# Trying to understand the "too many NR hunters"



## rd51 (Jan 13, 2007)

:beer: :beer: Sorry if I stepped on anyone's toes


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## djleye (Nov 14, 2002)

> When we visit with farmers that we grew up with or the ones we've gotten to know from the Steele area, we are always welcome and we constantly hear complaints from them about resident hunters from east side of the state that are trying to dictate to them what they can and can't do with their land. In our home town we hear and did 40+ years ago about those "SOB's" from Fargo. I know some will tell me to stay in MN,as we don't need your kind, but I won't. I'd just like to understand what the problem is. I know posting this will bring out the hounds, but fire away.


Blah, blah, blah, blah!!!!

For every resident landowner that you have that hates Resident hunters, I could find one that hates NR hunters. Same old song and dance, been there done that!! Great post though!! You really added a lot today to the board!!! :eyeroll: :eyeroll: :eyeroll: :eyeroll:


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## Matt Jones (Mar 6, 2002)

I personally could care less. I'm glad you had a good trip and enjoyed yourself.


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## Plainsman (Jul 30, 2003)

I hope this doesn't turn into a bash fest, but I'll give you a tiny bit of what I think is happening.

I noticed you talked about hunting Monday, Tuesday, etc. When I elk hunt in in Montana on public land I am nearly alone on week days, then get over run on the week-end. That's to be expected I am a visitor, while it's just another week to them and they are working.

First off I don't think there are that many people against non-residents. What they are angry with is our legislature who sometimes think the non-resident comes before the resident. Then of course if one rich non-resident leases up an area a few who loose hunting in that area will not be happy. We never paid to hunt, until people who live in other states and make much higher salaries came to North Dakota and paid to hunt. Now some landowners expect it, and residents blame that attitude on non-residents. I think mostly it's the loss of access they are angry at, and not the non-resident. Of course a few blame the problem on the non-resident which in some cases is wrong, and in others is right.

Also, some areas of the state have few non-resident while other areas have developed a reputation of good hunting and have as many non-resident as resident.

One more problem. When biologists think we should lower hunting pressure for the birds, and hunters think we should lower hunting pressure to keep them around longer, guides and outfitters go to our legislature and defeat that proposal. When greed defeats science and the best interest of the resident some hunters misplace their anger.

So, if anyone else has some insight have at it, but lets try keep this one real, and inject more thought than passion. Thanks.


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## Norm70 (Aug 26, 2005)

bash fest? It is always a bash fest. It comes down to i don't want you hunting land i hunt. most feel that way and it won't change. kill the argument :-?


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## MSG Rude (Oct 6, 2003)

This topic has been discussed and debated so many times here...

I will let it go just please, either reply in-kind or do not reply at all and just skip it....


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## golfer (Apr 22, 2004)

I grew up on a farm in the Steele area and we had excellent hunting. My Dad was one who let anyone hunt the land as long as they came to the house and asked. If he saw someone hunting who didn't ask he would go and check them out. We had as many offenders from Minnesota, Bismarck, and locals as we had from Fargo. I don't see any point in your post other than stirring something up.


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## MRN (Apr 1, 2002)

rd51 said:


> I live in Minnesota, born in Fargo(1951) grew up in Wheatland, ND, graduated high school in Chaffee(1970),


Like Matt Jones, I'm glad you can still get out and walk and stuff, even if you're like 100 years old or something and your eyes and ears aren't working too well anymore, and you're apparently pretty cranky about it all....

Don't let that stuff eat you up inside.

M.


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## Plainsman (Jul 30, 2003)

So far this is more civilized than some, and if rd51 really is trying to understand I hope some of the past posts will help him do that. In the past there has been a lot of emotion. Good job so far.


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## bearhunter (Jan 30, 2009)

all this crap about non-res. is crazy. i took 3 trips to western n.d last year for coyotes and did not see ONE hunter out. res or non res..took 2 trips also bowhunting and pheasant with my brother same thing not ONE other hunter was seen. i'm sure some areas MAY get a little to much attention from hunters but for the most part you n.d. residents have it VERY GOOD.


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## djleye (Nov 14, 2002)

> for the most part you n.d. residents have it VERY GOOD.


_________________

Yep, we would like to keep it that way as well!!! :beer:


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## Plainsman (Jul 30, 2003)

> i took 3 trips to western n.d last year for coyotes and did not see ONE hunter out.


That might be a problem your optometrist can solve.  Nothing wrong with a little levity right?

Seriously though, what time of week did you hunt? Were you on vacation and hunting during the week, or were you hunting week-ends? It will make a huge difference in the number of hunters you see in an area.


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## djleye (Nov 14, 2002)

Plus the fact that IF you were hunting after birds and bucks seasons have run their course it would be typical to see fewer hunters afield. There are usually less pooch hunters than birds and buck hunters roaming around.


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## Bustem36 (Feb 5, 2008)

I'm a non-resident and have only had one farmer/resident seem annoyed by me asking to hunt but it wasn't because I was from out of state. It was because some hunters got stuck, he helped them out and they didn't even offer anything in return. He said he really didn't expect anything but they could have atleast offered or lied and said they would send soemthing.

I think the biggest problem is there is alot of hype on hunting and fishing certain places that people just flock too. Same in all states. It gets mentioned a few times and people just overload. I think if people (residents and non-residents would realize that there are more places than just the one everybody mentions there would be alot less problems)


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## barebackjack (Sep 5, 2006)

Bustem36 said:


> I think if people (residents and non-residents would realize that there are more places than just the one everybody mentions there would be alot less problems)


Well, alot of residents dont want to go far, especially when the huntings right out their back door, and they shouldnt be expected to.

I grew up in the heart of waterfowl mecca, I joke about it, but theres years I swear 29,999 of 30,000 NR waterfowlers came to my home county. So when NR's come on and say "I spent four days in ND midweek and didnt see a SINGLE other hunter", well it kind of sticks in the craw of some local guys, like the guy that lives 1,000 miles away knows better than the guy thats here 365 days a year. The NR's need to realize there are some "problem spots" in the state where to many NR's is the issue.

Being from this key area, ive had MANY negative run ins with NR hunters. Disrepectful, tresspassing, purposefuly screwing up others hunts, etc etc. Ive had a few run-ins with bad resident hunters, but not anywhere near the number ive had with NR's. It gets to be such a headache ive pretty much quit duck/dark goose hunting in this area and really only hunt snows now.

Opening day of NR waterfowl season last year we kicked four groups, thats right, FOUR groups of NR waterfowlers off our posted land, none of which had permission, with one group LYING to us saying they had permission and the landowner gave THEM the sign to put out! Should have seen the look on their faces when I informed them I put that sign there in August. :lol:

Non-residents just need to realize that although they themselves may be "good", theres alot out their giving them a bad name.


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## sdgoosekiller (Mar 26, 2008)

adding to barebackjack's post above. I live in SD where we have roughly 120000 NR pheasant waterfow hunters every year. yes that is 120000. they do bring alot of money into our economy but like anything its the 1% that do some that ruin it for the other 99%. We hunt a particular area and every year there is geese and ducks in the same field all year throughout the year as the migration progresses. I can't tell you how many times we have hauled out 10-15 doz goose decoys and hunted the field. This year some guys from Louisiana decided to go on an evening duck hunt and DRIVE out in the field. Remember this is along a major highway and right beside a waterfow refuge. We do hunt with out of staters and dont have problems with them but when guys come and do this it is ridiculous which is where the NR stereotype comes from in my opinion. bottom line they need to understand their week of fun does not need to ruin everyone else's season.


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## Bustem36 (Feb 5, 2008)

barebackjack said:


> Bustem36 said:
> 
> 
> > I think if people (residents and non-residents would realize that there are more places than just the one everybody mentions there would be alot less problems)


Well, alot of residents dont want to go far, especially when the huntings right out their back door, and they shouldnt be expected to.
quote]

I agree that they shouldn't be expected to, but Im not exactly talking about the guy from that immediate area. And, I don't believe that non-residents should be expected to dance around the residents scheduals or wants. Everyone should however be expected to respect eachother, there property, and there hunts.

Say a couple groups from Grand Forks goes to Jamestown to hunt because theres alot of birds around then a couple groups from East Grandforks (MN) go there for the same reason. It seems to me those residents from GF will report that there were non-residents everywhere but they don't realize that there are alot of residents there also. And these groups may live within a mile of eachother and it seems living that 1 mile the wrong way labels you a slob no talent hunter. I'm definately not trying to start anything because i've never had a problem with ND or SD residents and I follow the laws with respect for the land owners. But, it would be nice if people would realize like anything else its a case to case basis.

I don't think it matters where someone is from as long as they come and respect the land and so on.


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## Bustem36 (Feb 5, 2008)

BAREBACKJACK

I had that same thing happened to us before in ND. I was predator hunting and called this yote across a lake. A local guy drove by and must have saw the yote then the non-res plates. He came flying across the field, pulled right up to me and started chewing me out saying he posted teh land and he was the only one with permission tobe on it. I let him say his piece then mentioned who actually owned the land and that I obtained permission the day before and that the landowner used to live in Minnesota and worked for my dad's business until about 15years ago....I think what really ticked him off is when I told him I ate dinner with the land owner and his family the night before so I'm pretty sure I have permission. He shut up fast got red and raced off. I thought it was pretty funny but was kinda ticked I only got two shots of at the yote before he got to me.

Like I said in my post above...its case by case and remember for every group you have bad experiences with there are probably 10 that you never notice. ND residents are very nice people and deserve respect!


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## Plainsman (Jul 30, 2003)

> Like I said in my post above...its case by case and remember for every group you have bad experiences with there are probably 10 that you never notice. ND residents are very nice people and deserve respect!


There are bad characters all over, but still you have to make every judgement on a individual basis. 
Many of these threads simply turn into resident vs. non-resident. I responded in the hopes that if I watched it perhaps some real discussion could occur. A few got off topic, but it's not bad for the most part.

I'm a non-resident when I go to Montana, so I am careful to look at this issue from both sides. Like the people from Minnesota that come here some of the people in Montana are pleasant when we meet, others flip me off when they see my license plate. It is what it is, and I don't judge a person from Montana until I know them. It should always work that way, and we should always remember that every state has it's good people and it's jerks.


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## USAlx50 (Nov 30, 2004)

My dad brought a friend with him to hunt ND with me this fall. All weekend he was rambling about how ND is a $hithole and that the only time it is even worth thinking about is during hunting season. He wanted to hop out of the pickup and jump every little pothole he saw that was holding ducks, who cares if they're posted. Fit the bad MN stereotype to a T. "I'm only here for the weekend so F em, i need to shoot something." "who cares if its a roost, I need to shoot MY birds." That attitude p1sses me off. He wont be welcome to come out with me next year.

Of course there are good and bad, but run ins with people that have the attitude of the guy I just mentioned are common and it wears on a guys temper through the season.

All anyone can do is come with respect and try to keep opportunities available for hunters from all over the country. I spend a lot of time hunting other states as well and would like to continue to do so.


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## Plainsman (Jul 30, 2003)

> All anyone can do is come with respect and try to keep opportunities available for hunters from all over the country. I spend a lot of time hunting other states as well and would like to continue to do so.


Good attitude. Some of us have endured a lot, but still keep an open mind. Sometimes these guys create an opportunity for us. One time four guys from Minnesota were hunting south of Devils Lake. They had posted the land, and the landowner was just in the process of confronting them as I drove up. He put his finger in the air meaning wait just a second. He called his wife on the two way radio and asked her to call the game warden. He then informed the four guys that were kicking him off the land that the land belonged to him, and had for forty years. Then he asked: what do you want? Well, I didn't think I had much of a chance, but I told him the truth. He said wait until I and the game warden are done with these guys and I will drive you out and drop you at the straw piles in the middle of the field. Then he said: what time would you like to come out of the field, it's a long walk, I can pick you up. The guys from Minnesota just stood there with their mouths hanging open. I am sure he was doing it just to irritate them, but I was always welcome back there after that.
Of course I have had just as crazy things happen with North Dakota folks. One was a deputy Sheriff, but that didn't keep me from contacting the game warden. 
Don't get to angry to quick though, the next guy you meet could turn into a life long friend. You never know so don't burn any bridges that don't need burning.


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## Bustem36 (Feb 5, 2008)

Plainsman good comment on not burning bridges.

I think that is the biggest problem with residents and non-residents disrespecting people and there land. They go out there maybe once a year and don't really know if they'll ever be back in that spot again so they don't care.

I own a farm house on ten acres in central ND. My dad and his friends have been hunting the area for 30 yrs or so and rented the house one year. Then the ladies husband died so we asked if she would be interested in selling it. We don't lease any land but pay the taxes,gas, a local handyman to keep an eye on it and fix things if we can not make it out there. So I take a little pride in keeping friendly relations out there because, not only is that the way it should be, but because a lot of these folks have become friends. The mechanic even let me barrow his truck for a day when he was fixing mine.

Even the one bad experience with a landowner I had, where he actually yelled at me because other hunters (res and non-res) were causing troubles ended well. I talked him down a little and reminded him that it was not me that was causing the problems. He realized what he did and thanked me for asking unlike most people and told me I couldn't hunt there right then but come back and ask some other time. I think a lot of guys would have argued with the guy and made the situation even worse. But, since I have talked to the guy many times before I knew he was a nice guy and must have been really annoyed to go off like that.


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## Colt (Oct 25, 2007)

Bareback,

When I was a landowner in ND, I had the same thing happen to me all the time. The difference being THEY WERE ALWAYS RESIDENTS!!!!!!!


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## Plainsman (Jul 30, 2003)

Colt said:


> Bareback,
> 
> When I was a landowner in ND, I had the same thing happen to me all the time. The difference being THEY WERE ALWAYS RESIDENTS!!!!!!!


I think if they were always residents, oooooor if they were always non-residents a person has a small representation of experiences. Give it years and you will find it's about equal.

Some patterns will develop over the years you observe poor behavior. The pattern I see is the disconnect with the outdoors in general, and the disconnect with rural areas. When you observe poor behavior from a non-resident it's often someone from a very large city, with a very large income, who is used to being catered to. Still the reality is we need to judge everyone as an individual. Even when patterns develop remember they are not all jerks, just a slightly higher percentage. None of us want to be judged by the worst in our ranks. Jerks may occur 1/1000 in poor rural North Dakota and 1/990 in rich slobs from big cities. Is the difference enough to judge, or is it prejudice?

The fact is we are all hunters. Some good, some slobs. The good old boy next door and the respectful non-resident with the fat wallet from the big city should both agree to condemn the slob hunter no matter who they are. We don't know which are which until we share some time together.


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## barebackjack (Sep 5, 2006)

My attitude towards NR waterfowlers is "guarded optimism". I hope their good guys, but prepared for or expecting them to be slobs.

Sorry, but 15 years of dealing with them year after year has made me cynical.

Plainsman is right, alot of the slob residents are from the more urban areas. Sense of entitlement. I only run into a group like this maybe once every 3-5 years though.

Ill also add that most of the slob NR's I see are from our eastern neighbors of WI, MI, and MN. Again, I think its the "sense of entitlement". I run into these multiple times every year, as sure as the sunrise.

Ive run into NR hunters from 40+ states over the years, and the three states I named above are the "big three" as far as making me think the way I think.


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## Plainsman (Jul 30, 2003)

> "guarded optimism"


BBJ, I look at a lot of things in life that way. It's a good non-prejudice point of view.



> Sorry, but 15 years of dealing with them year after year has made me cynical.


I'm in the same boat, but I'm just to darn stubborn to let it make me judge someone I haven't met yet. I bet you and most people on here feel that way.



> Ill also add that most of the slob NR's I see are from our eastern neighbors of WI, MI, and MN. Again, I think its the "sense of entitlement". I run into these multiple times every year, as sure as the sunrise.


That's my experience also, but I think it's because of numbers. There are a lot more from Minnesota than Nebraska, Virginia, etc. Still, every time I meet a car load from Minnesota I am "guardedly optimistic". Some days it's tough to remain optomistic. Some days I can't do it, but I keep trying, and appreciating all the good people I meet.


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## cgreeny (Apr 21, 2004)

heck I still give a truckload of hunters out scouting the wave, regardless of where the plates say they are from. Its the experiences where say the area you hunt is all of the suddne ground zero for a large influx of birds, which shortly followed by a large influx of hunters. I had a group pull up next to me after I had been sitting and quietly watched a field build from a few birds into thousands as it was getting dark. This truck pulls up, (NR) After I had been there for several hours, and proceed to tell me they were hunting that field in the morning and I was welcome to join them, but only after they asked what kinds of gear and how many decoys I had. The best part was the field wasnt posted, fair game to everyone. Leo was there too and saw the entire conversation go down and the next morning I was set to have this group show up and hunt with us or next to us, but it never happened. I guess they meandered into the local watering hole and were sleeping it off. As it was getting light in the east another vehicle pulled into the field and drove up to our spread and asked if it was ok to hunt the ither end of the field, I said it was a 320 acre field and it was fine, I didnt own the field. Turns otu it was a bust anyways, but this rant goes to show why a few can give a bad opinion of many others. And they were from other than ND.....


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## Field Hunter (Mar 4, 2002)

What gets me when hunting fields, are the guys, residents and NRs alike that run around a good area and ask permission from 3-4 different farmers and lock up 4 different posted fields knowing full well that they are only hunting one field.

If everyone just respected everyone else there wouldn't be any problems. There are just as many NR as resident hunters that I've run into over the years that cause the problems.


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## Plainsman (Jul 30, 2003)

It sounds like we all agree it's the few individuals causing the problem, and the license plate doesn't make a large difference. Slight perhaps, but it also sounds like most of us are not biased.
I have thought for a long time that it isn't the NR that frustrates us as much as the fact that each year access gets tighter and tighter, and more people think we must pay to play. 
Hunting affects the economy more than people might think. Eventually the free hunting and the pay to play will reach an equilibrium. Unfortunately I am sure that equilibrium will include far fewer hunters. This will mean less revenue for the Game and Fish, but also less revenue for those who sell 4X4 pickups, the motels, the restaurants. They think hunting has given them a lift in some areas, but make it to much pay to play and they will loose it all. 
I think that our neighbors (non-resident) and our resident sportsmen will need each other in the future. When we talk about restricting high numbers of waterfowlers, it isn't to punish them. If we understand that and can get beyond it then we can have each others back when our gun rights are threatened, and when the anti-hunters threaten our sport.


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## barebackjack (Sep 5, 2006)

Plainsman said:


> When we talk about restricting high numbers of waterfowlers, it isn't to punish them.


 :beer: :beer: :beer:


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## Colt (Oct 25, 2007)

Everybody has a God given right to hunt those birds.

Some people abuse that right, including NR. I live in MN and know about slob hunters. I've also lived in ND for decades. Long enough to know that ND has it;'s share of slobs also.

I bowhunt multiple states every year. I can honestly say that ND hunters (not land owners) are BY FAR THE LEAST FRIENDLIEST AND MOST HYPOCRITICAL of them all. Just read this forum. Everyday, NR bashing galore. ND has an equal percentage of rogues as does any state.

Last fall when I came HOME to hunt ducks, I was amazed how when passing other hunters with ND plates, they didn't return a wave. I can't say that I have encountered that in the other states I hunt.

I LOVE TO HUNT DUCKS OVER WATER!!!!!!


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## Chuck Smith (Feb 22, 2005)

> What gets me when hunting fields, are the guys, residents and NRs alike that run around a good area and ask permission from 3-4 different farmers and lock up 4 different posted fields knowing full well that they are only hunting one field.


This is what is called scouting and having back up plans. I do this all the time no matter where I hunt. But I am not the one who locks up the field. It is the land owner if they deny permission to others.

One time I got permission and asked the land owner if anyone else did (just so I know in case of a run in.) He said nope you are the only one who has asked for permission. I show up the next day and there is a group setting up the decoys. I asked if they had permission they said yes. I just went with plan B. Later on that day ran into the land owner at local cafe. He said, "Must have had a Heck of a hunt because of all the banging." I told him it was not us and that another group was in the field. he said he never gave permission to anyone else. and this was a posted field.

Here is another one. I went and asked for permission to hunt a slough for roosters (Posted) Myself and my group... 10 of us. No problem land owner told me to have a great time and pointed out a couple of other spots we could hit on his land. Well as I was standing there (my turn to post) a pick up came flying up and started to chew me a new one. Told me I did not have permission. I let the guy rant on and then i politely ask him if the land owner lived in that house and pointed to it. He said yes. I told him I just got permission from him. The guy raced off. I left my post and told everyone to halt the hunt while I went back up to the land owner and made sure it was ok and that we were not stepping on anyones toes. He told me it was ok and asked what the truck looked like. I told him. He said that guy is not allowed on his land, his fathers land, the neighbors, etc. This guy trys to run off every NR that comes out to hunt.

Again these two stories just goes to show it is individual people not a group. Yes some have bias because of past experiences. But you have to put them aside and judge the person not the state they come from.



> I bowhunt multiple states every year. I can honestly say that ND hunters (not land owners) are BY FAR THE LEAST FRIENDLIEST AND MOST HYPOCRITICAL of them all. Just read this forum. Everyday, NR bashing galore. ND has an equal percentage of rogues as does any state.


This has no business here you are just trying to stir the pot.

Also the NR bashing has been less and less each year on this site. When I first joined the site it was an everyday thing......now it is more civil discussions. Good job guys. :beer:


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## Plainsman (Jul 30, 2003)

> I bowhunt multiple states every year. I can honestly say that ND hunters (not land owners) are BY FAR THE LEAST FRIENDLIEST AND MOST HYPOCRITICAL of them all. Just read this forum. Everyday, NR bashing galore. ND has an equal percentage of rogues as does any state.


Well, I hunt multiple states also. Sometimes I get flipped off from guys in pickups when I am on public land and I have never had a previous encounter with them. There are people like that all over. I would guess your angry about no favorite son bill or something like that passing the legislature that lets you come back home for a bargain. Maybe some states do that. I have relatives out of state, and they just happily pay the license fee.
As far as North Dakota being the lest friendly I say bull. I will go no further than that, because I refuse to start comparing people as a whole. When I go to Montana and get flipped off up in the mountains I still like Montana people. Every state has it's jerks, and some of those who flip me off perhaps don't even know themselves what they are angry about. I'm not going to waste my time and let it eat me up. Life is to short and hunting is to much fun to sweat the petty. 
Many times these threads turn ugly. I thought I would put some time into watching one and see if we could truly come to terms with the problems. Heck maybe we should get a bunch of nodak fellows together, with no concern for what state they are from. I rarely carry a shotgun, but I could make an exception just to meet a few guys.


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## Colt (Oct 25, 2007)

Plainsman,

I NEVER said I was upset about the cost of coming back to ND to hunt. Where do you get that?

I simply said that last fall, I never had a ND HUNTER return a wave. I didn't say folks in general were rude in ND. I was refering to the resident HUNTERS.

I may not live in ND, but I was born and raised there. I only live in MN because of my job. I know how friendly people in ND are. I also know how Nodaks like to shoot pheasants in the ditch and chase deer in a pickup accross a pasture during rifle season. I've spent a lifetime witnessing it on my farm. That's why it cracks me up how on this site, Nodaks like to talk smack about the unethical NR.


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## barebackjack (Sep 5, 2006)

Colt said:


> Just read this forum. Everyday, NR bashing galore. ND has an equal percentage of rogues as does any state.


Considering this thread (and if I remember correctly the last several related to this topic) was started by a NR, I dont think this paticular argument has much merit.


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## barebackjack (Sep 5, 2006)

Colt said:


> I simply said that last fall, I never had a ND HUNTER return a wave. I didn't say folks in general were rude in ND. I was refering to the resident HUNTERS.


Im not suprised one bit considering what color your plates are.

Look at it from the resident perspective. He deals with NR's in the field, some good, some bad. Than he comes on here, where the NR's bash him, name call, and tell him he doesnt know what he's talking about. ALOT of NR's on these websites act like they know the whole story. Well, im sorry, but the week they spend in this state isnt the whole story. They guy that lives here 365 days of the year, sees the before/during/after of the non-resident onslaught, HE knows whats going on. Than, the ones that try to explain it in a friendly, intelligent manner get crapped on. Theres no reasoning with some of you guys. You REFUSE to believe what we tell you because you think we're greedy gamehogs and just trying to keep you out.

Most of us dont care if you hunt water, BUT BE SMART ABOUT IT!

Most of us dont care how much money you spend here.

Most of us just want everybody, residents and nons to have a good hunt. Do you think I like having multiple run-ins with NR hunters every year? That I like having to kick tresspassers off land, being lied to, having people come in at the stroke of shooting light and sit in my lap? HECK NO! I would LOOOOVE to be able to wave and be happy go lucky to every group I come across. But sadly, by the end of the first week, theyve usually spun me into a level of pis sed off to the point where I HATE seeing them and am just sick of "giving the benefit of the doubt".

There is a day coming, and its coming soon where ND hunting will change, and I fear it may be for the worse. We need to curb this change so that ALL can benefit from it. If it means limiting the overall number of NR's, or making more units to spread out the pressure, or limiting guide/outfitter land, than that's what will have to be done. Like it or not, RESIDENTS SHOULD have precedence over NR's.


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## Bustem36 (Feb 5, 2008)

barebackjack said:


> Colt said:
> 
> 
> > Just read this forum. Everyday, NR bashing galore. ND has an equal percentage of rogues as does any state.
> ...


Wasn't the thread just started to try and understand why people feel this way? Then everybody turns it into attacks and such. Like I said before it is a person by person basis. That goes with being a slob hunter or not and that goes to why residents hate NRs.

But I will say one thing alot of the younger guys that I encounter (not all) and I went to college with don't even know why they hate NRs. They don't know when it started and they seem extremely nieve to the fact that not all NRs are like that. I respect the guys that have had bad encounters and state those encounters as individual instances but some guys need to step back and look at the big picture. Go ahead and run the slob hunters out of your state...hell I'll help...but, please don't generalize and say crap like all blue platers and sotas are slobs.

ALSO I hope to move to ND in the near future so I can hunt all the time there. I love the state and the people for the most part.


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## barebackjack (Sep 5, 2006)

Bustem36 said:


> ALSO I hope to move to ND in the near future so I can hunt all the time there. I love the state and the people for the most part.


Joining the "dark side"? :lol:

Dont laugh, as ive seen it happen with several guys. But I know several former MN residents who move here, become residents, and after a couple seasons know EXACTLY where us "game hoggin" residents are coming from.

:beer:


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## Plainsman (Jul 30, 2003)

Colt said:


> Plainsman,
> 
> I NEVER said I was upset about the cost of coming back to ND to hunt. Where do you get that?
> 
> ...


Sorry, I will admit I was guessing. Something has a bur under your saddle, and I was trying to guess what. There has been a lot of conflict as of late, and I would guess many are left thinking that there are some who think we have to share the sandbox. We don't mind sharing, but it does rub people the wrong way when we get the attitude that we have to.

I would guess that most Minnesota hunters have a good time. I would guess that if North Dakota resident hunters read this and could identify you on the road they wouldn't wave. I don't notice sometimes when people wave and I do it a couple hundred yards down the road. My wife keeps telling me: "it's not like they can see you now". I know that, but it makes me feel better. 

Since we are all trying to be honest, and since this has been relatively civil so far lets try something. Lets not get snooty with each other, but lets level with each other. What is bothering you, and why do you think those people didn't wave at you? I often get the one finger salute for no reason, but I don't let it turn me against everyone.


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## Bustem36 (Feb 5, 2008)

> Like it or not, RESIDENTS SHOULD have precedence over NR's.


I agree that your state should take care of its residents first. Limiting NRs isnt a bad idea to a point. I do see that the zone thing is/was done very badly considering the DL area gets pounded but they allow people(NR) to hunt there both weeks.

But, where do you draw the line on precedence? Not saying they shouldn't have some (like resident waterfowl opener) but it could go too far. Like hunting public lands that the purchase of NR licenses help fund. If residents don't want us to hunt them then we should have a reduction in license cost (which makes sense). And you have would have to admit that your early season makes no sense. The only reason to have early season is population control yet you take away a NRs days of general season if they participate.


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## Bustem36 (Feb 5, 2008)

barebackjack said:


> Bustem36 said:
> 
> 
> > ALSO I hope to move to ND in the near future so I can hunt all the time there. I love the state and the people for the most part.
> ...


I understand some of the arguments. I hate slob hunters too and have dealt with them in ND and MN. In both states I have had residents Pi$$ me off and NR do the same. I don't hunt with guys in Minnesota that I know are di** heads and quit hunting with ND guys in ND that hunted like slobs in there own state. A slob is a slob and a good respectful hunter is the same respectful hunter no matter what state. I would like to see Residents and NR get harsher penalties for breaking game laws. Like the msot sensable way of doing it and revoke their license for the year. That would get it through alot of guys heads that they can't mess around get alittle fine or slap on the wrist then go over the hill and do it again.


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## Chuck Smith (Feb 22, 2005)

Bust em....

That is a great point. I too have encountered many younger (20-30 year olds) and have asked why the distance for NR hunters. They can't give me an answer. They just don't like them.

Here is another story....I was in ND onetime traveling through and was at the local watering hole because I was staying over in that town when I over heard people commenting on my vehicle and how I was a NR coming to ruin hunting and what not. I told them that it was my vehicle One of the guys basicly wanted to fight me for no reason other than i was a NR. Now do I go and generalize...NO. Myself and the bartender difused the situation. Then I started a discussion with them with them about the hate towards NR. Just asked them why.....did not get any real replys other than cuz. .

Then like my two above references/stories were about people this age. When I talk with land owners and the people they have trouble with R and NR alike are people in this age group. Again I am not trying to start anything because I am only 30.

I also am not saying I know everything that is going on. I am only around a week here, weekend there, etc. But I do keep in contact with many of the people I have met in ND. One thing is the so called "HATE" towards NR is not as great as one would think if they read this post and others like it.


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## barebackjack (Sep 5, 2006)

Bustem36 said:


> > Like it or not, RESIDENTS SHOULD have precedence over NR's.
> 
> 
> I agree that your state should take care of its residents first. Limiting NRs isnt a bad idea to a point. I do see that the zone thing is/was done very badly considering the DL area gets pounded but they allow people(NR) to hunt there both weeks.
> ...


I wont argue you there. Theres MANY things our state G&F does that I think is backwards. Like allowing an unlimited number of resident and NR antelope bow tags, than limiting resident gun tags, and not allowing ANY NR gun tags.

But, something will have to give before it gets extremely bad. I just think NR's will have to and should "give" more. If we have to put a cap on NR numbers so that both residents and NR's can have better hunts, thats what should done. I feel if opportunity needs to be cut, it should be NR opportunity before resident opportunity.


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## Bustem36 (Feb 5, 2008)

I guess we agree for the most part. I think instead of "giving" more we maybe could deal with not getting some stuff. I think it wouldn't hurt for NR limits and those things but I don't believe they should hit the pocket book which is nice to see that isn't really being looked at as option.

I may support a NR limit to a point and some other changes as long as it doesn't turn into a double hit of lets give them less licenses but to make up for money lost on licenses not sold bump the price up (Resident or Non-Resident! Which I bet would happen because then the state would say well we need more money for funding these areas and by limiting licenses to NRs we are making X amount less than we normally would.


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## Chuck Smith (Feb 22, 2005)

Bust em....

That will happen if a "Cap" is put on. Then you would have to look at the PLOTS program would get less money because of less sales ($10 fee per license).

But i agree the R should come first. I have always stated use the NR for funding to a certain extent. Raise the PLOTS fee $10 more. But if you did that you would have to give up the R week only on PLOTS. But is that a fair turn around....some may say yes because more $$ goes towards more PLOTS and that would equate more land. Others would say no because they want that land to themselves.

But yes I agree that the NR should give more to a certain extent. One thing I am always afraid of is that the limiting of NR will only be a bandaid on a gunshot wound type of fix. Because a real issue is habitat loss and access. The NR has limited amount in the access issue......in some area's.

But the habitat goes with access, pressure, and bird numbers. Think about it.....if land is getting posted or limited on access it must have good habitat. So if more places had good habitat then why would that one piece of land be a hot commodity. Also then with loss of habitat that will concentrate pressure or hunters. Also loss of habitat equates less birds.

You see habitat is the root of everything. Where as NR are not the "root" but do equate to some of the problem so to speak (more hunters and possible leasing of land)


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## barebackjack (Sep 5, 2006)

Bustem36 said:


> *I guess we agree for the most part. I think instead of "giving" more we maybe could deal with not getting some stuff.* I think it wouldn't hurt for NR limits and those things but I don't believe they should hit the pocket book which is nice to see that isn't really being looked at as option.
> 
> I may support a NR limit to a point and some other changes as long as it doesn't turn into a double hit of lets give them less licenses but to make up for money lost on licenses not sold bump the price up (Resident or Non-Resident! Which I bet would happen because then the state would say well we need more money for funding these areas and by limiting licenses to NRs we are making X amount less than we normally would.


Much better wording than my example.

Ive never been in support of an overall number cap. An overall number cap will very likely increase license cost.

I am a STRONG proponent of redrawing out waterfowl units. As it sits now, their a joke. Key areas of the state get just blasted with pressure while other areas get little to no pressure. Ill use the famous Devils Lake area, year in and year out, this area just gets hammered. This area should be a unit in itself. Model the NR waterfowl units like the deer gun units. You get a first, second, third choice. You may not always get your first choice unit, but youll always get a license somewhere. This would also curb NR leasing/buying of land (not an issue yet, but will be in future years).


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## Bustem36 (Feb 5, 2008)

I think it's definately a comfort thing with people though. They hunt there and know the area, there are hotels close, and some birds around. I'm still young enough I can work on little to no sleep and the truck is still comfortable.(of course at home I sleep on the floor more than on my bed).

And, I enjoy new scenery. I make it a point to hunt other places other than the immediate area around the house so I don't over shoot areas and maybe I'll find a new spot. One of my favorite hunts was when I was younger my dad and I set no exact destination except to where the birds are. Had no idea if there wre birds. drove till we found them slept in the back of the truck got up shot birds. Drove a half day found birds and repeat.


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## blhunter3 (May 5, 2007)

North Dakota should put an over all cap on NR's. Then they should raise the price of all tag's $5, both R and NR. They really need to rezone everything to even out the pressure. Have a lottery type of deal. Then hire a couple more Game Wardens and start ticketing everyone who breaks the law.

I'm so tired of the NR bashing on this site. I have seen and kicked off NR on land in ND. I have seen how rude NR's can be. I have also seen how nice NR's can be. I have also seen R's break laws just as much if not more then NR's. Its a two way street. Both sides need to clean up their act.

This fall was my first time back hunting in ND for a couple years. I was amazed by how badly NR's act. It can be sickening. Then after seen how R's act during deer season uke:

I have also seen how polite NR's are, this winter we had some NR's drive 20 miles to ask for permission in person to shoot some does with the bow, they then asked if I could go with them to make sure they don't cross into the wrong pasture.

Over all, NR's I think should give up some things and I think that R's should also quit generalizing everyone.

In a perfect world there would be NO guides, no slobs, and enough game for everyone to have a back up field or two, but unfortunately that isn't going to happen.


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## Bustem36 (Feb 5, 2008)

blhunter3 said:


> I have also seen how polite NR's are, this winter we had some NR's drive 20 miles to ask for permission in person to shoot some does with the bow, they then asked if I could go with them to make sure they don't cross into the wrong pasture.


I did the same thing last year for Snow Geese. Thousands of geese were using a pond for a loafing area they'd sit then get up feed come back. But weren't there at night. My plats book stopped one mile short so I found the nearest landowner who was home asked them. They told me he worked in town. Drove 10miles to where he worked asked him if we could hunt there and he said he didn't mind then he pulled us into an 45min conversation about deer hunting, moose hunting, and everything else. Nice guy. We went back to the pond and as we were driving up the geese got up an flew out of site. And............never came back but now we have a few more places to hunt he couldn't believe we drove that far to get permission.


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## water_swater (Sep 19, 2006)

Your right our early season does make no sense, it ruined hunting for me. Before we had our early season I had no idea how good we could have it. Waterfowling in the Devils Lake area in October isn't extremely enjoyable. I cannot even hunt within 20 miles of Devils Lake anymore, either because of guide leases or because the birds get pounded out.

In early goose there actually fields that don't get hunted, nobody is hunting the water so you know the general area where the birds are so you don't have to drive everywhere. Also why would you want to give someone who chooses to live in ND the first crack to enjoy the resources it has. Thats unAmerican, in America whoever has the most money gets first crack!


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## dakotashooter2 (Oct 31, 2003)

I'm not so sure some of the NR problems are not instigated by some of the resident hunters. Let face it, the perception by many is that NRs are the devil and with many nothing is gonna change their mind. Even the decent NR's are often coming into a hostile environment and many are gonna "fight back " if pushed. In many cases we need to step up and lead by example. On the occasions I encountered NRs I generally try to go out of my way to try to have a positive contact with them even if I am competing for a spot.

Frankly a lot of the problems I see and hear appear to be the results of the "entitlement attitude" (on both sides) that seems so prevalent now days. Hunting IS going to hit a down trend at some point in time and fingers will likely start pointing at all the causes but the right one. :eyeroll:

Even the residents can't agree on how to regulate NRs. One guy will say the root of the problem is that the NRs cause extra pressure on the weekends ruining opportunities for all while the next will claim that since many are pressuring the birds during the weekdays they are hurting the weekend hunting. They are damned if the do damned if they don't. I have no dobt that if the NR hunting was cut out all together those who complain the loudest would still find something to complain about. :eyeroll:


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## Plainsman (Jul 30, 2003)

Unfortunately their is a snowball affect. One bad non resident ticks off ten residents and the ten residents in turn tick off ten non residents. Soon everyone is ticked. Somehow the brakes have to be put on because we are coming under fire more each year. They will find out weakest links, which will be the most unsportsmanlike hunting practices and target them. I'm not sure which is the best philosophy, to stick together now, or to clean up our house and give them little ammo to fire at us.


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