# Savage 243 load work up. Initial impressions and questions.



## Robert A. Langager (Feb 22, 2002)

Good afternoon!

I am looking for comments, criticism, suggestions from you loaders out there.

I went to the range yesterday with the new to me Savage 110CL .243. I found out from the stampings that it was made in 1969, making it 3 years older than me.

Anyhow, I loaded up 30 rounds for my first test. The data is as follows:

Brass is new Remington. Full length sized, trimmed to 2.035", deburred, chamfered, and flash hole deburred.

Primers are CCI BR-2 large rifle benchrest.

Powder was Varget. I chose a middle of the range charge of 32.0 grains for all of the loads, to simplify things.

The bullets I worked with, their max OAL, and seating depth are as follows. I loaded 10 of each. I used the Stoney Point OAL gauge and comparator for the measurements.

Remigton 100 grain Core-Lokt Spitzer. This bullet has a cannelure, so I seated to that depth of 3.280".

Sierra 100 grain Game King BT Spitzer. Max OAL 3.355", seated 0.010" off at 3.345".

Speer 105 grain Hot-Cor Spitzer. Max OAL 3.400", seated 0.025" off at 3.375".

I sighted in with the cheaper Remingtons. It took 4 rounds to make me happy leaving 6 for 2-3 shot groups.


















Nothing really exciting, but not to terrible either.

The following 3 groups were from the Sierra Game Kings. The last group is 4 shots due to the even number I had loaded.

























The last group was really promising, the the 4th shot went astray a bit, hence the two measurements.

Lastly were the 105 Speers. I did not have much hope for these as my 1:10" twist barrel is not supposed to like heavier bullets. That appeard to come to fruition with these:


















I debated even shooting the last 4 but what the heck. My theory led to confusion as I followed with this.










The first 3 grouped at 0.822". I hoped the 4th would do the same. Wrong! 2.62".

So now I am a bit befuddled. The Savage seems to want to shoot, but is not consistent at all. I am going to double check the action screws, scope mounts, rings, etc.

The scope is a refurbished Nikon Buckmasters 4.5-14x42 side focus from SWFA. It only has a 90 day warranty. I may put it on my heavy barreled .308 Savage to test its consistency. That rifle is deadly, as I followed up the 243 testing with a few 0.4" groups from the .308.

One thing I did notice, I was chronographing my reloads. After the 13th shot the velocities increased by 100 fps. Meaning, I was in the middle of the Sierra string when the velocities went from 2650 to 2750 fps and stayed there. Strange, perhaps a chrono fart? Maybe the barrel needed 13 shots to settle in after cleaning the crap out of it?

Perhaps if throat erosion is an issue, then some fouling gave a better seal leading to higher velocties?

One would think that load testing would lead to answers, but rather I have more questions.

One thing though, the Sierra, as expected, did perform the best.

Robert


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## Burly1 (Sep 20, 2003)

Seeing the consistancy you had with the 100 Sierra's, I think you are on a roll. Now...... I believe my next try would be five rounds each with increases of .5 grains, up to whatever maximum is listed in your loading manual. My own experience with a 6mm/1 in ten twist has been that they like faster loadings. Another observation would be that your rifle likes to be fouled a little. Shoot for groups with a seasoned tube. That's probably enough changes for now. What load development I have done has led me to believe that changing only one variable at a time is the only way to see and identify those things that will benefit performance. If you experience a benefit with faster loadings and want to try something else, I think that seating out closer to the lands might help. This sometimes eliminates any problem you might have with a slightly off-center chamber. Checking your loaded ammo for bullet run out (concentricity) might also be something to consider. It seems that you're really dedicated to this project. Good luck. If you approach this in an orderly and scientific manner, as you do most of your projects, you're sure to have a satisfactory result. Good shooting, Burl


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## Horsager (Aug 31, 2006)

> So now I am a bit befuddled. The Savage seems to want to shoot, but is not consistent at all. I am going to double check the action screws, scope mounts, rings, etc.


I'd check the bedding (or lack thereof) too.


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## Robert A. Langager (Feb 22, 2002)

Thanks for the encouragement Burl. I am going to revisit the Sierras and mess with different powder charges. You are surely right about adjusting only one variable at a time. You will certainly end up chasing your tail if you mix it up too much.

I am going to order some more bullets in the 85-95 gr. range as well, including Horsager's beloved TSX. I still have a box of 95 gr. CT BSTs that I haven't loaded yet.

Hopefully she'll settle down a bit. I told myself at the outset that this rifle only needs to hold 1 inch. I will have to keep reminding myself of that. It is not my heavy barreled .308, just a utilitarian NC deer rifle.

Robert


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## Robert A. Langager (Feb 22, 2002)

Horsager said:


> > So now I am a bit befuddled. The Savage seems to want to shoot, but is not consistent at all. I am going to double check the action screws, scope mounts, rings, etc.
> 
> 
> I'd check the bedding (or lack thereof) too.


This rifle has been glass bedded. Now whether or not it is a good bedding job has yet to be determined.

I did notice that the tang is not completely floated as it should be on a Savage. Will get the Dremel out before the next range trip.

Thanks and keep 'em coming.

Robert


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## SDHandgunner (Jun 22, 2004)

I am wondering if you wouldn't be better off to try a little slower burning powder with the 100gr. Bullets. In my experience when trying to use too fast a powder with heavier bullets consistancy can suffer.

However like has been said don't try but one change at a time.

Your loading with the Sierra really shows promise. I bet with some tweaking either in powder charge and or bullet seating depth (Cartridge Overall Length) you may well find what you are looking for.

I have seen barrels that when they get a certain number of rounds through the tube show an increase in velocity. In my experience this generally happens around 100 rounds but would greatly depend on the smoothness of the bore to start with (or lack thereof).

Good luck with the .243.

Larry

Larry


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## Robert A. Langager (Feb 22, 2002)

SDHandgunner said:


> I am wondering if you wouldn't be better off to try a little slower burning powder with the 100gr. Bullets. In my experience when trying to use too fast a powder with heavier bullets consistancy can suffer.


Do you have any suggestions for a slower powder? H380, H4350 Re-19, Re-22, etc?

I am open to suggestions. I went with Varget as I have 9 pounds on hand. I do have a pound of Re-15 as well. The only centerfire I load for is my .308, hence the gluttony of Varget.

Thanks and keep em coming!

Robert


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## Horsager (Aug 31, 2006)

Slower that Varget powders I've used with success in a 243 are, Ramshot Hunter (my favorite), H414, WW 760, IMR 4831. I've not used it but a buddy of mine swears by H4350.

45gn of Ramshot Hunter with an 85gn TSX gives 3200fps, is under max, and fills the case quite well. It also meters through a powder measurer like a dream and runs through a Dillon as though it were made specifically for it.


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## iwantabuggy (Feb 15, 2005)

I agree with the fouling comments. I have a gun of similar age (Savage 111). Once I finally got my barrel float and scope problems worked out it grouped much better than it had, but was still in the 1 1/2 to 2 inch range. Prior to that it was a 5 inch gun @100 yards. I cleaned the heck out of it and the groups dropped to under 1 inch. I knew there was still copper in the bore, though, so I cleaned it more.....until all copper was gone. I went to the range and the groups were back into the 1 1/2 to 2 inch range again. I was very puzzled, but kept on shooting. As I shot the groups got tighter and tighter. I could take that gun to the range today, and I'd very likely get 3/4 inch groups or better. The gun needs some fouling, so most of the time I don't clean it all that well. When the groups open up again, I'll give it another good cleaning.

I suspect your gun may be similar. In addition, you may need to find it's pet load. It looks like you are getting pretty close. I would also be somewhat suspicious of the scope. Nikon Buckmaster is a pretty good scope for the money IMO, but I would never buy a referb. It is too likely that they only fixed the symptoms of whatever problem the scope had originally and the problem could come back very quickly. Good luck with that.


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## SDHandgunner (Jun 22, 2004)

I used to use IMR-4350 exclusively in the .243 with bullets heavier than 85grs.. That all changed when I stumbled onto H-4350. H-4350 is a touch slower burning and seems to provide not only increased velocity but also better accuracy in the .243's I have tested it in.

With the 95gr. Nosler Ballistic Tips and a max load of H-4350 in a Ruger KM77RFP MKII .243 I had would print 3 shot 100 yard groups from the bench at 1/2" or slightly less and exit the muzzle at 3071 FPS. I took a couple (4 if I remember right) with this Bullet / Powder Combination. All were one shot kills and none of the Whitetails traveled more than a few yards after the shot.

With a little luck I am going to try this Bullet / Powder Combination on Whitetails this fall out of a 15" T/C Encore Handgun in .243.

Larry


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