# what do you think?



## honkerslayr (Dec 14, 2006)

This article appeared in the university paper in Grand Forks here. I think it's completely insane and totally contains false accusations :******: .take a look:

"It's getting to be that time of year again; the leaves are gone, the wind is getting stronger, and the air is getting colder. Fires (or electric base-board heaters) are roaring, and my roommate is starting to drink hot chocolate on a regular basis. Christmas music has even started playing in department stores, though it's a whole other column to go into how it's too soon for that. And, people are heading outdoors to shoot animals.

Hunting is something I can't and won't understand. How can any self-respecting person venture out to the beautiful world of nature to destroy it? How does a civilized human being get their jollies from murder? It's beyond me, really it is. But let's say, for the sake of argument, that killing is something that you do enjoy. I'd like to lay down some "courtesy ground rules," if you will, that will keep this sad season at its most tolerable for those of us who prefer wildlife to be alive.

1. Don't boast loudly during class about the deer (bird, buffalo, kitten, baby, whatever) that you killed at some place that had this many points and weighed that many pounds. And definitely don't boast about how its head is now dripping blood in your garage, or mounted on your living room wall. I don't think that recent, senseless carnage is really a good topic for the classroom.

2. Don't wear your hunting gear to class. Are you going back out to the killing fields so soon that you can't even bother to stop at your house and change after your school day? On a Tuesday afternoon, I highly doubt it. That bright orange color is extremely offensive to the eyes, and wearing shirts that have grass and deer printed all over them is ironic only in a sadistic sense. For those of you who wore that kind of thing all the time to high school, so you keep doing it now, I say: you're in college now. You're supposed to be on your way to being a more educated, ethical person. And Grand Forks is bigger than your hometown of 100-3,000 people, and there are actually people here who'd prefer you keep your brutal habits to yourself.

3. If you have just come from an all-night spree of gunfire and beer, change your clothes before you show yourself in public. Having animal blood all over your pants is neither a fashion statement nor particularly healthy.

4. For those of you who do it for only for food, not sport, and to keep deer "off your car hood," fine; at least your intentions are honest. I don't like the beef industry, either; I'd much rather all animals have a free life before they become dinner. And I get that there are a lot of deer out there causing car accidents. But that's what happens when we destroy all their natural predators, stupid. That said, though, please pick the weakest of the herd, and make it a quick end. You think the deer of future generations are going to be able to get out of the way of your speeding vehicle any faster if you kill off their best genetic lines? You're really shooting yourself in the foot with that one, or rather, shooting your children and grandchildren in the foot. Also, all of the above rules still apply to you.

In conclusion, try to keep your dirty habit to yourself. I don't want to hear about it, and I don't want to see it. You have not gained my respect for "conquering" the wilderness with your down jackets, thermal underwear and heat packs; nor will you ever gain my respect for taking the lives of animals that have no defense from you."

When i read this all these things are views probably from a PETA or non-hunter. I plan to write in on the opinion and hopefully get an article published to show some respect for the hunters out there i was just wondering what many of you have to think about this article which is in my opinion crazy and non-true. So whats the opinion of many of you fellow outdoorsman/women out there?It's free speech, but its definetely a slap in the face to us considering if you take a look at the university here in north dakota what do you expect lots and lots of students and people hunt around here what do you expect if you are going to go to school here i mean think about it.all classes were almost abandoned last friday that kind of says something and all those statements made were totally not true.

What do some of you think?


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## wyogoose (Feb 11, 2006)

I think you should write an article of your own for them on the rules for being a dumba$$! That article was so stupid it makes you want to laugh.

Rule 1- If you are to big of a dumba$$ to research your topic and find out the real facts on hunting and conservation than you will be kicked in the cooter and sent to the back of the class.

Honestly though I really think that you should write an article back defending us and clearing up some facts. Maybe you should send in some pics of a coyote with mange to show them what overpopulation does. Ohh thats right we destroyed all of the natural predators!! Give me a break.


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## mallardrocker (Nov 29, 2006)

"In conclusion, try to keep your dirty habit to yourself. I don't want to hear about it, and I don't want to see it. You have not gained my respect for "conquering" the wilderness with your down jackets, thermal underwear and heat packs; nor will you ever gain my respect for taking the lives of animals that have no defense from you."

YEEE HAWWWW BOYS IM ALL ABOUT THE THERMAL UNDERWEAR AND HEAT PACKS.... AND IF HE DOENST LIKE IT, STICK HIM IN A SNOW BANK WITH NO NICKERS AND NO HEAT PACKSS...

STAY STRONG FELLOW MEN/WOMEN WHO HUNT :beer:


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## docquack (Sep 20, 2006)

While I think a rebuttle is fine, you have to be very careful as to not sound like the type of person (she ?), I'll assume this is a female, wants us to look like.

I am a non-resident of ND but have always felt very comfortable wearing camoflage in your state, unlike where I come from (Indiana).

But I think (she) has a point as far as wearing it in a classroom in College.

We as hunters must try a project the best possible image of what we are at all times. We are a dying breed ourselves and must do everything we can to look as Stewards of the land and should help make others aware that we are also here to protect all Wildlife.

Some Hunters give to much ammunition to the non-hunter groups to use by not thinking about the consequences of their actions such as hanging a freshly killed deer in your back yard, blood on your clothing when you go to a store or a resteraunt. Some are just waiting for the day our Sport has an end put to it, so we all need to do our best to see that we defeat their actions.
Good luck,
Docquack


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## dfisher (Oct 12, 2007)

This person sounds a lot like my wife. Well, they sound worse than she does, only because I tune her out when I here this genre of thought and vocalization start to hum in my ears.

Sometimes, though, I do fire back. I simply ask her how much she has put towards the cause with the purchase of licenses and sporting equipment. I ask her what wildlife conservation, research, and habitat groups that she regularly donates too. I point out that if she is so concerned with our wildlife and its future, she may do well to focus her ample intelligence on the funding and findings of research into such matters as global warming, wildlife statistics, and habitat preservation; wetland and upland retainment.

She never says much after I fire my verbal salvos at her, though I suspect she feels very much like the hypocrite she is. She always seems to take the dogs out, filling the bird feeders or watering and surveying the small evergreens that were recently planted as a shelter belt for winter song and game birds.

You may point these same things out, in a gentle and articulate way, to your hunter bashing columnist. Of course, you really can't expect much of an answer to any sensible points. This person, and others of this type, usually know, understand, or feel little for the wildlife that they so triumphantly and ineffectively attempt to defend.

As for the ridicule of the "good 'ole boy" hunter's image, I agree that a more subdued wardrobe and posture may be more acceptable. But I doubt that dressing for overall appeal in an attempt to nudge this person or others, of this mind set, in the right direction will stop this type of tirade. Too many "good old boy" hunter types have died in battle to guarantee the freedom of speech that these people love to exercise.

Brandish your own right to refute this attack. Do it gently and without malice, while stoking it with facts from Game and Fish, DU, Delta, Pheasants Forever, and other conservation goaled, wildlife minded, yet hunter friendly venues. Point out the facts of hunting and harvesting wildlife, and how it's needed to maintain the delicate balance of nature. Only in this way can others view both sides of this age old issue, and make an informed decision about who is contributing to the good of the natural world and who is the vocal fraud, vying for attention.

Good luck in your pursuits,
Dan


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## honkerslayr (Dec 14, 2006)

ya thanks for the support i had planned on writing back an opinion defending us like you guys said and state some "true" facts. it will be nowhere near this article as in i will go about it in a kind fashion and talk about all the untrue statements and tell how hunting is actually a benifit for the wildlife and us.


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## goosebusters2 (Jan 13, 2006)

I might just start wering camo to class everyday, with my calls around my neck.


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## Bucky Goldstein (Jun 23, 2007)

Regardless of the content, the article is atrociously written.

You would think a piece written solely to garner attention and cause controversy would at least have been run by her English professor for a little restructuring and proofreading.

Rereading everything, I realize how great of an article this is for us hunters. Anyone on the fence regarding hunting would see this as a meager, anecdotal, and unintelligent attack on hunters.

You alum should be concerned about the condition of the UND literary department.


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## T Shot (Oct 4, 2002)

Love how he/she seems to describe Grand Forks as some sort of cultural Mecca... Anyway, I would have to agree that this wouldn't be the place for the good ole' boy type response. Make sure to have a response that is factual and intelligent, not full of pot shots and presumptions that this article is filled with. As Denny Green would say, "take the high road".


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## Rick Acker (Sep 26, 2002)

Nobody reads the Dakota Stupid anyway. Take the high road as mentioned above!


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## TANATA (Oct 31, 2003)

Trust me with these people, dont waste your time. It will do nothing but get you ****** off and make them happy. It's like argueing with your dog.

I just got out of English class, 3 kids with camo on and all of them started talking about shooting pheasants, ducks, geese, and deer this weekend. Gotta love NDSU.


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## dfisher (Oct 12, 2007)

Do you suppose it may have been an English instructor who wrote that?
Good luck in whatever you decide,
Dan


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## dfisher (Oct 12, 2007)

Okay guys, here is the story.

I like to write and was recently invited to join a writing group. The deal is; you go to the meeting and free write for about 30 minutes, then you read what you've written and the others critique and comment on your piece.
Anyway, since I'm an avid hunter, I wrote a short piece about the recent demise of a pair of snow geese. This was meant to be an action piece to denote how fast the chain of events can unfold, from the time a person sets up to shoot until the final, third shell is fired.

So I read my piece and quickly found out that neither of my two colleagues was overly thrilled with hunting. There I sat, my old brown Carhartt coat on and a piece told of how two young blue geese had been ripped from the sky by loads of magnum BB's.

So this guy is critiquing my writing and tells me that he thinks that it's too much "in the moment" and doesn't touch on the full circle of killing and then eating the game, which I had done in a earlier piece that I'd written and read to this group. Then this fella goes on to tell me that he really liked the fact that I had missed my third shot and at least it showed that some of the geese got away.

Okay, okay, okay, I thought. Then he went on to ask me if this was a recent hunt and I told him it was. He said he wondered, as the paper had a picture of a huge flock of snow geese that flew in and lit in a nearby field. I told him there were millions of them and he asked me where they wintered. I told him, mostly in Texas and Louisiana. Then he hit me with the jaw dropper. He said well good, maybe they'll breed down there and they'll be more of them. I told him no, they breed on the tundra in the Arctic and sub-Arctic. At this revelation he looked sorta perplexed, like he couldn't figure out why they were flying all the way to Texas if they don't really do anything there.

I just point this out because it's a perfect example of what we hunters are up against. This guy has an MFA and has not a clue as to what is going on in the natural world. The other person in our group is a business person. I guess these people just awaken one day and decide that they like animals and it's a good idea not to shoot them. No research, no questions, nothing except a stone cold judgment that hunting is a bad thing and that they are not going to take part in it or like anything that has to do with it.

Obviously they don't go out of their way to learn anything about the animals or birds that are being hunted. They know that they are pretty and that they sound nice when they fly over. That must be it, because if they think snow geese fly south to breed, they can't be overly informed.
I bring all this up because I think that this is a good example of the majority of anti-hunters. People who are educated and just never have had the other side of the picture presented to them. I think that there are a lot of these types of people around too, and that accounts for a lot of the anti- hunting sentiment and resentment that we hunters face in this world today.

In my opinion, hunters owe it to themselves, the sport, their legacy, and anything else that they think is good and right and true in this world to refute anti hunter, anti hunting attacks whenever possible. You can bet your bippy that the hard core groups will be out, trying to sway the masses in their favor. These people who aren't deftly opposed to the sport, but who know they don't care for it, are ripe for the anti-hunting lobby to recruit to the dark side.

If hunters and the people in who they support in both the political and industrial arenas could, at the very least, keep the marginal's marginal through the use of facts, statistics, and articulate and informative speech, then half of our battle would be won. If we could further police our own ranks and weed out the slob hunters and outlaws who represent a bad image for the sport, then by golly, we just might have something to hand down to our future generations.
Just my thoughts.
Good hunting,
Dan


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## DakotaDog72 (Sep 27, 2005)

"you're in college now. You're supposed to be on your way to being a more educated, ethical person"

Well....actually, college is about drinking beer and having sex with as many beautiful (and not so beautiful) woman as humanly possible. Obviously, she went to school for all the wrong reasons :roll:

:beer:


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## R y a n (Apr 4, 2005)

dfisher said:


> I just point this out because it's a perfect example of what we hunters are up against. This guy has an MFA and has not a clue as to what is going on in the natural world. The other person in our group is a business person. I guess these people just awaken one day and decide that they like animals and it's a good idea not to shoot them. No research, no questions, nothing except a stone cold judgment that hunting is a bad thing and that they are not going to take part in it or like anything that has to do with it.
> 
> Just my thoughts.
> Good hunting,
> Dan


Great points Dan

We need to make sure that we take time to discuss these types of things in an appropriate way to those who don't know any better...

I just had a similar discussion with a drop dead gorgeous girl friend of mine over lunch last week before coming back out here...

She is a college educated, city girl with a very sharp intelligent and open mind. She honestly has no idea why anyone would want to travel back to ND in the cold to hunt cute deer.

Now that being said.. she is not a tree hugging liberal animal lover.... rather she is just one of MANY similar girls who do not grow up in the country, near a farm, or have any other exposure to the "real" world, other than what they see on the internet or TV. We have to realize that there are MANY MANY people who have no interest in this type of lifestyle. That doesn't make them bad people..... Jessi (my friend) just had never met anyone in her circle of friends (like me) who had any idea of what really happens with hunting.

Now.... I realized (and I hope all of you reading this do too), that I had to carefully measure and consider my approach in discussing this topic with her. She was genuinely curious. However she wasn't going to get sold in one conversation that hunting was perfectly acceptable. She was adamant that we no longer needed to continue with the practice, even in sport, as ultimately the US is a modern country. She indicated that she has no problem with hunting in other places where people are doing it to subsist....

Now I'm great friends with Jessi... it's not worth me getting upset over her reaction, as it is what she has grown up with. I won't convince her otherwise that day. So I let the topic continue for a bit, and then left it open to bring up another day... She agreed. I let her look into what I said a little more, and some day next month we'll chat again.

This type of soft approach is what you need to employ with someone you'll have a chance to interact with over time. Trying to throw tons of facts at them just turns them off to what you are trying to do....

Ryan


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## averyghg (Oct 16, 2006)

> Well....actually, college is about drinking beer and having sex with as many beautiful (and not so beautiful) woman as humanly possible


hahaha i love it because it soooooo true! atleast for the majority of people i know


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## Rick Acker (Sep 26, 2002)

averyghg said:


> > Well....actually, college is about drinking beer and having sex with as many beautiful (and not so beautiful) woman as humanly possible
> 
> 
> hahaha i love it because it soooooo true! atleast for the majority of people i know


That doesn't end with college, Marriage will end that...for most that is!


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## 9erfan (Oct 18, 2007)

my 2 cents



> Hunting is something *I can't and won't* understand.


Very open minded for someone seeking/dispensing an education...



> Don't boast loudly during class about the deer (bird, buffalo, kitten, baby, whatever)


deer = bird = kitten = baby -- it's very difficult to have a battle of the wits with the unarmed



> If you have just come from an all-night spree of gunfire and beer,


 hmm, I've yet to be able to hit anything in the dark, and that's quite the assumption on the beer ( i prefer whiskey!!)



> Don't wear your hunting gear to class.


 only if you promise not to show your fat (insert body part here) in your bicycle shorts this spring---yuck!!

I could go on, but it's too easy!! I would let it go--people that absorbed in themselves don't have open minds about much of anything...[/u]


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## dfisher (Oct 12, 2007)

College and college life should be an all encompassing experience for the student. It should lend culture to their lives, as they meet other young people from every walk of life and ethnic back ground. The learning experiences, the lively debate, and the cultural diversity should lend itself to broadening the healthy and motivated student's view of the world and the events that shape our lives.

College should also be an arena in which to express opinions and debate various issues. Rubbing shoulders with fellow students from many different and diverse back grounds, as well as input from professional educators, should not only broaden a student's view of the world, but also allow for a open mindedness when listening to what those on the other side of an issue have to say.

It sounds to me like this person was doing exactly that. Perhaps the cutting, chiding style was used to incite anger from hunters and outdoors people and garner replies that are hostile and mindless. This clever approach would surely point to the Neanderthal mind set in which hunters operate. Then, how simple of a matter would it be to point to the anger wrought replies and trumpet their correctness in judging hunters as mindless, barbaric, killers of innocent animals.

Don't worry though. We showed him/her. We didn't fall into this trap and show our hostile side. No we didn't. We couldn't get off of the beer drinking and sex long enough.

Boy, what bright futures we have!

Sincerely,
Dan


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## nickwesterholm (Nov 16, 2006)

docquack said:


> While I think a rebuttle is fine, you have to be very careful as to not sound like the type of person (she ?), I'll assume this is a female, wants us to look like.
> 
> I am a non-resident of ND but have always felt very comfortable wearing camoflage in your state, unlike where I come from (Indiana).
> 
> ...


Docquack,

while i'm glad you enjoy coming to north dakota and feel comfortable in your own skin here (by wearing camo) i feel bad that you can't do that down in indiana. i am a proud hunter. i wear it on my shirt sleeve. i am an avid outdoorsman, i work, and i'm a full-time student, and i have a girlfriend which we all know takes up a lot of time. i'm not ashamed of any of these things, i don't hide my girlfriend, i boast about going to ndsu, i love working in the hunting department at scheels, and i have a real passion for hunting. i'm proud to tell people about each and every one of these. if i am out in the field in the morning hunting and i come into town at 12:15 and have class at 12:30 i'm going class in my camo. and i don't think that's disrespectful. no more disrespectful than the kid in the corner wearing the shirt ragging on our government or the kid in the other corner wearing the shirt saying my religion is bad, and no more disrespectful then the girl wearing some slutty clothes showing every piece of skin possible. i love to hunt and i'm not going to change clothes so as to please a couple people i don't even know in my class. we as hunters shouldn't have to hide ourselves. this makes me sad to see someone who is a member of these boards and is willing to comply with these people. i may be alone here, but we shouldn't have to hide ourselves. i'm proud of who i am and where i came from. if i were to die today i'd hope my family would put me in my casket in my natural gear fleece pullover with my filson double tin pants danner boots and avery hat, cause i'm proud of who am and what i stand for. maybe i'm wrong about all of this, but i think we should be proud of who we are. we are a dying breed, so we need to stand strong


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