted on getting my plate number and calling me in to the sheriff for trespassing. What would he turn me in for, legally hunting unposted land? So I got out as quickly as possible, and sure as hell, on my way out I see him pull up to a gate and throw up a posted sign.  Needless to say the sheriff never showed up at the house. I know it sounds cocky, but it really erks me when people do stuff like that. :eyeroll: If you don't want people to hunt it, you gotta post it before season opens. Don't run in there late and chew people out, 'cuz it's not their fault.


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## wmcpartland (Dec 13, 2004)

North Dakato sure has some funny rules. I hunt in Maryland. I would love it if I could just roll up to a field if it was not posted and set out a spread or deer hunt or whatever. Over here it goes without saying. If you don't have permission to work a field, you just can't set out a spread and have at it. But then again, Maryland is much more populated (i believe) than ND and that might have something to do about it. At least that landowner was made aware that his peice wasn't posted and now its clear....boy, if I could work fields that weren't posted I can tell you this...they would be posted shortly! :rock:


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## mallardhunter (May 15, 2004)

Here in South Dakota you can go out into a field without any guns and retrieve a bird. So I don't think you broke the law. Why would they want people to waste game if it flies into another field.


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## fishunt (Jan 24, 2004)

I would ask permission first and if they not home I will wait until they arrived and ask them permission before u enter their proptery post without caused any more trouble.... in New York where I grew up and I shot my 11 pointer nice big buck and buck got hit and ran jump over the fence where the posted are and I went over the landower and not home and I waited and they arrived and I asked them and they say sure and thank u for waited for and ask permission.... I went and bring my buck home and cam back and gave the cake to thank u for the kinds


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## Leo Porcello (Jul 10, 2003)

Unfortunetly I did not have time to wait in their driveway and at that moment I was fresh out of cake. Maybe I will have the wife bake one in the morning and I will run it to them in the afternoon. They both were plump so maybe I will put SFCRUDE's theory of "a fat kid on cake" to the test. :lol:

I am tossing the idea around of just calling the Warden myself. In hind sight I should have just called the RAP # right then to get it over with and to ensure those guys don't make stuff up. Luckily I have a witness. Ahhhhhh the joy of trying to do the right thing!


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## fishunt (Jan 24, 2004)

that is good play safe than headaches


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## win4win (Sep 8, 2003)

Gary Rankin told me as long as I didnt carry a weapon/gun etc onto the property I could legally enter posted land to retrieve downed game. He said if the land owner prevented me from entering then I was to call G&F and have a Game Warden come out and escort me onto the property to retrieve the game.

Good nuff for me!


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## Remmi_&amp;_I (Dec 2, 2003)

fishunt said:


> I would ask permission first and if they not home I will wait until they arrived and ask them permission before u enter their proptery


Actually, I think that would be bad. If you have downed/wounded game, you should try to retrieve/recover it as soon as possible. Yes, inform the landowner first, but I wouldn't sit around waiting for them to return.


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## farmerj (Jun 19, 2004)

If they followed YOU all the way into town and were looking for other stuff.. Sounds lke you need to turn him in for stalking. That will knock down an up-tight landowner that needs to have life explained a little bit to him.

GNF EXPECT you to make every effort to retrieve shot game. Even IF it ends up on posted land. That is the whole Idea behind leaving you gun. It is called avoiding wanton waste if you can retrieve it.

Yeah, it's his land, yeah, it was posted, He also should be thankful you were up-front, honest and trying to do many of the right things.

Too many times I have run into farmers who, just because they are farmers, have a nose higher in the air than some people from town.

It's their land, I respect that. But if you want to complain about crop loss from wildlife, get with the program. The two farmers I have talked with aout hunting their land made me feel like a second class citizen just because I was asking. There are some that would like to hunt private land, but don't feel like dealing with the hassle and confrontational attitude farmers have.

I have worked for farmers, and I have relatives who farm, and everyone of them can be confrontational for the slightest thing.


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## Leo Porcello (Jul 10, 2003)

They did not follow me. It was a guy that just happened to be on the HWY most of my trip home. After everything we even went to the local restaurant and had some lunch. There was 2 sheriffs there and I was waiting for them to come over but they never did. The thing that makes me think they are bluffng is he kept saying "you can expect a call from the warden". I offerred my # but they refused to take it. Seems like that would have been easier than making law enforcement run my plates?


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## farmerj (Jun 19, 2004)

Porkchop, (and anyone else for that matter)

As crazy as this seems. Next time you see a couple of officers, deputies, HP sitting around jawing. Ask them if you could join them. Just Bs with them some time. The weather, sports, hunting, fishing, whatever.

These guys are stewards of the community and one of their jobs is public relations. So it is right up there alley.

What will this do.
For starters, it will lay in your mind, these guys are just another person on the street. So they carry a badge and a gun. You would be amazed how many CCW permit holders are out there.

Do this a couple of times and you start to have a repore with them. You can start to feel comfortable with them and not get all nervous and fidgety when face to face with "The LAW".

You will find out, the LEO in your community love to have you talk with them. It helps you understand their job, as well as they to understand the concerns of the community.

If this guy intimidated you the way he did, they would have set you straight you did nothing wrong. Even if he had reported you, they would have remembered you, and chances are, would have said, "Hi, we worked it out already."

Contrary to popular belief, LEO are not the jack-booted thugs some make them out to be. Often times, if a person is not knowing of a particular law or unsure of the interpretation, they will help you through the situation and not just run you in.

If you have a cell phone, next time that happens, call the regional dispatch yourself. It is about the best way I know of to cut the wind out of a blow hard like that. At the point he was, he was beginning to interfer (IMO) with the legal hunting activity of a hunter. And that IS against Regulation.


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## Leo Porcello (Jul 10, 2003)

> If this guy intimidated you the way he did


Let there be no bones about it. There was no intimidation. The guy was just being a rooster sucking @sshole. I wonder if I had slanted eyes if he would have given me the same treatment? Think about it.

As far as the LEO go. I work with them everyday for my job and your right. Just get to know them. They are a good bunch. When I retire from the USAF I am thinking about that or maybe being a warden.


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## strand (Sep 29, 2004)

Porkchop, I have had something similar happen and it was just a bluff by a landowner who has a hardA$$ reputation in my area. The only technicality that might get you is if the land is posted NO TRESPASSING, if it's posted no hunting, that doesn't mean no retrieving. A warden for the USFWS in a round about way told me that if it is posted just no hunting, retrieving wounded game WITHOUT a weapon was ok, but if it is posted no trespassing it's a little different story because this is where the ND laws start intertwining.

if you haven't heard by now you're fine.


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