# North Dakota to the highest bidder!



## Dave Brandt (Jun 20, 2003)

If this don't fire you up for the upcoming legislative session, I don't know what will! Starting to look more and more like Texas. :eyeroll:


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## GooseBuster3 (Mar 1, 2002)

That is just a crock of ****.


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## farmerj (Jun 19, 2004)

"A" for creativity in Marketting.....

"F" for execution.


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## gandergrinder (Mar 10, 2002)

Guys,
I removed the link because I don't think this should get any free advertising.


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## Dave Brandt (Jun 20, 2003)

To anyone who is interested in what prompted the original post, let it be known that hunting in North Dakota has made its debut on E-Bay.

-Dave


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## bioman (Mar 1, 2002)

The owner of that market hunting service frequents this site and so does one of his main market hunters. I see he has actually tamed the language within the ad. In a previous installment, he bragged about shooting over 1,000 birds in a season uke:.


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## jimboy (Apr 1, 2003)

2 day hunt $1000. what a rip off. And you still have to pay for your own food and lodging. what a scam. :eyeroll:


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## GooseBuster3 (Mar 1, 2002)

The funny thing is they dont shoot near that many geese up there anymore in the fall.


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## Plainsman (Jul 30, 2003)

Ya, Dave, that ticked me off all day. I seen the site before it was removed, but it was a good idea to remove it. I have been debating political things, and need to again pay more attention to our legislative session so the sell your mother for a buck crowd don't slip more wildlife for dollars bills past us. Thanks for firing up the complaisant.


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## Remmi_&amp;_I (Dec 2, 2003)

Someone PM me the link........I am curious about who/where/etc...


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## KEN W (Feb 22, 2002)

Remmi...I think it is over....it was a 3 day hunt with a guy out of Bowbells.


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## backwater (Jan 29, 2003)

Is that the guy that runs Northern Waterfowl Outfitters? Yep! and some of you guys hunt with Dean. Then you ***** about guides? I won't say it but some of you are a bunch of........


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## Guuse (Dec 21, 2004)

You guys need more facts before you start bashing. The guys over in Bowbells do NOT lease land. The only thing you are competing with is people getting to the field before you.


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## backwater (Jan 29, 2003)

But they will when they have to! Just ask Dean he says it all the time on the refuge.


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## Guuse (Dec 21, 2004)

Yea, and so will you.


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## backwater (Jan 29, 2003)

Guuse said:


> Yea, and so will you.


Ahhh I don't think I would ever lease land in ND. I am from Wi so if acess became a issue in ND I would not come out. How about you? Well you answered that question already,you apparently would lease land and leave your fellow sportsman behind.


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## Guuse (Dec 21, 2004)

You bet I would.


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## Remmi_&amp;_I (Dec 2, 2003)

:eyeroll:


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## backwater (Jan 29, 2003)

Guuse, Where are you from? I am guessing that you are either the guy that runs Northern Waterfowl Outfitters or you work for him.

Here you go guys the link to the ebay add, just started today. You better get your bids in so you can hunt ND.

LINK REMOVED BY MODERATOR


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## Gunner (Oct 30, 2002)

Guuse said:


> You bet I would.


What a short-sighted, ignorant, self-centered way of thinking. Tell me Guuse, if your economic situation changes (it usually does sometime in a lifetime) such that you can no longer afford to buy or lease land to hunt, what will you do? By your own philosophy, you'll be forced to hunt public land because it will become a rich man's game! Wealth can disappear just as easily as it comes.


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## Guuse (Dec 21, 2004)

Guys, I am not a guide. To be honest... And I AM from ND...

I stick up for one guide who you all bash and state some FACTs, like I will lease if the time comes, and all of a sudden I am the DEVIL...  
Talk about biased...


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## quackattack (Sep 27, 2003)

Guuse just curious as to what you do for a job and how much "hunting" land you own in North Dakota? 
I think it is sad to know that one day in the future, sportsman like us won't have anywhere to hunt because of people like you selling their land. I'm not tryin to bash you or anyone else but I am just stating a fact that people like you who contribute to something like this can be to blame in the future when the only way to hunt in Nodak is to pay to hunt. But there isn't much we can do to stop you. After all it is YOUR land.
Just something to think about...is a little money worth ruining it for everyone?
:eyeroll:


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## Remmi_&amp;_I (Dec 2, 2003)

The game and fish needs to help fight this issue as much as anyone. When there is no land left to hunt, how many licenses do you think they will sell? No licenses = No revenue = No jobs = No habitat


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## Remmi_&amp;_I (Dec 2, 2003)

And if it ever comes close to what SD is.......... you can bet a few thousand residents will move, including me!


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## Gunner (Oct 30, 2002)

I would like to see the leasing of land, for hunting purposes, and in the name of game conservation and hunting heritage preservation, become an illegal practice, much like it is in Canada. This very much goes against my freemarket, capitalist principles, but somethings are more important than money.


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## PUB.590 (Jan 22, 2005)

You people amaze me. I was given this site yesterday and thought it was pretty interesting until I came across this forum. After reading your hatred for a lot of things, espicially g/o I really don't think this website is as neat as I once did.
This guy advertises a hunt on ebay and you want to burn him at the stake. Let me tell you he isn't the first to do it and won't be the last. You can go on there different times of the year and see people selling hunts and yes some are in North Dakota.
This guy stays in north dakota and starts a business and you would have thought he started the Aids epidemic. Let me see what I am missing. He is a young guy who stays in ND. He starts a business to support himself. Helps create economic activity for his community and surrounding towns. He brings in people who spend money in the community who wouldn't have otherwise spent money there. He employees other people to assist him, so you knock him for being a g/o and trying to make money.
What did you want him to do....leave and become a non-resident. In a few of your other post you talk about how people choose to stay for the hunting, but when one guy does and makes a profit from it you would think he is the devil. It would be interesting to hear what some of you guys do for a living so we can pick that apart. Go ahead...Flame away.


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## Bob Kellam (Apr 8, 2004)

Pub 590

Welcome to the site, Chris allows everyone to express their opinion as long as they don't attack the person. You may or may not agree with some of the views here, but it is their opinion, just as you have yours.

Enjoy the site!!

Bob


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## Ron Gilmore (Jan 7, 2003)

Pub you underscore the old saying that "Ignorance is bliss!" Having been a NR at one time and now returned to live here, I can understand your point of view! I do know that what we are fighting to preserve and to prevent is one of the reasons that ND is a destination point for 20,000 NR hunters that do not want to have to use a G/O. I do not know the est numbers of upland hunters that come here for the same reason.

Many of those 20,000 waterfowl hunters do use G/O to hunt back where they live and own or lease land strictly for waterfowl hunting. They do so not because they want to but because they have too! Many of them have stated that ND is the only place they can afford to take their kids hunting because many times leases or club dues are based upon total numbers not age. We are trying to protect the ability for anyone of any economic level can have an opportunity to be exposed to hunting. When a dollar figure gets attached to that single purpose the result is more costly to society in the long run that the loss of a business that seeks to gain off of a public trust resource with no return in many cases to the resource.

Many a hunter from other states that have never freelanced now understand why we are so opposed to commercialization of hunting. They simply until they came here did not think there was any other way! They also are now on the same side of the issue as most here are. They now have the bliss of being informed and educated!

Stick around and learn a little more about this issue and enjoy the site. There is a great deal of general hunting and fishing tips that get shared here. You can choose not to participate in these types of discussion and down the road hopefully you may come to understand the feeling and thoughts and passions that the members and guests have.

I got to meet a couple guys this past fall that are great people. They hold a different view point on some issues than I but still great people. They are as welcome here even though they take some grief for defending their positions. You are tuning in at a time when the passions are high because of our Leg session! Be patient and see what this site can offer to you. You may even chose to be a member.


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## PUB.590 (Jan 22, 2005)

Ron Gilmore said:


> Pub you underscore the old saying that "Ignorance is bliss!"
> 
> Maybe, but it brings to mind the saying "Don't mock what you don't understand."
> 
> So you are telling me this guy returns nothing to society or to the resources. That is a pretty broad brush you are stroking if that is the case. If that isn't the case then why say it? I assume you speak of generalities and just lump him in because he is a g/o. So all g/o's are bad people? Just like all lawyers are crooked or all government workers are lazy or all New Yorkers are rude........It is odd people speak bad about somebody who they have probably never met.


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## Leo Porcello (Jul 10, 2003)

> After reading your hatred for a lot of things, espicially g/o I really don't think this website is as neat as I once did.


Neat to not as neat all in the course of one day. WOW kind of like a rocking horse. Back and forth, back and forth, back and forth...


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## PUB.590 (Jan 22, 2005)

PorkChop said:


> > After reading your hatred for a lot of things, espicially g/o I really don't think this website is as neat as I once did.
> 
> 
> Neat to not as neat all in the course of one day. WOW kind of like a rocking horse. Back and forth, back and forth, back and forth...


You may want to check out Websters....That is a company that publishes dictionaries.

Neat
-free from dilution


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## Leo Porcello (Jul 10, 2003)

Ummmmm you may want to invest in a dictionary yourself. I copied your words. Get a clue!! What a tool!


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## PUB.590 (Jan 22, 2005)

PorkChop said:


> Ummmmm you may want to invest in a dictionary yourself. I copied your words. Get a clue!! What a tool!


Par for the course.


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## Leo Porcello (Jul 10, 2003)

:beer:


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## Ron Gilmore (Jan 7, 2003)

PUB.590 said:


> Ron Gilmore said:
> 
> 
> > Pub you underscore the old saying that "Ignorance is bliss!"
> ...


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## PUB.590 (Jan 22, 2005)

So you are telling me this guy returns nothing to society or to the resources.  That is a pretty broad brush you are stroking if that is the case. If that isn't the case then why say it?

It has negatively affected the management of game in many area and has reduced the number of people that would hunt if they could afford too.

*Even murders and drug dealers add some positive assets to society* but the negative things they do out weight them. I use this to point out the fallacy of your reasoning in statement that I underlined. 
quote]

Besides a license, gas, shells and clothes it doesn't reallycost anything to hunt in ND, so how could they not afford to hunt? They would be buying that anyways.

WOW. Let me remind you that you stated he returned nothing to the resources, so now you are saying he does? So a g/o returns things to the resources. Sounds a little John Kerryish. Let me pause I have to explain to my five year old how Jeffrey Dahmer, John Gacy, Charles Manson.....are positive assets to society.

I am not certain some of you guys are fighting the good fight. It is fun to have an intelligent discord regarding matters, but Mr. Side Bacon drives home the fact it can't happen. Instead of discussing the issues he would rather through out rancorous comments.

While I am on the soap box let me add my .02 on NR. I heard some of you are marketing specialists. Isn't that a job to attract people to your product or service, but you oppose anything related to NR's. So in essence you are driving people away. You oppose everything related to NR's and would rather not give former residents or native sons any breaks to come home, but will hand out a resident license to anybody in state for what 30 days.

So the people who move to the state for 2 years for their job can hunt as a resident. Then when they get transfered or move back to their home state they never come back, but somebody who has lived there 25 years and moved away gets no breaks to come home. Even though he or she still owns lands and will eventually retire there. Let alone continue to make additional trips home. I am not saying give them the world, but a break every now and then would be nice. Then more people probably would opt to return home instead of driving them away. With that said I am out of here....for good.


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## buckseye (Dec 8, 2003)

How about the very rich investing in their state, That really is the only way we will stop out migration. All successfull cities and states have a history of someone very wealthy being the driving forces that make or break an area. I'm not saying we are a poor state just that our wealth is much more spread out than most states.

Somebody leaving the state to get work is not the problem just the results of bigger problems stemming from lack of concern for the future of ND. 8)


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## Ron Gilmore (Jan 7, 2003)

PUD I never said he returned anything to the resource in my post! I said a drug dealer or murder may contribute to society in a positive manner but it does not outweigh the negative. Read it again and again and again like you would have a child do to retain and understand a lesson.

Do not put words in my mouth or spin the meanings to fit your little agenda. With that said I am done with you on this issue.


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## smalls (Sep 9, 2003)

PUB.590 said:


> So the people who move to the state for 2 years for their job can hunt as a resident. Then when they get transfered or move back to their home state they never come back, but somebody who has lived there 25 years and moved away gets no breaks to come home. Even though he or she still owns lands and will eventually retire there. Let alone continue to make additional trips home. I am not saying give them the world, but a break every now and then would be nice. Then more people probably would opt to return home instead of driving them away. With that said I am out of here....for good.


First, who says people who move away (for whatever reason) can't come back? They can hunt pretty much anything, especially when you consider that they could have bought an excess doe tag for like $50 last year.

Second, as unfortunate as it is that someone who has lived here for 25 years has to move away, they are still no longer a resident. Life isn't always fair. As said before, there really isn't anything they can't do (other than apply for the Big Three) in the state, they just have to pay higher fees to do it. They can even get turned down for a mule deer tag every year like most of us residents!

Third, people retiring in ND...is that a new trend? Most retirement age people I know are looking south to Texas, Arizona, and Florida to retire. Is the impact they (retirees) have on the economy of ND enough to give talented, educated youth of this state even more reason to leave?

Not to be rude, but where should the emphasis be. Encouraging talented and educated young people who are our future business leaders and employers to stay in the state...OR attempting to bring back retired people who will not be running businesses and not be raising families.

Don't underestimate the power of ND's natural resources to encourage youth to stay here. I know a multitude of guys between the ages of 22 and 30 that the main reason they stayed here was for the outdoors, even when they could have made much more money out of state. With that in mind, giving the privelege away of resident fees to people who move out of state is a very, very bad decision.

Keith Groven (the guy you referred to as the "marketing specialist)

By the way, since you're going to attack me and my opinion based on my profession, what's your name, and what do you do? C'mon now, don't be a spineless coward hiding behind an internet handle.


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## wiscan22 (Apr 4, 2004)

PUB.590 said:


> So you are telling me this guy returns nothing to society or to the resources.  That is a pretty broad brush you are stroking if that is the case. If that isn't the case then why say it?
> 
> It has negatively affected the management of game in many area and has reduced the number of people that would hunt if they could afford too.
> 
> ...


Hey Pub,

I know you will come back to read this because in all honesty this site is really just too damn good to stay away. I also don't believe you won't comment again because the site does offer valuable discussions from good people. You need to do a few things first.

A few things about me...

I am a non resident of ND, worse yet I'm a Packer fan.

I've hunted ND for the last 25+ or - years.

When I first got on this site I probably had the same feelings as you did..."who the hell is this group of obnoxious idiots?". Well, it took a bit but I was proven wrong on the above question.

The big thing you have to do is enter this site with an open mind. If you come in here in "attack mode" it's just not going to work. (I tried the same thing). Yes, it's alright to disagree, we do on this site all the time, but we also agree on alot of issues.

Getting on to the g/o thing. ND resident hunters/outdoors persons have a valid concern here. As I mentioned before I've been coming here for 25ish years and I've seen the depletion of huntable land due to g/o and corporate leasing. You can deny it or not but it is a problem in this state. The big difference is you have a group of guys who are trying to control the problem before it turns into a nightmare. You've got to remember that these guys live here and take a great amount of pride in a state that most people wouldn't bother visiting. These guys just see a lot more in the state than most do. True there is an economic benefit to having g/o services and a ton of NR's coming in. The point here is actually twofold. One, do the ND outdoors persons want it? And two, are they willing to accept it with a strong chance that the game that is being hunted may get depleated as the traditional ND hunt goes to a commercial environment.

Many years ago snagging of King Salmon was legalized in Wisconsin based on the fact that they die anyway. Nobody anticipated the negative affects of snagging until they were exposed. Speaking for myself, I never really cared for snagging because I believe in the old spawn sack / hook technique. After the first year of legalized snagging I could no longer fish the traditional method anymore because there was so much lead flying through the air and water that my line would get snagged more times than what it would be worth. Lake Michigan was also lined up shoulder to shoulder (literally) on either side of any river mouth and up the mouth for about a mile. After a few years many of these "fishermen" decided that the fish they snagged "tasted like mud too much" and simply cut the spawn out of them. Spawn could be sold for quite a price back then. Needless to say there were more dead salmon laying around than what you care to speak about. Well it didn't last long and now snagging is a dead issue. Yah we lost the tourism but it simply wasn't worth the headaches.

Anyway, as your initial invite stated, stick around the site for a while, if you don't want to partake in a discussion, don't. And if you do try doing so with a bit of an open mind. Even though many times we won't agree, the participants on this site are really a great bunch of guys.... even if some of them are Vikings fans. :lol:

wiscan22 :beer:


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## curty (Sep 18, 2003)

Wiscan your right about the economic impact of hunters, especially in the smaller towns.But I agree with the fact that we have to control the numbers also. As a business owner I would rather have hunters staying here for the next 30 years verses depleating our resources and having just a few good years of customers.

Pub....like Wiscan said stick around!!! there a wealth of information on this sight.I also had the same thoughts like you when I first found this site..but after hearing the debates I have since changed my mind on a lot of topics..mainly because my narrow mind got broadend by others on this site....Later Curt..........


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## fowlkiller (Jan 24, 2005)

I find it quite amusing when reading this website for a long time now, that when anyone comes on to the forum and expresses an opinion, there is a handful of the same guys who come on here and blast into them for having a different opinion.

I am not sure where I stand on the whole issue of selling hunts on ebay, but I do not understand why you guys constantly rip and bash hunting guides. Of course there are a handful of them that ruin it for everyone else, but every profession has people like that.

I'm not ripping into anyone here, I just think that people in the guide business are trying to survive and make a living, but obviously some people on here think otherwise.

Its a great site and I have enjoyed reading it for a long time, but I finally had to join in on this discussion.


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## djleye (Nov 14, 2002)

> there is a handful of the same guys who come on here and blast into them for having a different opinion





> I'm not ripping into anyone here


???????????????  If you are not ripping then what are you doing?????


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## KEN W (Feb 22, 2002)

No one is ripped personally here.

O/G are a group....fair game.

No one will rip YOU for what you say...what you say is fair game.

Otherwise there would never be any disenting opinions here.


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## gandergrinder (Mar 10, 2002)

I still can't understand why people get so upset about having their views, thoughts and ideas challenged by others.

I guess it's easier to imagine the world as a tiny little place where everyone thinks the same and we surround ourselves with people who think exactly like us. :eyeroll:

It suprises me that some are offended when people challenge each other into thinking at a higher level or examining an issue a little deeper.

Imagine if we talked about politics and religion at the dinner table face to face.  Imagine how offensive that would be.


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## fowlkiller (Jan 24, 2005)

gandergrinder said:


> I guess it's easier to imagine the world as a tiny little place where everyone thinks the same and we surround ourselves with people who think exactly like us. :eyeroll:
> quote]
> 
> I wish everyone on this site would read that quote. :lol:


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## Goldy's Pal (Jan 6, 2004)

> I guess it's easier to imagine the world as a tiny little place where everyone thinks the same and we surround ourselves with people who think exactly like us.


GG There is a place in the world, it's called Pleasantville.


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## wiscan22 (Apr 4, 2004)

Goldy's Pal said:


> > I guess it's easier to imagine the world as a tiny little place where everyone thinks the same and we surround ourselves with people who think exactly like us.
> 
> 
> GG There is a place in the world, it's called Pleasantville.


Hey Goldy,

By chance thats not Green Bay is it? :wink: :lol:

Sorry, with my simple frame of mind I just couldn't resist, fire back, I deserve it.


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## Goldy's Pal (Jan 6, 2004)

I should have seen that coming. (Monday) Don't be so hard on yourself Wiscan, If you're a Packer fan a "simple frame of mind" is something you were born with. It's not your fault. :lol:


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## wiscan22 (Apr 4, 2004)

Goldy's Pal said:


> I should have seen that coming. (Monday) Don't be so hard on yourself Wiscan, If you're a Packer fan a "simple frame of mind" is something you were born with. It's not your fault. :lol:


Good one Goldy! :rollin:


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## wiscan22 (Apr 4, 2004)

fowlkiller said:


> I find it quite amusing when reading this website for a long time now, that when anyone comes on to the forum and expresses an opinion, there is a handful of the same guys who come on here and blast into them for having a different opinion.
> 
> I am not sure where I stand on the whole issue of selling hunts on ebay, but I do not understand why you guys constantly rip and bash hunting guides. Of course there are a handful of them that ruin it for everyone else, but every profession has people like that.
> 
> ...


Hey fowlkiller!

Welcome aboard! I think the issue of guides and outfitters is a big thing to the residents because it changes alot of things that weren't issues many years ago. Some of these such as loss of access to land normally hunted and just a general commercialization of the sport can go against the grain of alot of people.

True, guides do have a place in the market. For the individual that wants to come out hunting and only has a limited amount of days they offer a great service..... until it's your section of land that the guide posts and you're not able to hunt it anymore. Then there's the attitude change of hunting becoming a business. For all practical purposes darn few people actually hunt for sustanence purposes. That's how the term sport/recreational hunting became the politically correct term for what we do. Personally, I have a real problem addressing hunting as a "recreational sport" simply because it does involve the taking of a life... even thought that life is that of an animal it's still a life. I don't want to sound like a tree hugger but calling killing a sport or recreation just doesn't sound right. Anyway, now let's throw hunting for profit into the equation and the rules take a major change. Once again g/o's are a "sign of the times" but that doesn't mean one has to like them.

Regarding your comment about the members on this board attacking new posters I really think that in more cases than none that most posters end up in the "defense mode" defending their stands. All to often we tend to enter these sites in an "attack mode" instead of analyzing the whole issue first. I've been guilty of that numerous time myself and I've been on here for a while. Like I said before in a previous post, many times we disagree and sometimes that leads to negative posts. Generally speaking though I feel pretty safe to say that if we met any of the individuals in person, a beer or two over a nice friendly discussion wouldn't be out of the question.

Anyway, enjoy the site. Overall it's the best ND sportmen have to offer and it's really a good site.  :beer:


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