# Just a "Dumb thought from a Dummy"



## DecoyDummy (May 25, 2005)

Political thinking often seems to emanate from ones perspective on life and one of those perspectives is impacted greatly by what it is one does to put a roof over their head and food in the fridge.

I am self employed ... I'm your basic Owner/Operator and Sole Proprietor of a small Service Business here in Las Vegas NV. I have been going after life this way for ten years and it seems to be working out pretty well. I spent twenty years in Corporate America prior to that ... and FINALLY I made the leap into owning my life.

I can tell you for certain that most all folks I have found who chase cash similarly to the way I do ... are quite conservative in their politics ...

If anyone cares to get involved here and tell us in some general sense what it is you do to maintain your existence I'd be interested to know.

IF THE MODERATORS THINK THIS TOPIC TO BE OUT OF LINE ... PLEASE FEEL FREE TO DELETE IT ... I WON'T MIND


----------



## Plainsman (Jul 30, 2003)

I can't see any problem. Keep in mind that many may not respond, because of reprisals at work or some other reason. Also, some may feel that what they do will prejudice people against them. I will admit it will be interesting if you get responses. I think most of the time we vote what we think will somehow improve our lives. I think private business men are perhaps conservative. If you want to stay on welfare all your life your probably liberal. I don't think that is a partisan view, I think it is real. Isn't that one of the reasons liberals think we are heartless? I think it is heartless to let someone stay on welfare for years, it has to damage your self image terribly. Oh well, we will see what happens.

Lets watch it, and if things get nasty I'll delete or lock it. I'm glad you indicated you don't mind, it makes my job easier, and will perhaps set the stage for civility.


----------



## DecoyDummy (May 25, 2005)

Thank you Plainsman ...

One of the people I admire in life is James Madison ... not that he was all the brains behind our Constitution, but he was the guy who got it down in script ... for the ages.

As folks might already realize I would think ... much of what is happening in America today would have Mr. Madison rolling over in his grave ... those same things have me rolling my eyes in my head &#8230; shrugging my shoulders &#8230; not to mention biting my tongue.

America today is nothing our founders could have imagined ...

Or so it seems to me.


----------



## seabass (Sep 26, 2002)

Plainsman said:


> I think private business men are perhaps conservative. If you want to stay on welfare all your life your probably liberal.


I love it. Is this what it boils down to for you? I may very well be wrong on this score, but I have a much different view of someone who is habitually on welfare. In my mind I picture trailer houses, empty beer bottles in the front yard, and red neck mentality. You maybe can picture that too. Are you telling me that these people vote Democrat? I can't imagine that most welfare abusers align themselves with democrats who tend to be characterized as non-homophobic, environmentalists, and non-denominational. Again, I didn't run some double-blind survey on a random population of welfare users, but it just strikes me as a group of people at odds with the democratic platform. Even so, there must be PLENTY of republican voters abusing welfare out there.

My wife is in clinical rotations at a local private hospital and has had rotations at the VA hospital. She says there is a clear difference in the efficiency between the two hospitals. The federally run hospital being a smooth sailing ship compared to the other. I don't want to speak in general terms though on this... this is only a specific sections of the hospital. In either case though, her cohorts are democrats, mainly because of healthcare issues.

I am starting a short-term job in the Netherlands at a university as a post-doctoral researcher. I'm democrat for many reasons, but if I were to focus only on job-related issues its because I think the University system provides excellent cheap education to students and conducts worthwhile, important research that private organizations don't or wouldn't do.

I just heard from a relative that President Bush has borrowed more money during his administration than all past presidents have borrowed combinded. Can this be true? I certainly hope not.


----------



## R y a n (Apr 4, 2005)

seabass said:



> I just heard from a relative that President Bush has borrowed more money during his administration than all past presidents have borrowed combinded. Can this be true? I certainly hope not.


Yes that information was just discussed this week...

http://www.factcheck.org/article148.html

However it is important to note that this is in terms of total dollars. It is not the largest in regards to GDP (deficit size relative to the nation's economic output). Our debt is only 4.5% of the national economy. We were actually in a much worse state during WWII as outlined in that article.

Ryan

.


----------



## Plainsman (Jul 30, 2003)

> In my mind I picture trailer houses, empty beer bottles in the front yard, and red neck mentality. You maybe can picture that too.


At the extreme end of the picture this is what I see, but only at the extreme. I also don't think democrats are more likely to be on welfare, I think welfare recipients are more likely to be democrat. To me this view reflects more on the welfare people, and less on the democrats. One only has to look at the two parties. Democrats support more government programs, some of which are very worth while I might add. Even the welfare system. Liberals (not democrat) see themselves as more compassionate. I see them as compassionate, but to the extreme that they are taken advantage of by the lazy. People who are constantly on welfare know their best chance to remain on welfare is to vote democrat. I admire the compassion they have, but many take advantage of it when it is given to easily.



> The federally run hospital being a smooth sailing ship compared to the other.


It may come as a surprise to you, but that doesn't surprise me. Remember the security at the airports? The contracted security was absurd. The federal employed security people were polite, efficient, the difference of night and day. Something else that I noticed here at our little airport in Jamestown. I could have worked security at the airport for $30/hr as a contract employee. When the government took over I was talking to the lady who was the head of 30 security employees including the ones in Fargo. I asked her what her salary was. She said a GS7. I think that is in the neighborhood of $15/hr. If you filter our taxes through contracts, the employee gets paid, but so does the company he or she works for. I think when conservatives say they don't like big government they are talking about how much government intrudes into their lives, not how many employees they have.



> I just heard from a relative that President Bush has borrowed more money during his administration than all past presidents have borrowed combinded. Can this be true? I certainly hope not.


As inflation and costs skyrocket I would expect this to be true of every president. I would be nice to always point it out when democrats do it, but the truth is democrat or republican if the next president finds the same problems (terrorism) that Bush has he will outspend Bush. The major difference between the two parties is what they want to spend money on. I think they both spend, but democrats spend on welfare (see above discussion) while republicans spend on defense.

I like the way republicans give tax breaks to start businesses, but the whole world doesn't revolve around businesses. I like that democrats provide for the poor and are concerned about the environment, but they are taken advantage of by the lazy, and the whole world doesn't revolve around the environment. You may notice I am not happy with either group.

As a side note: Although we think of beer bottles and trailer houses when we think of welfare abuse it is not the case. I know a couple of people that fit this category, and they dress well, and their children are clean and better dressed than the average school student. Go figure.


----------



## buckseye (Dec 8, 2003)

I'd say most people on welfare don't vote, to much work to get to the voting booth. A past relative of mine was married to President Madison, doesn't mean much but I do have a lot of pride in what we have helped build. It's like a mother who can never see her own child's faults will always stand behind her children to the end.


----------



## Gohon (Feb 14, 2005)

The majority of the people I've met that are welfare career oriented live in subsidized housing or government run apartments. The majority of the people I know that live in trailer houses are normally low income or retired elderly people that are hard working and in most cases hold down two jobs to make ends meet. They are proud of their homes because it is their home. Why people want to look down on these people is beyond me.

********, well I'm not sure what that means. Most of the people I know that are classified as ******** by those looking down their noses are hard working country folks that are proud of their southern heritage.

As mentioned earlier those that are career welfare usually do identify themselves with the Democrat party, not all but most of the one's I've met. I would only assume that is because that is where the support for their chosen way of life comes from. Seems to me those trailer house and ******* people normally identify themselves with the Republican party because all they want is to be left alone, raise their kids and a chance at that big house in the future.

I heard on the news the other day that tens of millions of dollars for Katrina relief was just sitting somewhere and unable to be delivered to the hurricane victims. The reason why was thousands of those victims in the New Orleans area were on welfare and they had used several aliases and different addresses to collect checks, so now the government can't get the money to them. 
I think it would surprise most people that those that do abuse the system don't consider what they do as abuse. Most feel they deserve what they get and feel the government has a responsibility to take care of them, even if it is their choice not be part of a productive society. Then question then has to be asked is how did we get to the point that a segment of our society even thinks that way.


----------



## Plainsman (Jul 30, 2003)

Gohon, thank you for pointing out prejudice that can sneak up on us. When sea bass mentioned the beer bottle trailer house I had to agree with him. Then I edited my post explaining that the ones I knew dressed well, and dressed their children better than average. I see your point about the trailer house people. We often hear the term trailer trash, and that term bothers me. Your post made me stop to think about the people in trailer houses. More often than not they are people who can not afford the comparable luxury the welfare people live in. They may not be as educated, hence don't have good paying jobs, but give me a good person over a educated or rich person any day. Thanks for the reminder.


----------



## DecoyDummy (May 25, 2005)

In 1794, when Congress appropriated $15,000 for relief of French refugees who fled from insurrection in San Domingo to Baltimore and Philadelphia, James Madison stood on the floor of the House to object saying,

"I cannot undertake to lay my finger on that article of the Constitution which granted a right to Congress of expending, on objects of benevolence, the money of their constituents." 
-- James Madison, 4 Annals of congress 179 (1794)

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

There were zero provisions in the minds of The Founders for the Federal Government to be responsible in any way for the daily personal welfare of any citizen ... and keep in mind those are words spoken on the floor of the House by the man who penned the Constitution.


----------



## Bobm (Aug 26, 2003)

Anyone that recieves income redistribution is going to be more likely to vote for whoever is promoteing the latest gimme program and the republicans have been on that bandwagon pretty strong the last few years!

I can't really see a big difference in the two parties lately. To say nothing of all the correctly called corporate welfare the republicans pass around with all their BS.

I'm disgusted with both parties.

The Dems give the welfare to the worthless and the Reps give it to the wealthy neither one of them should get it, its our money and I don't want mine allocated to anyone, by some vote buying blowhard in the congress.

Let the people that earn it keep it. :sniper:


----------



## zogman (Mar 20, 2002)

Plaisman,


> Liberals (not democrat) see themselves as more compassionate


One additional thing to add. Liberals are extremely selecctive on their compassion and talk a good show. Famous over used Liberal quote "I feel your pain", but on the same line no action or never come up with solutions just cretisize uke: Very hypicretical uke: uke:


----------



## arctic plainsman (Aug 21, 2005)

Decoy,
To answer your question, I am a small construction business owner in Alaska. I suspect you are right, in large part because of my career choice, I am very conservative/ libertarian politically. Like you, I have to make out a check to the US Treasury quarterly. This act makes me very aware of the concept of the government being on my payroll or working for me, so I have an idea of what I expect out of them. 
I require from the gov. in general: security, ability to transport goods, (roads,) management of natural resources, and,.........uh,.......I'm running out of ideas here, well, there's probably one other thing but I can't think of it. 
I guess my point is, I require the bare minimum from the government I pay for, and the rest I'll handle myself. Education? Should be handled on a state or local level. Charity on any level should be handled by churches or other non profit organizations. Health care should remain a private industry, regulated by the consumer. 
I don't look to the gov to bail me out of anything. I keep plenty of food, (moose,) on hand, plenty of ammo and firearms for personal safety, and a stock of scrap 2x4's for the wood stove. These are the choices I have made for myself. Now it is true that if a tsunami hits Dillingham, I'm going to be washed right up the proverbial creek, but I am still satisfied with my efforts at self sufficiency, and am not done with them yet, so maybe by the time the wave hits I'll be prepared for that too!


----------



## boondocks (Jan 27, 2006)

Plainsman said:


> give me a good person over a educated or rich person any day.


I second that.


----------

