# Patterning a shotgun



## Duckslayer100 (Apr 7, 2004)

Alright, I did a basic search to see if this topic has been beat to death yet, but I didn't find a whole lot, so I figured I'd give it a chance and see what happens. I have a Remington 870 express super mag that I switch between a modified and an improved over the hunting season depending on what situation i'm in. This year was the first year I did any real serious goose hunting and for some reason I can't hit anything. Maybe I'm out of practice, but i figured patterning my gun couldn't hurt either. My question is, what do I do? Do I go out and spend a bunch to see what loads work the best and what chokes or has somebody graceously done the work for me and can tell me what I can put on and in my gun? Any advice would help. I'm shooting federals right now, heavy high velocity 2's and bb's. The bb's were what I was trying to use on the geese (3 and 3 1/2 inchers). Thanks a bunch
-Tyler


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## Gohon (Feb 14, 2005)

Saw this on the MN DNR site the other day. Might help........

"Although it's a big bird, a goose has a relatively small vital zone. The total area in which pellets will kill a goose is just one-tenth the bird's total size. To ensure they hit the vital zone with enough ?oomph,? waterfowl hunters need to pattern their guns and find the correct loads.

Most experts say the best loads for geese are sizes 1, BB, BBB, or T steel shot. For most hunting situations, BB or BBB shot is the most effective shot size. Both have plenty of pellets, but still enough energy to bring down a goose. Guns are usually 10- or 12-gauge. Because steel shoots tighter patterns than lead does, the best chokes for geese are modified and improved modified. However, each shotgun choke is unique, which is why hunters should pattern their particular guns.

To test loads, place a 40- by 40-inch-square sheet of paper at the same distance as flying geese that will be shot at. (For most hunters and situations, that's about 30 to 50 yards). Fire at an aiming point you mark on the paper. Do this on five sheets. Then, on each sheet, draw a 30-inch diameter circle around the densest pattern area on each sheet and count the pellets that hit inside the circle. This is the "pattern density." Try different loads and chokes until one is found that puts enough pellets (from 35 for heavier loads up to 55 for lighter loads) into the circle, which ensures that enough will hit the goose's vital zone for a clean kill. Another common mistake of beginning hunters is to shoot at geese flying out of range ("skybusting"). This can cripple birds, flare off approaching geese, and may cause approaching flocks to fly even higher. Some exceptional shooters have the skill to occasionally drop a bird "from the stratosphere," but for most hunters, a kill at over 50 yards is just dumb luck and poor sportsmanship. A good rule of thumb recommended by goose guides is this: If the end of your gun barrel covers more than half the bird, it is beyond 45 yards and is too far away for a clean kill.

It takes practice to find the correct lead for geese. The big birds have slow wing beats that make them appear to be lumbering along. But actually, geese move as fast as a mallard. Lead accordingly".


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## bratlabs (Mar 11, 2005)

Gohon said:


> A good rule of thumb recommended by goose guides is this: If the end of your gun barrel covers more than half the bird, it is beyond 45 yards and is too far away for a clean kill.


Ill have to remember that one. :thumb:


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## drjongy (Oct 13, 2003)

Good post, Gohon. I'll have to check out the gun/bird size ratio rule as well! :thumb:


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## Dan Bueide (Jul 1, 2002)

One of my favorite topics and always good for a number of conflicting thoughts. Here are a couple of threads that will give you more info on patterns and patterning than you'll care for:

http://nodakoutdoors.com/forums/viewtop ... ttern+shot

http://nodakoutdoors.com/forums/viewtop ... ttern+shot

I've seen a few of your recent posts about misses - can be very frustrating. But, you've missed too many for less than ideal pattern to be the culprit. The ultimate goal of improving pattern shouldn't necessarily be to hit more birds - rather to help you kill more birds more cleanly (and conversely wound less), but I think you have something else going on with the whiffs. I'll bet you're "peaking" - pulling your head slightly off the stock just before you shoot. It's a natural instinct to do that - to allow you to see the target better - but will cause you to miss high, time and again. Ideally, you shouldn't have to "aim" a shotgun - that should all be done peripherally while focusing solely on the target - but for a while, try concentrating on keeping your head down and actually siting down the barrel and through the bead to your correct lead, and see if that produces. Every once in a while, I used to have this problem with a low post shotgun - they don't fit me very well - and a little extra concentration on keeping my head down and aiming for a volley or two would usually get me back in line.

Good luck.


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## BIRDSHOOTER (Jul 18, 2005)

Slayer,

Most likely your just a little rusty. Go out and shoot some clays, set up to duplicate your problem shots and experiment a little with sight pictures (leads) and so forth. If that doesn't tell you anything maybe its a gun fit problem.

An even better way to determine this is to find a piece of paper or cardboard set it up to shoot a pattern. Mark an aiming point. Step back 25 yards, put a tight choke in your gun. With the gun starting in the lowered position, concentrate only on the aiming spot not your barrel. Bring it up and mount it like you normally would firing immediatly as the gun hits your cheek. Repeat this 5 times one right after another on the same piece of paper. Note: *DO NOT AIM AS YOU FIRE * this will not be a true measure of gun fit. When your finished look at the pattern, with 5 shots overlapped on each other you should get some idea where your shots are going, and how well your gun fits.


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## Ryan_Todd (Apr 11, 2004)

i have found over the past couple of years that #2's work well on geese. that is all i shoot now. the exact loads are federal HHV 3 1/2's. i've brought plenty of geese down with this load in the 50 yard range.


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## Duckslayer100 (Apr 7, 2004)

Wow...that was a lot of great information really fast. Thanks for all the advice. I think I'll go out tomorrow before scouting geese and give that patterning a try. Thanks again for all the help!

-Tyler


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## willie123 (Sep 24, 2005)

i have the same 870. it is a wonderful gun. i am new to goose hunting. but like anything i set my mind too i have been doing non stop research on calling and canada and snow geese. as far as pattering ur gun. i have not patterned any waterfowl loads out of mine yet. i plan to. i have researched this topic briefly and this is what i have found out. for the most part it is identical to pattering buck shot something i have almost 20 years of experience at. 1st figure out your avg shot distance at the geese. should be 30- 40 yards i am guessing. now find a suitable place to shoot. place a 3 foot by 3 foot sturdy back stop up. pin up a30 inch paper circle with 4 inch bullseye. u will need one of these 30 inch papers per different load u shoot. now step back to ur desired distance and fire one of each round at each 30 inch paper. when done count the pellets in the 30 inch paper. for an effective pattern u should have 35-55 pellets in the circle. now all u have to do is use which one is best. keep in mind that u will have to switch chokes and fire the same rounds again to have accurate results. also when using steel shot a tighter choke is not usually better. this is because as we now steel does not deform like lead so if it is compressed to much it will expand the pattern. just oh by the way i ahve had great luck with hevi shot #4 and #2 3 inch 12 ga loads. they are devasting on geese.but i can no longer afford $2.50 a pull so i am using steel now. i live in ap and hunt in pa for geese and hunt deer in (huge bucks) in n.j. take care


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