# Steel shot on coyotes?



## weasle414 (Dec 31, 2006)

I know I'll probably get a bit of gruf on this one, but I was wondering if I could use my left over steel shot from duck hunting on coyotes and be able to still be in the catagory of being an ethical hunter. I've got a bunch of left over 2, 3 and bb shot laying around and want to use it up. Of course with my coyote hunting record I think I'll need to find something else to be hunting to use any of it :lol:


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## hagfan72 (Apr 15, 2007)

Personally, I wouldn't. Unless it patterns really well out to 30 yards, and you can get them that close, I would just save that steel shot for next year if your duck hunting is already over for this year.

I have put a 3", 2oz load of #4's into a coyote at 25 yards, and he tumbled and RAN over the horizon. Granted, i had a modified choke in, but still, they are hard to put down.


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## R Buker (Oct 29, 2005)

I agree. Save it for next year's ducks. Steel is horrible on predators.


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## weasle414 (Dec 31, 2006)

That's kind of what I figured. I've got two boxes of 00 buckshot that I can use instead, I just wanted to know if I could use the steel loads.


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## hagfan72 (Apr 15, 2007)

Just make sure you pattern that 00. You'd be surprised how few pellets are in the kill zone as close as 25 yards. I'd step down to #4 BUCK if you really want to use a shotgun.


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## barebackjack (Sep 5, 2006)

Id stay away from 00 as well. Too few pellets. Im a big fan of putting more pellets on the target over energy (same with steel for waterfowl). 4-buck, or even BB's with a tight choke, or a patternmaster work really well, lots and lots of pellets from those BB's out to 40+ yards.


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## coyote_buster (Mar 11, 2007)

What is 3 in. T shot like, i seen that is what hevi shot is


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## CoyoteBlitz (Apr 11, 2007)

When you guys use buckshot for yotes where do you aim, head or heart/lungs?


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## hagfan72 (Apr 15, 2007)

Good question! The only 'yote i ever killed with a shotgun was aimed at where the neck and head come together. He went down like a sack of potatos, but he was all mangy and probably not the strongest dog around.

So guys, where do you try to place your shots?


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## Virginian (Aug 17, 2007)

Make sure you pattern that #4 buchshot. I managed to put only one pellet in the EDGE of a 17" x 22" sheet of paper at 40 yards with my full choke.

SUPPORT OUR RIGHT TO KEEP AND BEAR ARMS


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## CoyoteBlitz (Apr 11, 2007)

hag, I guess we are out of luck. I can get #3 buckshot for my 20ga that pushes at 1200 fps. with 20 pellets, think it'll work?


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## hagfan72 (Apr 15, 2007)

Sure, if you can get them in within 20 yards or so. That would be a rush to say the least!


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## falconryman (Jan 31, 2007)

Hey weasel i got some 4 buck, for thrus. will 00 buck good for pretection from cougars


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## 308 (Jul 10, 2007)

00buck should work good for protection out to 25yards :beer: :beer:


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## coyote_buster (Mar 11, 2007)

slug would protect you, they have some pretty dang accurate slugs this year, with rifled barrel they are accurate at 200 yards, they talked about them in field stream or maybe outdoor life


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## hagfan72 (Apr 15, 2007)

coyote_buster said:


> slug would protect you, they have some pretty dang accurate slugs this year, with rifled barrel they are accurate at 200 yards, they talked about them in field stream or maybe outdoor life


Yeah, I regularly shoot at animals 100+yards away for "protection". LOL


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## coyote_buster (Mar 11, 2007)

im just sayin, if its running right at you screaming, you wont have to wait until its 40 yards away, :lol:


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## Ron Gilmore (Jan 7, 2003)

I find it funny that people do not think 00 Buck is not enough for yotes! Good lord that is what many people still use on deer in some states!!!!!

The energy of a 00 shot with even one pellet in the kill zone is enough out to 65 yards. Most people do over choke this load, a modified choke is a good choice for that range, but I would pattern test it first.

Back in the lead days we killed a lot of geese with 00 buck and a goose is a lot smaller target and has a smaller vital area than a coyote!


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## hagfan72 (Apr 15, 2007)

Ron, I don't think any of us thingk that 00Buck is too _small_ for 'yotes, just too few pellets. At 40yds, the possibility of just putting one or two in the guts is too great to be a feasible load. If I were to use a shotgun, I would go with nothing bigger than #4 buck, and no farther than 30-35 yds. Just make sure you pattern your gun so you know what it likes and doesn't like.


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## Ron Gilmore (Jan 7, 2003)

hagfan, you illustrate my point for me with your explanation. I understand what you are thinking, but 00buck is a much better choice of load for killing coyote than 4 buck from the energy and range factor.

We today have experts who have determined that X amount of pellets need to be on target with X amount of energy to be a lethal load for ducks or geese. Many of todays shooters live by these standards without a lot of experience in using loads they condemn.

My 35 years of hunting has taught me a few things in regards to the reality of what works and what does not. I have had people tell me that 00 and 4 buck do not kill geese and that this load cripples birds. They use the formula stated above as a reason never having shot a single load of it at a goose! I have shot 100's of geese with these two loads. The one constant in using that load is the energy was so great a single pellet anywhere in the body caused that bird to fall from the sky.

Now I also have killed a lot of coyotes and fox with these loads as well. 00 was preferred because of the lower pellet count and holes in the pelt. Shooting for the head and neck area results in clean kills with this with ranges getting out to 60-70 yards. 4Buck would be my next choice in a load, but from shear killing power 00 out shines 4 buck on anchoring prey such as coyotes.

This post is not meant as a slam against you, just pointing out some in the field practical use. In your previous posts, you said you have only ever killed one coyote with a shotgun. Now compare that to actual field use by someone who has been shooting fox and coyotes for 30+ years!

To the poster who has the 00 buck pattern your gun and shoot the choke that gives you the tightest pattern, but you do not need to worry about not having enough shot nor energy to kill coyotes at 40 yards with them.


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## Bloodyblinddoors (Oct 25, 2006)

weasle....What ever happened to buying a predator rifle??? Remember? .308 or .243? You're not gonna earn your first coyote by sitting on the computer. Put some hours in, or even sell the computer and buy a rifle. Then go call a coyote in and reach out and touch that b-tch!
http://www.nodakoutdoors.com/forums/vie ... hp?t=37272


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## hagfan72 (Apr 15, 2007)

Ron, yes you are right, the per pellet energy delivered by 00 buck far exceeds that of a #4 buck. However, I have seen many a dog head out over the horizon with a poorly placed shot to the guts, hams, or shoulders. To get lucky enough to place multiple pellets in the heart/lung area, you need lots of pellets. I would never say that 00 would not do the job, I was merely saying that #4 gives you a much better chance for the multiple hits that you need to somewhat reliably take a dog down. The one coyote that i shot with a shotgun was taken with #5 birdshot at 25 yards. It wasnt the per pellet energy that killed that dog, it was the multiple hits to the vitals.

As to your claim that you are taking coyotes out to 70 yards with 00 buck, I will, at the risk of angering you and your 30+ years afield, call BS. Whether or not you have knocked a few down at that range, telling a new hunter that 70 yards is a shootable range with a shotgun is irresponsible. I would love to know what sort of choke you are using to get multiple hits in a 10" diameter circle at 70 yards. I am not saying it cant be done, I am just saying that it is HIGHLY unlikely.


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## Ron Gilmore (Jan 7, 2003)

Your point is taken and my information should have been clearer on lethal range. Anytime you are shooting a shotgun be it a duck or coyote. You should be limiting your shots to the load and choke combo and skill for the range you are shooting.

That being said, one needs to place the shot on target and choose the right shot angle. At 40 yards if a coyote had his butt facing you a load of shotgun pellets is going to kill the animal but not on the spot. Most likely the animal is going to run off and die a slow death.

Shotguns are best used under 50 yards and 40 and under even better. If I have the choice between a rifle and a shotgun from 40 yards out the rifle will get the nod everytime.

Hope this clears up any confusion that new hunters or users of shotguns may have. Anyone using a shotgun should be pattern testing at the ranges they plan on shooting. Do not push your range beyond skill level regardless of weapon or caliber choice.

One guy I have hunted coyotes with was a very acomplished shooter at 500+ yards. He practiced at those ranges and used bullets and calibers that performed well at those distances.

Now if he handed me that same set up or someone else, we would have the tool to make the shot, but not the skill. Thus it really would not matter if we where shooting a .243 or a 30-30 at that range. The shot most likely would be missed and a hit would be the result of pure luck!


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## dfisher (Oct 12, 2007)

If I were to limit my shotgun work to the range capabilities of my skill, I'd never get to shoot at anything. :lol:

Happy New Year,
Dan


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## Ron Gilmore (Jan 7, 2003)

@dfisher


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## Plainsman (Jul 30, 2003)

Ron,

I think the use of buckshot has really dropped off in the past ten years. Shotguns used by police are loaded with 4buck, 00 buck, and sometimes slugs.
Not very scientific, but years ago I was trying to decide the same thing on fox and coyote. I used some old one gallon Coleman fuel cans. I kept putting them further and further out. I don't remember how many 4 buck pellets I got in the can at 100 yards, but I do remember there were always a couple with 00 buck. Two out of nine at 100 yards really surprised me, and like you suggested the moderate choke gave a tighter pattern than the full choke with large shot. Unfortunately that was a friends double shotgun, and I had full choke only on my old 870. 
Back in those days there were few coyotes around and I was hunting fox so I went with the 4 buck because I thought I needed more pellets and fox are small. I did hit one and put him down at 70 yards. He run into a small brush pile, and I already had the lead so I pulled the trigger. I seen his tail flip in the air. When I got there I found I had broke his back, but he was very much alive. I pushed his head to the side with the barrel, and stood on him. When I pushed his head aside he bit the barrel so hard it looked like he scratched it. Fifteen years later I had five inches cut off and threaded for choke tubes. The gunsmith gave me the piece he cut off, and when I looked closely the mark wasn't a scratch, it was a small piece of tooth enamel imbedded in the barrel from that fox. For years I had been careful to make sure that spot always had some oil on it so it wouldn't rust. I guess that's why it would never take cold blue. :lost:


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## barebackjack (Sep 5, 2006)

Throwing 00 at a coyote at 70 yards is kinda like slingin arrows at a deer at 90 yards......not very responsible IMO.

So we all agree, at the generally "accepted" *responsible* shotgun ranges of 30-40 yards max, 4 buck has more than enough power and pellets to makes clean kills, so at these "accepted" maximum ranges 00 is not needed.

Good, glad we could all agree.


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## Ron Gilmore (Jan 7, 2003)

Bareback, I will take 00 over 4 buck at those ranges every time. Nothing personal just plain experience of having used these loads. I understand how you feel, because in shooting ducks, a lot of people swear by 4 shot steel. I swear at it!

Happy Holidays to all!!!!


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## barebackjack (Sep 5, 2006)

I actually prefer 3" BB with a turkey or patternmaster choke. Never had a need for buckshot when the BB rolls em clean.


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