# carbon or aluminum



## Albertahunter (Oct 25, 2005)

what do u prefer carbon or aluminum, i cannot decide whether to get more aluminums or try out carbons.


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## dogdigger (Jan 26, 2004)

i am assuming you are hunting with them? i highly recommend easton axis. super tough, you can shoot them into the ground at squirrels and go pick them up and they are fine. they fly great and also they use HIT tech. which is an insert that is deeper into the shaft and aligns the broadhead with the shaft instead of with the insert itself.

mark


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## Reflex (Feb 27, 2006)

My friends have had nothing but trouble with the HIT. They don't hold up very well at all. As far as an arrow that you can go out and beat the crap out of I would look into C2's. Easton and Beaman carry them. They are the excact same arrow,(same customer service number and same tech guys....they are made in Utah) but with a different name on the side. Easton doesn't sell them anymore, but you can get them from Beaman cheaper anyways.


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## dogdigger (Jan 26, 2004)

they didnt hold up? i shoot axis out of a 70 pound bow shooting 295fps and i killed a turkey, 3 deer , was with a friend that took two deer, i shot praire dogs, squirrels, shot into trees and never had a HIT insert come out or fail. beman arrows dont have the same quailty control and easton and thus arent as straight. they use a different technique to get their straight factor.

mark


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## Reflex (Feb 27, 2006)

The C2's are made by the same company. Not Easton or Beaman, some company in Utah. I have shot Easton for years, I like Easton. I would be using C2's from Easton if they had them still, but they don't. As for Beamans not being as straight...

http://www.duckhuntingchat.com/viewtopic.php?t=17348

They shoot fine to me. I am not saying that Easton is the worst company in the world, but they have had better products than the axis with the HIT. If they work good for you than thats awsome. I ain't gonna lie to Albertahunter who asked the question. C2's are built tough and are a little cheaper.


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## dogdigger (Jan 26, 2004)

what ever you say man, as for the pic of the robin hood? i had two robin hoods in the last two weeks doesnt prove anything besides i am an idiot and should be shooting at different spots.

mark


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## dogdigger (Jan 26, 2004)

as for the C2 are you talking about the easton epics? they reworked the insert for those also for 06 and they are also tough as nails.

mark


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## Reflex (Feb 27, 2006)

No they are not Epics......I apologize. HIT is the best technology in bow history....please forgive me archery god :bowdown:

Have you seen anyone shoot the Epics, C2's or any other arrow besides the Axis? My old man shoots the Epics...he loves them. Two of my friends shoot the Axis....they don't care for them much. They like the way they fly, just not the way look after a few missed shots. I just ordered some Epics for my dad and I am looking forward to seeing the new insert. Like I said before, if the Axis with HIT works for you, then great. I am sure Albertahunter wanted more than on person input. I posted what I have seen and what arrows I like. Just like you posted the arrows you like. Sorry we disagree dogdigger. I have read alot of your posts and never wanted a problem with you.


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## Reflex (Feb 27, 2006)

Maybe we can just agree to disagree :beer:


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## buckseye (Dec 8, 2003)

I like aluminum they are heavier and hit harder. i like to see a deer fold a little when it's hit.


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## oatsboy (Mar 29, 2005)

the answer you give to these questions might help you decide.

* do you have stash of old aluminum arrows around that you plan on revamping some day, but deep down you know you never will because you won't be able to trust them when it counts?

*if you do have an aluminum arrow thats been reconditioned would it be on your rest if your in your tree stand or in a shoot?

* have you ever had the misfurtune during transport to camp or to stand were your not sure wheather you bent your alluminum arrows or not?

* would you ever contemplate feeling confident to be able to pull an alluminum arrow out of a hillside or after passing through a buck and reuse it without a trip to the range first?

for myself ,with thirty-+ years of lofting arrows confidence in my equipment is the secrete to being a successfull archer, i shoot carbon for no other reason. although i feel very confident that my old alluminum arrows make great plant stakes.


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## buckseye (Dec 8, 2003)

yes to all of the above, I think arrows are commonly blamed for shooter error. Think of all the years before carbon arrows were invented, many world and Olympic titles were won with aluminum arrows.


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## dogdigger (Jan 26, 2004)

yes i have shot many different kinds of arrows. i currently shoot 2613 for spots, axis and a/c/c 's for target and hunting and easton fatboys for 3d. i try out every arrow that comes through the shop. i am also an easton staff shooter and i get to try things out before most guys will even see them. i am not talking about what my friend did or some guy i talked to, i am talking from first hand experience. I really like the new epics they are very tough and they use a hybrid insert the is a cross between the HIT and a normal insert. I have in the past shot goldtip and carbon express and they both aso make a quality product. also for a hunting arrow this year easton came out with the full metal jacket. even heavier than an axis for deeper penetration.

mark


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## Reflex (Feb 27, 2006)

How much them FMJ arrows run a dozen? Not trying to be a smart-a$$, just curious. I may give those a go.


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## dogdigger (Jan 26, 2004)

they retail for about $105 a dozen. a little more than the axis but about $50 less than the a/c/c So far they seem to be very tough and they are heavy. I will say if anyone is interested in a good hunting arrow the epic's are great for the price i believe about $65 a dozen. the FMJ can bend but they are much tougher than a regular alum. shaft due to the carbon inner. I dont mean to come off as an *** but i jsut get frustrated when people say they heard someone that didnt like something or had trouble with something but they have no first hand experence. You ever done that game where you get in a circle and tell person number 1 something and they repeat it and it goes around and when it comes to person number ten its somthing completely different? There are guys out there and i am sure on here that know alot more about archery than i do. But i do have alot of first hand experence because i do this everyday and i get to shoot all kinds of crap at the shop.

mark


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## Starky (Mar 15, 2006)

Mark, which shop were you refering to?


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## dogdigger (Jan 26, 2004)

valley archery in east grand forks, mn


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## dogdigger (Jan 26, 2004)

i am a staff shooter for bowtech through them and i also work there part time.

mark


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## Reflex (Feb 27, 2006)

Thanks for the info. I will get off my :soapbox: :lol: I like the a/c/c's but I have never shot them. They are pretty spendy. If my old man likes the new Epics better than the old ones I may give them a go.


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## oatsboy (Mar 29, 2005)

buckseye

how true,and on the same note there were many a fine cowboy shot with wooden arrows.all kidding aside though,i feel if someone asks a question whether to change ones equipment he must think what he is using is inadequate or why change.

this guys obviously on the fence,hes seems not to be one to fix something thats not broken,unlike some poor few that get fooled into trying every new bow every new gimic and gadget that hits the market.


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## dogdigger (Jan 26, 2004)

for the a/c/c 's i jsut started shooting them this year. I am amazed how well they fly and how consistant they are. the 2 dozen i have weighed within 1.5 grains fully built. for me carbon arrows are great, what happens if you have a quiver full of alum. arrows and you drop you bow or get it caught on something and some get bent? with carbons you never have to worry. alum. arrows are straighter and more consistant but for the average hunter he would never be able to see any difference, i dont even see much different till i get out to 40 yards. if you like what your shooting then shoot them, if you have alum. left use them up this year then if you want try something different next year. you can jsut get a half dozen to test, 6 epics ready to shoot will run you about $40. :beer:

mark


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## buckseye (Dec 8, 2003)

oatsboy

I agree use what you want and don't be afraid to experiment. I tend to advocate methods and equipment that has stood the test of time, sorta like me...lol.

I like the weight of the aluminum arrow shaft, I'm a little over 500 gr. when tipped and ready to shoot. There's something about watching the deer hit the ground from the impact of a quartering away shot that keeps me shooting the old dinosaur stickers.


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## dogdigger (Jan 26, 2004)

with a full metal jacket in 340 spine (normal spine for a 70 pound bow) with arrow at 29" and a 125 grain tip you be right at 500 grains.

mark


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## dogdigger (Jan 26, 2004)

a regular camo axis would put you about 475 with a 340 spine and a 125 gr tip or 500 with a 300 spine depending on you bow and poundage and draw length.


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## Goldy's Pal (Jan 6, 2004)

> for the a/c/c 's i jsut started shooting them this year. I am amazed how well they fly and how consistant they are.


Exactly, I went to them 12 years ago and haven't thought of another arrow. If you don't notice tighter groups with these arrows your bow is screwed up somewhere.


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## buckseye (Dec 8, 2003)

Thanks mark

I'm going to try some sometime. I shoot crossbow and the velocity is around 350fps, combined with that weight it is awesome. I've been looking for carbon crossbow bolts and haven't found any yet. They have to be the exact diameter to travel in the rail system on the Barnett bow I have. Any suggestions? Thanks again


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## dogdigger (Jan 26, 2004)

you are shooting a 500gr bolt at 350fps? first off let me state i dont know anything about cross bows. i do know easton makes a carbon bolt you could put weight tubes in them to get the weight up. i dont know how you would get it up to 500 gr without puting sand in it. its 10.4 an inch i think.

mark


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## buckseye (Dec 8, 2003)

yeah its a quad 400 Barnett. The bolts are 20 in. long without tip. It's pushing the 500 so hard its fishtailing I don't think I would dare go lighter.


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## dogdigger (Jan 26, 2004)

what bolts are you shooting now?

mark


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## dogdigger (Jan 26, 2004)

ok buckseye. i did some research for ya. the bolts you are shooting are about 13.6 GPI. i am guessing 2219. barnett recommends at least 450 grains for the quad 400 and a 22 inch bolt with a 125 grain tip, straight from their site. if you are wanting to shoot a carbon i have two options for you there are other but this is what i came up with. same arrow jsut two different lengths. both would need the 3 GPI weight tubes which are super easy to install all you need a tape a some scissors. here is a link to the tubes. http://www.lancasterarchery.com/shop/pr ... ebacf8e2db

first choice:
20" easton carbon power bolt
shaft weight 210 grains
vanes with glue ~ 25 gr
insert 43 gr
half moon nock 12 gr
19" 3GPI weight tube 57gr
tip 125gr
TOTAL 472 GRAINS

second choice:
22" easton carbon power bolt
shaft weight 231gr
vanes with glue ~ 25 gr
insert 43 gr
half moon nock 12 gr
21" 3GPI weight tube 63gr
tip 125gr 
TOTAL 499 GRAINS


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