# Would you hunt a 4 month old?



## Quincy (Jul 27, 2010)

I'm looking for input.......would you take a 4 month old lab hunting waterfowl or would you leave him at home until next year? He has been doing great, has been exposed to birds several times, has been to the lake and already swims like a champ and has been exposed to shotgun report with no issues. I know he is young and I am stuck between trying to expose him to as many things as i can as early as possible, and risking "ruining" him if something goes wrong. I'm just looking for opinions if you would take him this year with no expectations other than exposure or if you would leave him home.

If I decide to take him along, I would leave my gun at home and just work with him while the 2 guys I hunt with do the shooting. They are both experienced with "breaking in" a new dog and are very understanding and respectful, so I have no concerns with who I am with.

Thanks in advance for the input.


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## Sasha and Abby (May 11, 2004)

I would... I would do EXACTLY what you are referring to - I would not take him on really nasty weather days unless it is for brief periods. Make it fun for him - they are like kids with short attention spans at that age. Good luck and post some pics of your pal.

Oh yeah... you know this but NO geese yet and set him up for success.


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## BROWNDOG (Nov 2, 2004)

IT ALL DEPENDS IF YOU WANT TO SPEND THE NEXT 8,9,10 YEARS OF HIS LIFE FIXING PROBLEMS THAT WERE CREATED AT 4 MONTHES, I HAVE NO IDEA WHAT YOUR EXPECTATIONS OR GOALS ARE WITH YOUR DOG BUT NO I WOULD NEVER HUNT A 4 MONTHE OLD. HERE ARE JUST A FEW EXAMPLES OF PROBLEMS THAT ARE VERY HARD TO FIX LATER ON, BREAKING, NOT HANDLING BIRDS PROPERLY, NOISE, GETS SPOOKED BY A CRIPPLE, THE LIST GOES ON AND ON.

IV'E GOT A 14 M0NTHE OLD THAT IS FF/CC AND JUST STARTING TO RUN COLD BLINDS, HAS HAD 25+ LIVE FLYERS SHOT FOR HIM, AND I'LL MOST LIKELY NOT HUNT HIM THIS FALL, HE HASN'T HAD ENOUGH CHEATING SINGLES AROUND THE WATER TO BE CONSIDERED HONEST, THE LAST THING I WANT TO DO IS CREATE A CHEATING PROBLEM ' JUST SO I CAN HUNT HIM'

TAKE YOUR TIME GET INVOLVED WITH A RETRIEVER CLUB, AND FOLLOW A PROGRAM, NEXT YEAR YOU'LL HAVE A DOG YOU CAN HAVE FUN WITH....


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## Quincy (Jul 27, 2010)

Thanks for your replies. It's exactly what I have gotten from different people I have talked to in person that knows more about it than me. It has been about a 50/50 split of people who have said they would verses those who have said absolutely not. :-? That is what makes me ponder.
Browndog, I understand your points of concern. To answer your question on my expectations, I am simply looking for a dog to take duck hunting. I just want a dog that will retrieve the birds we shoot. My expectations are that he be steady and not go until sent, other than that, just that he brings the bird back to me. 
I have joined the NDRC and will continue to work with him. I guess I will make the decision when the time comes depending on how he is doing. BTW, he has been retrieving very well, has NO issues with water (other than I can't get him out when it is time to call it quits  ), has been exposed to live birds and has been shot over for the last week or so(about 15 birds) and never even flinched. The pic is of some bird work we did this afternoon.
Thanks again to both of you for taking the time to reply and give me your opinions. I really do appreciate it.


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## Sasha and Abby (May 11, 2004)

Take him... just don't have high expectations yet. I took my 8 month old yesterday and had no expectations. She did great on finding and holding birds as she brought them back to heal. I was ready to cut it short if bad habits (chewing) popped up, but was pleasantly surprised.


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## Duckslayer100 (Apr 7, 2004)

I'll respectfully disagree with Browndog (what's with the yelling, by the way? The guys just asked an honest question...or did you forget to take the capslock off?)

I had Remy out at 4 months and hunted him the entire fall. Just like S&A said, keep your expectations low and stay positive. Getting the dog jacked up on birds and excited about hunting is the best thing you can do for it. Plan on hitting the training hard next summer and by next fall you'll have a bird-hunting machine.

I did this exact thing with my GWP. Hunted him last fall on every possible bird I could find. The more he hunted, the better he got. And after a full summer of training, I didn't see ANY problems with "bad habits" he may or may not have picked up on.

Just do yourself a favor and make sure the dug is exposed to gunfire before you head out. Also, put a bell or something on him, or keep his lead tied to him. Young pups have a tendency to forget what little training you've given them the first few times out, and a bell will help you hear them and the lead often slows 'em down a tad.


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## slough (Oct 12, 2003)

Mine was 9 months at the start of the season last year and I think that was pushing it. I'm no pro trainer but I had worked quite a bit with him. It seems hard to believe that at 4 months he could have his obedience down well enough where it's not going to be a hassle to have him with in the field. But I'm sure it's possible. I'm guessing Browndog's thoughts come from training dogs to hunt test and be perfect. Not hunting a dog until he's over 2 years old seems a bit much though for the non-pro guy.


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## Bobm (Aug 26, 2003)

Lab with waterfowl.... IMO no... hes too young especially if anyone else is shooting no matter how much I trust them.

Pointing dog maybe to probably depending on the dog and how outgoing it is but again only by myself.


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## BROWNDOG (Nov 2, 2004)

> Getting the dog jacked up on birds and excited about hunting is the best thing you can do for it.


Not so sure I agree with that considering the minnimal OB training a 4 monthe old can have, if you have ever had a noise problem that was created from early exposure to exciting situations with no way of correcting youd'e know where I'm comming from. The other problem is your hunting a dog that is not steady, exspecially in a hunting situation, just because the pup knows sit doesn't mean he is steady. The negetives involved in hunting a dog too young, completly out weight the possitives.

Bring the pup along, leave him in his crate during the hunt and let him out after the hunt to run around in the deeks, smell the birds, ect.


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## Quincy (Jul 27, 2010)

Thanks again for the replies. If the question is if we have the OB training down "rock solid" the answer is obviously no at 4 months. The "here" command is the one he is "blowing off" more than I would like at this stage in the game. I work on it with him 2-3 times a day for 10-15 minutes while out in the yard. The one thing he is doing much better than expected is being steady until sent. It is a pet peeve of mine when I have duck hunted with guys whose dogs just go whenever they want. I'm always afraid I'm not going to see them in the cattails and one of them is going to get shot. 
He will sit on only one command to "sit" until I release him to go. I had my brother toss a pigeon from behind some bushes this afternoon and shoot the bird out in front of us. I wanted to see how long he would hold until I released him. He sat solid as a rock for a good couple of minutes just staring at the down bird until I sent him. 
Bobm, you bring up a good point I really never thought of, I can see how a young pointer would be able to be worked on upland better than a young lab over a duck spread.
Browndog, that is actually a really good idea. I want to get him out there for the experience and exposure but I really am not trying to rush him "just so I can hunt him". I have been without a dog for the last 4 years so one more year isn't going to kill me. I may just do what you suggest so I don't risk anything and just let him be out while we are setting up and then crate him until we are picking up the deeks and let him run around.


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## Vernon.Miller (Apr 25, 2007)

I just took my 4 month old vizsla dove hunting. There is nothing like a blood thirsty pup eager to see a bird on the ground (or water). It is great experience to get them out there and experience the guns shots and dropping birds. Dont expect the world from them and make sure they are getting lots of praise. If you make it fun for them and they are responding with excitement, you cant beat early exposure.


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## Duckslayer100 (Apr 7, 2004)

Vernon.Miller said:


> I just took my 4 month old vizsla dove hunting. There is nothing like a blood thirsty pup eager to see a bird on the ground (or water). It is great experience to get them out there and experience the guns shots and dropping birds. Dont expect the world from them and make sure they are getting lots of praise. If you make it fun for them and they are responding with excitement, you cant beat early exposure.


What he said! :beer:


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## Chaws (Oct 12, 2007)

Encourage proper responses and condition desired results with young dogs as they're typically too young to use pressure such as choke chains and e-collars on. Also keep in mind that a pup that age is just a child in terms of their mental abilities as well as they physical abilities. I'd hate to see someone bring a very young pup into the field and have them break a limb or tear a muscle because the owner was trying to get the pup to do things before it's ready. Not to mention the chances of a puppy running in a weird direction after the first shot and end up jumping over someone else and getting in the range of a shotgun blast.

Couple quick question for the original poster.

Has the dog been on real birds? Wing clipped or dead? Fresh or frozen? Also, what's the dogs physical conditioning been like? Frequency of exercise, water exposure, etc? How about gun exposure?


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## dakotashooter2 (Oct 31, 2003)

Dogs like people vary.....Some handle it some don't. My first springer was in the field with me at about 5 1/2 months. I expected nothing out of it except to watch and experience the smells, sounds and excitement. It was a pretty agressive pup and probably learned more being in the field with me than my crappy training. It did a good job of retrieving birds and thats what I wanted. My current one was in the field at 7 1/2 months. This dog unlike my other is on the farm with me and never seemed to have much fear of anything. The first time out I had her in the blind with me hunting Canada geese. She hit the first goose that tried to get away like a freight train. All I saw was a cloud of dust and a goose tumbling end over end. She was to small to retrieve it but stood on it till I got there flapping wings and all. i'm not saying I'd advise it to everyone but for what I want out of my dogs it has worked out OK.


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## templey_41 (Jul 19, 2008)

yes! Every day of the week as long as you have faith in the training that you've put your dog through. I had my pup around gun fire around 11 weeks .22 LR. Slowly worked them up to a 12 guage. as long as you associate gun fire with pleasure they will do fine.


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## Quincy (Jul 27, 2010)

Thanks guys, to respond to some of the comments/questions, I have NO intention of even carrying my gun if I decide to take him with. I would be 100% focused on the dog. I would not be allowing him to break early, or go into a situation that would be a problem. I would have my blind set up right next to his with him on a lead to make sure he follows commands and would only allow him to try a retrieve if it is a simple one that I am confident he would make. Chaws, to answer your questions; yes, he has been on real birds (live and dead) also has had a bunch of live birds shot over him during training in the yard. I held the lead to correct him if he broke early, my brother shot standing directley next to me, then I sent him to get the downed pigeons. He has been exposed to water, never any hesitation at all, has been doing water retrieves with no problems. I take him for a walk (about a mile total) in the morning as well as another walk (maybe 2 miles total) in the evening everyday. Also, we are on a farm so he spends a ton of time chasing and wrestling with my wifes dog, physical conditioning I have no concerns about. Also, all of the training so far has been with positive feedback for the dog, I haven't used any pressure except for a stern "NO" when he started mouthing my daughters. Otherwise, everytime I get his check cord out, he is running to me to see what we're doing today 

Thanks again guys! :beer: I'm still planning to wait and decide when it's time based on how I think he is doing, no matter what, I'll post an update with either some pictures from the hunt or just the yard during training.


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