# MUZZLE LOADER BASICS



## OBSESSED (Nov 23, 2006)

THIS IS MY SECOND YR. HUNTING WITH A MUZZLE LOADER. IN OUR AREA WE CANNOT USE MAGNIFYING SCOPES...WHICH I DONT GET? ANYWAY HAD ONE QUICK QUESTION. I SHOOT A .50 CAL. OMEGA WITH 240 GRN H.P HORNADY SABOTS. I USE TRPL. 7 PIRODEX PELLETS.

DO U THINK THERE WOULD BE A MAJOR DIFFERENCE IN RANGE AND KNOCK DOWN POWER IF I ONLY USED 100 GRAINS OF PIRODEX INSTEAD OF 150?

I SEEM TO GET MUCH BETTER GROUPS USING 100 GRAINS. MY SHOTS WILL NOT BE FURTHER THAN 150 YDS AND MOST LIKELY BE W/IN 50. ANYOTHER TIPS INFO. IS APPRECIATED. TY IN ADVANCE!

I LOOK FORWARD TO GOING OUT THIS COMING WEEKEND.


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## peakoftherut (Nov 13, 2006)

Pyrodex and tripple 7 are two different powders. They are both made by the same company though. From what I have run across they don't recomend shooting over a 100gr of tripple seven because it burns hotter than pyrodex. I have been useing two 50gr pellets of tripple seven in my 50 cal. and its been deadly on the targets, I have not shot any deer yet but I am working on it.


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## Danimal (Sep 9, 2005)

IMHO,... 100 grains of 777 are plenty for deer. 777 is slightly more powerful than BP or Pyrodex (if I remember right, about 7% more). If that is the most accurate load, I would use it. Afterall, how many deer were taken with flintlocks and patched round balls while this country was founded!

I shoot a .50 Win Apex, 200 grain shockwave sabots and 777. I have taken 3 deer so far with this combo, but I have tried different powder charges.

Last year, I started out with 130 grains, shot (45 yard shot) a 4 pntr through the front leg, bullet came apart but took a golf ball size chunk out of heart and shredded the lungs. He ran about 60 yards before piling up.

This year I tried 80 grains of 777. I shot a doe (at 35 yards) through the front leg. The bullet stayed together ripping through the heart and exiting the far side. The exit hole was not much larger than the entry hole. She ran about 40 yards before dropping.

The second deer this year was another doe, about 27 yards away. Same load (80grains 777). Double lung shot, through the ribs. She ran about 35 yards. Again the exit hole was about the same size as the entrance hole.

Now I want to see how the Shockwave performs with 100 grains of 777. Hopefully it will expand more. But either way, 3 very dead deer so far.


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## Chuck Smith (Feb 22, 2005)

In my omega .50 I use a 295 gr. HP powerbelt with 100 gr.s of 777. It has taken down 5 deer. THe ranges have been from 15 yards to 80 yards. No deer has went farther than 30 yards.

So yes 100 gr. of 777 is plenty for deer.

Chuck


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## goatboy (Dec 29, 2003)

This is my first season as well, I'm shooting an Omega .50 with 100gr 777 and 240 grain dead center sabots.

My question is should I shoot my deer with a foued barrel or a clean one?
I really don't feel like loading it in the dark and firing a round thru it before I go out but some say that's what I should do.

Sighting in I have cleaned it after everyshot, my groups however are not steller with that 1X scope at 100. It seems to be in that 6 inch range and that's off a bench with a vise. The trigger isn't the best in the world either, must be about 8 lbs it seems like. But 100 yds seems to be a long ways out there, so I shot the rest at 75 and that seemed to keep them within about 3-4. I'm goiong after a very large buck and I'd hate to mess up by missing or worst yet wounding him. Right now I'm 2 1/2" high at 75 yds.


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## Danimal (Sep 9, 2005)

Well as for the fouled barrel,....here's my .02.....

I will not store my ML dirty and where I hunt, I can not shoot a fouler shot (for many reasons,...like too close to houses where I park) so therefore, my first shots at deer have been with a clean barrel.

I have done enough testing at the range to determine with MY gun (and every gun can be different) that it doesn't make much difference. I did find out that the groups will get larger in a realllllly dirty barrel. But how many shots do you really take in the field anyway. The most I have fired (with my Apex) is 2... and neither deer asked me if the barrel was clean or fouled. I guess I could open the freezer and ask, but the aren't saying much right now.. :lol:

The best advice I could offer is to go to the range and try different combos of bullets/powder/clean or fouled.... besides,...it's an excuse to spend time at the range!

Good luck!!


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## OBSESSED (Nov 23, 2006)

THANKS FOR ALL THE INFO., I SHOOT 777.

IM GOING OUT THIS WEEKEND AND HOPEFULLY THIS COLD WEATHER WILL BE MOVING THEM AROUND AND MORE HUNTERS IN THE WOODS TOO. WENT OUT THIS MORNING ON SOME PUBLIC LAND CLOSE TO HOME AND DIDNT SEE ANYTHING, WAS STILL NICE TO BE OUT, THOUGH I SHOULD HAVE GONE GOOSE HUNTING THERE WERE LOTS MOVING AROUND. THIS WEEKEND ILL BE HUNTING MY PRIVATE LAND HOPEFULLY I CAN WAIT OUT THE COLD AND COME UP WITH SOMETHING TO SHOW FOR.

ONE MORE QUICK QUESTION. WITH THE COLD COMING IS IT BEST TO LEAVE MY GUN SIT OUTSIDE SO IT WONT GET MOISTURE ON THE POWDER PELLETS? OR DOES THAT APPLY TO GUNS BEFORE THE MODERN MUZZLELOADERS?

GOOD LUCK TO EVERYONE THIS WEEKEND!

-BE SAFE


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## goatboy (Dec 29, 2003)

:beer:


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## usmarine0352 (Nov 26, 2005)

An article in "Peterson's Hunting" said that that 2 pellets/100 grains of Triple Seven actually probably the best for most bullets.

The reason being, after much testing many, many of today's Muzzleloaders bullets weren't built to withstand that much velocity and blow apart on impact.

So 2 pellets was still plenty enough to kill deer and not ruin the bullet.

I've shot 3 pellets, but I think I'm going to do some testing with 2 pellets for next year.

:sniper:


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## OBSESSED (Nov 23, 2006)

WISH I WOULD HAVE AT LEAST SEEN A DEER.

NICE JOB ON THAT BUCK, GOOD JOB!


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## Habitat Hugger (Jan 19, 2005)

Having shot traditional muzzy and black powder cartridge guns for 30+ years, I have come to the conclusion that is almost never a reason to ever shoot over 80-100 grains of black, pyrodex, 777, or American pioneer. In all my guns they shoot much better groups with powder amounts up to 80 grains, but not over. 
If I were forced to use one of those modern in line abominations with pellets and modern bullets, ! suppose I would use 2 X 50 grain pellets, but never three!
Even my muzzy .50 cal horse pistol will shoot right through a deer at 25 yards with a patched round ball and 25 grains fffg! And remember, if you can believe the powder making companies propoganda, the modern powders are more powerful than traditional black!
When you figure even the grandaddy buffalo gun .45 - 70 had only 70 grains ffg black powder behind a 410 grain hand-cast-around-the-campfire-at-night-lead bullet and it and others of about the same power, killed millions of buffalo often at very long ranges...
Sure the .45-70 is a cartridge gun, but remember, with a muzzloader all you are doing is handloading the "cartridge" one at a time down your barrel. 
In both my .50-70 and .45-70 cartridge rifles I only use 50 grains ffg (sometimes 777) and a card wad to fill the space and they shoot through deer without slowing down way farther away than I can hit em!
I seriously believe that the modern enthusiasm with excessive power and modern superbullets are way overkill for deer and bear sized game, even elk if you care to hunt rather than shoot! IMHO


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## OBSESSED (Nov 23, 2006)

IM GIVING IT ANOTHER RUN AND TRYING A DIFFERENT PART OF THE STATE WED AND THURS. HOPEFULLY MY LUCK CHANGES IF NOT I STILL APPRECIATE ALL OF THIS USEFUL INFO. U GUYS ARE GIVING ME. :lol:


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