# Another School shooting



## Plainsman (Jul 30, 2003)

This is terrible. I hope we soon figure out what is wrong. I would guess it's a number of things, but one of the things is what we teach in schools these days. First we through God out of the schools, then we teach that life isn't that valuable. We do that through support of abortion. So rather than looking at the gun as the problem we need to look in the mirror. Have we supported taking down the ten commandments? Have we disguised the murder of the innocent as a woman's choice? If you have then accept the responsibility. Sure there are some other circumstances, but these are two of the major reasons.


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## north1 (Nov 9, 2010)

I agree wholeheartedly with your list and will add:

1. Breakdown of family unit. Divorce, separation, both parents working out of home or simply emotionally removed from the home. Also the disengagement from grandparents who in past served as a reservoir of knowledge and wisdom they imparted to their grandchildren.
2. Pharmaceutical industry and its role in the misuse of psychotropic drugs.
3. Devaluation of human life not only by abortion but via violent and bloody video games where taking a human life is portrayed as simply destroying pixels on a screen.
4. Dissension, hatred, anger and uncivil behavior towards our fellow human beings which is so prevalent today.
5. Disassociation with community and mentality that what happens next door is none of my business.
6. Removing Christianity from the family, community, schools, local government, state government and federal government. The moral compass needed by our young has been yanked from them and it is no wonder they are adrift. When you look around and are alone, no framework or idea that you were created by an omnipresent being(God), that created you for a righteous purpose, loves you and wants you to love your fellow man-that is where the seed of evil is sown and grows monsters that do these sorts of things.


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## KEN W (Feb 22, 2002)

There is the same thread on this topic on the Hot Topics Forum started before this one.


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## Habitat Hugger (Jan 19, 2005)

I think Bruce and I hit the SUBMIT button at the same time! 
Maybe someone more computer literate than I can roll both threads together. Looks like we are all pretty well on the same page, same chapter in the same book, anyway.


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## Plainsman (Jul 30, 2003)

Habitat Hugger said:


> I think Bruce and I hit the SUBMIT button at the same time!
> Maybe someone more computer literate than I can roll both threads together. Looks like we are all pretty well on the same page, same chapter in the same book, anyway.


I think your right. I looked before I typed and nothing. I have always been confused by the times we see on posts. I think it' affected by what time zone your in. Not sure, but something is goofy with post times.

Edit: For example it is 4:29pm now and my post says 5:29pm.


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## Habitat Hugger (Jan 19, 2005)

Yep, you'd think the time would be reported as GMT or Universal time. Just got ack from fishing. No matter what time it is, those lousy fish aren't biting! Must be mass starvation underwater.


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## dakotashooter2 (Oct 31, 2003)

Liberals are teaching and treating kids like life should be a utopia. Kids grow up have no idea how to deal with problems, lifes up and downs. When I was growing up when life threw you curves you dealt with it. If a student died the school didn't bring in councilors to hold your hand, If you were bullied you fought back or adapted. You didn't kill yourself or do a school shooting. You might feel like beating the snot out of somebody but you didn't kill them over petty stuff. Embarassment doesn't kill you so you don't kill someone for embarassing you.

Daily, I want to grab some kid shake him violently, and say WTF is wrong with you..... But I refrain........


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## Plainsman (Jul 30, 2003)

If you had a problem with another kid in a class that our coach taught he would drag the two of you into the gym and put the boxing gloves on you. If you were bleeding he would give you a couple of wraps of toilet tissue to stuff in your nose and send you back to class. I'll bet if your under 50 years old you perhaps think I am bs'ing. Never did we think of doing any type of permanent harm to anyone.


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## blhunter3 (May 5, 2007)

There are only a few reason we have school shootings

1. Poor parenting. Parents want to be friends instead of parents. Not having good parent(s) in the household.
2. Kids don't know how to deal with stress, bullying, something not going their way. That leads back to poor parenting and a horrible school system teaching kids that everyone is equal. Some kids excel at sports, some don't. 
3. Gun Free Zones is like a damn welcome mat for bad guys. Let the school faculity get CCW and let them practice and train for that. Let the teacher use those courses for the continueing education.
4. Poor parenting again


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## dakotashooter2 (Oct 31, 2003)

One has to ask why Schools ? 
1) Apparently the culture of schools are fostering this
2) Security is a joke
3) Offenders know the above
4) It is a target rich environment where the targets are naive, easily confused, helpless and entrapped.


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## Plainsman (Jul 30, 2003)

Oh I hate it when I bump some button and my whole post disappears before I can post it. :******:

Anyway ------- I spent all day Saturday at a security seminar called Sheepdogs. The premise is 98% of the population are sheep. One percent are wolves who want to prey on the sheep. Another one percent have the mentality and job of a sheepdog that protects the sheep from the wolf. They had it on television Saturday night and you may have seen it.

There were four speakers. One was the guy who shot two terrorists that came with automatic AK47 to the "draw the prophet" contest in Dallas, Texas. You may remember that on the news. The policeman dropped them both. They missed him 37 times. Someone and we know who was watching out for him. The other fellow was a retired Army Colonel. His name was Dave Grossman. He has many publications and I ordered the one called Assassination Generation. Another fellow was a policeman for 15 years and a pastor for 15 years. The fourth man was a security specialist and had worked for a long time for Focus on the Family which has it's headquarters south of Denver.

The focus was on churches and schools. Both spend much of their building budget on meeting fire codes, but little or nothing on security. It's very cheap to put laminated glass on the doors so a shooter doesn't just shoot out the window then reach in and open the door. Also the first line of defense is the parking lot and there should be a person or at least cameras to monitor. They estimate 60% of killers could be stopped in the parking lot. They said don't use the term shooters because they are really killers.

I may miss some of these statistics by one or two percent. I believe it was 618 Christians murdered in church from 2009 to 2016. In the last century with communist take over in China and Russia more Christians were killed than in all previous centuries. 90 million Christians were murdered last century. Churches get crazed killers coming in, but schools have often of late had a terrorist wannabe connection. These guys said more gun laws will do absolutely nothing. They also said it's a shame that churches and schools are soft targets. Perfectly set up for cowardly killers. Perhaps the best option are concealed carry teachers and selected church members. A gun fight in the parking lot is much preferred to the narthex or the sanctuary. Churches have robberies after services while the Sunday collection is still at the church.

All the speakers have had hostage or terrorist experience first hand.

The young people are sure calling for gun control. They are at that age when teenagers know everything. Sheep, taught by sheep and raised by sheep, and they want to throttle the sheepdogs. God help us.

Edit: Maybe hunt1 can chime in on all the things I forgot.


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## huntin1 (Nov 14, 2003)

They presented so much information in such a short time that it is hard to remember it all. But, since somewhere around 1999 every one of the perpetrators of a school massacre were heavily into first person shooter video games and most were taking some type of drug for ADHD, anxiety, or some other mental health issue. This also applied to church killers in most cases.

Another sickening statistic that applies to kids preschool to age 16-18, they will be sexually molested at church, or a church function at a rate of:

female - 3 of 5
male - 1 of 5

That's at church folks, by people that they are supposed to be able to trust.

Something else I picked up on another forum,










So the same 17 year old is witness to a shooting 6 months apart on opposite sides of the country. Could happen, I suppose. :-?


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## dakotashooter2 (Oct 31, 2003)

The news media should probably be verifying their witnesses. Wouldn't surprise me if he is about 25 years old.


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## Chuck Smith (Feb 22, 2005)

I think I made a post about how this whole situation that Huntin1 brought up with the picture....

From the other thread in "hot topics"... this is what I wrote on Monday...



> I am not a conspiracy type person. But to show how politics play into everything...
> 
> The day after the shooting that student had one very well thought out TV interview. Is he a student of the school or did someone prep him or give him that speech/interview responses? Look how fast they have mobilized for walk outs, sit ins, marches, etc.... Is this the students or some other group looking to further an agenda.


Also here is a good article of what is happening...
http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/florid ... id=DELLDHP

Also look how the media is going crazy showing WHO and HOW MUCH people received in donations from the NRA.

Yet a stat people don't know.... (taken from Ben Shapiro Twitter feed): NRA from 1998 -2017 have donated $200 million to politicians... Unions spent $1.7 Billion in 2016 cycle alone.

So to say that the NRA has a death grip on Congress is totally wrong.


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## Habitat Hugger (Jan 19, 2005)

That news clip sure looks pretty suspicious and genuine, though nowadays with all the made up stuff throughout the internet I'm skeptical and wonder if this is just one more made up nonsensical thing manufactured for the cutn paste posters. NOT saying it is or isn't true, butcall me skeptical about ALL the stuff passed along. Lots of,claims and accurate looking stuff is being found to be totally untrue. For Example - Stuff that arrived on my Facebook and put on some newssites - Cruz was a card carrying Democrat, then he was a member of a white supremacist group, then he was a Republican -EVERY ONE of these proven untrue, and finally the major news sources stopped parroting it on!! 
Seems every hour, the fact checkers are finding BS in so much pass along stuff, and with quite a few supposedly reputable news sources passing the nonsense on! Yes, ALL the News Sources! NONE excluded! Easy to do in our electronic age, I guess. 
Habítat's rule of thumb -disbelieve everything, no matter what the source, even if you WANT to believe it's true....until absolutely proven.


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## huntin1 (Nov 14, 2003)

Saw this at Americansnipers.org, then remembered that they gave these, or very similar statistics at that training.


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## Chuck Smith (Feb 22, 2005)

HH.... I have sent you a couple PM's... Just wondering if you got them.

Thanks


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## Plainsman (Jul 30, 2003)

Hunt1 I am going to save that pic. Good find.


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## huntin1 (Nov 14, 2003)

dakotashooter2 said:


> The news media should probably be verifying their witnesses. Wouldn't surprise me if he is about 25 years old.


That, and I wouldn't be surprised to learn that he is a schill for the gun control lobby, and didn't actually witness anything.


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## Habitat Hugger (Jan 19, 2005)

Huntin 1, not to be critical but turns out at least your first post, about the kid being a shill and actor ,etc. is untrue, fabricated by some no name website and passed on. My point exactly! What good does this type of thing ever do, othe than divide people further, like the Russian Troll website stuff supposedly did last election? 
Like the thread on Africa -the Russians did their best to sow dissension and division, their efforts at least partly resulting in the chaotic mess there now. Are they doing the same here via the internet? A No Brainer! There's lots written in the international news about this phenomenon, all chuckling that Americans love to sincerely believe exactly what they want to believe, no more, no less without question and are collectively so gullible it works better here than any other country! I tend to believe them! Export propaganda and arms to Africa, and export internet Crap to America! LOL whatever works! Time we all got together on I,portante issues.


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## Chuck Smith (Feb 22, 2005)

HH.... I just read an article that they said the "two main kids" are in theatre and also apart of the school broadcast team. So they are comfortable in front of the camera and also speaking in public.


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## dakotashooter2 (Oct 31, 2003)

Ok... The picture posted is deceiving. The picture/ video on top was reported by the media but had nothing to do with the California school shooting. It was shot in CA but it was about an incident this and other kids had with a reportedly over zealous lifeguard. Still it seems this kid is working really hard to work his way into the liberal media field.


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## huntin1 (Nov 14, 2003)

Since I posted that pic I too have learned that the California pic had nothing to do with a shooting. Mea culpa. If the mods want it taken down I shall do so.


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## Plainsman (Jul 30, 2003)

huntin1 said:


> Since I posted that pic I too have learned that the California pic had nothing to do with a shooting. Mea culpa. If the mods want it taken down I shall do so.


 Nope, it appears the kid was in California too. He likes the camera doesn't he? Did he live there? Vacation? Whatever he is in the camera again.


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## dakotashooter2 (Oct 31, 2003)

The California shooting was April 10th..... The top picture is dated August 17th His family was in CA on vacation and had an altercation with a lifeguard that made the news.

Though he kind of has that Eddie Haskal look to him.


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## Plainsman (Jul 30, 2003)

dakotashooter2 said:


> The California shooting was April 10th..... The top picture is dated August 17th His family was in CA on vacation and had an altercation with a lifeguard that made the news.
> 
> Though he kind of has that Eddie Haskal look to him.


I look at him and see a kid that wants fame and getting to your guns is a way to get there. Unfortunately the same mindset in parents that let kids run the home will let this kid do a lot of damage to the second amendment. Maybe it would strike home more if I said let him do damage to our constitution. Some people in society today don't equate an amendment to actually being our constitution. It's not taught in schools much anymore.


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## Plainsman (Jul 30, 2003)

One kid I think is speaking the truth and not being a glory hound like Hogg. Easy to get the names confused.

How long until CNN looses all credibility?



> CNN denies school shooting town hall was scripted after Parkland massacre survivor claimed the network rejected his question about armed guards and urged him to ask one it had written
> Colton Haab, 17, claimed CNN presented him with a prepared question at Wednesday's town hall meeting
> After the alleged incident, Haab decided not to attend the town hall
> Haab, who shielded students during the Parkland, Florida, shooting said he wanted to ask about using veterans as armed security guards in schools
> ...


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## Habitat Hugger (Jan 19, 2005)

So the whole discussion degenerates into who or what are the bad guys, and on this site of course it's the Dratted Liberals and Democrats, and it looks like most of us just blow any truths off and continue to believe what we want to believe, and are thus easily duped! Obviously those scores of opinion/ editorial psychology/ sociology international talking and writing heads who laugh at us divided sheep are definitely correct! LOL try reading some international press stuff what the rest of the civilized word thinks!yeah, I know, they don't count. 
I read an interesting article this morning that a software company has developed technology that FROM A SINGLE PICTURE OR SELFIE, it can produce a walking, talking movie with sounds, voices, etc. Saying anything they want to fabricate the picture to say! Sort of a turbocharged Forrest GUMP technology, that is almost indistinguishable from the real thing! Scary! But Plaisguy's cutnpaste posts will be pretty liveley now, in moving living color and sound! Kiddin U Bruce, but as always, my main point is "what does one believe theses days?" NOTHING, IMHO! Especially any kind of cutnpaste from the internet!
I could go on about a picture posted recently about deaths from various causes, some but not all of the numbers fairly accurate, but conveniently leaving out tons of relevant numbers, like handgun deaths, the thousands of kids hospitalized with accidental gunshot wounds, surviving but [email protected] so many with lifelong crippling wounds, vegetables, arms and legs gone or permanently disabled, lungs and guts and kidneys blown away, etc. Even in ND I've seen and heard of my fair share! And I could go on and on, too. Cherry pick numbers and you can "prove" whatever your own agenda might be. I don't want to be guilty of that, Want to remain objective, look at the good and bad of everything, hopefully with an open mind!


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## Chuck Smith (Feb 22, 2005)

Plainsman....

I will attach another article about the same thing. CNN was "scripting" the Townhall meeting.

Now I don't doubt that 1 bit. Most of "live" tv is still scripted to a certain extent.

I was at a spring break event in Cancun many years ago. Went where MTV was "live". Well lets just say they moved people around to making it look the way they wanted. They re-did takes to make the crowd noise "louder". They made people put on shirts if they didn't like the body image that was going to be on camera... Stuff like that. But it was "live".

https://www.realclearpolitics.com/video ... uards.html

Now I am not saying CNN cut this kid out because it didn't fit their narrative but who knows. They could have done it for time frame reasons or it could have been to push an agenda. We don't know.

But I did read somewhere that a news outlet was saying a "politician" wouldn't meet with kids and made them wait hours before meeting with them. Well he was at a funeral for one of the victims. The news outlet forgot to mention that in the article.


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## Chuck Smith (Feb 22, 2005)

HH...

You are 100% correct. People want to jump to a narrative or conclusion ASAP. They don't let TRUE facts surface. It is all opinion and "gossip" and fear driven.

Let the Facts come out before we jump to conclusion, knee jerk reaction laws, etc.

It is why we have so many over corrections and go too far one way or another. This is the reason why we get no middle ground. It is the old saying, "sqweaking wheel gets the grease". Now it is who can be louder and more in your face.


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## Plainsman (Jul 30, 2003)

Edit: As most times I agree with you 90% HH, but I will address a couple of things where I think your a little bias for some reason.



Habitat Hugger said:


> So the whole discussion degenerates into who or what are the bad guys, and on this (most sites) site of course it's the Dratted Liberals and Democrats, and it looks like most of us just blow any truths off and continue to believe what we want to believe, and are thus easily duped! If we are to be honest we must first all agree it's the democrats who want to severely restrict firearms. There has been many proposals over the years for school safety but the democrats always stop it. One would think they are comfortable with a number of deaths if it will give them an excuse to take the guns. Yes, I know that sounds radical, but if they really wanted to solve the problem they could. Metal detectors, armed guards, real time cameras, laminated glass in the doors etc. Obviously those scores of opinion/ editorial psychology/ sociology international talking and writing heads who laugh at us divided sheep are definitely correct! LOL try reading some international press stuff what the rest of the civilized word thinks!yeah, I know, they don't count. Much of that civilized world is without the freedoms we have. Perhaps they can't handle that much freedom.
> I read an interesting article this morning that a software company has developed technology that FROM A SINGLE PICTURE OR SELFIE, it can produce a walking, talking movie with sounds, voices, etc. Saying anything they want to fabricate the picture to say! Sort of a turbocharged Forrest GUMP technology, that is almost indistinguishable from the real thing! Scary! But Plaisguy's cutnpaste posts will be pretty liveley now, in moving living color and sound! Kiddin U Bruce, but as always, my main point is "what does one believe theses days?" NOTHING, IMHO! Especially any kind of cutnpaste from the internet! Yes that was on Drudge a couple of days ago. The headline was "Don't always believe what you see".
> I could go on about a picture posted recently about deaths from various causes, some but not all of the numbers fairly accurate, but conveniently leaving out tons of relevant numbers, like handgun deaths, the thousands of kids hospitalized with accidental gunshot wounds, surviving but [email protected] so many with lifelong crippling wounds, vegetables, arms and legs gone or permanently disabled, lungs and guts and kidneys blown away, etc. Your absolutely right. Handguns deaths people often jump to the conclusion it's murder. A large number is police shooting violent felons. Many are people who shot criminals to protect the innocent from harm or even death. The interesting thing is we are not close to the death rate of some countries. We should be talking real murder rates, but that's nearly impossible to get. We score much lower if you look at murder rates. Other countries much higher simply use other methods. Some poison, some beat each other to death, but they all get the job done. Even in ND I've seen and heard of my fair share! And I could go on and on, too. Cherry pick numbers and you can "prove" whatever your own agenda might be. I don't want to be guilty of that, Want to remain objective, look at the good and bad of everything, hopefully with an open mind!


HH I don't see you as that open minded. Your bias often shows. No offense, but you have a ways to go. I'm not sure if I am bias, or just educated through experience. Remember the assault rifle ban? I said it would never help. Data collected by the DOJ shows it didn't help at all. So which part wants the assault rifle ban again democrat or republican. Is it bias or simply realistic to know it's the democrats?


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## Chuck Smith (Feb 22, 2005)

> There has been many proposals over the years for school safety but the democrats always stop it. One would think they are comfortable with a number of deaths if it will give them an excuse to take the guns. Yes, I know that sounds radical, but if they really wanted to solve the problem they could. Metal detectors, armed guards, real time cameras, laminated glass in the doors etc


I know of schools once the bell rings you can only access the school thru getting buzzed in. Or thru one entrance....ie: Front door.

It is people that don't want our schools to look like prisons....but yet that would keep them safe. But again at what cost to the tax payers??

Like I have mentioned before. People are willing to shell out money for new gyms, theaters, ball fields, etc. But they don't for new books, computers, and now safety. It is sad but look at most proposals for new schools.... what is the thing they improve the most and make bigger or add to the school.... Athletics. it is sad.


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## Plainsman (Jul 30, 2003)

Cut and paste ------ sorry HH. Kind hearted liberals rushed the stage screaming "burn her". Which is more violent the shooter or these kids who want a person to burn to death? I think they belong on an FBI list. That's not mentally stable.

https://www.realclearpolitics.com/video ... etail.html


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## Chuck Smith (Feb 22, 2005)

Plainsman,

Another thing is what she saying in the video.... How some people are calling Trump a tyrant (or Nazi/hitler) and then want him to take away guns. So they want him to become hitler and a tyrant....

HH this was no way pointed at you. Just something I saw the other day was something along this same lines.

People are calling Trump a Nazi and Hitler.... and it was a Jewish person talking about this. How calling Trump these names is actually down playing what Hitler did and the Holocaust. I mean Hitler took firearms away, he secretly came to power, he did genocide, he shipped people into camps, starved them, used them for medical experiments, murdered them, etc..... Trump hasn't done a single one of those things.

I wish I could find this video again and post it. It is a really interesting sound bite to listen too.


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