# .357 .44 or .45 whats your thoughts



## rob1089

I was looking to get a gun I could use to hunt deer with and for home protection. I looked at the S&W in .375 & .44, both have a nice feel.I am also thinking about a .45, What is the recoil differance between them. Is it enough to make a big difference? As you can tell I am a novice in hand guns so, I thought I would ask the experts! I am really leaning towards the .44 or .45, any input?


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## Cleankill47

It's important that you find a gun that you can handle and carry comfortably. Try all three at a range so you can see how you deal with each particular caliber.

As for your options, the first choice would be the .44 Mag, since it gets the upper hand on the .357 power-wise, but ammo is also more expensive than the .357.
I don't know much about hunting ammo availability for the .45...

.45 questions, there's a few people on here that you'll have to wait for, but they'll see your post and jump on it in no time.

Most people tend to go with the .357 Mag, as you can use a greater range of ammo in one than in any of your other choices. In .357 Mag, you can use .38 special, .38 +P, .357 Special, and .357 Magnum. .38 special is the cheapest of these, and .38+P is one of the most widely used defense calibers. :2cents:

It's hard to say the recoil difference between calibers, as it changes from gun to gun. A basic rule of thumb is that the steel revolvers handle/dish out less recoil than the light alloy frames, because there is more weight to balance out the kick.


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## dlip

The deer won't be more dead with a .44 than it will be with a .357 if you hit it where you are supposed to, but the .44 offers a little more room for error. The .357, you can probably get more comfortable with it, due to the fact that you can shoot .38 specials out of it for plinking, because of low recoil, and low cost. You can also shoot .44 specials out of the .44 magnum with lower recoil, but they cost more and are harder to find. I have seen some really cheap speer .44 magnum ammo that you could plink around wiht, and you need to do a lot of shooting especially out of a handgun to get comfortable with it, and to be effective with it. If it were me, I'd buy the .357 magnum, just because of the variety of ammo, good ammo availability, and you can shoot .38 specials out of it. I hope I helped you out some.


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## huntin1

As to the 45, check the regulations in your state, some states go by cartridge length and the 45 is not long enough.

The 44 mag. packs more energy and has more recoil as well, it is a better choice for deer hunting.

The 357 mag will work OK for deer just not quite as good as the 44. But then if you make a decent shot the deer ain't going to know the difference.

I agree with dlip, the 357 offers a much wider range of ammo and is easier to learn how to shoot with, than the heavy recoil of the 44.

Any of the above are good self defense calibers

huntin1


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## Plainsman

I shot two deer with a 357, then switched to a 44. I only kept one 357 because I really don't need one for anything other than a third or fourth choice for concealed.
Don't forget about all the 44 special loads out there. Even in 44 mag the energy will range from 700ft/lb to over 1000 ft/lb. Then there are some of the custome hot loads that will take you over 1200 ft/lb. With the 44 special that gives you loads from 310 ft/lb to 1200 ft/lb. 
My favotite load is a 240gr hardcast and 9 gr Unique. Out of my 8 3/8 inch Smith I get 1150 fps. I shoot cottontails with it without much damage.
I also have a 4 inch Smith and that drops my velocity with my favorite load to (I can't remember right off hand). The 4 inch was all old Elmer Keith ever shot. 
The hot 300 gr loads get unpleasant in the 4 inch.


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## rob1089

Thanks for all the info so far. It's great to be able to hear from people that are not just trying to sell you a certain product.


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## natemil373

Huntin1-I have found you to be very knowledgable in most of your posting so I certainly am not criticizing-I think that Rob1089 was referring to the .45 Colt not the .45 ACP, in which case most states will allow it for deer hunting. The 45 Colt will compare very well with the 44 mag, in fact with handloads it will actually slightly beat it in power as you can use heavier bullets. The .45 Colt is a great choice if you handload, but not the best if you don't. Most factory loads are loaded down pathetically to dealt with the pressure constraints of the old .45's out there. There are a few loads that will utilize the power of this round, but they usually are not widely available and the ones that I have seen are expensive. I would go with the .44 mag if I was a beginner, or the .45 if I was a little more experienced and was seroiusly looking at handloading. The .357 will certainly take down a deer with a well placed shot, but I think that I would be more satisfied in the long haul with the .44 mag or .45 Colt.


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## Burly1

My take on Rob's original post is that he was considering wheelguns. With that in mind, here are my thoughts. I agree that the .45 Colt is a great choice for deer hunting as well, particularly when loaded up for the Rugers and T/Cs. I must however give the edge to the .44 when considering our friends quest for a home defense weapon. As Plainsman stated, the .44 special will provide all you need in a defense cartridge without beating you up. The .44 mag, with nearly any factory load over 200 grains, is a good deer hunting cartridge, when ranges are kept reasonable. I have to disagree about the .357 for deer. Maybe it's just my bad fortune, but I have seen some poor performance with the .38/.357 on game and can not recommend it. Examining available bullet weights for the different cartridges might better support my views. When speeds are lower, greater bullet weight will deliver more punch to the target. I'm not saying that a .38/.357 will not take a deer cleanly, but as an experienced handgunner, it would not be my first choice. Good shooting, Burl


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## Remington 7400

For deer most people are really better off with the .44 mag, but if you have a extremely accurate gun and are confident the .45 will surely take them out!


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## huntin1

My bad, you guys are probably right about him meaning the 45 colt, got 45 ACP on the brain here lately. Chief finally approved them for carry here and I've been trying to decide if I should get one or just stay with my 40 S&W.

huntin1


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## Remington 7400

huntin1

Buy the .45 ACP you WILL NOT be dissapointed. Get a 1911, COCKED LOCKED AND READY TO ROCK! Yeah Baby! 

:beer:


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## huntin1

Considering a Kimber, but man I love my Sig!

huntin1


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## Bore.224

Remington 7400 said:


> huntin1
> 
> Buy the .45 ACP you WILL NOT be dissapointed. Get a 1911, COCKED LOCKED AND READY TO ROCK! Yeah Baby!
> 
> :beer:


Yeah and then prey the bad guy does not have a modern pistol and can put three rounds throught you before you thumb off the safety on that 1911!! :lol:


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## huntin1

Anyone with any handgun training, or who has taken the time to practice can thumb the safety off as the pistol is clearing leather and match your "modern" gun shot for shot. I've done it, and had it done to me more than once while shooting competition.

huntin1


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## Remington 7400

> Anyone with any handgun training, or who has taken the time to practice can thumb the safety off as the pistol is clearing leather and match your "modern" gun shot for shot. I've done it, and had it done to me more than once while shooting competition.


That is so true!

:beer:


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## rob1089

BURLY WAS RIGHT I AM THINKING ABOUT GETTING A WHEELGUN. SO FROM WHAT I'VE READ HERE I'M THINKING OF GETTING THE 44 OR THE 357, BUT LEANING TOWARDS THE 44. I'LL HAVE TO GO TO THE GUN STORE AND SEE WHAT THEY HAVE TO OFFER.BUT FIRST I HAVE TO SELL A 7MM MAG I WON AT A WHITETAILS UNLIMITED BANQUET SO I'LL HAVE SOME EXTRA CASH.


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## Burly1

Bore, Re: the "old 1911" vs. the "modern" pistols; if you acquaint yourself with people who carry 1911's to fill a genuine need for self defense you'll find an interesting fact. The majority, excepting many of those who were subject to military training, which is designed to account for the "idiot factor", carry cocked and locked with the thumb safety off. The thumb safety on the 1911 is a redundant device. The grip safety provides all anyone needs to feel secure in it's carry without the thumb lever. The trigger safety on Glocks, and some other "modern" pistols mimics this type of safety and it's function. Take a look at what's winning practical pistol matches around the world. 90% are pistols built on the 1911 platform. Slow? I think not.................................
When the new deputy noticed that the old sheriff carried his well worn 1911 cocked and locked, thumb safety off and stuffed into the waistband of his jeans, he questioned, pointing at the offending pistol; "Sir, isn't that dangerous?". After taking in the new kid for a moment, the old lawman replied; "Well son, if it wasn't dangerous, it wouldn't do me much good, now would it?" :wink: Shooting fast can get you dead. Shooting straight will get you home. Burl


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## dlip

Bore.224 said:


> Remington 7400 said:
> 
> 
> 
> huntin1
> 
> Buy the .45 ACP you WILL NOT be dissapointed. Get a 1911, COCKED LOCKED AND READY TO ROCK! Yeah Baby!
> 
> :beer:
> 
> 
> 
> Yeah and then prey the bad guy does not have a modern pistol and can put three rounds throught you before you thumb off the safety on that 1911!! :lol:
Click to expand...

What a ridiculous statement. You have much experience with one? Heck guys, I don't even like carrying mine with the hammer back when I'm in the deer woods, I'm not old enough for CCW, but when I carry mine on my hip, I have on in the chamber, but I always keep the hammer at half cock position. I've practiced enough of having it like that on the draw that I can get it back from the transition from holstered before it is unholstered. I can't believe you'd think that the thumbsafety on the 1911 was half slow if you had any experience with it.


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## Bore.224

dlip no I do not have much experiance with the 1911, however it just makes sence anything extra you need to do to get the gun ready to fire is slowing you down!
Burly1 without the thumb safety on, would that be called cocked and not locked? I sure hope that old Sheiff still has his balls after carring a pistol like that :lol: 
hunting1 yes anyone with training can thumb off the safety fast I agree, I also think anyone with training and practice could use a Ruger Blackhawk singleaction as well. Lets face it the 1911's time has come and gone its still good but their are better choices now.
I wish you guys lived around here we could all meet bring yer 1911's and we will set up three 1 gallon milk jugs filled with water at say 10-15 yards. Evrybody bring $100 dollars and throw it in a hat, the guy who can draw and splash the 3 water jugs the fastest can wear the hat home. I will use a Beretta 92FS Good luck you will need it!!


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## Longshot

Bore.224

Ya thats why they use this for IPSC and USPSA because the 1911 platform is so slow. Your not going to see your Beretta with them. Think again!










:eyeroll:


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## Burly1

After reading your opinion of the 1911, the only conclusion I can come to is that you are one of the many who was unable to master the 1911 platform. Don't feel bad. It is a big scary looking pistol. That is indeed why the armed forces abandoned it in favor of the Beretta. Well, that and spray and pray logic. It is also why many elite forces, who have their choice of armament, have returned to the 1911 platform as the very best available when the rubber meets the road and their own survival is on the line. Burl


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## huntin1

Dang Bore

I wish you were closer, I could use some extra cash. 8) 

huntin1


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## Bore.224

Longshot , that is not a carry gun! Looks like M TV's version of PIMP MY GUN. :lol: 
Burly1 when I was in the US Army from 1987-1990 MP's still carried 1911's without a cartidge in the chamber. To ready the weapon they would have to rack the slide "real fast huh".And What is so hard about mastering the 1911? 
huntin1 I would love the challenge game on!!


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## Burly1

Hi Bore, So what does whatever MP's did way back when have to do with the correct way to carry a 1911? I'll answer that for you. Not much. By the by, if you lose the comp and no-mag sight , niether of which does much to enhance speed, That STI in the picture is a great carry gun. Even though you have been repeatedly schooled, you choose to ignore what the real word calls a good carry gun, and how it is carried by those who know how and have the confidence to use it. In your mind at least, you win! Enjoy that spray and pray special. Burl


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## Bore.224

You guys got me all wrong, all I was saying is I think their are better choices nowadays than the 1911. Face it a 1911 wishes it could do what a Glock or a Sig can do. Also the .357 sig and the .40 S&W are better cartridges than the .45 ACP , they hit just as hard if not harder, recoil less and you can stuff more of em in a magazine. Sorry guys I know you like the old mule and it hurts to take it out and shoot it, but its the 21st century now lets get with it. 
By the way I never spray and prey!! Good shooting


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## Burly1

The only thing that was right in your last post.......is that you are sorry. 
I'm done. Burl


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## Remington 7400

The 1911 will never die! It is the king of pistols! The .357 Sig only dreams it could do what the 1911 .45 is capiable of!

But I'm with Burl, enough is enough, if we can't change your mind, at least respect our opinions enough to not bash our choice handgun.


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## Longshot

Bore

Watch a factory USPSA shoot some time and you will see that +90% are 1911 style handguns ranging from 9mm to 45 acp. The last one I shot in had one Glock and 30some 1911's. The latest is not always the greatest.

Later, I'm done.


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## huntin1

Man we are really hijacking this thread here, so this is my last word.

I really like my Sig P229, but there is a reason why the 1911 platform dominates the competition circut. It's dependable, accurate and IT WORKS.

I'm done too.

huntin1


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## People

Hunting1 you are right we are hijacking this thread.

Any ways I vote for the 44mag. It will give you a little more room for error. If you like single action you can get one in either 45colt (not ACP) or 44mag. Me I do not like the single action besides in a .22LR. If you want a revolver that is reasonable for cost. I would say look at a Taurus. I just bought one from CDNN with the 12inch bbl. It is crazy long. The recoil is pretty stout but this thing does shoot very well. I was shooting 4inch groups at 100yds with it(with a rest I am not that good). Granted this was shooting at a big sheet of plywood with no real aiming point. I fired three and then walked around to let my hand cool down. Then fired three more. There was no real aiming point I had two groups that were very close to in appearance to each other but were a total of one foot.

Personally I could deal with 5.5 inches less on the tube. I do not know how much more it would kick.

The recoil was a little more than what I thought it was going to be but as long as you take your time and think about your shots and the gun will do the rest. These have a trigger stop and a very good trigger. Well worth $375 out the door. Heck with that kind of savings you can buy a lot of reloading components.


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## Bore.224

I am done to, must have ****** of the 1911 gods having problem with my Beretta !!!! 
But to adress this thread Go with the S&W 686 .357 magnum with a 6 inch barrel you will not be dissapointed.


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## huntin1

Bore.224 said:


> Go with the S&W 686 .357 magnum with a 6 inch barrel you will not be dissapointed.


Now there's a statement I agree with. If you choose the 357 you will not find any better handgun that the S&W 686!

huntin1


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## wyogoose

I have a S&W mountian pistol in .44 with a 4" barrel. The only thing I use it for is mountain lion hunting and griz bear protection. It is extrememly light and easy to carry but I have to be honest it does jump pretty good. Good luck to you in whatever your choice.


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## Scooter

As far as a go to pistol for carry home defence and hunting my vote goes to the .44 mag. Now for my 2 cents on the other topic I carry a Para Ordinance LDA TAC FOUR. It is a DA only 1911 style pistol and is carried with one in the tube all you have to do is draw and squeeze can't get much faster than that! But it is also a 45 ACP to me you can't do better than that for defence. I have come to this conclusion by firing every handgun that I could get my hands on from 22lr to .500 S&W Magnum. These pistols have been made from more manufactures than I can remember both revolvers, autos and single shots. Now as far as the number of rounds in the mag goes to me that is a mute point today do to the hi-cap .45 I carry 13+1 of .45 ACP. Now hunting1 one I have owned Kimber's hi-cap .45 and got rid of it quikly because it was not a good pistol it jammed out of the box and was sent back and returned 5 weeks later with the same problem after a hastle with costumer service. I will never own a Kimer again stick with Sig Saur or my favorite now Para Ordinance!


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## Longshot

I have had a full size Kimber 1911 for about 6 years now and love it. I have had no problems. I had also bought a Kimber Eclipse II a couple years ago that I did not like. It had a really bad trigger and would jamb too much. It may have been a lemon. I got rid of it for a STI LS that I'm very happy with.


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## mr.trooper

Personaly, i like the .357 or the 45 Colt. The 44 is fine too.


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## Dave_w

Well, if we're gonna talk CCW, a Glock chambered in .45ACP is going to win every time. Although really, you don't need a .45 for self-defense against critters of the two-legged variety. What you need is the ability to take whatever you have and put the holes where they count. A .357 does nothing if you graze his shoulder, or miss.

Although...if you run out of ammo, those big .44-mags CAN be used to beat the bugger to death...although in that case, I like the S&W 500 j/k


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## NDTerminator

As to the original question; you can take deer with a 357, but after having done it a couple times, I decided the 357 isn't the way to go. Expansion is always iffy at handgun velocities with all calibers and the 357 is just not a big enough bullet when your shot doesn't go as planned.

Don't know about Michigan but in ND, the 45ACP isn't legal for deer hunting. Much as I love the 45ACP for defense, I wouldn't use it for deer hunting even if it was legal. Plenty of bullet, but the limited case capacity means you can only get so much velocity out of it, which translates into limited penetration.

That leaves the 44 Mag. This is my choice for hunting, and although not the best choice for home defense, it will do that job very well. It is just too big for every day CC, however.

The key to versatility with the 44 mag is handloading. Essentially every factory load is maxed out for hunting. This makes them great game killing loads, but fairly uncomfortable to shoot & difficult to control w/o regular practice. They are also pricey.

My do everything hand load for the 44 mag is 17.0 grains of 2400 and a Laser Cast 240 grain hard cast lead round nose flat point. This load chroni's just under 1200 FPS out of my 6.5" Taurus M44. It is very accurate and penetrates like there's no tomorrow. The 44 caliber bullet is essentially "pre-expanded", so it makes a nice big hole through the vitals. This load quite pleasant to shoot and fairly easy to control.

Ideally, I would get a get a 40 S&W or 45ACP in whatever flavor hits your switch for home defense/CC, and a 6"-6.5" 44 mag for hunting...


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## Bore.224

Take a look at the Glock 20 , 10mm this could be the best do all gun!!


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## Dave_w

10mm won't be enough to do a deer properly, if that's what he's looking for. And really...is the 10mm anything special? The FBI used it for a while but dropped it. IMHO, it just makes buying ammo a little complicated.

And upon further reflection, I've decided it's probably unwise to use the same gun for both hunting deer and home defense. The two are just two dissimilar. Overpenetration is a bigger problem than most people think when they pull the trigger in their own home, and slinging .357 mags around won't make that any better.

Talk to the deer hunters if you're looking to use a handgun to take deer (as in using it to make the primary shot, not finish off a wounded one). 9mm would be sufficient to for home defense and two-legged threats in the woods, although when you're in the woods, you've got a much better weapon at hand--a rifle or shotgun. I agree, there are a lot of crazies out there, but carrying a sidearm is superfluous when you have a long gun. If you need protection against random predators like coydogs, you'll need something heavier than that, and you'll have to go to the experts for that one, too. If you're thinking about bear, just forget it. Handguns aren't going to stop bear in anything approaching a reliable fashion.


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## mr.trooper

Dave_w said:


> 10mm won't be enough to do a deer properly, if that's what he's looking for. And really...is the 10mm anything special? The FBI used it for a while but dropped it. IMHO, it just makes buying ammo a little complicated.


What a load of crap.


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