# @#$% Roadhunters



## Recurvenator

During this weekend, I witnessed 6 different vehicles (all North Dakota plates) shooting pheasants in the road ditches along my property. This happens every year and I'm getting sick and tired of it. It gets even worse during deer season. :******: :******: :******:

Why are so many North Dakota "hunters" such slobs? :eyeroll: :eyeroll: :eyeroll:


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## rd51

It happens on our property alot. Our property is posted very clearly and they shoot the pheasants and run out get them. We've confronted the ones we catch and their line is, "We were ditch hunting". They know the laws they just push it. This year there's no listening to the BS; we'll just report the license number. That goes for deer also.


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## deacon

I have a couple of solutions.

1. Let me hunt your land and I will beat the road hunters to the birds (definitely my preference) :beer:

2. Legalize road hunting like every state surrounding ND. Never could understand how road hunting is legal in ND, yet illegal if land next to ditch is posted, very confusing.


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## averyghg

I am in no way for road hunting, BUT.......when many land owners post their land tighter than shiat expecting people to come in and pay them to hunt birds and or "save" their spots for only a select few people, what do you expect? Yes plots are great, but come NR opener for legal plot shooting they all go down the crapper for a while. (speaking for the western part of the state)


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## duckp

Prosecute all the ditch pigs!


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## takethekids

We had a very similar experience in ND. My friend bought land up there and we mistakenly planned our trip during deer rifle season (I think it was season....Thanksgiving w/e last year) and some goons w/ ND plates were shooting deer out the window, IN THE FIELD WE WERE HUNTING. Then we heard them tear down the road a ways and boom, boom, boom, more shots. It was evident (saw the tracks later) that they were actually driving through the fields shooting them out the window. I've never seen that sort of thing in KS.

We went to a farmer's house later that day and found a nice buck corpse, just rotting in one of his hedgerows. It had not been cleaned. We got done hunting and he showed us the head. My guess is the ND residents have done as much or more to piss off the landowners in the area as NR's have......I hunted in SD w/ residents/locals and they were doing the same thing to pheasants. 3 kids bragged about their opening w/e road hunt. The were "just a few short of 70" roosters for the day and didn't pick any of them up b/c they "don't like eating them."


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## eliptiabeht

This thread alone proves we have far more to worry about in the eyes of the non-hunting public than a few farm raised animals being harvested!! :eyeroll: Hell some of these free lancers blame the landowner and want it legalized!! :eyeroll:


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## teamflightstoppersND

Dont bash road hunting, its ok in moderation. This ditch hunting posted land will only increase as more landowners post there land.


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## the professor

two thoughts come to mind after reading some of these posts.

1. its just as easy to put a conservation officer's phone number on speed dial as it is to ***** on a forum.
2. mow the ditches. problem solved. :wink:


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## Savage260

Recurve, what is it about these people hunting that upsets you so? I know they are not supposed to be hunting a ditch adjacent to posted land, but are they depositing trash, or tearing up the ditch, or what is it that makes you so angry? Is it just the fact they are hunting right next to your posted land?


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## Dave R

I personaly don't like that they are just out to "Kill, Kill, Kill". They kill the animals and leave them alot because they have no clue what to do with the body after they shoot them. I'm sure every person knows somebody that could use the extra meat for their family rather than let it waste away on the road side for a quick few seconds of excitement.

My main problem is that I've seen (and hunted with) people that jump out of a moving vehicle and blast away like young guns not caring what's behind their target. A buddies dog was shot for being behind a few birds that were spooked up at his place by a couple of road hunting guys. He was on his property and wanting to get at the birds from the other side of the pond. Many road hunters take it too far and give the legit guys a bad name.

I've tried to teach a few guys how to clean their animals only to have them go out to get more than they were allowed and start only cleaning a few but shooting more. I even had 2 guys shoot deer and bring them to me for gutting and they were mad that I wouldn't help them unless they put their tag on the animals.

Why not perfect the entire sport rather than just kill for the hell of it?

Dave


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## wurgs

Land posted is closed to hunting which unless the road has a purchased right of way is to the section line, which is typically the center of the road. Interstates, US, and State highways and paved county roads are usually purchased ROWs with most others just using easements. More often then not if shooting in the ditch of posted land its illegal.


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## blhunter3

teamflightstoppersND said:


> Dont bash road hunting, its ok in moderation. This ditch hunting posted land will only increase as more landowners post there land.


There is always land for sale.....


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## Savage260

There is always land for sale.....

True, but there are only a select few who have the cash to buy it. It sure as heck isn't those who are hunting birds in the ditch!!!


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## indsport

from the North Dakota regulations:

"Do not hunt on road rights of way unless you are certain that they are open to public use. Most road rights of way are under the control of the adjacent landowner and are closed to hunting when the adjacent land is posted closed to hunting."


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## duckp

Professor,
Why not *****?
Lots of us mow our ditches but there's a core group of ditch pigs that set out with the intent,yes INTENT,to violate the law.The bird NEVER or certainly rarely is in the 'ditch' as legally defined.They see the bird on your land,posted or not,they jump out,send their dogs,shoot the flushed birds,lay down their guns and retrieve the bird if their dog doesn't.
As to speed dialing a CO,why?Are you lonesome?If not,don't waste your time.The sheriff maybe.What some of us here in SoDak may start doing is request their license(legally mandatory for them to show it-and failure to do so may actually mean a serious criminal prosecution)and with that info sue them for civil trespass and damages.Win or lose,a suit for say 10K is something few can ignore if they have a job.


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## 9manfan

duckp said:


> Professor,
> Why not b#tch?
> Lots of us mow our ditches but there's a core group of ditch pigs that set out with the intent,yes INTENT,to violate the law.The bird NEVER or certainly rarely is in the 'ditch' as legally defined.They see the bird on your land,posted or not,they jump out,send their dogs,shoot the flushed birds,lay down their guns and retrieve the bird if their dog doesn't.
> As to speed dialing a CO,why?Are you lonesome?If not,don't waste your time.The sheriff maybe.What some of us here in SoDak may start doing is request their license(legally mandatory for them to show it-and failure to do so may actually mean a serious criminal prosecution)and with that info sue them for civil trespass and damages.Win or lose,a suit for say 10K is something few can ignore if they have a job.


Do all of that because they shot a pheasent in your ditch,,, they must be worth alot of money I guess,,,


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## rowdie

duckp said:


> Professor,
> Why not b#tch?
> Lots of us mow our ditches but there's a core group of ditch pigs that set out with the intent,yes INTENT,to violate the law.The bird NEVER or certainly rarely is in the 'ditch' as legally defined.They see the bird on your land,posted or not,they jump out,send their dogs,shoot the flushed birds,lay down their guns and retrieve the bird if their dog doesn't.
> As to speed dialing a CO,why?Are you lonesome?If not,don't waste your time.The sheriff maybe.What some of us here in SoDak may start doing is request their license(legally mandatory for them to show it-and failure to do so may actually mean a serious criminal prosecution)and with that info sue them for civil trespass and damages.Win or lose,a suit for say 10K is something few can ignore if they have a job.


If your from SD, its leagal to shoot them in the road right of way!? Unarmed retreival is defined in the hunting handbook in SD. So thats why you want to call the sheriff, and not the CO, because the CO is going by the book. The law is clear that they are not supposed run up to the fence and shoot them on your land. I'm sure that it happens, but I'll bet if you watched someone leagally shoot a bird in the ditch, and it fell or ran on your land, you would still go chew their but.

This is what charging for access leads to. All this fuss over a ditch parrot.


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## Duckslayer100

rowdie said:


> This is what charging for access leads to. All this fuss over a ditch parrot.


AGREED! :beer:


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## blhunter3

Savage260 said:


> There is always land for sale.....
> 
> True, but there are only a select few who have the cash to buy it. It sure as heck isn't those who are hunting birds in the ditch!!!


Then why are people mad when landowners post their land? If someone doesn't like that someone posts land, go buy some yourself if you can't afford it, don't b1tch.


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## barebackjack

blhunter3 said:


> Savage260 said:
> 
> 
> 
> There is always land for sale.....
> 
> True, but there are only a select few who have the cash to buy it. It sure as heck isn't those who are hunting birds in the ditch!!!
> 
> 
> 
> Then why are people mad when landowners post their land? If someone doesn't like that someone posts land, go buy some yourself if you can't afford it, don't b1tch.
Click to expand...

Geez BL, you make it sound so easy! :roll:


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## 6162rk

how do you feel about the old hunter that can't walk any more to speak of doing a little road hunting? if he's lucky he might shoot a couple birds a year, but he still (in his mind) is getting out to hunt and look over the countryside before his time completely runs out.


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## deacon

time to go golfing, where players enforce rules upon themselves. Sure is nice weather we are having!


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## Savage260

"Then why are people mad when landowners post their land? If someone doesn't like that someone posts land, go buy some yourself if you can't afford it, don't b1tch."

Spoken like a true spoiled child! How much land have you had handed down to you?


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## duckp

Rowdie,
Go back and read what I said.The birds do NOT originate in the ditch or right away.They send dogs onto your land not the right away.Oh well,I guess a little violation if fine as long as its only a worthless pheasant.Or a deer.Or ducks.Or even coyotes.Why honor the outdated concept of private property.Hey,send me your gun,I'd like to use it for awhile.Not your wife though.
As to the COs,I didn't mean to give the impression they wouldn't do anything,they have and will but they are over stretched and overworked and absent pics and solid details are nearly powerless.I think this year though they may be setting up a 'surprise' for the 'pigs' when it comes to deer on my land.Hope so.Can't wait. :beer:

PS As to the 'old man' or the 'cripples' or all the other 'examples' that usually come up in this type thread,send em out and I'll likely take em hunting.Like I do with many Vets and kids.Just leave the ditch pigs home.


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## 9manfan

blhunter3 said:


> Savage260 said:
> 
> 
> 
> There is always land for sale.....
> 
> True, but there are only a select few who have the cash to buy it. It sure as heck isn't those who are hunting birds in the ditch!!!
> 
> 
> 
> Then why are people mad when landowners post their land? If someone doesn't like that someone posts land, go buy some yourself if you can't afford it, don't b1tch.
Click to expand...

Why,,,,because everyone is not born with a silver spoon in their mouth,,,,


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## alleyyooper

Road hunters!! How can you even utter the word hunter along with the word road. They sit on their butts all year long doing what ever lazy thing they can, then hunting season rolls around. They havn't put any effort in finding a place to hunt but the state allows them to ride around in a car or truck with loaded guns to shoot game. Many are just pochers that are legal during hunting season.

Those road hunters are going to cause a major upheavel in the hinting world there some day. Land owners are going to get so ticked off they not only post their land and make it difficult to get permission to hunt it, they will also start lobbying the powers that be to make the act of road killing illegal.

I know because I live in a state where it is *NOW*illegal, and it is nearly impossiable to get permission to hunt the posted land because the slobs are just that slobs with out any respect for a persons working hard to afford the property.
I can now be in one of my fields or the woods and not worry some slob from the road will kill or injurer me.

As for the handicapped they have laws in place here in michigan that allow them to use motorized transpot to hunt from but not on the roads. There are farms that only allow handicapped persons to hunt there.

 Al


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## dakotashooter2

On most ND township and county roads maintenance of the R-O-W (mowing, ditching, etc.)is generally the responsibility of the adjacent landowner as such by law they are granted some control of of that property. 
I guess it also depends how you define road hunters. In areas where cover is limited I have parked my vehicle and walked up one ditch and back the other (where not posted). By some definition that may qualify me as a road hunter.

Another note. Some time back our county did some investigating/research to see how many farmers were farming int the R-O-W along county roads and state Hwys. Seems many were encroaching quite a bit in some cases making the ditch/field edge open game if you followed the regulations correctly. oke:


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## MSG Rude

This is a volatile topic every single year.

Remember folks, stay on topic, don't get personal, and respect other folks' point of view please.

We'll let her run, but stay civil please.


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## teamflightstoppersND

I like how Obama wants to spread the wealth around, I am thinking I like this way of thinking so I believe we should also spread the land around too! It is not fair that us normal people did not inherit land or become filthy rich and buy it.

These slobs that go out and shoot animals just for killing ARE NOT HUNTERS and they should not be compared and are not related to hunters. Get this into your head!

I drive around to find a spot to shoot birds and if I see a bird on the road with either side not posted I will shoot and retieve the bird, is there anything wrong with that.

So landowners are these birds and deer yours?????? I do not think so, they are all of our birds.


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## swift

duckP, if you live in SD like your location says I see why you don't like deer season. The roadhunters in ND are bush league compared to down here. They really need to have a no off trail rule down in SD. I understand the ditch hunting for birds and see it as a necessary evil since commercial hunting has taken hold so hard. When I moved here 4 years ago from ND I thought the stories of pickups chasing deer across fields shooting from the window where embellished as they are in many cases in ND. But now I know I was wrong I've witnessed it several times each weekend, during deer season.


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## blhunter3

Doesn't matter how much land I have or will have. I just hate it how people complain with how landowners control THEIR land. If you don't own land, then don't b1tch because someone posts theirs.

No, the animals are public property, so the landowner does not own them, unless he or she runs a penned in shooting deal, then they own those animals.

bbj finding land to buy is very easy, so is buying it. Take out a loan and make payments like everyone else. :roll:


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## dogdonthunt

@savage.... hahaha.. I was thinking the same exact thing.... I dont wanna get off topic here and I dont wanna bash anyone but its not always easy to take out a loan... yes the rates are at an all time low but that doesnt mean they are giving out the money for it.... Id love to buy some extra land... it just isnt in the cards for me and my family right now... I say 'IF" its legal... hunt em up  and as far as whoever said that I gotta show you my liscense.... wanna bet?!!!!!  Im not advocateing illegal hunting but if you as a civilian ask to see my personal information your gonna be walking away in shame  lol


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## barebackjack

blhunter3 said:


> Doesn't matter how much land I have or will have. I just hate it how people complain with how landowners control THEIR land. If you don't own land, then don't b1tch because someone posts theirs.
> 
> No, the animals are public property, so the landowner does not own them, unless he or she runs a penned in shooting deal, then they own those animals.
> 
> bbj finding land to buy is very easy, so is buying it. Take out a loan and make payments like everyone else. :roll:


Got a lot of loans out for land do ya? :lol:

:eyeroll:


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## blhunter3

What does my personal finances have to do with the topic? Nothing. :roll:

That's pretty typical of your very poor debating methods bbj, you just make personal attacks, because you can't make a solid arguement.


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## barebackjack

blhunter3 said:


> What does my personal finances have to do with the topic? Nothing. :roll:
> 
> That's pretty typical of your very poor debating methods bbj, you just make personal attacks, because you can't make a solid arguement.


 :rollin: :rollin: :rollin: :rollin:

I didn't bring up your personal finances. You mentioned getting a loan for the purchase of land is quite easy (like they almost hand em out like free cupcakes). You speak as though you have experience in this matter. Do you?

Your previous statements come across as being an elitist landowner that everybody "owes".....is this what your grandpa is teaching you BL?

How much land have YOU purchased BL?


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## blhunter3

Still attacking chacater bbj by bringing in family members.

All I was saying is why do people complain when a landowner posts THEIR land? It's theirs to do what they want with. If they don't want you on their, then you can't go on and get over it.

I just mentioned that if someone wants their own place to hunt, go buy some land. It's not hard to find land and to buy it.

I am not a landowner elitest, I'm just tired of nonlandowners complaining about what landowners do with their land.

Again, it doesn't matter how much land I may or may not have or how much I may or may not have to buy or if I will buy any land.


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## barebackjack

How did I attack BL?

I know you work for you grandpa, I know he farms. I merely asked if this was what he was teaching you.

That is not an attack, that is a question.


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## wurgs

There is no excuse for breaking the law for a bird. If hunting a ditch adjacent to posted land unless its a purchased ROW its still illegal!


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## blhunter3

I actually do not work for him. Yes, he owns land, and he isn't the only landowner that I learn from either.


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## rowdie

dogdonthunt said:


> Im not advocateing illegal hunting but if you as a civilian ask to see my personal information your gonna be walking away in shame  lol


I'm sure that in SD at least, if someone asks you to show your your liscense while fishing or hunting, and you refuse, you could face a penalty. Maybe lose your liscense for a year. When you buy a fishing and hunting liscense, you agree to abide by the rules set by the state, and I know this used to be a rule in SD. 
DuckP
You should reread my post, I talked about both situations. Where guys shoot across the fence, and guys that do it withing the law. Unless you see the shot happen, you can't be sure if a rooster was hit within the right of way. You can't just say it ALWAYS happens the illegal way. I know there are landowners out there that will come and chew some butt, even if the hunters don't cross, or shoot over the fence. (this is a SD situation where it is legal to hunt road R.O.W)

Its too bad that the average guy can't afford to hunt. (in SD its getting all pay to hunt) Its hard for the average guy with a job and kids to afford hundreds of dollars a day to shoot a few birds. So they round up little pieces to hunt here and there, pound the public for the 3rd or 4th time that day, and of course they drive from place to place. Some may even take the "long" way around, or a section line shortcut, hoping to see bonus birds, to take legally in the ditch. These are the same average guys that fix your cars, tractors, stock shelves, deliver water, beer, etc..

I'm worried how the hunting herritage is being passed on. Eventually, over enough time, it will have been pay big bucks for so long, that the average guy will never hunt, actually dislike the hunters and thus hunting, and then where will hunting stand. In the extreme minority, even in the heartland.


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## Dave R

I'll have to agree with you on that one Rowdie. The television has surely not helped your concern with them making it look so easy on TV and they don't mention the price they're paying. To top it off, the popukation will grow and they will eventually start allowing these people to make more money by allowing each person more tags. I have exclisivity on a certain portion of land for deer and turkey and my father in law has a farm where I can hunt but so far I've been able to stay away from the farm. The small areas there are, will just get overrun with hunters. The spots I used to go to 9 years ago here are already gone or overused. Sad.

Dave


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## swift

Blhunter no attack here just a question. Is your name on any land deed or promissory note for land? It seems that the guys that complain the most and preach the loudest are not the landowners but the kids, grandkids, hired men or neighbors of the landowners. I understand protecting your access but until you make the payments and pay the taxes quite preaching. Let the rightful owners do that. Duckp I have no doubt you are the rightful owner of your land so that was not directed at you. Most of the owners that really give a damn are the ones with pay to hunt properties. They don't give a hoot about snowmobiles tresspassing all winter but shoot a bird flying in their airspace and the world is coming to an end. It's not the trespassing that bothers these guys it's somebody getting the opportunity to shoot one of thier money makers. Speaking from a SD point of view.


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## 9manfan

blhunter3 said:


> bbj finding land to buy is very easy, so is buying it. Take out a loan and make payments like everyone else. :roll:


So your telling me that a average guy who's making say 20.00 hr( which jobs like that are hard to find) can go to the bank and borrow a some money to buy 160 acres of land for hunting,I'm sorry, but I just don't see how an average worker can get that done ,unless you have a rich co-signer,,,,,


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## alleyyooper

Fact, hundreds of acres of property are sold in America every day with out the buyer steping foot in a bank, credit union or savings and loan.
Fact I bought my deer camp with no money down just monthly payments at a rate manageable for my income on a land contract for 30 years. ended up only being 18 years as all my raises went to the payments.
Took me 4 years to find that deer camp land, had to be sold on a land contract and be a land worth hunting.
We didn't have cable TV so save that money for the land payment, No cell phone so had that money for a land payment. didn't go out for dining and danceing every week end so had that money for a land payment. didn't buy $50.00 worth of beer every week so had that money for a land payment.
It can be done, just depends on what you really want.

My deer camp is on a black top road that goes around the bay so there is a J turn on one side of my property. My deer camp also butts up againest 6000 acres of state and federal land that also is right on the that road. So years (1991) ago when we bought the place road hunting wasn't being enforceed there. The slobs could have hunted the 6000 acres but just drove the 2 miles from the east end of the road to the turn around at the edge of my property near the west end then back all day long. In all the years I have owned our deer camp I have never seen one person hunting on the federal land.
The state finally got the message from the federal ranger about the road hunting and poching so put a stop to that.

Michigan also has what is termed *HAP* in the lower near the bigger cities. the state leases hunting rights from farmers so those who can't drive to the hundred of thousands of acres of state and federal land to hunt can sign up to hunt those *HAP *acres, no extra fee required.

Road hunting in Michigan is costly. If caught you loose your car/truck every thing in i,t a fine in the thousands of dollars and time in jail Plus hunting prevliges for at least 3 years.

 Al


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## PJG

Its really sad what has become of hunting. Back when sportsman where respectful ethical people land owners were more than happy to give folks permission to hunt on their land. Now we have a bunch of spoiled brats with no respect for the animals or land owners. If your to lazy to get out the truck and walk the fields where it is legal just stay home. One more thing they are called pheasants, not ditch parrots or ditch chickens, ringnecked pheasants show some respect disrespectful punks. Maybe all you ditch hunters just can't hack an honest day in the field.


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## Bug Guy

9manfan said:


> blhunter3 said:
> 
> 
> 
> bbj finding land to buy is very easy, so is buying it. Take out a loan and make payments like everyone else. :roll:
> 
> 
> 
> So your telling me that a average guy who's making say 20.00 hr( which jobs like that are hard to find) can go to the bank and borrow a some money to buy 160 acres of land for hunting,I'm sorry, but I just don't see how an average worker can get that done ,unless you have a rich co-signer,,,,,
Click to expand...

Not trying to be a smartazz, but check out the "contract for deed" option. It is a contract between you and the seller. No bank if you don't want it. Land ownership is not about the amount of money a guy has, its about the amount of perserverence a guy has to see a deal through. Anyone can own land if they want to bad enough.


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## alleyyooper

Buying land takes work and sacrfice. Isn't some thing a lazy road killer slob wants to do. Buying land is a lot like what real hunters do. Leg work and scouting day after day and month after month till you find that place that just clicks and screams buy me.

 Al


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## 9manfan

alleyyooper said:


> Buying land takes work and sacrfice. Isn't some thing a lazy road killer slob wants to do. Buying land is a lot like what real hunters do. Leg work and scouting day after day and month after month till you find that place that just clicks and screams buy me.
> 
> Al


"Wow" is all I can say


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## blhunter3

Who said you need 160 acres to hunt? It's all about how you manage your money, if you want something bad enough you will figure out a way to pay for it.

I am not going to discuss whether or not I own how much land or how I get land on an internet forum. So quit asking.


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## wingaddict

blhunter3 said:


> Who said you need 160 acres to hunt? It's all about how you manage your money, if you want something bad enough you will figure out a way to pay for it.
> 
> I am not going to discuss whether or not I own how much land or how I get land on an internet forum. So quit asking.


probably because you dont own squat.


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## duckp

Just a thought for ditch pigs.Since in most States 90% or more of the land is in private ownership,wouldn't it make sense to try and get along with landowners?I doubt there is anything that ****** off landowners more and turns them against hunters than ditch pigs.Pigging shuts out good hunters with the bad.But of course its just a pheasant..,or a deer...,or a .....
The sad fact is that ditch pigs don't care about other hunters,just themselves.


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## Seven1

So if I have permission to hunt a landowners property and I shoot a pheasant in the ditch, does that still make me a slob???

I'm sure you have a legitimate gripe, but this seems like a "Look at me I own land, so suck it!" thread.

With most landowners posting their land, and reluctance to give permission for hunting and especially those that want compensation for said hunting I can see why road hunting is becoming a problem. It almost seems like the new generation of landowners have a "mine, mine, mine" attitude. A vicious circle no doubt.


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## blhunter3

Its not about "I have land I king" at all. Its just dealing with all the stuff that comes with owning land gets real old sometimes and its easier to just lock it up and only let family and close friends on.


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## blhunter3

Yes, its frusterating that landowners do that, because I have lost hunting land because of some people ruining it for everyone but I respect there decision to what they want.


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## Savage260

Very funny how easily people will back down when called on the carpet!

I am all for nailing people that hunt illegally, but I don't understand why a ditch is not able to be hunted when adjacent to posted land. Obviously I am not a land owner, so I don't know how it all works. Does the farmer/land owner actually own the ditch area? I have been told a few different things. If so, I am all for not being able to hunt it. If it is county or township, or what ever, then any one should be able to hunt it. If the land owner owns the ditch it makes no sense to me to get all pi$$y over shooting a bird in the ditch if you don't get pi$$y about some one riding a 4 wheeler or snowmobile in that same ditch. Why are these owners not throwing a fit over that?

"Now we have a bunch of spoiled brats with no respect for the animals or land owners. If your to lazy to get out the truck and walk the fields where it is legal just stay home. One more thing they are called pheasants, not ditch parrots or ditch chickens, ringnecked pheasants show some respect disrespectful punks. Maybe all you ditch hunters just can't hack an honest day in the field.

First learn grammar and spelling before you try to insult people because it just makes you look stupid, then realize there are just as many "spoiled brat" land owners as hunters. Realize you can't "walk the fields where it is legal" if you have no access to land. Realize there are bigger issues to worry about than some one calling a pheasant a "ditch parrot". Don't call a Savage rifle a "Salvage" or I will cry, boo hoo hoo! As for the name calling, that is just childish, I am disgusted. uke: :wink:

I agree this sounds like an "I own land so suck it!" Thread.

Al, not sure exactly what planet you live on, but the avarage joe just can not go out and purchase land for a "hunting camp". Maybe once a person retires, and is lucky enough to have a bunch of assets, but not the average guy off the street. Sorry, not happening. It sounds nice, and I am really glad you could do it, but realistically it won't and can't happen for most of us. I am sure my wife would allow me to spend my son's college money/our mortgage payment/car payment, ect on hunting land. :rollinnot that it would be cheap enough to buy thanks to all the wealthy NRs buying up the land for STUPID HIGH prices)

The only person I know that has been able to do this without having family owned land to help with the purchase is a good friend of mine who makes well into 6 figures.


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## Fallguy

PJG said:


> IOne more thing they are called pheasants, not ditch parrots or ditch chickens, ringnecked pheasants show some respect disrespectful punks. Maybe all you ditch hunters just can't hack an honest day in the field.


AMEN!!!


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## swift

Duckp aren't you in SD? Isn't ditch hunting pheasants legal in SD? If your gripe is guys shooting too close to your house then report them. But if your all riled up because some guys are legally shooting gamebirds on likely the only ground they have access then your the one with the problem. Look in the mirror pal. There is no excuse for trespassing but you need to remember those pheasants are not yours. Your posts sound like you own the wildlife and you don't want anyone to have access to them except through you and probably for a fee.


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## Chuck Smith

One funny thing is I hear from people in ND....is this old saying...."If I can't get it from the truck window it ain't worth getting."

That shows you some of the way people think. Am I generalizing every ND hunter...nope. I am just repeating some things I have heard.

Also on the purchasing of land..... it is easy. If you are financially strong you can purchase land. It may only be 5 acres or 500 acres. You go to a bank, get qualified for a loan and then go buy. Also there are more programs out there for people to buy land than homes... go to farm beurua offices, land management offices, etc. Just do some digging and you can find a loan. You can also find programs that will pay you to have CRP, WRP, Planting trees, letting people hunt on your land, etc. Not to mention rent to help pay for the land you are purchasing. All which can help with payments. It is easier to cash flow land than many rental properties. You can also talk to farmers or land owners and buy on contract for deed. You can refinance your home and with the equity you have go buy land! Many different possibilites out there. But I for one get the main thing BL is stating. If you don't own the land then don't ***** how the owner decides to handle his property or access. I have been gone for 3 weeks hunting. I went and checked my trail cams. I found pictures of guys hunting my stands. I talked with the land owner and he said he did not give anyone permission. But yet his land is not posted either. So I can't *****.


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## duckp

Swift,
Obviously you either can't read or didn't bother to read my first post before flapping your lips.Right of way hunting is legal here most places(unfortunately),ditch pigging and trespassing isn't.
As to letting others hunt,if kids,Vets,friends and even a few non-res guys who asked don't count,you are right,I hunt it by myself.
I don't charge nor do I pay anyone else to hunt.
I now may consider a reading test pre permission though. :lol:


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## swift

Please enlighten me on the difference between right of way hunting and "ditch pigging". Read my post again especially the part that says "there is no excuse for trespassing", You tipped your hand with your (unfortunately) plug. I don't like the neighbors kids riding their 4-wheelers through my mowed ditch but I understand they have the right and I don't hassle them about it. I applaud you for allowing people to hunt without fee on your land. You are the exception down here. And seriously tell me the difference between right of way hunting and ditch pigging.


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## duckp

Right of way hunting,at least theoretically,is walking the right of way and shooting ONLY birds that 'originate'in or fly' over' the right of way.(except for Federal or Indian land where there are more restrictions).
Ditch pigging is shooting out the window or more commonly seeing birds OUT of the right of way and releasing your dogs to flush them,then shooting them FROM the right away and having your dog retrieve them.
If you live here,or are in NE SoDak send me a PM and I'll invite you out to see the difference.No,sorry but I couldn't do that cause here you NEVER see anyone walking the right of way,but guarantee we will see a minimum of 3- 6 violaters around our section alone per evening.  (except on those rare days a warden is around of course.)


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## blhunter3

Chuck Smith said:


> Also on the purchasing of land..... it is easy. If you are financially strong you can purchase land. It may only be 5 acres or 500 acres. You go to a bank, get qualified for a loan and then go buy. Also there are more programs out there for people to buy land than homes... go to farm beurua offices, land management offices, etc. Just do some digging and you can find a loan. You can also find programs that will pay you to have CRP, WRP, Planting trees, letting people hunt on your land, etc. Not to mention rent to help pay for the land you are purchasing. All which can help with payments. It is easier to cash flow land than many rental properties. You can also talk to farmers or land owners and buy on contract for deed. You can refinance your home and with the equity you have go buy land! Many different possibilites out there. But I for one get the main thing BL is stating. If you don't own the land then don't b#tch how the owner decides to handle his property or access. I have been gone for 3 weeks hunting. I went and checked my trail cams. I found pictures of guys hunting my stands. I talked with the land owner and he said he did not give anyone permission. But yet his land is not posted either. So I can't b#tch.


Finally someone understands what I am getting at.


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## waconia5

Moral of the story... if its posted its not yours so don't hunt it. If you want guaranteed hunting land go out and buy some or make friends with those landowners so you can have a successful hunt in NoDak.


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## dogdonthunt

Chuck and BL... Im sure there are ways out there and Chuck the info you provided is enlightening... however alot of us have been hit with this great democratic economy we live in today includeing myself as I was laid off for 8 months... when you have a family with teenage kids that hurts... sob story yes... water under the bridge... been back to work now for awhile however the whole catch up game is still in effect.. like someone mentioned earlier... its not always an option to make payments on land and (live)... good for you that have done it or are doing it... I would love to buy some land right now that my kids are coming into hunting age but until then I being from ND will rely on state land ,plots/privately owned land and if the land is open and the ditches look good I dont mind GETTING OUT AND GOIN FOR A WALK.... I know its just generalizing when its posted up about ditch hunting and calling everyone slobs that do it but I will refer to my earlier post and say IF ITS LEGAL... hunt em up


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## dogdonthunt

side note... if people didnt [email protected]#ch... we would have no need for a forum.... oke:     I like to refer to it as an anonymis spirited debate ... besides.. if you get upset over what someone writes on a forum you need to get out and hunt more often and get off the computer..... lol


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## alleyyooper

Lot of young guys buy hunting land who have familys. We sacrficed to buy our home and hunting property at the same time.
NO cable TV, Only one TV in the house the kids had to watch what we did except one hour a day. Only one phone in the house and the kids could not call and talk to their friends all day long and no long distances calls for them either.
We didn't eat out but maybe once every 6 months.
No new car or truck every other year, most had over 150000 before they were sold and some thing newer bought to replace them.
No golf outing with the buds EVER still don't. No fancy vacations to islands or other countrys. No crusies. If we took a vacation it was a tent on the property we bought and cooking over an open fire.

Daughter got real good grades and got a part paid MTU education the rest paid by US, mom and dad.
Son went to Nothland in Ashland Wisconsin. All paid by US, mom and dad.

I wasn't able to go buy new rifles or shot guns on a whim or even used ones. I didn't have to have a $800.00 scope with gold rings to impress the game I was hunting either.

The stock we bought for our retirement days was pretty much wiped out last year when the company went bankrupt. The 401K we put money into was reduced by 60% when the markets puked.

But today we still have the land, Ours as long as we pay the taxes on it. Not worth what it was 5 years ago but still better than that stock we lost.

A close friend needed a place to hunt when his sons came of age to hunt. He bought a 40 acre parcel with only 20 acres tillable. 15 acres that was a huge hill the past owner had pastured young cattle in. 5 acres of swampy wooded land.
A farmer rented the 20 tillable acres which paid the taxes and a bit extra. The county bought close to 100 thousand yards of sand for road fill which half paid for the land. I know that doesn't always happen.
He planted trees on the hilly part not taken for fill and today has some prime hunting property.

I really do see the day the land owners there band together like they did here and stop road hunting. To many were shooting to close to buildings and even hitting them. shooting to close to animals and even killing them. And the hunters them selves shotting each other trying to get the loaded gun out the window.

 Al


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## swift

Duckp, I see what your getting at. As I posted earlier deer hunting in Eastern SD is treacherous. Pickups driving around CRP fields, fence lines and tree rows. Guys brag about shooting from the window at 60mph across a bean field. Like I said before SD should pass a no off trail law for deer hunting. The reason I asked about the difference in road hunting and ditch pigging is, here around Redfield anyone that hunts the right of ways are called ditch pigs. Commercial hunting is the norm here as you know and most of the locals only have access to the right of ways. Guys around here see a $500 bill with wings and have a fit if someone that isn't paying gets a chance at "their" birds. Some year we will have another winter like 96-97 and there wont be enough birds or hunters to pay for the 4000 dollar an acre land and fancy lodges. Then the banks will be in control of the hunting.


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## dogdonthunt

Al first off good for you.. thats great.... and I know its not directed at me but your assumption of us is we all are like what your saying... I drive one NEWER car which gets great gas milage for my daily commute and my second vehicle was paid for and cost 400 bucks... I dont use a scope on my rifle so thats out... I dont have a home phone but do have a cell phone which gets free long distance.. dont have cable... however I did MAKE a homemade antanea.. which for those of you who use one Ill post up a link in another thread later... works awsome....If I go on vacations its usually tied into a graduation or unfortunately a funeral and usually just for the weekend and at the cheapest hotel I can find or at a relatives...both my kids are on the A honor rolls and both in all the sports the school offers.. and I was able to keep my house being unemployed for eight months however my credit rating went way down... thus preventing me from refinancing anything... so like I said before... those are just my examples... others Im sure others have their own problems... so again... not always an option for eveyone...


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## carp_killer

Amyone can own land. If you want it bad enough you can find ways to sacifice to pay for the land. End of story, end of debate.


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## GarySND

Most if not all township roads in North Dakota are owned by the adjacent landowner, who pays taxes up to the center of the road. The township just has right of way to use the section lines as roads if they chose to do so. If the land is posted the road is also posted. Not sure how it works on owned right of way land like county roads or state roads. If the state permits ditch hunting those lands would be open for that use.


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## duckp

Swift,
I hear ya and agree totally on deer hunting via pickup and on commercial hunting.I view both as a threat to the sport.I see the average hunter surviving by continued expansion of 'Walk In' or 'PLOTS' type programs.The new CREP program here has and will continue to open thousands of acres of PRIME(some of the best)land to anyone.Therein is the future,not ditch pigging.


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## HUNTNFISHND

You know, many years ago there was very little posted land and landowners didn't seem to have a problem with seeing others out on their property enjoying a good hunt. They also didn't seem to have the same problems as the landowners who now have just about everything posted up solid. Is there a correlation there? I don't know, it's kind of like the chicken or the egg debate, which came first the entitlistic, monarchistic landowner, or the ungrateful, slob loving, road hunter?

I've got no problem with landowners posting there property and controlling the access to the land. I would do the same if I were fortunate enough to be able to own land. I also see how it's getting harder and harder each year to gain access to quality land to pursue the sport we all care about. The question becomes what happens to hunting when only landowners are the hunters? Do the animal rights groups finally win and stop all hunting? I sure hope it never comes to that!

I just think we are losing respect for each other more and more everyday. I don't know what the answer is, too bad we can't turn back the clock 20 or 30 years, but we need to find a balance some how or it's just going to get worse! Just my thoughts on the subject.


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## swift

Huntnfish, good post. I think the generations that survived the thirties and fought in WW2 had more respect for other people than any of the generations since. Starting with the baby boomers to the current spoon fed generation of entitlists, decency toward people has been replaced with "what's in it for me"? There were both types all through history but the norm and the exception have swapped sides. This is my opinion and it goes for both nonlandowning people and landowners. Thankfully there are still a few that listened to Grandpa when he taught right from wrong on both sides.


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## AdamFisk

HUNTNFISHND said:


> I just think we are losing respect for each other more and more everyday. I don't know what the answer is, too bad we can't turn back the clock 20 or 30 years, but we need to find a balance some how or it's just going to get worse! Just my thoughts on the subject.


You are absolutely right. It's getting pretty bad. I will disclose that I am probably a young pup to a lot of you,27, but I like to think I got my head on right, priorities are in order, follow laws, etc etc. Maybe in my teenager days I couldn't say all that, but I was a dumb know it all kid. Now, I think there are too many people out there nowadays who never "grew up", or whatever you want to call it. Slobs!!! They are certainly wrecking it for all. I had a close buddy tell me one time that he drew back on a doe and was about to attempt to shoot her right between the eyes with a bow. I was freaking out, on the inside. I calmly informed him that is not a shot one should take, ever, and left it at that. I was furious!!!!!!!

Point is, young or old, ther are many people who are just stupid. And, in the last few years it seems the level of stupid people in the field is increasing. Now, some of you think we need more hunters. I say BS, a lot of the new hunters we have now are the problem. They were not raised up hunting, therfore not taught right or wrong from their elders. They are lacking some traits, that, as a hunter develops over the years, he builds upon. Hunting is becoming the "popular" thing to do now. Some guys see a big buck, go buy a bow, shoot it 10 times and decide now that they are a bow hunters. Same with waterfowl. Same with coyotes, etc etc....That's all find and dandy, if you have your head on straight; respect, sportsmanship, consideration, etc etc. In my experiences, it's been the opposite for the newcomers. And im' not talking "youths", I would almost guess most youths are being taught right and wrong, respect for others, etc etc....I hope.

I will get blasted for this, but I wish we would have a fricken 5 year drought. I wish this stupid early goose season would close for 10 years. I also wish we would have another 5 hard winters to kill off deer. The guys left standing at the end of all that, them are the guys I would like to share the outdoors with.


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## djleye

Guys, instead of *****ing about it why not try and do something about it? Try and get youths that have no one to mentor them out. Teach a kid to shoot a bow, tech them to shoot a bb gun or .22 if the are older. Get a youth outdoors camp started!! Do something about it instead of *****ing on an internet forum!!!!
Maybe some of you do and if so this is not directed at you.


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## teamflightstoppersND

Did you know that you can shoot birds in the air over a National Wildlife Refuge as long as you are on a public road. Lets say you are driving down a public road and you see some birds in the field on a refuge right next to the road. You can stop, get out, let the birds fly and then shoot them as long as you are not shooting them while on the ground. Legally you can not be procsecuted because the air is not a part of the refuge. This is what I was told by one NFWS employee.

So if I drive down the road and decide to road hunt I will make sure I dont shoot any birds on the ground on posted land. Just let them fly first and its technically legal. I would not try this necessarily because someone may try to take you to court, but in the end you will be not guilty with a bunch of wasted time and money.

Remember landowners that you may own the land but you do not own the air or the wildlife!


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## Duckslayer100

But that scenario only works if the landowner does not own the right of way. The only way you would know that is if you had a PLATT book. Otherwise, the land could be posted ALL THE WAY TO THE CENTER OF THE ROAD. Therefore, even though the bird might be in the air, your feet are still planted on the ground and in violation of the law. Unless the other side of the road isn't posted and you're shooting from that side, but then that's just silly :roll:

In any case, you guys arguing for this are really grasping at straws. All the "what ifs" should be sending off warning bells in your head. When a fat, pheasant is sitting in a ditch next to a posted sign and your first instinct is to figure out if you can shoot that bird without getting into trouble, I say you're a few ethical logs shy of a full load. If in doubt, keep on driving. I mean, honestly, is a friggin' pheasant worth getting into a pi$$ing match over with a PO'd landowner? It boggles the mind what some people will go through for a damn bird...


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## blhunter3

Duckslayer100 said:


> But that scenario only works if the landowner does not own the right of way. The only way you would know that is if you had a PLATT book. Otherwise, the land could be posted ALL THE WAY TO THE CENTER OF THE ROAD. Therefore, even though the bird might be in the air, your feet are still planted on the ground and in violation of the law. Unless the other side of the road isn't posted and you're shooting from that side, but then that's just silly :roll:
> 
> In any case, you guys arguing for this are really grasping at straws. All the "what ifs" should be sending off warning bells in your head. When a fat, pheasant is sitting in a ditch next to a posted sign and your first instinct is to figure out if you can shoot that bird without getting into trouble, I say you're a few ethical logs shy of a full load. If in doubt, keep on driving. I mean, honestly, is a friggin' pheasant worth getting into a pi$$ing match over with a PO'd landowner? It boggles the mind what some people will go through for a damn bird...


Exactly. What people do for a bird is amazing but what some people do for a deer.... I think deer season coincides with lets all become illiterate and dumb for 16 days.


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## alleyyooper

Remove all the warning labels from every thing. That sure would weed out a lot of dumb stupid people.
Friends lawn mower had two pages of warnings in the manual, warning labels all over the lawn mower, kill switch shuts down the mower if placed in reverse, engine shuts it down if he doesn't maintain so much pressure on the seat saftey switch, Engine shuts down if he turns to fast .

Remove them and reduce waste.

 Al


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## duckp

The idea you can shoot 'in the air' on a federal refuge is total BS.
Go try it.Have a friend with to bail you out though.


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## HUNTNFISHND

Duckslayer100 said:


> I mean, honestly, is a friggin' pheasant worth getting into a pi$$ing match over with a PO'd landowner? It boggles the mind what some people will go through for a damn bird...


I agree with you, but is a friggin' pheasant worth getting PO'd about as a landowner? It is just a "damn bird" as you put it.


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## ShineRunner

Not trying to highjack the thread but since this has been mentioned I felt this might help keep someone from having a problem in the future if they are thinking about buying land.

If you decide to buy land please do not buy with a "Contract for Deed". You would have to be really trusting to do this. The owner of the property could borrow money against the land or not pay the taxes unknown to you. It may not happen but who knows. The owner might get in a bind and borrow money thinking they would have it paid back before you paid it off. A "Note and Deed of Trust" registered in the county of purchase is the way to go. That keeps everyone honest! :beer:


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## Chuck Smith

Shinner runner....good point.

That is why the Contract for deed needs to have specific terms spelled out and then recorded. In most states it is already taken care of once it is recorded. But it is up to the buyer to make sure they are covered.


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## duckp

You can record the contract for deed and then you're protected.Thats 'notice' to creditors or anyone of your prior interest.
See a real estate lawyer no matter what form of purchase you use to be safe.


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## JBB

This really gets old. The law is the law. If a person does not understand it just call ND GNF and ask for the CORRECT interpation. They will give you the same information that the warden uses to write citiations. The law is very clear. If the land beside the roadway is posted it is posted up to the center line of the road. The land owner pays taxes based on that info. If you stand on the non-posted side and shoot into the posted side you are in violation of the law. The interstate and most state highways are owned by the federal or state goverments. You can hunt those as long as you do not put others at risk.
If you do not agree with the LAW as it is written get hold of your state legiuslaters and have them change the law. It is hunters who have their own ways of reading the law and putting their interpation of it to use that makes it tough on those of us that follow the rules. Do I like some of the laws, no, do I follow them, yes. 
For the out of staters , whom I have no problem with, just because the law is different in your state does not mean that that is the way it is here. If you hunt in ND follow ND laws. If you do not like ND rules find out who is the repensitive for that district and start a letter writing campain. 
If everybody hunted leagally there would be a lot less friction between the land owner/ renter and the hunters. If you act like a dumb a$$ all of us will be treated like such and I am tired of having to pay for others doing things they should not be doing.


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## Duckslayer100

HUNTNFISHND said:


> Duckslayer100 said:
> 
> 
> 
> I mean, honestly, is a friggin' pheasant worth getting into a pi$$ing match over with a PO'd landowner? It boggles the mind what some people will go through for a damn bird...
> 
> 
> 
> I agree with you, but is a friggin' pheasant worth getting PO'd about as a landowner? It is just a "damn bird" as you put it.
Click to expand...

Maybe he doesn't give a rats behind about the bird...but he could get PO'd because you are TRESPASSING. He can be mad about that, right? Or is that asking to much...


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## teamflightstoppersND

Landowners should not get mad if hunters are shooting birds when one side of the road is not posted. As long as the bird is in the air, it is legal to shoot even if over posted land. Of course you must not bring your gun when retrieving the bird. Dont believe me then I guess i will shoot them and you can keep driving by......


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## HUNTNFISHND

Duckslayer100 said:


> Maybe he doesn't give a rats behind about the bird...but he could get PO'd because you are TRESPASSING. He can be mad about that, right? Or is that asking to much...


Yes, absolutely! The point I'm trying to make is why does a guy need to fly off the handle just by seeing somebody retrieve a pheasant in the ditch? Did he bend a blade of grass or leave a boot print in some dirt? What's the harm? Now if someones driving across your land leaving ruts or tearing up your property I can see getting upset about it.

I don't know, I guess I just don't sweat the small stuff like some people. Sure is alot less stress on yourself when you learn to just relax and enjoy life rather then constantly worrying about someone maybe trespassing in the ditch for a pheasant.


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## Duckslayer100

Agreed! There's some tightly-wound folk out there, though the chance of running into them might not be all that great

But I'd rather not push my luck and have to deal with a fuming landowner. Just not worth the effort.


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## Guest

this is why i say goodby. all the hate.


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## greenwinger_13

Threads like this make me even more nervous to even potentially consider field hunting ducks and geese during deer season...


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## Savage260

"Remove all the warning labels from every thing. That sure would weed out a lot of dumb stupid people.
Friends lawn mower had two pages of warnings in the manual, warning labels all over the lawn mower, kill switch shuts down the mower if placed in reverse, engine shuts it down if he doesn't maintain so much pressure on the seat saftey switch, Engine shuts down if he turns to fast .

Remove them and reduce waste."

AMEN!!!

This whole deal is going way, way, back to the time when hunting was only for the rich. It was trendy, and a "lord" owned the land and all the animals upon that land. Now that hunting is becoming trendy again, the new "lords" realize there is lots o $$$ to be made by opening the gate with their hand out. It will go back to being only for the rich. Sad to say, but it is the case where I grew up. In HS I don't remember much if any land being posted. Now I can't find much land that isn't posted. I can't fault any one for wanting to make more money, but when does it become plain greed?


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## duckp

Maybe greed for some but,hey,thats the concept of private property-outdated as far as some of you seem to feel I guess.For most though its frustration with slobs,vandals,ditch pigs,and their ilk claiming to be 'hunters'.
Love it when people talk about the 'ol days'.I miss them as well but there's 2 sides to everything.If 'hunters' back then were slobs,ditch pigs,vandals,etc they were dealt with HARSHLY.By landowners,law and parents.
The good ol days are gone so face it.Buy land,cultivate long term relationships with landowners,get behind 'PLOTS' or 'WALK IN' type programs-or take up shuffleboard.


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## Vinroy

OK so i can tell by reading the previous posts that there are allot of people who somehow are so STRONGLY against roadhunting posting on this forum, ok so im just gunna go out on a whim and say that all of you who are so STRONGLY against roadhunting have one of the 3 things listed.
A- you yourself own land that you can hunt whenever you like.....
B- your family or close friend owns land in which you have access to hunt on.....
C- you have a well paying good job that allows you to spare the ridiculous fees that some farmers have to allow you to hunt there land or the guide fee for land.......

Ok so then lets go to the other spectrum, lets say the average person who works a day to day job who pays his bills and raises his family and just barely makes ends meet, who A- does not own land, B- does not have any family or close friends who own land that allow him to hunt, and C- obviously since he just makes ends meet cant afford the ridiculous fees that some land owners charge to have access to there land to hunt..... Ok so what is he gunna do to get out there and do something he enjoys such as hunting..... He will pry have to ROAD HUNT...... So to all of you who are sooo STRONGLY against road hunting please ask yourself does the fact that this man doesnt have access to land and doesnt have access to the funds it takes to be able to pay the fees to have access to land. Does this take away his RIGHT to get out there and try to do something he loves such as trying to shoot a couple pheasants. NO....... and any of you who think differently aught to be ashamed of yourself for being such selfish pricks........

Oh and i know im gunna get someone who will say what about all the public access land out there and walk-ins...... and my reply to that is OH PLEASE...... we all know how walk-ins and public access areas can get after the first few weekends of hunting season any which have been known to hold birds in past years get hunted almost daily and are ridden of any birds that may have been using the land....

thats my .02


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## Longshot

For all you that hate road hunters and own land. You can always not post your land and let everyone hunt it. I am sure that will get rid of the road hunters along your property. oke:


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## duckp

Maybe we are quibbling over nothing.How about just facing the fact 'road hunting' isn't hunting?
Sad they even call themselves hunters IMO.(I'm not talking about the 'theoretical roadhunter' who walks right of ways-since they are just a theory anyway-or so rare as to never show themselves)And,the 'pricks' are those that violate the law-not those that defend their rights. :beer: 
As to 'Walk Ins' being worthless,if you really believe that you're too lazy to find out MANY are great spots.
Another thought,note that the vast majority of the slob ditch pigs are residents,not non-residents.That ought to tighten your undies a bit.


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## alleyyooper

I see it coming in your area maybe sooner than latter but is a coming. 95 to 99% of all private land is posted no tresspassing no hunting. Those so called ditch hunters will be one of the major causes. When legal hunters are being shot over from road ways they don't take kindly to such actions. When cattle and buildings are shot from road ways it doesn't indear hunters in the hearts of farmers and other land owners. they will bann together and pass laws so you can not hunt from a ditch in or out of a truck/car.

I am old enough to remember the free open land for hunting here in Michigan in the 1960's. I am going to talk a about a 240 acre tract of woods that joined up to my dads 80 acre wood lot.
During deer season that tract got many a hunter hunting it they waited by the drive way in the early morning for the farmer who owned the land next door to arrive with his tractor and trailer. all those hunters so inclund not to walk in would hop on the trailer to ride to the spot they wanted to get to and hop off. Around noon the farmer woiuld drive out for lunch and pick up hunters wanting to ride out for lunch. About 1:00 PM the farmer made a return trip in and out again at night.
the land owner was a lawyer from the near by town who kept the land for hunting and fishing the beaver ponds on the property.
About 1967 it was he came to our home and talked with my dad to not let any body thru our property to hunt his property. He was going to post his. Seems he and his wife was tired about all the trash that was left after deer season at the trail head. That 240 acres was closed to hunters and being a lawyer he didn't fool around with just giving warnings, he went the whole 9 yards. Soon we were not able to hunt our own property in peace either as many who had hunted the 240 invaded our 80 since it was so near. We were always having some one walk up on our deer blind with have you seen any? We also got the trash pile where they parked. We got the fence cutting so they had access to the posted 240 too.
1968 Our farm got posted and My dad also didn't fool around with tresspassers.

Today I own my own land but can not hunt it any time I want. Seems the state regulates the seasons.
Every year I have to call the DNER about tresspassers despite the huge yellow and small red no tresspassing signs posted 10 feet apart on my property, including the head of my drive way.

Never in the 25 years I have owned this property has any person knocked on my door asking to hunt here.

Our deer camp is 6 1/2 hours away from home. In the 14 years we have owned the property we have not had a tresspasser there nor any one ask to hunt there.
there is about 6000 ruffly federal acres open to hunting all around our camp. In 14 years I have only seen a couple of guys one year hunt there.

Yesterday I drove 160 plus miles up to the farm I just inhereted in Febuary. You could tell that the NOVEMBER 15th deer season was near. Even along the 140 mile interstate sectoin of the drive those yellow and red no hunting signs were refreashed.

 Al


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## ShineRunner

Just got back from walking my 40 acre tract (getting ready for Pheasant in ND) here in NC this morning and found PU tracts in all my woods roads I have cleared. I guess I will put up another gate across from my house! All other ways are already gated. A lady hit a very nice buck a few weeks back that was heading into my wheat field (left for birds/game animals) and there where about 10 young hunters looking and listening to the lady tell how she had hit this one and that there had been 5 big bucks total. :eyeroll:


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