# Obama and His Church



## hunter9494 (Jan 21, 2007)

interesting article, but Obama shows bad judgement in his continuous association with this church and the "right" reverend Wright....this guy is a total idiot and it sure seems inappropriate for a potential presidential candidate to continue to worship and recognize this ******* as his spiritual leader, but the liberals are totally blind to it, anything goes with Obama....."oh yes it does!". :eyeroll:

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2008/ma ... aryclinton


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## boondocks (Jan 27, 2006)

Attending this church says alot about Obama. How can people even think about voting for this guy?


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## Gun Owner (Sep 9, 2005)

Because hes gonna bring about some much needed CHANGE!

Wait till its legal to Kill ******.... That'll be a helluva change..


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## boondocks (Jan 27, 2006)

Gun Owner said:


> Because hes gonna bring about some much needed CHANGE!
> 
> Wait till its legal to Kill ******.... That'll be a helluva change..


Listening to his Pastor, it wouldn't suprise me. :eyeroll:


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## hunter9494 (Jan 21, 2007)

well, the problem is so many people want "change" they are throwing all caution to the wind and embracing a guy who has no track record. 4 years in the senate allows for damn little experience.

can you imagine, Steve Balmer at Microsoft retiring and appointing a guy with 4 years at MS to his position?

only this is much worse, giving this brainy-ak the keys to the country?
what the hell are people thinking?? oops, i forgot, liberals just fall for his appeal...... :eyeroll:


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## wyogoose (Feb 11, 2006)

This whole situation just angers me. To think how stupid some Americans are is unreal. You have a guy with no experience to begin with and then throw in the fact that he associates himself with this nutty white and America hating pastor and this guy still has a chance at the presidency? I can not believe that Hillary and even more, McCain are not exploiting this. If it were me I would be throwing it at him like flaming bags of poo. I say if Liberals want this kind of "change" than they can move to South Africa. :******:


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## Gun Owner (Sep 9, 2005)

Its not just this pastor. Have you guys heard about the friendly relationship he has with William Ayers? He was a member of the WEathermen Underground that set bombs off at the capitol, the pentagon, and other targets in the 70s. Ayers was never prosocuted, but has no problem aking credit for the actions. When asked about Obamas relationship with Mr Ayers, a spokesman replied that they were friendly.

So not only does Obama follow the teachings of a psycho racist pastor, His friendly neighbor happens to be a domestic terrorist.


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## Plainsman (Jul 30, 2003)

The mainstream media wants to sweep this under the rug. Lets put this in another perspective. If a white candidate went to a white separatist church for many years, had that same pastor for many years, associated with that pastor, and the pastor preached "God Dam America" would that person be in political trouble?

The media can ignore it, the radical liberals can talk it down, but not all Americans are stupid. Watch Hillary's numbers start to catch up. This man is like going into a department store and purchasing one of those grab bag packages that you have no idea what's inside. If you have no idea what's inside the package a buck or two will not bankrupt you. However, are you willing to put your life savings, your freedom, your children's future, and the security of this nation into a grab bag?

Every day we are getting a better glimpse of what's in that bag, and it isn't pretty.


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## R y a n (Apr 4, 2005)

Did all of you take some time to listen to Obama's speech today? Did you really listen to the whole thing?

Here is a link:

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/21134540/vp ... 9#23691239

Please if you haven't take a moment to watch this. It is a powerful speech. It is far deeper in its context than most realize.

I found a great summation of my thoughts with this blogger's:



> Thoughts on Obama's Speech
> 
> I guess the Clinton chorus has gotten inside my head, because I feel like I have to start off this post by anticipating, and dealing with, the predictable complaint: "You would never do a post analyzing a Clinton speech like this!"
> 
> ...


Well argued. Elegantly put. Smart.

But I wonder: Is this really an effective way of talking to working- and middle-class white voters? I don't think so. Just as the language and fervor of the Black church is foreign to many working class whites, so is the language of the academy and of high-end liberalism. That's the language Obama was speaking today.

Which reminds: Obama's campaign is not just a bet on the ability of a black candidate to inspire voters across the lines that demarcate traditional racial, ethnic, and class divisions. It is a bet on the ability of the average American voter to rise to the level of his rhetoric.

The latter may be a far bigger bet than the former.

Powerful stuff is you follow the point he is trying to make. I believe he is trying to talk to many of you.

Ryan


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## adokken (Jan 28, 2003)

Ryan there are to many liberal haters on here, it is hopeless to reason with hate.


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## Ron Gilmore (Jan 7, 2003)

Very simple for me, Obama has been claiming he is different and not the same as others who seek this office. He claims to be genuine, honest and sincere.

What this has shown is that Obama is the same as most politicians who will say and do anything they think is necessary to gain office.

During his interview with Fox news he stated had he heard the inflammatory statements and words he would have left the church. Then today admitted because he had to that he had heard the inflammatory sermons.

Ding!Ding!Ding!Ding!

That should tell anyone and everyone who thinks he is for change that he is not. Thus it should be about qualifications and records. He barely casts a shadow on Hillary in that regard.

It really matter little to me that Wright is a racist, nor does it matter to me that Farrakhan endorsed Obama. What matters to me is that Obama has such poor judgment in people he has taken in close. Rezko, Wright are just a couple examples and now that the media sees that he is touchable without being a called a racist for asking the hard questions. This is going to steam roll. He may win the Dem position, but his own words are going to hang him.

Some group is going to run clips of Obama claiming he would have left the Church if he had heard them and then run the part of this speech where he admits to having heard them!!!!!!!!!!


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## cwoparson (Aug 23, 2007)

Catch the part where he said "there are politicians that use race and hate to divide". Thats fair enough and so true. But then he added "as well as conservative talk show hosts". Yeah right. Like liberal talk show hosts never do that. Don't have to be a liberal hater to pick up on him talking out of both sides of his mouth. Even Juan Williams thinks his speech was a flop and dishonest at best.


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## hunter9494 (Jan 21, 2007)

obama has always showed a propensity to be an impassioned speaker.

it's just his speaking style and passionate speeches that are attracting so many voters. he is thumping the "change moniker" like a baptist speaker thumbs the Bible. but deep down inside he is a modern day socialist and i am not in favor of socialists ideas or policies being advanced by our president. you guys call it "change".

what is even more troubling is that folks like you think an elegant 20 minute speech by Obama can erase the teachings and radical religious affiliation with Rev. Wright which spanned 20 years. it is amazingly naive of anyone to think that he has addressed this issue because he truly feels as he says he does....he was obligated to make the speech to reduce the adverse impaction of his 20 year affiliation with Wright, nothing more than that, sorry to say......but once again he has spun the tale and sprinkled "fairy dust" in the eyes and ears of those who would listen and be influenced by a 20 minute speech..not 20 years of action and activity and support in this radical African based church. :eyeroll:

there are a lot of institutions that need regulated to prevent fraudulent activities from being advanced in this country, as we are beginning to see. but i chose not to support a guy who is not capable of telling the truth or what his real intentions are if he is chosen as president. he is not a predictable, know quantity and that reality makes me nervous.

like i said, ryan......do you think Steve Balmer would nominate or hand the reins over to a 4 year wonder at Microsoft? we both know the answer to that question.......

ask yourself, should we hand the future of our country over to a guy with little experience in how governing and leading a nation really works, especially in these turbulent times?? rational thinking folks would answer, no, not ever. those that "hope" it would be better than having a known quantity as our leader are gambling with their future and the future of their children......gamblers belong in Vegas......


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## zogman (Mar 20, 2002)

Addokken, I don't hate Liberals. However I am very scared of them.
All Liberals want to repeal the Second Amendment, please note I said Liberal not Democrat.........
I am also very scared of Liberal Judges.
All Ombama said was warm fuzzies. No substance.


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## Plainsman (Jul 30, 2003)

> Well argued. Elegantly put. Smart.


Elderly people have told me Hitler could really turn a crowd. One fellow I worked with many years ago had his parents tell him many stories. He didn't believe the Holocaust happened, and thought well of Hitler. My point is well argued, elegant, smart, do not reflect the man's knowledge of right and wrong, they reflect his training and education.



> Anger over welfare and affirmative action helped forge the Reagan Coalition.


He passed that off as if it was not a problem. If affirmative action worked like liberals tell us it would be ok. I'll tell you right now there are quotas in government. I once applied for a job that required a year of experience. I had 18 years experience. If your familiar with government this was a GS11 (salary) position meaning you had to be a GS9 to apply. The job went to a female minority GS5 (illegal hire) with no experience. Now you know why some people hate affirmative action. You don't see the full extent of affirmative action until your in government. This alone tells me the man is false.



> But the anger is real; it is powerful; and to simply wish it away, to condemn it without understanding its roots, only serves to widen the chasm of misunderstanding that exists between the races.


That sounds like an excuse for the Rev Wright to me.



> Talk show hosts and conservative commentators built entire careers unmasking bogus claims of racism while dismissing legitimate discussions of racial injustice and inequality as mere political correctness or reverse racism.


In your careers have any of you spent an entire day on training and celebrations of multicultural diversity? I have. It does not unite people, it divides them. If we want to unite people we talk about all the things we have in common. If you want to divide them you keep them separated and you train that it is good. It destroys the whole melting pot ideal of America. Everyone today wants to maintain their cultural identity rather than being Americans.



> Just as black anger often proved counterproductive, so have these white resentments distracted attention from the real culprits of the middle class squeeze - a corporate culture rife with inside dealing, questionable accounting practices, and short-term greed;


That was just and unpaid for political speech complements of the media. The man is not what he portrays.


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## sdeprie (May 1, 2004)

I hardly know where to begin. There have been so many thoughts presented in this thread. I have to agree that the Rev's statements are nothing short of inflammatory and racist. I agree that "I didn't know what he was preaching" doesn't cut it. What concerns me the most is the propensity for socialism that pervades the political community, the need to "meet the needs of the people." What most people "NEED" is a swift kick in the ###. But no politician will ever get elected saying that. I can't quote the saying, but I'm sure someone will correct me. Basically when a republic discovers it can vote itself money from the treasury, it is doomed. That is the basic problem. Everyone wants to vote themselves money in some way. We as a society are greedy. We have to have taxes of some kind. Running the government isn't free. Human nature dictates that someone, somewhere will waste someone else's money. Greed isn't limited to corporate America. It permeates all of our lives. Until someone finds a pill to cure greed, we're all in deep "kim-chee." I don't think socialism will work any better, if as well, as capitalism. The best we can do is to try to keep as tight a reign on inequality as possible, allow people the means to better themselves and then allow them (perhaps reward them) for achieving that. I don't believe socialism does that. Any candidate that promotes personal liberty and achievement gets my vote. Is that Obama? You tell me.


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## hunter9494 (Jan 21, 2007)

answer: no. he is the entitlement presidential candidate with a hand out to those of his choosing, make no mistake about that! :eyeroll:


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## Bore.224 (Mar 23, 2005)

Cmon Plainsman lets call affirmative action what it really is... RACISM. Racism to benifit minoritys has been the norm for over 25 years, and it does not work , it is wrong and it fuels the fire of hatred between whites and blacks.

If Obama was a white guy going to white sepratist churches they would call him a Racist pig. So that is what I now think of Obama he is a Racist pig!! I think its all over for Hussan Obama!!


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## boondocks (Jan 27, 2006)

Bore.224 said:


> If Obama was a white guy going to white sepratist churches they would call him a Racist pig. So that is what I now think of Obama he is a Racist pig!! I think its all over for Hussan Obama!!


This statement says it all. If this happened to a white guy there would be no question about it, he would be done. Al Sharpton and Jesse Jackson would be calling for his apology and to drop out of the race ASAP. Of course last night on FOX News Al Sharpton was on basically saying the there was nothing wrong with the Rev's comments.


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## BigDaddy (Mar 4, 2002)

You guys are making way too much about Obama's church and its "Blackness". From the homepage of the Trinity United Church of Christ, it states that it has a non-negotiable commitment to Africa. So what?

How many Jewish synagogues have a strong, non-negotiable commitment to Israel? Almost all of them do.

Second, let's remember that this church is located in a predominantly Black part of Chicago. If we think about that, then why wouldn't it be "Black". Question for all you holier-than-though folks on this board in ND... How many minority members attend your church services? How many of your churches have lutefisk dinners to celebrate your Scandinavian heritage, or how many of your churches have a polka mass or German mass to celebrate your German heritage.

Leadership from Obama's church have stated repeatedly that you do not have to be Black to be a member. All races and people are welcome. However, they make no apologies for being "Black" and they will continue to celebrate their African heritage.

Heck, that sounds like every Lutheran church in southern MN where I grew up. All people were welcome, but we were proud of our Swedish heritage. We had Swedish hymns, ate meatballs and lutefisk, and did other things to keep our commitment to Scandinavia.

Last, have any of you actually viewed the entire video of Rev. Wright instead of just viewing the "God damn America" sound byte? I have. I can't and won't dismiss the statements, but after viewing it a few times, I understand them.

What Wright was stressing was the fact that many flag-waving, patriotic Americans assume that the U.S. has some sort of special place in God's eyes. In other words, many people say "God bless America", not asking for God to bless America, but saying it to somehow stress that God has blessed America. Big difference.

Along these lines, Wright was point out that there are lots of non-Christian things being pushed in the U.S. right now by supposed Bible-banging conservatives. When you see his comments in the context of the entire sermon, he was saying that God is really watching the U.S., and if was going to judge us, he wouldn't be blessing us... he'd be damning us.

After watching the video, I think that Wright was saying "God damn America" as if he was God. Somebody watch the video and tell me that I am wrong.

This is non-issue. It's a video excerpt from an entire sermon. Furthermore, Obama didn't say it, his pastor did. That's why folks haven't put more stock in it.

Now, how about we talk about some real issues... homelessness, poverty, the economy, two wars, the environment, education, and a proactive energy policy.


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## g/o (Jul 13, 2004)

> The point I was making was not that my grandmother harbors any racial animosity. She doesn't. But she is a typical white person who, uh, if she sees somebody on the street that she doesn't know there's a reaction that's been been bred into our experiences that don't go away and that sometimes come out in the wrong way and that's just the nature of race in our society. We have to break through it..." - Senator Barack Obama


Nice try Big Daddy, We know you love Barack and thats fine,your choice. He keeps inserting his foot in his mouth and this isn't going away. Geraldine is all fired up again and I don't blame her. She's just another typical white grandmother :eyeroll: :eyeroll: :eyeroll:


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## Ron Gilmore (Jan 7, 2003)

BigDaddy, the issue of Wright puts into light the lack of judgment that Obama has and it has taken away the halo of change as well!

Judgment: If you are going to attempt to unite two parties and as he has said the nation. You do not put someone who is a radical and racially divisive as Pastor Wright on any panel that advises you. It will cause people to stop and question your statements on a host of other issues and his denial of special treatment or granting of influence concerning Rezko.

Change: Obama says he is a candidate of change, but when faced with this issue he goes on Fox news and said had he known he would of left the church. Then later he makes a speech in which he admits to having known and heard some of the anti American comments but tries to quantify them. Then comes out and makes the case that white people have it breed into them to react negatively to a strange black man.

What his action shows is that it is business as usual. He has shown he will do anything, say anything to get elected. That is not change. He had some credibility on change by recognizing short comings of his party. He showed this in his comments on Reagan. But as soon as the liberal left whined he placated them. Business as usual

Now you want to talk about the issues. Let's talk about them!

The issue in Washington has been spending period. It matters little if it is Rep or Dem pork both parties have no high ground on this. The Rep spent to much and the Dem's wanted to spend even more. So what is Obama proposing more and new spending!

Now there are things that need fixing, but only one candidate so far is talking about trying to fix them within the confines of the current revenue that is coming in. Is it Obama?

Then there is the issue of Judaical appointments. Just this past week we have before the court the issue of gun ownership being a right or if that was limited only to the military. Many people who follow the court see this court siding with it being a right. If you listened to the oral arguments you saw Judges who where looking at this issue from a Constitutional position and Judges who where looking at it from a social position.

Obama has shown his belief is that social issues trump the Constitution. That position alone makes him an unworthy candidate in my mind!

I do not discount Obama for being a black man, and to be honest I am not influenced by the issues surrounding Wright other than what I pointed out in regards to his judgment. His social positions and economic positions are not compatible for me in any way shape or forum. I believe he lacks the ablity to surround himself with competent people who could advise him on foreign policy from trade to defense.

I do not believe in a forced redistribution of wealth nor do I care for his policy towards energy with the exception of some of his positions on coal.


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## Plainsman (Jul 30, 2003)

BigDaddy, it's clear you don't understand us. I don't care if he is black, purple, green, white, or stripped. I do care that he got caught saying one thing one day and changed it the next. Is that the change he talks of? I see why we debate now, you don't know how we think.


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## BigDaddy (Mar 4, 2002)

> BigDaddy, it's clear you don't understand us. I don't care if he is black, purple, green, white, or stripped. I do care that he got caught saying one thing one day and changed it the next. Is that the change he talks of? I see why we debate now, you don't know how we think.


Plainsman:

Just who is "us" and "we" in your post above. Is it conservatives, you personally, or most members of this board?

I think that it can just as accurately be stated that you don't understand us. For your benefit, I'll define "us" as the moderate or liberal citizens of this country that think beyond gun control and abortion as being significant social issues).

I think that your frustration with Obama is that he doesn't issue categorical answers to questions in most cases. This is because issues are complicated. The answer to most questions on most complicated answers are not "yes" or "no".

For example, I think that the right answer to questions like, "Do you support tax cuts?" is "It depends". This is because it depends on what benefit we get some cuts, who gets them, and what programs will need to be cut after they lose funding. The right answer to questions like, "Do you support a woman's right to choose abortion?" is "It depends". This is because it depends on whether we are talking about a fetus that is 2 days old or 9 months old, and whether the mother's life is in danger.

I have heard Obama debate and answer questions, and I have read his book The Audacity of Hope. One thing that I respect is that he answers questions with less than "yes" or "no" answers. I see this as a strength, while it drives conservatives nuts. Others see this as a sign that he doesn't take firm stances on issues. If folks would listen to him, you will see that his answers on issues are really consistent.

So, Plainsman. Stop speaking in generalities. What specifically did Obama flip on that has your panties in such a bind?


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## Plainsman (Jul 30, 2003)

> Just who is "us" and "we" in your post above. Is it conservatives, you personally, or most members of this board?


Conservatives.

For your benefit, I'll define "us" as the moderate or liberal citizens of this country that think beyond gun control and abortion as being significant social issues).

I get a kick out of very liberal people who define themselves as moderate. Everyone thinks they are moderate. You think I am far right, and I think your way way left.



> Do you support a woman's right to choose abortion?


Do you support a child's right to life?



> What specifically did Obama flip on that has your panties in such a bind?


He said he never heard his pastor talk like that, and 24 hours later he admitted he did. After a 20 year close acquaintance no one but the extremely naive believed him. He realized that and came clean. He should have done that to begin with, but rather than tell the truth he chose what he thought would be to his political advantage. Exit credability stage left.


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## g/o (Jul 13, 2004)

BigDaddy, Here is another of Baracks famous quotes



> "I understand MSNBC has suspended Mr. Imus," Obama told ABC News, "but I would also say that there's nobody on my staff who would still be working for me if they made a comment like that about anybody of any ethnic group. And I would hope that NBC ends up having that same attitude."


No he didn't say yes or no here either. Funny how when Imus said this the Rev.'s Al and Jesse and Barrack condemned this but what the Rev Wright says is just fine.


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## Plainsman (Jul 30, 2003)

g/o said:


> BigDaddy, Here is another of Baracks famous quotes
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I was listening to that the other day too. Talk about a bunch of hypocrites. I notice he wasn't that eloquent today, it was a bunch of ah, duh, ah, duh, duh, his speech writer must have taken a day off.


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## g/o (Jul 13, 2004)

> I notice he wasn't that eloquent today,


No Plainsman he is finally being asked some questions. He is the darling of the media so far, but as time goes on he will get asked more and more. I think he is in big trouble McCain is really gaining in the polls and Barack is losing. Of course what are his positions


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## BigDaddy (Mar 4, 2002)

> BigDaddy, Here is another of Baracks famous quotes
> 
> Quote:
> "I understand MSNBC has suspended Mr. Imus," Obama told ABC News, "but I would also say that there's nobody on my staff who would still be working for me if they made a comment like that about anybody of any ethnic group. And I would hope that NBC ends up having that same attitude."
> ...


Maybe I'm confused. Rev. Wright made race-based statements and Obama removed him from his campaign. Another aide called Hillary Clinton a "monster" and Obama fired her. Sounds like he has dealt with staff that that made comments about racial groups.

I think you both want Obama to simply leave his church. Do either of you belong to a church? Have you have ever had a pastor that you did not like or one that you did not agree with all the time? I have. Did you leave? I didn't. Why? Because I was a member of that church, and part of being a member of a church congregation is being a member of church family where you build strong bonds and friendships. Bonds between me and the members of my congregation were far stronger than between me and my pastor.

Rev. Wright is Obama's pastor and he is a friend. Personally, I respect Obama for standing strong and saying that while he dismissed Wright from his campaign, he would not abandon his friend and pastor outright because the pundits think that it makes good political sense.


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## g/o (Jul 13, 2004)

Not so fast Big Daddy, Obama was condemning Don Imus while he still had the Rev Wright on his staff. He didn't get rid of Rev Wright until they started investigating Rev Wright. Lets not forget Geraldine and she is not about to go away.

Big Daddy in your church did your Rev speak as Rev Wright does? Did the Rev you didn't like say God Damn the USA, United States of kkk A, we infected the blacks with the aids virus?


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## BigDaddy (Mar 4, 2002)

> Not so fast Big Daddy, Obama was condemning Don Imus while he still had the Rev Wright on his staff. He didn't get rid of Rev Wright until they started investigating Rev Wright. Lets not forget Geraldine and she is not about to go away.


g/o:

You are doing exactly what the status quo politicians (note: see definition of "conservative") want you to do. You are focusing on semantics and trivial matters, instead of trying to handle serious issues that transcend political lines.

For crying out loud, once the Rev. Wright videos were aired, Obama came out and said that while he loves his pastor and credits him with becoming a Christian, he was unaware of the statements in question. As soon as he became aware, he dealt with it and Wright was no longer on his staff.

You're grasping for straws on a non-issue instead of dealing with issues that need to be dealt with.


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## g/o (Jul 13, 2004)

> You are doing exactly what the status quo politicians (note: see definition of "conservative") want you to do. You are focusing on semantics and trivial matters, instead of trying to handle serious issues that transcend political lines.


Is this what typical white people do? I'm far from a conservative and would love for Barack to let people know where he actually stands on issues.


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## BigDaddy (Mar 4, 2002)

> I'm far from a conservative and would love for Barack to let people know where he actually stands on issues.


Good. Then get to it.

Here is his website where he describes his position on 21 different issues: http://www.barackobama.com/index.php.

Here is where you can order his book The Audacity of Hope in which he describes his position on numerous issues and describes his plan to make this country better: http://search.barnesandnoble.com/The-Audacity-of-Hope/Barack-Obama/e/9780307237705/?itm=2.

That'd be a good start to learn where he stands on issues.


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## Ron Gilmore (Jan 7, 2003)

Big Daddy,standing strong? He is running from it faster than a *john* from a brothel house during a raid!!!!

Those moderates you speak of are still human and I would bet a good portion of them are rethinking support for him with his comments. Plus I have noticed as of late that a number of black pundits who have supported him are now very upset with the comments as of late.

To them instead of finding a common ground it exposed just more questions! Like did he join the church strickly for political gain, or where his wifes comments rooted in the hate speech from Wright, or the fact that he is attempting to be a fence rider and not willing to take a position.


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## Plainsman (Jul 30, 2003)

> trivial matters


Trivial matters??????? I don't think they are trivial.



> once the Rev. Wright videos were aired, Obama came out and said that while he loves his pastor and credits him with becoming a Christian, he was unaware of the statements in question.


I got some swamp land for sale.



> As soon as he became aware


Please, please, please, tell me you didn't fall for that. He came out and admitted he had heard these remarks. He was perhaps aware for years. For crying out loud, who is grasping at straws. I'll bet it's a chore to get yourself to believe that he didn't know all along.

I guess love is blind.


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## Gun Owner (Sep 9, 2005)

I dont see how anyone can believe that Obama had this man as his pastor for 20 years and only knew he was anti-american AFTER someone else pointed it out. LONG before these sermons came to light, conservatives and moderates investigating Obamas website were directed to his churches website. ANd without hearing one word from siad pastor, it was very obvious to a LOT of people what that church stood for. This pastors sermons just cemented theory into blatant fact. Obama spent the last 20 years of his life attending a "christian" church that blamed our government for atrocities against blacks for NO OTHER PURPOSE that to keep blacks ****** off at "White America,"

Its the same BS racecard constantly being thrown around by Al Sharpton, who btw, Is in contact with Obama at least 3 times a week. Obama aligns himself with black separatists, and no amount of back peddling or elequant speaches is going to change the minds of your average intelligent, free thnking American.

For furthur proof you need look no further than the comment by his wife. Twenty years of indoctrination at this church as to how racist America was led her to comment that she was finally proud of America, now that her Black husband was a serious contender for the white house.

In the end, the voters will decide. Its just nice to see the media putting a little pressure on thier golden boy for once. I hope it continues.


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## g/o (Jul 13, 2004)

Big Daddy I said where he actually stands on things. I'm not argue with you all day because you have your mind up and reading your posts for the past several years I know where you stand on things. I respect your feelings and will leave things at that


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## Chinwhiskers (Jan 13, 2008)

Looks like the "Great Uniter" has turned into the "Great Divider".


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## sdeprie (May 1, 2004)

I think the "issue" a lot of people are expressing concern about is Senator Obama's Racism. Is he a racist? His close friend, religious mentor and advisor is clearly a racist. It has been clearly suggested that his wife is a racist. I believe that people can be judged by the company they keep. Now, neither his pastor nor his wife just recently became racist. They have been that way since before the senator met them.

I think you both want Obama to simply leave his church. Do either of you belong to a church? Have you have ever had a pastor that you did not like or one that you did not agree with all the time? I have. Did you leave? I didn't. Why? Because I was a member of that church, and part of being a member of a church congregation is being a member of church family where you build strong bonds and friendships. Bonds between me and the members of my congregation were far stronger than between me and my pastor.

To answer this question, yes, leave. If you strongly oppose the views of your church, your responsibility is to work to change them or go elsewhere, if they cannot be changed. I personally know hundreds of people who left their church because they opposed the changes that were being made. I myself go to a church of my denomination 30 miles away instead of the one several blocks down the road because of concern about their attitudes and for other reasons. If you stay in spite of differences, you support those ideals you may not want to support. You don't accept it until someone makes it public, then denounce it. If you do that, *you're too late*.


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