# M1 Carbine



## Stealth (Jan 15, 2004)

I am looking for a working replica of the M1 Carbine used in WWII, not the M1 Garand but the Carbine model. It uses a straight cased .30 caliber round. Was wondering if they have any rifles that are this without owning a treasure cause I'm gonna shoot it. That M1 Carbine looks just like a 10/22 lol!


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## Sasha and Abby (May 11, 2004)

www.gunsamerica.com

All you could ever want.


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## Militant_Tiger (Feb 23, 2004)

it was a world war two gun, if it lasted in those conditions im sure it can take all you can dish out


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## TANATA (Oct 31, 2003)

Militant_Tiger said:


> it was a world war two gun, if it lasted in those conditions im sure it can take all you can dish out


True


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## Whelen35 (Mar 9, 2004)

Actually, it was developed and used after WWII. Iver Johnson made several of the M1's up untill the late 60's these woul be the cheapest to find id you don't want a millitary contract M1. They will acctpt all orginal equipment and were very well built. What a great knock about gun the M1. Fun to shoot, and good out to about 100yds for the most part. I hope you find one.


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## Whelen35 (Mar 9, 2004)

Actually, it was developed and used after WWII. Iver Johnson made several of the M1's up untill the late 60's these woul be the cheapest to find id you don't want a millitary contract M1. They will acctpt all orginal equipment and were very well built. What a great knock about gun the M1. Fun to shoot, and good out to about 100yds for the most part. I hope you find one.


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## Militant_Tiger (Feb 23, 2004)

im not sure what history book you are going by but i will bet my boots that the m1 carbine was designed for use in ww2, and was used as such. it also saw some use in nam.

http://www.rt66.com/~korteng/SmallArms/m1carbin.htm
"The Carbine continued to be used in Viet Nam, until replaced by the M16.

http://world.guns.ru/rifle/rfl08-e.htm
"and lightweight shoulder arm to replace service handguns for second-line (non-fighting) troops was first issued by US Army in 1938. "


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## sdeprie (May 1, 2004)

Tiger, you're right, the M1 was meant as a replacement for the sidearm, not as a front line rifle, but many saw action because of the easy portability and low ammunition weight. It wouldn't shoot anywhere near the MI Garand, but was heads and shoulders above the 45 for range and accuracy. Many paratroops carried them with the folding stock design. It wasn't until later they gained full auto capability and 30 rd mags. Not sure exactly when, but before Korea.


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## Militant_Tiger (Feb 23, 2004)

the full auto 30 rounders were the m2 and m3 carbine, but i couldnt tell you when they were made


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## Sasha and Abby (May 11, 2004)

M-1's were manufactured for WWII. They were issued to clerks, cooks etc... those who were not normally on the front line. They were also used in Korea and Nam. Please do not try to shoot a deer with one...


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## Militant_Tiger (Feb 23, 2004)

im sure it could drop a deer with decent shot placement, you sure as heck wouldnt want to take a lung shot but i have no doubt that where legal it could.


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## sdeprie (May 1, 2004)

I suspect that you could, indeed, take a deer with a 30 carbine, but I'm not sure it is legal in any state. It has the caliber and bullet weight lacking in other rounds, but the final energy just isn't there for a definitive deer round. Besides, most (and I mean most, not all) are too inaccurate for good shot placement beyond 50 yds. That doesn't mean that if I was in survival mode, I wouldn't use one, but I wouldn't take one out for that purpose. They are a blast to shoot, though.


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## dlip (May 16, 2004)

> They were also used in Korea and Nam. Please do not try to shoot a deer with one...


thats weird, A LOT of people around here in oklahoma use m1 carbines for deer hunting, because of how light weight they are and they are a good brush gun, i wouldnt use one, just because i dont have one, and i also have a browning b.a.r. 30/06 that i will be using for deer this coming season, but i never knew those werent legal for deer hunting, i know many people who have taken deer with the ole m1 carbine, please explain why it would be illegal


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## Stealth (Jan 15, 2004)

In the great state of Texas it is illegal to use a rimfire of any kind on any legal game (this doesnt apply to rabbits, skunks etc...) Anything else is fair game, even pea shooters like the .22 Hornet are legal for deer,however I'll save my Hornet for turkey's gobbbl gobble.

Regarding the M1 I have been looking around and found a site that sells them and they want $1000 for them!!! Man, I was thinking something less than $500 for the M1. Sure its a military rifle, but it really isnt used for that purpose anymore and you'd think it'd be pretty cheap to re-manufacture those guns. I mean I dont want no antique rifle I just wanted one to go bunny bangin with.


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## sdeprie (May 1, 2004)

The reason they are illegal, at least everywhere I know of, is that you need at least 1000 ft/lb of energe AT THE DEER. Most hot reloads for the 30m1 give less than 900 at the muzzle. Will they kill deer? Sure. Is it a good idea? Well, with the controversy we have already heard, I'll let you make up your own mind. Yes. They are light and handy, but so is a Ruger in 44 mag. Gunbroker.com has one advertised at about $400. If that's what you want (small, light, pistol cartridge), MY OPINION is that there is something better available.


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## Militant_Tiger (Feb 23, 2004)

so... if i choose to shoot a deer at a half mile with a .243 and it has sub 1000 fpe at the deer that is illegal? you've got your wires crossed


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## sdeprie (May 1, 2004)

How so? It doesn't have 1000 ft/lb at a half mile, only out to a MAX of 400 yds. (If you handload HOT.) The 243 is adequate to about 400 yds, IF everything in you shooting situation is perfect. It is legal, it shoudn't be used beyond 400 yds. The 30m1 doesn't attain 1000 ft/lb at the muzzle. I fail to see the comparison. Do you have any reloading manuals? Do you have any references at all, or are you using your indigent information, which you gained where? I'm not the expert, but I do back up my opinions with facts.


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## TANATA (Oct 31, 2003)

If you look around you can find factory loads good for .243 out to 400. It may be alittle more expensive then loading yourself, but I've been doing lots of ballistics research getting ready for my first season with the good ole' .243.

Get the Federal 100g Vital Shock SierraGameKing BTSP or the Hornady 100 GR Boat Tail Spire Point LIGHT MAG. Both carry over 1000 ft/lb out to 400 yards. Only factory 243 loads that carry that much power I've found.

Off topic but o well


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## Militant_Tiger (Feb 23, 2004)

"ft/lb of energe AT THE DEER"

"30m1 doesn't attain 1000 ft/lb at the muzzle"

i dont need any information to prove that you just contradicted yourself. you said as in the first quote "AT THE DEER" which is indeed wrong. if i shoot at the max distance of the cartridge it may not have 1000 fpe, but it will still be as legal as it was at the muzzle.

if you are going to tell half truths, keep telling the same half

Tiger


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## Sasha and Abby (May 11, 2004)

Yall sing with me...

Kuhm Bah Yah...
Kuhm Bah Yah...


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## sdeprie (May 1, 2004)

Again, I fail to see your point. The definition of an adequate deer caliber is 1000 ft/lb of energy *at the deer*. Many states use different criteria for what they think will do this. Sometimes they fail. For instance, Minn. lists the 25-20 as legal for deer, even though It also does not reach 1000 ft/lb at the muzzle. How did this happen? I don't know. I didn't have anything to do with it. States don't only use this criteria, as the 223 can easily develop 1000 ft/lb. I'm not looking at my reference book, so I don't remember how far it will carry with that much energy. But in spite of the energy level, the 223 is not legal in Minn. I'll tell you what, you decide what's adequate for you, and I'll decide what is adequate for me, and I'll use what I want. I'll have a blast with a 30 carbine, but I won't take it deer hunting. If you want to, go right ahead. Also, if you're confused about that AT THE DEER concept, check with the other readers. 
Concensus, folks?


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## sdeprie (May 1, 2004)

PS: I think you better get some information and don't depend on your logic.


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## sdeprie (May 1, 2004)

Militant Tiger, I want to apologize if you take my remarks to be insulting to you. I didn't mean for them to be. However, I am sincere in advising you to get reference material and check out those numbers. The ft/lbs isn't the whole story. A standard foster 20 ga slug carries 1000 ft/lb out to 120 yds, but it doesn't have the velocity to penetrate a deer, only to knock it off of its feet, then allow it to get up and limp off, with probably a couple of broken ribs. (Happened to my brother-in-law on the LAST time he used a 20 ga in Iowa where rifles are not legal. Shotguns, archery or muzzleloaders only.) But many people have an overinflated concept of what their favorite caliber will do without substantiation except in their own experience, and experience shows us that there are people out there who regularly use a 22 RF and make one shot kills. Experience is valuable, but it also must be mixed with a true understanding of what is happening. I killed my last deer with a 358 Win. It was a one shot kill, completely obliterated the spinal column (at the neck, which was the only shot I had). Without a true understanding of the ballistic numbers I might be led to believe that it is adequate for ANY game at ANY range. The numbers simply don't bear this out. It is deadly at short to medium range, say 200 yds. The trajectory is just too loopy beyond that for accurate shooting without fancy scopework, or "Kentucky windage." I've been reading the reference materials for about 35 years, now, and while not an expert, I think I do have some pretty good concepts.


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## Militant_Tiger (Feb 23, 2004)

this is an obvious misunderstanding. you see what im getting at is that 1000 fpe at muzzle would be a good judgement, but based on the shooting distances it is impossible to say if it would retain 1000 fpe at the deer, making it an improper measurement.

Tiger


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## sdeprie (May 1, 2004)

That's why I read the references and know how much energy I have remaining at any given range for the cartridge/load I'm shooting, and making sure I have an accurate judgement of the range of the game. Or, you could just guess and use intuition...


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## Stealth (Jan 15, 2004)

You mention one rifle, and the discussion always goes to deer hunting!!! :eyeroll: :eyeroll: :eyeroll:


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## sdeprie (May 1, 2004)

Stealth, you're right. Let's get back to the subject. They're a blast to shoot, light, almost no recoil, not too loud. Wish I had 3.


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## Militant_Tiger (Feb 23, 2004)

you just said that it is illegal, meaning against the LAW to use anything with less than 1000 fpe at the deer. this however would be inaccurate and impossible to be sure of. you are now saying that you do this by choice. all im saying is that 1000 fpe at the deer is an inacurate measurement.


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## sdeprie (May 1, 2004)

No, I said that 1000 Ft/Lb is the usual measurement of adequate for deer. I also said I don't know how Minn came up with some of their legal cartridges, as they don't even begin at 1000 Ft/Lb. (Such as the 25-20.) And I also said that there are a number of 22 centerfire that do have the requisite 1000 ft/Lb but aren't legal in Minn (and some other states, Mo being one of them) simply because they are 22 cal, not becaues they don't have the energy. And they are inaccurate only as they are somewhat theoretical, but if you know the velocity of your round, it's not difficult to determine the Ft/Lb of energy at that velocity. The ballistics charts tell us what we can expect for velocity at certain given ranges for bullets of a given ballistic coefficient. If you want to say that it is inaccurate, so be it.


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## Azian (Jul 8, 2004)

I live in Montana and we have gun shows at least a few times a year. At these shows I see M-1 Carbines all the time. The range from 450 on up. I would suggest looking at pawn shops if you don't have any gun shows close by. My friend picked up a very clean M-1 real cheap at a pawn shop here in Great Falls.


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