# New Disease is running rampant in the Devils Lake Region



## Bucky (Oct 8, 2003)

Took a drive West of Devils Lake yesterday. There are thousands of geese in the area around Penn. Unfortunatly Fee hunting is running rampid in the area. If you want to hunt the area bring your wallet. I did see two feilds with spreads in them so somebody is bringing the $.

Two years ago there were a couple of fields posted for Fee Hunting. Now the entire South end of Lake Alice all the way to the West edge of Dry Lake is Posted Fee Hunting. I even saw a couple between Churches Ferry and Leeds so it is moving West.

Now I pose a question to all out there. What are we going to do about this, or can we do anything? I am worried that my 7 year old will never be able to hunt prime land. I think at this rate I will have to pay to take him on a good hunt, and I am here to tell you that will NEVER happen. I don't beilive in it. I am glad that I have good realations with a few farmers now because if this trend keeps on as it has been we will be just like the southern part of the state. I continue to knock on doors and make lots of phone calls during the week in order to gain permission. I am worried that even the ones I can gain permission from now will jump on the bandwagon.

Seeing this disgusting sight made me mad. I had hunted alot of those fields over the last 10 years and now they want us to pay to shoot. On another note the areas that were open to public were over run by out of staters. I urge all that come to the D.L. area to Boycott Fee hunting, if you pay to hunt you are only feeding the disease.

One last thing. Do I have to pay to deer hunt these area also or is it just for the farmer to take advantage of rich out of staters, I guess I will call the guys and ask. Don't you all think that if they are doing this for waterfowl hunting only they should take the signs down once deer season starts. I think they need to post it differently. Maybe, I don't know. Lets hear you ideas.


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## Bobm (Aug 26, 2003)

I thinks it's rampant not rampid. You should get used to it its only going to get worse and there is nothing you can do, your farmer friends will succumb to the money waved at them for leases. Your politicians will be bought off by the G/O's. And leasing will be the way it is, get your kids into some other sport or move to a state that has a lot of public land. Nd is the last to fall why do you think all the NR's come there? You are witnessing the last gasp of hunting.


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## tb (Jul 26, 2002)

Seriously Bucky, get your kid a fishing rod. Seriously.


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## Bucky (Oct 8, 2003)

My kid has a fishing rod and has had one since he was 2. What's your point.


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## rap (Mar 26, 2002)

the point is hunting in north dakota is heading down the ****ter very very fast. nd is the next texas, just like every other state has become. that's why we have so many nonresidents coming now, all the other states are already what nd will be in a few years


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## nodakoutdoors.com (Feb 27, 2002)

Bucky,

Make sure that you and EVERYONE you know gets their email address on the etree:

http://www.nodakoutdoors.com/signup.php

We'll be working really hard to battle this, and will need everyone's help. The more organized the etree becomes, the more weight it carries when it's needed.

Stay Active!


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## Bucky (Oct 8, 2003)

Rap, tb point well taken, I will hopefully not have to go fishing instead of hunting. Chris I will get on it thanks. I guess I just wanted to post about Fee hunting because it is fairly new and growing in popularity. I know now how the Southern NoDak boys feel. I have no problems currently finding land to hunt on or gaining permission. I do know a few rare farmers that say they will never do anything like that. I hope they keep that train of thought.


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## Bobm (Aug 26, 2003)

Once it starts, it spreads like wildfires in California, almost impossible to stop. There is no other state like ND and ND will be next unless something extraordinary happens. One of my coworkers was braggin that he got in with ten guys on 450 acres (deer lease) and it was only $1100.00 per man. Thats what you have to look forward to, except it will be worse because of the limited amount of public land in ND.


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## MRN (Apr 1, 2002)

Bob,

What could possibly be your motivation for posting?



> You should get used to it its only going to get worse and there is nothing you can do, ...... leasing will be the way it is, get your kids into some other sport or move to a state that has a lot of public land......You are witnessing the last gasp of hunting.


Aside from being wrong, I'm actually baffled as to what would motivate you to post something like that. Are you like a "seeer" or something? Feel you gotta share the gift? Do you want folks to do nothing about it? Some personal financial interest in seeing things go poorly here in ND?

M.


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## Dan Bueide (Jul 1, 2002)

Ditto to the sentiments of MRN. Defeatists, please don't apply. Others, please follow Chris' instructions.

There are lots of examples (good and bad) of how we "do things differently" in ND. This is far from a lost cause, and we have a great chance of finishing what we started if we stay involved, committed and persistent through the next election cycle and session. The '04 elections and '05 session will be make or break.


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## smalls (Sep 9, 2003)

ABSOLUTELY DAN!

We have not lost. We can protect the resource and ourselves. This is not the time to fleet with tail between our legs, this is the time to let facts be known and voices heard.

On this site there are thousands of dedicated hunters who are aware and scared of the impending situation. At the same time there are avid sportsman (perhaps not as passionate as many on this site) that need to be educated that the luxuries they enjoy will not be perpetuated if no action is taken. Many of them, if ignored, won't be motivated until someone "leases" their hunting land and has no hunting signs with a 605 area code.

I am not anti-non resident. I have hunting with nr's several times this season, guys that I had never met and were looking for the ND experience. Point being, I want to uphold the integrity and quality of the ND experience for myself, my fellow sportsmen, and the future generations of sportsmen. To do that, we need to make some changes.


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## cootkiller (Oct 23, 2002)

Refer to DJRoosters post.

I like what he said.

If it is that important to you than you will be willing to pay for it. Let me ask you this. You will dish out $300+ per X-box and $60+ per game for your kid( I am just guessing because it seems every kid from 2 to 20 has one) but won't hand over $50 and change to a farmer to hunt his property and give you kid an outdoor experience.

To me that is insanity.

I keep going back to this time and time again and will go back to this point once.
"HUNTING IS A PRIVILEGE, NOT A RIGHT. YOU HAVE THE RIGHT TO BEAR ARMS, BUT YOU NEED THE LANDOWNERS PERMISSION TO PURSUE THE GAME IF THE LAND IS POSTED."

Maybe everyone doesn't DESERVE the privilege. 
All of you ask yourselves, 'What have I done to deserve to go out on ANY landowners land to pursue game?
I was born into it, but hey I do do things for the outdoors, I take kids hunting, I report all poachers, and I respect the land that I hunt and the landowners that own it.
I know that a lot of you on here, the ones that toot your horns at every little turn because you think an injustice has been done to you, don't do the same.

You know what sometimes life isn't fair, deal with it. If the prime land is locked up into Fee Hunting, FINE. Go to some not so prime land and shoot two or three fewer birds, or work that much harder to get your limit in a slough that isn't on prime land. It is still an outdoor experience for your son and yourself and will be that much more memorable for the work you put into it.

Or, you know what else you could do. Go out to the farmers, some time other than during hunting season and talk to them, make new friends, and maybe, just maybe, you will be suprised with how much land will just magically open up to you because of your new found friendship.

cootkiller


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## Bobm (Aug 26, 2003)

You are correct I shouldn't of posted that type of defeatist response I was just tired and more than a little depressed to see that it is spreading in ND because I love ND. After having lived through it in Texas and Georgia its kind of hard to believe that its not just unavoidable. MRN I'm not a Seer I just am frustrated that the commercializtion of hunting is progressing so rapidly thruout the nation. I have no financial interest in ND of any kind and if you read my posts on this site you will see I definitely don't favor the loss of hunting land in this manner. I just feel frustrated about this issue and political ignorance in general. Political decisions have a greater affect on our lives than any other single element yet if you ask the next 10 people you talk to to name the senator and congressman from their state that represent them and what their stand is on any mainstream issue I will wager you dinner and a box of shells of your choice that none of them will know. I have actually tried this test and none of the 10 I asked (some of which were professional white collar management types) could answer the question correctly. With this kind of apathy is my thinking defeatist or realist. Fight the good fight I hope you succeed I would love to see one success in this area. But read the posts and see how many of them are reporting more and more loss of access due to the G/Os industry. It doesn't look to positive at this point does it?


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## stevepike (Sep 14, 2002)

CootKiller,
I may be wrong (and am sure I will hear it if I am) but in ND Hunting is a Right. While hunting on private land can be considered a privilege.


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## muskat (Mar 5, 2002)

CK, 
When you compared the price of an X-Box to that of land access, you forgot to mention the longevity of each. The 50 dollars is per day, whereas the X-Box can be played year round, for probably two to three years(before something newer and better hits the market). This is not a legitimate comparison.


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## cootkiller (Oct 23, 2002)

Then you choose the x-box and other computerized games. Then that is your CHOICE. You CHOOSE to spend that money on those computer games and not on a hunting opportunity. And this all comes back to the fact that hunting on the prime land whether it is posted, fee hunting only, or leased by a guide is a privilege and NOT A RIGHT. No one is forcing you to hunt only on fee land, use a guide, or even hunt at all. My point was to the fact that some think that just because there are more birds here than there they should have the right to hunt where 'all the birds are' and that is not the case. It just might take some work to earn that PRIVILEGE.

Also, I don't see how anyone in ND has the 'Right' to hunt. Yes you have the right to bear arms, but you only gain the privilege of hunting if you take you hunter safety and pass, and then purchase or get drawn for a lisence or tag. 
You are born with rights, through life you earn privileges.

cootkiller


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## muskat (Mar 5, 2002)

I never refuted the fact that access to private land is a privilege. I was merely stating that most people cant afford to pay 50 dollars a day to access land for a quality hunt with their son/daughter, whereas they can easily spend 300-400 dollars to entertain their children for 365 days a year.

You said it was insanity to not spend the 50 dollars, I say for most people it isnt even an option.


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## cootkiller (Oct 23, 2002)

Yes, but muskat, this land that you would be paying $50 a day for would be that prime land and you don't HAVE to hunt ONLY prime land. 
You can't tell me you can't find unposted land or posted land that you can get on that may not be PRIME but may still offer an outdoor experience.

Our stuff hasn't been prime every weekend this year but I still went out and got birds. And I didn't hunt any stuff but ours.

cootkiller

(except for Mrs. cootkiller's moose, and we ended up making new friends on that one.)


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## muskat (Mar 5, 2002)

I dont know where you pulled the prime land thing, but I will go with it.

You are lucky enough to have "prime" land, (this is the feeling I get from your previous posts). Others are not so lucky, yet should we fault them and make them pay an extra 50-100 dollars to access land? Should we segregate the population into a caste system:
a) people who were born into prime hunting land
b) people who can afford to give their children a quality hunt by buying "prime" land access
c) people who can scrap together enough money to buy a license, shells, camo for their kids, boots for their kids, and gas money for one or two trips to public land

You tell me who deserves the better hunting out of this group??

When you tell me your land hasnt been prime everyweekend, it makes me wonder about you. Do you go out and make relationships with other landowners, like you preach non-stop on this site, or do you, as you said in your post, hunt only your land. Maybe thats why it hasnt been "prime" by your standards.


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## rap (Mar 26, 2002)

it's hard not to be a defeatist after last legislation. i thought the 03 session was make or break for us? don't get me wrong, i will be just as persistent during the next session and sessions to come as i was the last one. it's just to bad the legislature doesn't realize whats happening. i don't see them doing much in stopping the massive amount of leasing going on. i hope there will be some bills that actually might help that situation...


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## cootkiller (Oct 23, 2002)

muskat,
I grew up out here. I have known almost all the farmers in our area since I was a wee little lad. I have made my relationships with the landowners. I have, in the last couple years, CHOSEN to hunt almost exclusively on our land during waterfowl season because we DO post and we DO regulate who goes on it and who doesn't. I don't think it would be fair for me to go and ask another landowner to hunt on their posted stuff and let our posted stuff stay idle. That would be taking an opportunity away from someone else who might have done their homework but doeswn't know the landowner as well as I do because I grew up in the area.

Also, enlighten me. Who does deserve to hunt what you would consider to be a prime waterfowl field? YOU.

Hey maybe we should go back to old england, the only people allowed to hunt were the landowners themselves.

(vent, vent, vent,vent)

Ok I am fine now, but honestly WHO DO YOU SAY HAS THE RIGHT TO MAKE THAT DECISION?
Hold a lottery? Whoevers number gets called gets first choice of whatever land they want even though they didn't farm it. Poppycock!

I know, all the landowners should get together across ND, and for the next 3 years plant nothing but canola. Then we won't have this debate because the waterfowl will be gone for good. Then you will see how important the landowner and their decisions were and why they are so important to you.

P.S. muskat, I see you are an big city kid. How often do you come out to the country to make relationships with farmers? I have a guess but won't post what I think until I give you a chance to respond.

cootkiller


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## stevepike (Sep 14, 2002)

HCR 3018 - Constitutional Amendment to guarantee right to hunt and fish


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## gandergrinder (Mar 10, 2002)

Cootkiller,
I for one will vouch for the honesty and integrity of muskat. He does go out and ask permission and gain relationships with farmers. He is also very gracious in inviting other people who do not own land to hunt on the land that his family owns. He invited my dad and I to pheasant hunt on his families land having not ever met my father before. He is not the big city kid you think.

If farmers could make more money farming canola then that is what they would do. Most farmers in todays market run there farm as a business. They have to in order to stay farming. If farmers could make more money selling ducks and geese then there farming practices would reflect that and in some areas (the southwest for example) they do.

Until the value of access charging per acre for game animals exceeds the value that the farmer could recieve for the grain or cattle produced on that land per acre you will see very little change in farming practices.

How many farmers will not burn a dried up slough knowing they can plant it next spring? They all know the probability of it producing a crop are low but they will recieve insurance payments for it anyway. I think you are mistaken if you believe wildlife comes before profits for most farmers.

Having said that I know some farmers do consider wildlife but as a whole I believe that wildlife plays a very small role in business decisions.


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## MRN (Apr 1, 2002)

Bob,

Come on Bob, posts by the demented few might bring you down, but just consider the excellent lines in that society has drawn and will continue to draw. Believe it or not, I believe computer domain/intellectual property lawsuits will actually help us. When legislatures and courts start dealing with the issue of ownership, they will have a much better understanding of public trust issues.

The true issue is to whom the commodity of interest belongs. Consider music - regardless of where it is sitting, stored, or who charges you for access, the music belongs to its copyright owner. While music may sit on your computer with few problems, a fire storm of legal problems will befall you when you try to profit from this music that does not belong to you. Courts and legislatures will be forced to deal with these issues more and more.

If I can't profit from giving you access to Sony's music from my beautiful computer that I invested in and all that, then do you think a resonable state will care if I profit from giving you access to something that the state owns?

Game animals belong to the state - the public trust - until they are legally harvested (under the state's imposed rules) when they become the property of the person who has havested them. This ownership is regardless of where the game animals is sitting within the state. Charging for access to something to which you do not have ownership is no different than in the intellectual property case. The public trust game animals are comodity of interest here - not land - the land has no commodity value apart from the game animals. Enlightened legislatures have already enacted the most resonable laws to this effect. Others will follow. Be optimistic.

M.


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## bioman (Mar 1, 2002)

MRN excellent post :bowdown:.

I am sitting back laughing at CK's posts. First, he is lucky enough to have the prime land that his father owns, and he works (secondarily) for Devil's Lake largest market hunter. So all of you following this thread, just know that he isn't the slightest biased in his opinion of prime hunting land.


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## muskat (Mar 5, 2002)

CK,
Once again back to that SLBCK acronym you like to throw around. I list my home as Fargo, but that doesnt mean I grew up there. I merely attend college at NDSU.

I spend a lot of time and effort talking with farmers and building relationships throughout the entire year(both hunting season and non-hunting season). This is the only way that I have become successful in my hunts. Like I have said in other topics, I hunt over a couple dozen shells and silos, I dont have a field blind, I cant afford a great shotgun, but I DO make relationships with landowners/farmers in order to ensure a good hunt the coming fall.

As GG stated(Thanks GG  ), my family owns some land in SE ND. Does this mean that I solely hunt this land? NO. Does this mean no one else is able to hunt this land? NO.

Realisticly not everyone has a chance to hunt prime land, and I dont know why I got into this with you. Obviously the two latter choices in my list are the ones that are most likely, however, I merely wanted to state that the inability to pay for land access should not be the reason a child is not introduced into the sport.

As far as me hunting prime waterfowl fields, if I am so lucky, it is because of the time and effort that I have put into building relationships, scouting, giving gifts, etc, etc, etc. Not because I think that it is my right.


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## Maverick (Mar 4, 2002)

OHHHH Cooootie!!!!! Everytime you post, I read and laugh!
Inheritance is cheeper than paying for it!!

Mav....


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## cootkiller (Oct 23, 2002)

1. I didn't use the SLBCK acronym, I said big city kid, which should be a neutral way of saying it, I think

2. I was not bragging about being born into good land. On the contrary I was saying that even when our land isn't good I still huunt it to give others opportunities at land owned by other landowners because I don't want to be a land hog. Holy cow do you guys even read my posts, I think some of you just blow up and retaliate negatively towards me as soon as you see the name cootkiller.

cootkiller


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## Bobm (Aug 26, 2003)

MRN I'm trying to ignore the usaual babble that always accompanies these discussion. Give me some examples of the enlightened ledgislatures and of the successes which you refer. I just don't see it and I've lived thru the loss of hunting access in two states where money talked and the little guy walked. I've made the exact point you have in many previous posts about the fact that game animals are public property and while legislation may be able to somehow enforce that, they will not be able to force the issue of access because the land is clearly not public. What I'm saying is that they could make it illegal to sell hunting rights but they can't make the people that are making money doing it grant access to their land. And if forced not to sell the publics game I think the backlash will be bad. Look at the way landowners like CK view game animals (If they are on there land they are theirs!! And if they choose to charge to hunt them they will ). I really think you should try the questions I asked in the earlier post with your associates so you can see for yourself the political ignorance that exists in this country. When it get down to it there are politcal issues that are going to have a much greater effect on your life than any hunting issue. Right now in front of congress the stupid "free senior drug benefit" issue that is going to kill you young guys with the tax burden they create. And I am certian that 98% of the people reading this website (or in the rest of the country for that matter) don't know anything about the issue or how their representative is going to vote. I don't have any idea how old you are but I'm 51 and I've become cynical about the way these things work out based on my past experience and my certainty of the apathy and politcal ignorance that exists.


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## Fetch (Mar 1, 2002)

> I don't have any idea how old you are but I'm 51 and I've become cynical about the way these things work out based on my past experience and my certainty of the apathy and politcal ignorance that exists.


Ditto that - exact same here - I even tried to get involved in the political process - ran for local office (instead of just complain)

What happens is, if you speak up, be ready to get buried in work & diversions (be put in your place) & eventually get burned out & so frustrated with the system, you have to either get out or be bullheaded & dive in even further - so eventually you only think live breathe political crapola & problems :eyeroll:

This is basically true of all things run by Politics - Boards - Be it by election or appointment or by being railroaded. Most of these kinda things try hard to appoint or find, like minded folks, that go with the flow & not make waves - or have a special interest. Or have political ambitions & use the position as a stepping stone to higher office & you don't advance if you rock the boat - then you become part of the problem - a career politician

What is missing in our cause is some high profile or legal folks or Legislator that really sees what is happening & wants to keep what we have(or change) what is happening. & now Eddy is going Hollywood :roll: & I was never sure or trusting of which side he was on ???

We need to know, or help find a canidate for Govenor - & make a last stand on the next Legislative elections. If Not ND is doomed to become a Texas & will eventually lose all it's unique Laws & resources will suffer. & eventually the G&FD will have to become tax supported because NoDakers will not hunt like we used to. :eyeroll: Well maybe not if NR's license fees can keep pace with the needs of the dept. :eyeroll: & that will be SAD SAD SAD :******:

Sorry MRN - But as a Cynic I see this quote a Oxymoron in ND


> Enlightened legislatures


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## magnum3.5 (Sep 19, 2003)

Well guys I don't know why I am getting into this but, here is my two cents worth as a landowner and avid outdoorsman. 1. It is there land they baught it ,and pay taxes on it. They can do what ever they want with it's their's. 2.They don't have to let anybody hunt it because it's theirs. 3.They can charge what ever they want because it's their's. 4.They don't mind seeing the nr because they are courtous and they pick up there mess, alot of locals don't. I have never charged anybody to hunt, I have let lots of people hunt, even you BUCKY but, you have to remember it is there land they can do what they want. I think that these people that do this should be should severelly taxed they are double dipping sort of speak. magnum


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## MRN (Apr 1, 2002)

Bob,

This discussion began here long ago:
http://NodakOutdoors.com/members/phpBB/ ... .php?t=154
Search out posts by Bioman - been the voice informing us about the isuues related to public trust. The legislatures are in Alberta and Sask - where I own land - and where fee hunting would put you in the social company of prostitutes and other taudy folk.

Rather than bemoan ignorance, most of my work is aimed at fighting ignorance. Lie down and die isn't an option for most of us. Being cynical is fine, but it hasn't solved a single problem yet.

Magnum's post make clear the common misconception - sure it's the landowner's land, and they control access. However, the game animals are public trust - and profiting from something you don't own is pretty bad. Althought it's irrelevant to the issue really, I also say this as a landowner and avid sportsman. Fortunately, the moral compass from which I take my bearings is much different from the $$$$ that steers the ship here.

M.


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## Dick Monson (Aug 12, 2002)

bioman-MRN, three cheers for you! :beer:


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## Bucky (Oct 8, 2003)

magnum, I agree its there land they should do what they want with it, however when you see nothing but FEE HUNTING in area I have hunted for years it kinda depressing. Here's why 80% of that land had no hunters on it but thousands of birds, are these guys willing to let a local on it for free if buisness is not doing well, I don't know maybe I should ask. Magnum when did I hunt your land?Cootkiller you know that area and know what I am talking about congrats on only hunting your land that is not something you see from most land owners. These guys are also not posting it properly.

My kid will hunt simply because he is hooked on it, and he already knows that you don't have to pull the trigger to have a good day. He just loves going like his father. If 10 years from now I have to get up at 3 am and sit on a public hunting area just to get the spot. I will. My son also wants a X-box I see your point but don't agree with it. I will never, I mean never pay to hunt waterfowl or anything else. Its not about the money its just the principal of the whole idea. These are migratory birds and nobody owns them. Yes they own the land the birds are sitting on but should they profit from that???


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## cootkiller (Oct 23, 2002)

Bucky,
At times I do feel your pain.
I feel I have made as good of a point about this issue as I can and if some of you out there are too ignorant to open your minds and believe what I say, I guess there is nothing I can do about that.

Have your kid go outside and play basketball, football, baseball, anything but buy them a stupid video game.

The point some of you make is true, the landowner does not own migratory birds that rest or feed on his property, however, he owns the land that you need access to in order to harvest those birds.

cootkiller


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## Bobm (Aug 26, 2003)

MRN I still would like to see the enlightened legislature decisions you cited. It would help remove my cynicism( I'm not trying to be a smartass) I just can't believe they exist, such is the strength of my cynicism. I'm on your side for the public trust issue and think that the leaseing-guiding thing should be legally linked to market hunting and attacked that way. I'm no lawyer ( thankfully), so I don't know if its doable. BUts its the same thing in my mind and I've felt that way for 30 years when I saw what was happening in Texas as a young man. I applaud your attitude but so far not much success to point to country wide on this issue. Fight the good fight by all means, its worth it and you have my support and prayers. Elightened ledislature is an oxmoron and unfortunately we have what we deserve and a country of political idiots. Ask the 10 people the questions I suggested and I think you will see my side of this point more clearly. You have a tough fight ahead but a worthwhile one as well. Good Luck.


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## fireball (Oct 3, 2003)

Hey cootiee, you sth(small town hick), I am from a small town as well, but I am not a hick. Anyway, let me ask your all knowing brain a question. Is it your right, in ND, to take a test, pay a fee and get a drivers license? If you answered yes, you are correct. Is it my RIGHT to hunt in ND if I pass Hunters Safety and pay a fee for a license? If you answered yes, you are correct. HUNTING IS A RIGHT, NOT A PRIVELAGE.
Land access is a privelage, and by you equating hunting rights to land access privelages, shows your mentallity and lack of merrit as a true sportsman. You have no compassion for your fellow hunters, you just like to blow alot of smoke. Your view of life is sooo perverted, you must be a landowners son. Let me see...most your posts say...I got mine, you pay for yours....anyone who doesn't live in my little town must be a big city fella, so that makes them bad....and the best one yet, I really need help finding a moose for my fiance to shot, could some of you great fellow nd hunters help me out. Get out of my life you loser. You are the prime example of what is becoming wrong with this state. I ask for nothing more than I ever had, you ask for everything. Go post on an outfitters board, you would be welcome there with you rural legends and everyone owes you something attitude. Now run along like a good kid and play with what daddy bought you. It is just too bad that everyone who helped you gain access to land that moose was on, didn't charge you a 1000 bucks to shoot the animal. I bet you wouldn't be eating moose steaks, you may be enjoying crow. How come you didn't have to pay to shoot that moose, like you say we should for shooting waterfowl, upland and deer. You live by a dbl standard, and you will pay for it someday.
:sniper:


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## cootkiller (Oct 23, 2002)

Thank you moderators for disciplining fireball for his name calling post.

Oh what, nevermind.

Fireball, I got a PM for you. Check it out.

cootkiller


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## fireball (Oct 3, 2003)

That is all you can say when you know you are wrong...run to the teacher and hope they will fix it for you. Get a life. I wasn't calling you a name, where in the whole paragraph did I call you a name? You call people city slickers, I call you a sth. Ahh, to live in your world of, "it is ok for me, but not for them", wake up boy. Well, where is the PM, I haven't recieved it, but I am waiting so I can post it here and let everyone know the type of person you are in real life.


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## cootkiller (Oct 23, 2002)

The ignorance of fireball and people like him are what will bring an end to the outdoors in North Dakota.

Gee, am I suppose to apologize for my station in life, OK.

SORRY. :lol:

cootkiller


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## Perry Thorvig (Mar 6, 2002)

I have several thoughts.

About CK:

Cootkiller is a privileged country kid (not his fault). His parents and grandparents own or lease for farming, thousands of acres just off the Alice refuge. (I have been granted and refused permission to hunt on their land at various times. I have had a beer with CK's dad.) What's more, CK probably knows families for miles around. He didn't have to drive hundreds of miles to establish relationships with those folks. He just went to school with other kids from the area, played high school basketball with those kids and got to know their parents. Those folks are probably not going to deny him hunting access because they know him or his other family members. He's got it made. Access to him is not a problem. A simple phone call and he's in business.

Then, he also works part time for Kyle Blanchfield, the area's biggest outfitter and lessee of thousands of acres of hunting land in the DL area. Do you suppose Blanchfield allows CK to hunt on his leased land without paying?? I'll bet he does. Just a little perk that goes with the job.

Or, maybe CK has that part time job with Blanchfield because Kyle is just being nice to CK so that Blanchfield can have hunting rights on CK's family's land. Oh well, that's bidness.

I think we hunters all understand that the landowners can do what they want with access. I don't think CK understands our pain seeing traditions that are older than he is being ruined by the guides and the move toward paying for access. If CK had to pay for his hunting access, I think he might be a little more sympathetic to the plight of the hunter who lives more than 50 miles away from the refuge.

About hunting this fall:

It looks like the weather is going to move some birds into North Dakota this week. The time is right to get out there.

I have not hunted waterfowl in ND yet this year. I've got my 14 days. I was thinking about making an impromptu trip up there in the next week. My trailer is still loaded from our Canada trip. But, given the reports about the extent of leasing, I don't think I will. I will miss my first waterfowling experience in ND in 27 years. And, North Dakota will miss a few bucks that I would have spent at the Zephyrs (Durum House), Gordy's, Dee's, and the Cenex. It's too bad.


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## cootkiller (Oct 23, 2002)

You are so right in some areas Perry. The stuff about who I am and about my dad and basketball and how I made relations with landowners is right on. Am I suppose to aplogize for this, sorry I won't.

The stuff about Kyle. Have I ever been employed by him, NO. Have I ever hunted on ANY of his leased land, NO. Will I ever, probably not. Is Kyle just nice to me because he wants something from me, I hope not.

Perry, you should come, it is not as bad as it sounds from some of these doomsdayers.

cootkiller


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## MRN (Apr 1, 2002)

Bob,

Follow the link I posted. Read the thread. The relevant part of the legislative act is posted therein. Cheer-up.

M.


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## Perry Thorvig (Mar 6, 2002)

CK

My apologies if I got the connection to K. Blanchfield wrong. I understood that you did a little part time bar tending for Blanchfield's resort. I'm glad to here that you are not that cozy with him.


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## Fetch (Mar 1, 2002)

Kyle leases out the Bar & cafe - ck works for them- I can't imagine Kyle would appoint ck as their ambassador to this web site :roll: :lol:


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## magnum3.5 (Sep 19, 2003)

Guys, I never said landowners owned the game we hunt but, they do own the land we want to hunt. All I am saying is there is nothing we sportsman can do. It thier land. Bucky I know what you are saying but how can you stop it. You can't;;;; free enterprize. How can anybody be stopped from opening there own guide service they can't as long as they meet the states critria you can't stop them it is a legitament busisness. Bucky, I let you and your dad deer hunt many times I have taken you and your brother out to the pass lots of times . magnum


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## Fetch (Mar 1, 2002)

What about severely taxing G/O's based on how much they lease - with the idea they have to put as much back as they take (for profit) &/or per bird ???

(Their own land only - No way) - but leased land Yes Big Time. If they only hunt their own land maybe per bird - this should include renters of land that lease for hunting. & close potential loopholes in Partnerships.

would this slow them down & reverse the trend ???

Is this happening in any other States ???

who could write & promote such a Bill ???

Heck why not tax the owner of the land who leases too ??? & write it so the money goes back to the G&FD to improve the bird counts or more plots type projects & enforcement (& a Tax Lawyer & a CPA for the Dept.) ???

Maybe this is the eventual referal vote ???

Maybe give em a tax break if they give equal land to plots ??? Win -Win


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## magnum3.5 (Sep 19, 2003)

Fetch, you maybe on to something there. I think there is alot to think about. I think it would only work if the hunting quility was the same. You know what I mean? Let's say a farmer has 10 quarters of land 3 feilds in prime hunting land full of wild life all the time,and they charge to hunt. The other 7 feilds are poorly located not much for wildlife and it is open to public hunting do they deserve a tax break? magnum


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## Fetch (Mar 1, 2002)

That could be up to the PLOTS guys ??? Based on whats planted there ???

Hire several more PLOTS Guys & Gals too


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