# Commorant Season



## hammerhead (Dec 22, 2004)

Now that Snow goose season is about done I think that we should move right into Cormorant season. Last weekend when I was out looking for geese, and this week driving to Bismarck for work I saw loads of the black buggers. They were all over the sloughs diving for what ever they could find. There are getting to be more and more of them every year.
I think deer rifles would be a good option. No steel shot allowed, lead shot only. And jumping would be highly recommended(that leaves Leo out). These birds really need to be thinned out in my opinion.


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## Leo Porcello (Jul 10, 2003)

I have no problems jumping those nasty bastards. Send them back to China!!!


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## Ima870man (Oct 29, 2003)

Leo:
Maybe you should set up on them and use the umber super secret ...ummm...what the heck do you call it...hrmmm...oh yeah -- the umber super secret POR/Cormo/tex. :lol:

Ima870man

Golden Rule 5: Beer is King!


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## Large munsterlander1 (Feb 11, 2008)

I wonder how they taste? They seem to eat a lot of walleys i be they taste like walleys! :roll:


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## USSapper (Sep 26, 2005)

Do you ever think they would open up a season or just let people shoot them some day? These things run rampent on all small, ND lakes. Really ruined the fishing in alot of places


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## bud69652 (Feb 6, 2006)

"I think that we should move right into Cormorant season"

Best idea I have ever heard. I would take a week off from work and crush the polpulation.


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## CuttinDaisies (Nov 15, 2007)

Large munsterlander1 said:


> I wonder how they taste? They seem to eat a lot of walleys i be they taste like walleys! :roll:


Atleast thats what resort owners and guides will tell ya. Just look at Leech Lake in Minnesota, walleyes were found to make up a whopping LESS than 1% of their diet.

Not a single one of us are old enough to remember what the cormorant populations were before DDT. But there is enough evidence to suggest that they were as, if not not more plentiful than they are now. And there were plenty of fish back then according to any old-timer.

Cormorants are just the wolves of the fishing world. They are a new predator to the current outdoorsmen who are quick to judge. Cormorants are just coming back and playing their proper role. No need to worry, things will even out.


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## hunt4P&amp;Y (Sep 23, 2004)

:withstupid: Even out???? Not with this tree loving society! Only answer..... :sniper:

IMO


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## CuttinDaisies (Nov 15, 2007)

hunt4P&Y said:


> :withstupid: Even out???? Not with this tree loving society! Only answer..... :sniper:
> 
> IMO


Ok... only answer to what??? An unproven theory conconted by resort owners and bad fisherman?

I guess I'm just looking for a little more research that proves cormorants are a direct link to bad fishing before we start killing them all.... again. You seem to have your mind made up, can you post some links to the research that gave you this opinion, I'de really like to see it. Cormorants play a role, everything does, we need to find out what that role is then if management is necessary move ahead with it. Killing things is not always the answer I hate to say.


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## xtrema2 (Mar 16, 2008)

i dont mind them much but where i am there were a few small islands and once the cormorants started going there they just killed off the trees and grass now there are just little islands of red sand


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## MrSafety (Feb 22, 2005)

Why not throw the Pelican in on the fun too?? But, asking the DNR shows they don't think pelicans eat game fish either........ :eyeroll:


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## blhunter3 (May 5, 2007)

I have talked to DNR officer he was say when they release fish in a lake the cormorants know what truck it is and follow it and chow down. Also he said that alot of them when they killed them and examined them they had perch coming out of their mouth because they were so full of fish.


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## djleye (Nov 14, 2002)

The thing I really hate about Cormies is when you see a big flock in the distance and you follow them for a few miles while out scouting and then you realize you have been chasing those bastards for 8 miles @ $3.50 a gallon!!!!


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## Leo Porcello (Jul 10, 2003)

commorants are a very smart bird. Like the raven they can be taught by humans to do things. I respect that. In China they use commorants to fish. They release the commorants onto a lake. The birds will dive, catch fish, and come back to the boat, then the human will stroke the rants neck with a stick and the rant will upchuck the fish and it gets put in a basket.

I agree with what cuttindaisies has to say as far as just killing things is not always the answer. But like snowgeese I think the rants are overpopulated in some areas and are doing harm there. They either need to be spread out or some need to be killed off.

In Alaska you could hunt them in two zones but you had to utilize at least the feathers. I think the natives had free reign to kill them.

One thing I am not sure of is are commorants native to the lower 48 or were they introduced? If they are not native then I would say their impact or balance to the eco chain is not needed.


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## hammerhead (Dec 22, 2004)

It's not just the walleyes that they eat it's the frogs, salamanders, small turtles and what ever else they can find. You put 20 of them on a small slough and they can clean it out in no time.
And yes some of us are old enough to remember cormorant populations from years ago. In the 60's and 70's I don't remember the numbers like we have now. You might have seen a few in those years, but not the migration that goes on these days.
I don't know if any resort owners in ND have complained about the cormorants effecting fish populations or if it is just a Minn. thing. And I don't believe that we should kill them all off but about a reduction of about 80% would be a good start.


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## Leo Porcello (Jul 10, 2003)

80% :lol:


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## barebackjack (Sep 5, 2006)

CuttinDaisies said:


> I guess I'm just looking for a little more research that proves cormorants are a direct link to bad fishing before we start killing them all.... again.


Research is always good. But I really dont trust half the "research" that comes out of alot of "wildlife agencies". Walleye may only make up 1% of the diet, but if you have colony of 20,000+ comorants, well, thats alot of walleye over the summer.

I can tell you just by doing some binoc research, that there are some places that seem to have quite a few of these birds, which cant be helping the local fish populations. I say open season! No deer rifles though. Probably not a great idea to have guys banging away up into the tops of dead trees with hi-powers.

If it was opened, id go out in the boat under the nesting colonies with shotguns just after the younguns are hopping outta the nest but before they can fly.


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## hammerhead (Dec 22, 2004)

Oh no you could not shoot into a bare tree not knowing where the bullet will land. But when they are on shore with their wings spread drying off now there's a shot that would be big fun. :sniper:


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## AdamFisk (Jan 30, 2005)

djleye said:


> The thing I really hate about Cormies is when you see a big flock in the distance and you follow them for a few miles while out scouting and then you realize you have been chasing those bastards for 8 miles @ $3.50 a gallon!!!!


Been there, done that.........more than once. Damn birds.


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## CuttinDaisies (Nov 15, 2007)

hammerhead said:


> And yes some of us are old enough to remember cormorant populations from years ago. In the 60's and 70's I don't remember the numbers like we have now. You might have seen a few in those years, but not the migration that goes on these days.


Thats b/c the '60's and '70's were post-DDT. I bet you didn't see as many bald eagles during that time frame as you do now.

Leo, double-breasted cormorants like we see around here are native. Henry Schoolcraft reported seeing them when he was searching for the headwaters of the Mississippi. There was a report of a flock 4 miles long and one mile wide in 1891. I've seen my fair share of large cormorant flocks, but nothing like that yet.

All cormorants are doing is reestablishing themselves in areas that they used to inhabit before DDT. They are not an invasive species, as of right now they are not over-populated, they belong here.

I guess I just like things to be as natural as possible, the way nature and evolution intended. There is more to life than game species.


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## Triple B (Mar 9, 2004)

i didn't quite thoroughly read all the posts here but want to mention that while cormorants diet may only be 1% of desireable gamefish, the other 99% is "junk fish" and other species. these other species are potentially forage for game fish, now if you take out all that forage for our game fish, it indirectly affects the game fish populations in that aspect alone. so to say that cormorants only eat 1% walleye can be misleading, in that fact that yes only 1% are gobbled up by cormies, but the overall population is substantially more affected by the increase in cormorant population.


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## Muleys&amp;Honkers4life (Nov 23, 2004)

Do I smell a CORTEX in the works??


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## swedeole (May 21, 2007)

:roll:

CuttinDiasies has it right.

Cormorants really have no effect on walleye populations, and that has been proven - actually the study showed less than 1% of their diet was walleye.

Compared to the human harvest of walleyes, cormies are statistically insignificant.

Loons and eagles kill a lot more - shall we start killing them too?


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## hunt4P&amp;Y (Sep 23, 2004)

Well there is getting to be alot of eagles........................................

100% Kidding.


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## blhunter3 (May 5, 2007)

What do the dirty geese eat? Fingerlings. Humans take out the adults. The dirty geese know what truck the DNR stocks with and the follow them. Those dirty geese can clean out a bait slough in a hurry. Go ask some people that raise bait. The dirty geese need to be thinned out.


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## CuttinDaisies (Nov 15, 2007)

blhunter3 said:


> What do the dirty geese eat? Fingerlings. Humans take out the adults. The dirty geese know what truck the DNR stocks with and the follow them. Those dirty geese can clean out a bait slough in a hurry. Go ask some people that raise bait. The dirty geese need to be thinned out.


By bait slough do you mean rearing pond? By rearing pond I mean formerly very productive waterfowl habitat, until the MN DNR decided to dump thousands of walleye fingerlings and let them eat the same fresh water shrimp that used to be available for waterfowl, but is now in the belly of your precious walleye.... those bait sloughs? The desire to catch a walleye is what needs to be thinned out.

You do make good points though, as to why we need more cormorants. we need them to move into duck sloughs that have been destroyed by the DNR in their attempts to raise enough walleyes to put in every lake in MN, and eat all introduced species- such as walleyes.


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## blhunter3 (May 5, 2007)

Well these bait sloughs I am refering to are ones that have the owner legalily made it a bait slough. The owners are avid duck hunter and pick the slough that didn't hold many if all any ducks. They did their research. So before you go grilling people you better do some research first.


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## goosehunternd (Mar 10, 2006)

I thought they were always in season  my bad


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## CuttinDaisies (Nov 15, 2007)

blhunter3 said:


> Well these bait sloughs I am refering to are ones that have the owner legalily made it a bait slough. The owners are avid duck hunter and pick the slough that didn't hold many if all any ducks. They did their research. So before you go grilling people you better do some research first.


Yep, thats exactly what we need. Arm chair bioligists dumping minnows into every slough around. Its no wonder why Minnesota's duck hunting has declined so much.

Can you show me exactly what research I was supposed to find concerning your friend who did his research. I don't know many people running studies on that guy.


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## blhunter3 (May 5, 2007)

Don't assume anything, thats all I was after. Not all people that raise bait throw there bait where ever the freshwater shrimp are. I know for a fact that they have taken their time when they where selecting where they wanted to put bait.


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## CuttinDaisies (Nov 15, 2007)

blhunter3 said:


> Don't assume anything, thats all I was after. Not all people that raise bait throw there bait where ever the freshwater shrimp are. I know for a fact that they have taken their time when they where selecting where they wanted to put bait.


When it comes to guys dumping fish into waters they don't naturally inhabit, I will assume its a bad thing, as there still isn't an instance where it was a good thing.


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## hunt4P&amp;Y (Sep 23, 2004)

What is the reason it is a bad thing to stalk fish?

I guess I have never looked at it as a bad thing. :-?


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## diver_sniper (Sep 6, 2004)

CuttinDaisies said:


> By bait slough do you mean rearing pond? By rearing pond I mean formerly very productive waterfowl habitat, until the MN DNR decided to dump thousands of walleye fingerlings and let them eat the same fresh water shrimp that used to be available for waterfowl, but is now in the belly of your precious walleye.... those bait sloughs? The desire to catch a walleye is what needs to be thinned out.


That's a really good point. I never thought about that. F$&# walleyes, I want divers to fly through Minnesota again. Lets go cormies!

Here's my experience with the "dirty geese". Back home they stock walleye fingerlings in two ponds on my grandma's farm. In the summer the guy who stocks them gets a permit to shoot the cormorants that eat the fish. I'm not sure how legal it is, in fact I'm sure it's not, but they chase them down with their boat and shoot them. While they are chasing them the rants are so full of fish that they can't get themselves off the water, so they circle the pond running on the watter flapping their ***** off and puking up fish to drop weight so they can get away. So yeah, they eat some fish.

But like has been said, how natural is it to have thousands of baby fish in one little pond? How can you be too mad at the cormorants for showing up for what's an obviously easy meal? It's not their fault that humans provided them with the all you can eat buffet of a lifetime.

But like I said, if it takes a bunch of cormorants to bring some ducks back to Minnesota, I'll be the first member of Cormorants Unlimited.


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## Plainsman (Jul 30, 2003)

> Leo, double-breasted cormorants like we see around here are native.


I'm not sure what you got your mind on son, but isn't that double-crested?


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## CuttinDaisies (Nov 15, 2007)

Plainsman said:


> > Leo, double-breasted cormorants like we see around here are native.
> 
> 
> I'm not sure what you got your mind on son, but isn't that double-crested?


hahaha oops. I must have been warming up for Spring Fest a day early.



hunt4P&Y said:


> What is the reason it is a bad thing to stalk fish?
> 
> I guess I have never looked at it as a bad thing. :-?


I'm assuming you mean stock fish. Biologically speaking, its not necessarily a bad thing, but its never a good thing, neutral at best-economically its a different story which is why its so popular. As a duck hunter, my complaints about the stocking programs in MN, is where they raise the fish. Not to mention the liberal laws allowing bait dealers to stock ponds with bait fish like BLHunter has been referring to.


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## USSapper (Sep 26, 2005)

I say leave them, some days they are the only things that look like they are cooperating with my decoys


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## Neck Collar (Sep 19, 2006)

I know for a fact that back home in central MN the local bait shops get special permits from the dnr to shoot as many cormorants as possible on their "bait rearing ponds". A couple guys that worked at the bait shop were paid for a week to go around to the ponds and shoot them everyday. The bait shop even gave them a pallet of shotgun shells.

Now that's a sweet job!


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## blhunter3 (May 5, 2007)

Its fun. I got to go with on one of those, shoots.


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## jd mn/nd (Apr 8, 2004)

Well the fact is that fish as a whole make up 100% of their diet!!! Weather it be the almighty walleye or panfish or even perch and minnows. They are and can be a very detrimental bird in a variety of ways. Not only do they eat a lot of fish weather it be from lakes or rearing ponds or bait ponds, but when they decide to roost in certain areas they will desimate all of the surrounding habit.

That being said for the past two summers on Leech lake the MN DNR has hired sharp shooters to remove a percentage of the birds from the lake, because even their own studies, showed that the walleye population was waining due to the dirty geese. Even with all of thier stocking efforts and they were litterally dumping millions upon millions of fry into the lake, they could not get the populations of walleye up to the level that they needed to be at to sustain a good fishery. They knew by doing creel counts that the fisherman were not removing the fish from the lake, and with little or no summer die off, it did not leave a lot of other choices as to what could be the problem. This was all printed in various areas of the media from , newspapers, TV, outdoor magazines, etc.

Yes there is a certain part of this that says mother nature will take care of herself, however I do believe that the human race has to help her with her fight, weather it be through stocking efforts, predator control, habitat, you name it. We do have to help out, or there will not be anything there for our kids or thier kids to enjoy the outdoors like all of us.

Later JD


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## USAlx50 (Nov 30, 2004)

CuttinDaisies said:


> When it comes to guys dumping fish into waters they don't naturally inhabit, I will assume its a bad thing, as there still isn't an instance where it was a good thing.


 I sure wish people never would have started putting muskies into mille lacs or Tonka.. That sure turned into a mess.


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## Leo Porcello (Jul 10, 2003)

FPP GFY!!!!!!!!!!!


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## Leo Porcello (Jul 10, 2003)

Muleys&Honkers4life said:


> Do I smell a CORTEX in the works??


I will probably just make a conversion kit for the PORtex. They guys can have a CORPORtex!


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## Leo Porcello (Jul 10, 2003)

CuttinDaisies said:


> Leo, double-breasted crested cormorants like we see around here are native.


Thank you. I had heard that rants were brought in from China.


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## Muleys&amp;Honkers4life (Nov 23, 2004)

You are a genius PC, I would have never thought of that. If you need any financial support in this project, let me know.

:beer:


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## snow (Dec 7, 2007)

I'm with JD on this one,infact these birds are so smart the sharp shooters would take'em at night as not to educate the birds of approaching danger.I think their goal last spring was 5k nesting pairs.The DNR worries that if the birds are shot in the day light they'll just go to another lake and setup shop.

In addition to leech lake whoa's is the red "crusty" crayfish,another non-native species destyroying game fish habitate,they're everywhere and feed on spawn as well.


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## blhunter3 (May 5, 2007)

Our local bait store gets permits every year. Its real fun to go out and watch them shoot. We have cut some of them open and they are so full of fish that they are coming out of the throat. A couple fo them couldn't get off the water because they were so heavy.


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## goosehunternd (Mar 10, 2006)

> We have cut some of them open


your a better man than me, those are some ugly fu(kers


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## blhunter3 (May 5, 2007)

When you work on a farm some stuff just doesn't matter anymore.


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## goosebusters (Jan 12, 2006)

CuttinDaisies said:


> When it comes to guys dumping fish into waters they don't naturally inhabit, I will assume its a bad thing, as there still isn't an instance where it was a good thing.


I am so ****** that someone dumped a bunch of perch and largemouth into this slough near Petersburg. I caught a five pound largemouth last year, then on top of that I had to take it off my hook and take some pictures. What a pain!

On a lighter note, I got out on the opening day of 'rant season and bagged 423,045!!! 45 leg bands and 2 yellow collars. A pretty good start of the season. I had 75 mojo rants setup and used a couple CORTEX's for the first time. Obviously the results speak for themselves.


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## blhunter3 (May 5, 2007)

Not bad for opener. Last year all we did was roost busting and tell you what we got alot of them. Gotta love busing a roost.


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## hunt4P&amp;Y (Sep 23, 2004)

I used the dying tree decoy and call. They came right in!


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## goosehunternd (Mar 10, 2006)

> I used the dying tree decoy and call. They came right in!


true that


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## goosebusters (Jan 12, 2006)

hunt4P&Y said:


> I used the dying tree decoy and call. They came right in!


Do you use the new Avery fully-barked trees? Or do you find you have more success with the chalk-white bare trees?


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## hunt4P&amp;Y (Sep 23, 2004)

I used 33.333 Dozen of the FBT's They seemed to work well. I used the 89 foot models, but I heard the 55's were working well also.

Man it sucked having to bring 14 semi's with to haul them all in. But let me tell you when you set them up and the rants start flying it is game over. Shot 4.8702740 Million of them the first day!


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## goosehunternd (Mar 10, 2006)

Good thing you got that pro-staff postition to hook you up with all the ammo, otherwise that could have got really spendy! When are they guna set up that food pantry to drop all of these 'rants that I shot??


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## goosebusters (Jan 12, 2006)

Did you make sure to slit them from lips to anus and release all the fish back into the water? Oftentimes the walleyes in their guts are still alive. So we can help the fish population too. I actually found a couple of empty boxcars going West and threw my tree dekes in there.


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## diver_sniper (Sep 6, 2004)

You BP guys are Aholes.


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## mshutt (Apr 21, 2007)

The best place to shoot the cormies is when there roosting on a smaller river. Or just resting there for the time being looking for fish to eat. And when you find there feeding grounds, and youve got 33.333 dozen FFD cormie floaters, its LIGHTSOUT the next morning after you set up and wait for them to cup into your CORTEX. You had better have alot of shooters along, or a couple cases of ESTATES to shoot them with.


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## Hamm (Dec 10, 2007)

diver_sniper said:


> You BP guys are Aholes.


 :lol: :lol: :lol:


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## blhunter3 (May 5, 2007)

You guys and your decoys. ROOST BUSTING is the only way to go.


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## goosebusters (Jan 12, 2006)

I hope you are talking about estate trap loads. I think there is a 50 dollar fine for shooting them with anything besides lead.


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## blhunter3 (May 5, 2007)

Here in mn its a $100 fine and they are very strick.


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## hunt4P&amp;Y (Sep 23, 2004)

mshutt said:


> The best place to shoot the cormies is when there roosting on a smaller river. Or just resting there for the time being looking for fish to eat. And when you find there feeding grounds, and youve got 33.333 dozen FFD cormie floaters, its LIGHTSOUT the next morning after you set up and wait for them to cup into your CORTEX. You had better have alot of shooters along, or a couple cases of ESTATES to shoot them with.


NO NO I have 33.333 FBT's (Fully Barked Tree's) Shizz I got 3333.3333 doz FFC's!


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## poutpro (Mar 8, 2006)

I know that in MN people must get a permit from the DNR if they want to stock any type of fish. The DNR goes out and nets the lake to see if any fish species are already present. If fish are present, the permit is issued. If there are not fish present, the issue is denied as the DNR wants to keep natural wetlands natural.


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