# insaurance



## ohio (Nov 27, 2005)

i know that this is a little out of the ordinary.......but would about a 1990 toyota 4 runner be really bad on insaurance for a first car with insaurance cause ihave drove a few and fell in love with them and when you hunt and fishoftwen a 4wd is almost an essential.....thanx for any input


----------



## Ranger_Compact (Nov 2, 2005)

I wouldn't think so. My first car was an Eagle Talon, second was a Grand Am, and my boyfriend said the Suzuki Sidekick I'm getting won't be a lot more for insurance.


----------



## Invector (Jan 13, 2006)

I guess that all depends on the person who is driving it. Age and driving history all have to be looked at. I myself have a Dodge Dakota Sport with the 5.2 magnum V8 4x4.  At my age and a clear driving history I pay I think somthing around the $460 a year. That is also with just liability (i think). If you go full coverage it will be more.


----------



## Gohon (Feb 14, 2005)

As already mentioned your age and certainly your driving history from the DMV will play a role in determining cost. Also the retail value of the vehicle. A Toyota 4-Runner in my area will retail for about $4,300 which means with the first two items being okay they insurance shouldn't be very high considering the insurance company will usually just total the vehicle out if repair costs exceeds the retail value. Your driving record will be the biggest hurdle for you. You can help yourself out by listing low annual mileage driven and don't list off road use. The occasional dirt road, hunting trail or muddy field is not off road use but if they think you are going to be trying to cross the continental divide then expect to pay more.


----------



## jd mn/nd (Apr 8, 2004)

Ohio, I am an insurance agent in MN, there are a multitude of variables that most insurance carriers use such as the MVR, geographical location, age, type of vehicle owned, how many drivers on the policy, how far you commute to work one way, and the list goes on. However as someone this thread suggested to misinform the carrier about some of the information you give them would be VERY wrong!! the variables that are used to determine premium are also considered to be statements of truth and if you file a claim and they find out in the course of investigating the claim that you lied to them they may denie paying the claim, as well as cancell you, if you think that insurance is expensive now wait until you get cancelled and end up with non-standard carrier, your premiums will at least double!! I see this type of thing every day, and since I do not know you, I have no reason to misinform you. The best advice any one could have given you is talk to your insurance agent before you buy the truck and ask them to give you a qoute, on how you will use the vehicle.

Secondly, I have never had a carrier ask on the application is the vehicle used off road, know why? Because if you have purchased a 4X4 they automatically assume that you will use it off road at least occasionally, otherwise why did you buy it if you intend to stay on tar roads, these companies are not stupid they have seen everything under the sun and then some things you can't even begin to imagine.

If you have any further questions feel free to contact me, if you live in ND, MN, AZ, or WI I could provide you a free qoute, provided I have all of the neccesary info.

Good luck on your vehicle purchase, I am also happy to see that you are responsible enough to get insurance and be legal on the road ways.

Later J.D. Lundgren


----------



## Gohon (Feb 14, 2005)

JD, my insurance carrier specifically ask me if my vehicle would be used for hire, used for a business and would it be used for off road recreation. You may be a insurance salesman but that doesn't mean you know what every insurance company in the nation will require. As for the "misinform the carrier" comment I assume you were referring to my telling him to list low mileage. I didn't tell him to lie but to simply list low mileage, in other word be conservative and don't go listing cross country trips that may or may not occur. I have a 4X4 and I didn't buy it for off road use. I bought it for snow, ice, and muddy roads I drive on. I wouldn't be surprised to find more 2 wheel drive vehicles off road by sportsmen than 4X4's so why should any insurance assume such a thing. Nice sales pitch though.


----------



## jd mn/nd (Apr 8, 2004)

Gohon, I deal with some of the nations largest carriers, Hartford, Progressive, Auto Owners, State Auto, Allstate, AIG, (I hold about 25 different contracts total) etc... , not one of them asks on their application if the vehicle will be used off road. Yes they do ask if the vehicle is used for business, pleasure, commuting, or occasional business use. When you tell them that you are using the vehicle to commute to and from work one way at lets say 5 miles per day at 5 days per week on an average of 48 work weeks per year that comes out to 2400 miles per year that means that if tell them you will use the vehicle for 15,000 miles per year that the rest of the time that you are not commuting you are using it for personal erronds, hunting, fishing, going to sporting events, vacations etc..., ,like I said they are not stupid most people do use their vehicles about that many miles a year and some of use them even more than that. I did not say that I would sell the individual a policy, I did say that I would provide them a free qoute if thier own agent did want to help them out, and only if they lived one of the states that I am licensed in. I would also like to know how many claims you personally have been involved in setteling, and how many different claims reps. you have worked directly with to settle claims and had discussions with about what is covered and what is not and what a carrier will do if they find out you have lied to them on the application. If the carrier finds out before a claim they will issue a warning to the insured and make the adjustment on the policy, and all will be good. However I have had clients that have misrepresented themselves and the bad information after a claim led to them cancelled by the carrier, so do not try to tell me how my industry does or does not work when I personally have handeled these types of situations. Lets us now hear about your personal experience in the insurance industry and what your position is as I have laid mine out on the line, and have not misrepresented myself or who I am, I am not hiding behind a false name here on this site as you or anyone can plainly see by going to my personal information, I list who I am, what I do for a carrier (second generation family business) where I live, and so on.

Now that we have that out of the way lets hear about you.

J.D. Lundgren


----------



## PSDC (Jul 17, 2003)

Ohio,

If you are shopping for auto quotes,
many companies are now using your
credit score to determine the cost.
Lower credit score, higher premiums!

Keep that credit golden!


----------



## Chuck Smith (Feb 22, 2005)

Ohio,

Listen to JD mn/nd he is correct. I am an insurance agent as well. I hold about 20 different contracts with different companies. I hold contracts with some of the same ones as JD. I too am a third generation in an insurance agency. I too have seen many different/wierd things happen when people misrepresent themselves on claims, apps, reports, etc. Insurance companies are not dumb. They have all the numbers infront of them. They know the stats. Just call an agent to get a quote is your best option.

Like PDSC said....they are basis things on credit a lot more now....But it is not a credit score....it is an insurance score. They use your credit and other variables to determine this score.

Also Gohon stated....I don't know how all companies come up with a premium. I just know how mine do. But all of mine are very simular.

I hope this helps.

CHuck SMith


----------



## apeterson (Aug 3, 2005)

I have a 1987 4 runner and it is $75.00 per six months... but it is my 3rd vehical also...


----------



## Gohon (Feb 14, 2005)

JD, since I'm not in the business of selling insurance or working for a insurance what is the question about how many claims have I settled for? A little defensive grand standing there isn't it. Of course you want people to use a higher mileage driven than they would actually need. Higher premiums is higher commission for you so you're not fooling anyone here. I never told anyone to lie or misrepresent anything on their application so dump the crap. I don't care whether you believe my insurance ask me the question or not, they did.

Ohio, if you want lower premiums, deal with someone that sells insurance for one company only and not someone that is a middle man broker for 25 companies. Their goal is their own pocket book. Enough said..........


----------



## jd mn/nd (Apr 8, 2004)

Well Gohon, once again your lack of knowledge is showing through you obviously did not read the post from Chuck Smith who agreed with the statements that I made as he is also an agent, and independent just like me. The reason that most independent agents have multiple contracts is so that they can bring thier customers the best possible price as well as the best possible policy to fit thier needs, not all policies written with a captive agent are best for all of thier clients but they sell them one any way who is really padding thier checkbooks as you would say? As for the comment about the mileage driven in one year it does not effect the premium as greatly as you may think and even if it brought the premium up by $10.00 every six months my cut would only be about $1.50. So your statement about only wathching out for my pocket book I do take personally because as any of my clients as well as anyone that knows me would tell you that is the last thing I am worried about, MY clients are first and the service that I provide for them is the most important thing!!

I would challenge you to prove otherwise, my morals & ethics, are very important to me, and when someone especially someone that does not know me from adam, starts to attack my character, as well as others that I share this profession with, you bet that I get defensive!!

Once again Gohon, I will challange you to step out from behind the mask that you are hiding behind as I have never hiden from you or anyone on this site or any other for that matter. What are afraid of that we may attack your character, or your old profession, or maybe your morals or ethics, I think not, I am bigger than that, however you seem to have something to hide as this is the second time that I have asked you to reveal who or what you are and yet you ignored it the first time, lets see what you do on the second challange. The next time that you feel that you know more than two other people on a subject you should probably list your credentials on the matter before you start challenging others that do it everyday as a professionals.

again J.D. Lundgren


----------



## Chuck Smith (Feb 22, 2005)

Gohon,

I resent that statement of an Independent agent only worrys about himself..."Lining his pockets" as you put it. You are so far from the truth it is pitiful. Independents try to find the best policy for there costumer. I can give them three options A, B, C. Then they can choose. Typically the chose the one with less premium which equals less commission. I am not saying people who write for one company has bad products....but myself as a consumer I want to know my options. Sometimes you don't see all the options when you are with an agent who writes for one company.
Quit attacking JD. Everything he has stated is true. Also about the mileage....it is not that big of a deal. Most companies that I work for bracket the mileage anyway....ie 5,000-10,000 miles is a certain factor in the rating. 10,000 -20,000 is a different factor. The mileage is not that big of a deal. Insurance companies know....most applications that i deal with ask what is you job....so they know mileage. Trust me they have stats.

Now we are getting way off track. Ohio was just asking a question. I hope he got his answers that he needed.

OHIo,
if you have any other questions about insurance principles just pm me and I hope I can answer them. Like I mentioned before I can only answer what I know about my companies and in the states that i write.


----------



## Gohon (Feb 14, 2005)

> someone that does not know me from adam, starts to attack my character


And that is exactly what YOU did when you implied that I had some how told the guy to lie on his application which I did not do, and at the same time pretty much called me a liar about something I was asked by my insurance carrier. I don't have to prove anything to you and I could care less if you believe me. And Chuck is simply on the defensive as you are. Doesn't matter if it is $1.50 or $150 dollars more in your pocket it all adds up. That little $10 (which I would question) every six months for added protection is his pocket money that he doesn't need to spend unless someone like you talks him out of it. And then you wonder why salesmen are right down there with lawyers. Telling Ohio to keep the mileage low on his application is just that, keep it honest but keep it low. To run it up high is doing nothing more than helping you and Chuck to make your insurance payments.



> Once again Gohon, I will challange you to step out from behind the mask that you are hiding behind as I have never hiden from you or anyone on this site or any other for that matter. What are afraid of that we may attack your character, or your old profession, or maybe your morals or ethics, I think not, I am bigger than that, however you seem to have something to hide as this is the second time that I have asked you to reveal who or what you are and yet you ignored it the first time, lets see what you do on the second challange. The next time that you feel that you know more than two other people on a subject you should probably list your credentials on the matter before you start challenging others that do it everyday as a professionals.


Reveal who or what I am? What does this have to do with you calling me a liar and then getting all huffy when I step back on your toes. Apparently you also have a reading problem as I clearly stated I am no insurance salesman. But I do know what my own policy states and I do know what my own carrier ask regardless of your claiming to know everything. I'm not behind a mask....where do you come up with such ridiculous statements. I'm retired military and a steam propulsion mechanical engineer. Now what have you discovered.......... nothing. Tell you what....I'll paste a little article below and the people reading this can come to their own conclusions but first....if you want to go around calling people a liar without know what you speak about then don't get so excited when someone throws it right back at you. If your skin is that thin you would do well to just sit and listen. You claimed you worked with AllState and mileage doesn't make much difference on a application? Well explain the below................. Sure looks like more than $10 every six months to me.



> Suit: Allstate altered mileage records
> Class-action says goal was higher premiums
> 
> Three car insurance customers of Allstate Corp. have filed a class-action lawsuit in Sacramento against the company for allegedly telling its agents to alter its customers' records of annual miles driven in order to charge higher premiums.
> ...


----------



## Chuck Smith (Feb 22, 2005)

Gohon,

This law suit against Allstate is just people getting greedy. It was in one state. If it was for the entire nation it would have not just happened in California. Now I am not saying it has not happened in other states or agents don't do that. But that is just dishonest people. Now lets get off these personal attacks and just drop this issue. Ohio was just curious on price of insurance. The best thing he can do is go out and shop around for quotes to find out the cost.

Chuck


----------



## jd mn/nd (Apr 8, 2004)

Well Gohon, it has become very apparent that you just want an argument, your previous military back ground and steam fitter or whatever apparently better qualify you to answer insurance information rather the professionals that do it daily. I read your artical and although it was interesting to read what the "captive" Allstate agents (a different division of the company) were directed to do, I am not one of those and had I personally never been told to do something illegal which even if I had, I know that it is illegal to falsify information on a application, I would not have done so and would have told them that I would not have been a party to illegal or even questionable activities!!! As I stated in a previous post I do hold myself to higher standards than most, not just professionally either. You may question my morals, ethics, integrity, and honesty, however I personally know that the type of "salesman" that you are implieing that I am, is not true. I also went back and re-read your post about mileage and not once did you mention the word truth or truthfulnes in that post, you simply stated to keep the mileage low, leading one to believe that Ohio should mislead the agent that they intend to work with.

As for the statement that both Chuck Smith and I are nothing but bottom dwellers, and that we rank right down there with lawyers, I would question how many friends you must have as I am fairly certain that sometime in your life you have encountered sales people, like realestate, autos, insurance, cellular, audio or television etc... the list is miles long and if you think this way about sales people you must not have very many people you like. Seeing as how most of the products that are in your home were sold by salespeople of some nature, I would really question your broad statements about salespeople, and how you feel about them I am sure that at least one person you know and spend time with is or was a salesperson, why don't tell them how you feel about sales people?

In regards to the statement of $10.00 and my portion being a $1.50 it was simply and example to show you that the sales person is not the one getting rich off this it is the insurance carriers. So your broad example is not accurate either and since no one else responded the way you did to my statement I would speculate that most folks understood that I was using that as an example.

As for the thickness of my skin I can handle all the abuse you can throw my way when the facts are truthful, however broad statements, and half truthfull facts, or accusations when I corrected them you were the became defensive not me. I also did not ever call you a liar I simply told Ohio to be honest with the information they gave to the agent that they chose to deal with.

As for reavealing who or what you were, it was simply to show everyone on here that the only knowledge you have about the insurance industry is what ever you read in the papers or maybe some type of periodical, and from the t.v., that your only personal experiences do not make you qualified to answer the question at hand. Now on the other hand had Ohio asked about the military or being a steam fitter you would be very qualified to have answered thier question. I personally would not have attemped to have gotten involved, with that situation.

As for posting articals about insurance companies I am sure that if I had nothing better to do I could dig around and find bad articals on the military and on engineers and about how they were being sued for something stupid they did, but I would not have done it until all of the facts were in, as for the artical you posted they simply implied statements from certain individuals and only bits and pieces from the statements on the lawsuit, and we all know that the media NEVER blows anything out of proportion RIGHT?

As for this thread this will be my last post on this matter because now it has come to an argument of who is right and who is wrong and I will no longer play the game with you, I believe that I have shown that matter is best handled by a professional and that is all that matters.

Later J.D. Lundgren


----------



## Gohon (Feb 14, 2005)

Jd, the only person that seems to want to argue is you. You keep inventing comments like


> steam fitter


 which is not even close to Steam Propulsion engineer, so I assume that you want to get my blood boiling. And


> bottom dwellers


, a term I never used, and I never called you a liar but you did call me that. Now you are trying to imply that no one here on this board should have replied to the OP's post if they did not work in the insurance business. You made the statement that mileage meant little.......I quoted the opposite and ask you to explain.......but in another long winded drawn out spin you dance everywhere but there. So if you disagree with my suggestions to the OP then fine. But don't go calling me a liar about something you could not have knowledge about unless you were sitting right next to me.

Chuck, I don't know if it was people getting greedy or people tired of being ripped off. The courts will decide that. Yes you are right, the OP needs to get quotes from various places and make up his own mind and that is what he was sort of doing by posting his question here. However JD's snob nose remark that implied others were liars and he should pay no attention to anyone but himself really stunk. I had no intention of getting into a arguement in this thread so I'll also make it my last post on the matter.


----------



## kevin.k (Dec 31, 2005)

My dad is an insurance agent in Grand Forks


----------

