# 22-250 Do I need the heavy barrell?



## 2zwudz (Jan 6, 2007)

I am going to buy a Savage 22-250 for hunting coyotes and I was wanting to know from you guys who have this gun if I need the heavy barrell? I have talked to some gun dealers and some say the heavy barrell is good for accuracy and I have had some say the heavy barrell sucks carrying it around. What do you guys think?
Mark


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## weasle414 (Dec 31, 2006)

I think it's all in personal taste. If you walk a lot and don't want the extra weight, don't go heavy. If you don't walk very much or you're like me and don't care about weight when walking, go for the heavy barrel.


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## rednek (Dec 29, 2006)

the heavy barrel is for if you shoot alot of rounds at one time through it to keep the barrel from expanding, if you dont shoot alot at one time a regular barrel works just as great. i got 22-250 heavy barrel, and i love it.


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## Danny B (Jun 6, 2006)

They both work just fine on predators. Like weasel414 said the heavy barrel can get heavy if you like walking. Personally I don't like walking more then I have to, so all my predator hunting rifles are heavy barreled.


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## Horsager (Aug 31, 2006)

Put me in the standard barrel, or even light/short barrel catagory. I don't like to carry the weight. I do use heavy barrel rifles for prairie dogs, not due to heat though. I like the heavy barrels because they transfer less recoil to the shooter (often allowing you to see the impact in the scope), and they do settle down better on small targets.

Rednek, I'm interrested in this barrel expansion thing. When the barrel expands does it gain diameter or length?


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## ruger223killer (Jan 3, 2007)

If you are just going to be coyote hunting and not paper punching then get the light barrel. I have a heavy barrel ruger and w/scope it weighs about 12 lbs(pretty heavy to carry not to mention a mile or more)


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## yooperyotebuster (Dec 13, 2005)

I have a savage 12fv. Heavy barrel and the accuracy is superb. It does get tiresome lugging a 15 pound rifle (scope and bipod included) any real distance. I'm not lucky enough to hunt from my truck. My friend has a little savage package gun light barrel with the accu-trigger. I shoot that one as well as my heavy barrel. I'm going back to a sporter weight my next rifle.


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## boondocks (Jan 27, 2006)

I had a winchester 22-250 heavy barrel that I got sick of lugging around. Bought the new Savage with an acu-trigger also. Best move I made in a long time.Much more accurate and lot less of a pain in the behind to carry around. Unless you plan on shooting a ton of rounds through your gun, say like shooting prairie dogs, don't go the heavy route. You'll be glad you didn't.

When I bought the winchester, I was also told by the saleman that the heavy barrels are more accurate. I suppose they cost a little more so that was the one he wanted to sell. Any way, my light weight Savage shoots circles around the winchester.


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## Jiffy (Apr 22, 2005)

Horsager said:


> Rednek, I'm interrested in this barrel expansion thing. When the barrel expands does it gain diameter or length?


 :lol: :lol:

I would say that is personal preference. As far as accuracy goes I have seen sporter barrels out preform heavy barrels and vice a versa. Do you think it may have also been a combination of other factors also? hhhhmmmmmm....

As far as the weight goes.....I like the feel of my heavy barrel 700 VS. To me it feels more "stable". Its hard to describe a "feel". Again personal preference. I guess I don't even notice the weight when I am carry it from place to place.

IMO I would go with a heavier barreled rifle. :beer:


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## rednek (Dec 29, 2006)

when barrels heat up the diameter changes (expands) and a heavy barrel helps the rifle stay accurate shot after shot by being so thick the hole wont expand as easy. regular barrel has the same accuracy but after fired many rounds through it gets really hot and without all the metal there to help keep the shape it will expand easier. same applies to fluted barrel to help it cool down faster.


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## Horsager (Aug 31, 2006)

If the metal expands and the bore size grows why is it that the shells chamber harder the hotter the rifle gets? I'm wondering how the chamber shrinks and the bore grows when they're both cut into the same piece of steel?


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## rednek (Dec 29, 2006)

then why do you think heavy barrels improve accuracy?


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## rednek (Dec 29, 2006)

if everybody is sayin that heavy barrel has better accuracy than a reg barrel than how is that??? it has to come from somewhere


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## Burly1 (Sep 20, 2003)

Horsager, once again, your logic is on the money. The metal will certainly expand equally in all areas, provided the temperature is the same. But would the temperature not be highest in the area in front of the chamber? I think it would, but agree as well that the chamber would become tighter, never looser. If I am wrong I would like to have someone explain to me why it is so.
To answer the posted query, you probably will shoot better with a heavy barrel, most of us do. If you are the guy who likes to walk and call a lot, the lightweight is just the ticket. I guess to be safe, you should get one of each! More guns=good. Good shooting, Burl


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## Horsager (Aug 31, 2006)

Heavy barrels improve accuracy because they (the barrels) are stiffer than their lightweight counterparts, and therefore more consistant shot to shot.

Some pencil thin barrels shoot OK too:

3 Shots, 270Win, Winchester Featherweight.










3 Shots, 243Win, Kimber Montana 6.6# with 4 down and a sling, 200yds.










I do have a couple of heavy barrels, they shoot OK too (no pics of targets yet, sorry). My heavy barreled rifles are used almost exclusively for prairie dogs, I like the weight to help settle the rifle down an hold steady on small targets. I don't shoot heavy barrels any faster than I shoot standard barreled rifles. 5 or 6 shots and into the back seat to cool off, grab another rifle. Light barrel, standard barrel, pencil barrel, they all get the same protocol. Since the barrel heats up from the inside out it's difficult to assess chamber temps by feeling the outside of a barrel, especially with a heavy barrel, it does take longer for the heat to reach the outside diameter of the barrel, but that doesn't mean that the chamber isn't already beastly hot.


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## rednek (Dec 29, 2006)

then why do they shoot diff. i got a reg barrel and a heavy barrel. they shoot both with the same patterns until i put 50+ rounds through it and my reg starts to lose it tightness and my heavy keeps it group pattern


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## Horsager (Aug 31, 2006)

Based on the limited information you provided, your heavy barrel has a bore that doesn't foul as quickly. Nothing having anything to do with barrel contour is a factor in that.


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## rednek (Dec 29, 2006)

with the both barrels ( i have a 243 reg barrel and 22-250 heavy barrel) at the range i go to i usually get my moneys worth and stay all day. but i dont shoot at great distances since there limited on distances. but at 50yrds i can put 5 shots in penny with both until i get up there in rounds. then i can notice the diff with the reg over the heavy


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## rednek (Dec 29, 2006)

http://www.tacticsllc.com/support/barrels 
http://www.bushmaster.com/faqs/barrels-accuracy.asp

here is some sights i found off hand


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## Horsager (Aug 31, 2006)

When it relates to gun stuff, websites should all be relegated to the realm of opinion unless the statements can be corroborated with meticulous data, and mounds of it. Even then every rifle is a victim of it's own tolerance stacking and therefore there are few true universals when it comes to rifles. Even within the same manufacturing facility the variables are great. Your 243 might have been the 1st or last barrel made with that particular mandrel. It may have been the 1st made on a Monday AM or last one on a Friday afternoon.

The only statement I can make with absolute certainty is this. I complement you for having enough experience with your rifle to know what the round count needs to be between cleanings.


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## People (Jan 17, 2005)

Either one will work. Burl said it right if you walk alot the thinner one is the ticket. When shooting yotes you are almost never going to fire more than 10 rds at a time.

I had a rem 700 that did not have a free floating tube. The first shot would be right on the money then as the I fired more and more rounds it would shoot all over the place. I would let it totaly cool and right on the money. So I ground out my stock and no matter how hot it gets it is right there. 
Either one can shoot very well the key is free floating.


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## rednek (Dec 29, 2006)

the one i dont know is free floating. i know that it improves accuracy but how. i would have thought the other way? thats the one i have not figured out yet


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## Horsager (Aug 31, 2006)

Free Floating increases accuracy by increasing consistancy. Any place that wood (and to a lessor extent synthetics) touches the barrel/action you have a possibilty for error. Atmospheric changes, humidity, temperature can all effect the shape of wood. The fiberglass bedding material is less susceptable to this that is wood. If a rifle has tip pressure (like all wood stocked 700's do from the factory) and the barrel gets hot, weather gets humid (or dries out considerably from normal) that tip pressure can change from 10# to 8# or 12# (or more, or less, just examples). The further from the action the contact occurs the more detrimental it will be, it's simple physics, the lever gets longer. Simply removing tip pressure and free floating the barrel sometimes makes things worse because the barrel us now unsupported. Generally a free floated barrrel is supported at the barrel shank for 3/4" to 1.5". The action of course must be supported as well. Glass bedding the chamber/recoil lug area of the stock without also bedding the tang can cause the action to flex. This can effect accuracy and functioning. An action that is properly glass bedded minimizes or eliminates any contact between the wood and any of the metal. Some go as far as adding pillars so the stock/action screws don't touch wood either. The idea behind all of this is consistancy.


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## rednek (Dec 29, 2006)

cool thaks


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## rednek (Dec 29, 2006)

i mean thanks


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## Horsager (Aug 31, 2006)

So without knowing for sure I'll take a stab at the barrel expansion question. When you add heat to a rifle barrel the heat could cause expansion. If the barrel expands (and assuming the steel is reletivly homogenous with few imperfections) it would expand in all directions equally. That would result in a slightly larger outside diameter for the barrel itself. It would also result in an undersizing of the chamber (chamber shrinks as the barrel swells) and also an undersizing of the bore, this is evident in increased fouling as the barrel gets hotter, the hotter barrel swedges more copper jacket material from each subsequent round down the tube until it fully cools.

I have no research to back this up, this is mechanically how my "minds eye" sees what's occuring as the hot rifle chambers harder and fouls quicker.


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## 1shot1yote (Dec 23, 2006)

In my experience heavy barrel rifles normally shoot better than light barrel rifles. I believe this is mostly because a heavy barrel is more rigid than a light barrel and doesn't vibrate as much, this is the idea of the sims barrel deresenator to dampen vibration. I have not used one but have heard they work well. I have read that a barrel vibrates a certain amount when the gun is fired and the faster the barrel quits vibrating the better accuracy will be. I think this is part of the reason behind super heavy barrels on target rifles. The gunsmith who helped me put together my custom .223 also said that when the steel for the barrels is poured sometimes they get imperfections in the molding and then whet the rifling is cut it cuts through these imperfections. After the gun is shot it knocks the imperfections loose and leaves a sort of piting in the rifling. I suppose it would be similar to having a rusty bore. He believes that with factory barrels it's kind of a chance thing on if you get a good barrel or not. Metal used in today's rifle barrels is much better than it was even 20 years ago.
Almost all light barrel remington 700's come from the factory with a pressure point at the end of the barrel. My .223 started out a lightweight sporter. I removed the pressure point and it shot much better. My father has been shooting and reloading for probably 30 some years he believes that all barrels should be free floated regardless of weight. I think there is something to it because all of our bolt action's are free floated and I think they will all shoot at least 1 MOA or better. 
Any way that's my two cents worth.
My custom .223 has a heavy barrel and an HS-Precision synthetic stock with full length aluminum bedding block. The scope is a Tasco 6-24x42.
I reload and I shoot 50 gr ballistic silver tips made by Combined Technologies. Here are some pics of the gun and my best 5 shot group at 100 yds. :sniper:

[/siteimg]6123[siteimg]

[/siteimg]6122[siteimg]

[/siteimg]6125[siteimg]

Justin


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## 1shot1yote (Dec 23, 2006)

I always mess up the pics here let me try that again.

[siteimg]6123[/siteimg]

[siteimg]6122[/siteimg]

[siteimg]6125[/siteimg]

Justin


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## cpnhgnlngct (Jan 3, 2007)

The diameter of the bore definatley without a doubt shrinks as the barrel heats up. With thermal expansion on a hollow cylinder the outer diameter increases as the inner decreases...

Picture a sponge in the shape of a donut... when you drop that sponge into a pool of water picture what is going to happen.. The sponge starts to grow in all directions equally, (if it is submerged equally...) and this is the same for metal expanding from heat. (granted that the temperature change along the length of the barrel is the same)


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## cpnhgnlngct (Jan 3, 2007)

And I would like to address the heavy barrel compared to a lighter barrel. Ofcourse the heavy barrel will be less suseptable to thermal expansion.

Picture a thin strip of metal.. (approx 4'' X 1/8" X a small small fraction ")
Take a blow torch and hold it to the strip for a while... that metal will deform and expand in all directions... when done that piece will be wavy and inconsistant along its length.

Now Picture a thicker piece of metal... (approx. 4" X 1" X 1/2") Now take that same blow torch and repeat the process... That bar will be less apt to deform and than the thin piece...

Apply this theory with your gun barrel, and you have your answer..


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